[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens - It's True. All of it.

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Ganzlinger said:
Am I the only one who thinks Poe is the new Han rather than Finn?

Dude was pure sarcasm/irony when in the first act and when he was being tortured.
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Nope, I thought that also. Poe is just a fun character like Han was.

labx said:
She is her aunt or mother... You know that. So ep.8 starts 10 years after.... ep 7. Rey a bad ass Jedi and finn the new Han Solo rouge? So the big bad guy is one of Luke's disciples? This shit is going to get real in ep 8.

The coolest scene was the dream-ish thing with Rey when the first order siths are shown.
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They're going to get so much shit if it turns out she's Luke kid and nothing is said by Han or Leia.
 
I don't think Snoke will be Plagueis, it felt very much like they were sweeping the PT under the rug for this and I don't think they will have their main villain be an element from the PT. I think he is probably just a new character.
 
Frog-fu said:
She really is a Mary Sue. I like her a lot but her lack of flaws is in and of itself a flaw.

What should have happened in that interrogation was Kylo getting his way but then feeling a sudden push back that unsettled him and him report to Snoke to inform him.

What we got instead was Kylo talking shit, getting mentally beat and then running off like a bitch.

The duel in the forest was pretty disappointing too. Injured or not, Kylo should've had them both easily. Finn vs Kylo is what Rey vs Kylo should have been like. A short confrontation wherein she acquitted herself well - all things considered - but still ended up having to make a tactical retreat.

Rey fucking up Kylo really was the nadir for me.
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I agree.

I disagree, mostly. I loved the duel in the forest and people forget that Ren was fucking wounded from a shot to his abdomen, he was bleeding quite seriously and thus not at his best while dueling. The only thing I disliked was Rey tapping into the Force and "winning." I accepted Finn not getting immediately dismembered since as a Stormtrooper he likely got some melee combat training, however, we know nothing about Rey and thus have to assume she's never fought with such a weapon. Thus, her tapping into the Force and the immediately being imbued with fencing lessons is kind of ridiculous to me.

That said, I still loved the choreography of the duels. Fuck all that flashy prequel nonsense and give me back my ESB type duels.
 
foxtrot3d said:
I just feel like the whole movie had too much crammed into it, so confident in the trilogy it is setting up that it didn't believe it needed to explain anything to you or present you with a contained, satisfying story. It felt like it was this thing that was needed to move all the characters into their places for the future movies and cared little at how forced it all looked. Rey and Ren battle only to have a casm open up beneath them to physically separate them as they eye each other, dun dun dunnnn "To Be Continued..."
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I kinda felt like that too. I don't really dislike it as much as you do, but yeah.

This movie felt very much like its primary goals were to connect to the previous movies, and to establish the new characters. Left me wanting more for sure.
 
MGrant said:
I liked some of the camera work (in the opening 30 minutes or so the editing and cinematography are spot-on), but I did think the shots were a bit close overall in the middle and at the end. I wanted a few more contemplative, painterly shots like those that were influenced by George Lucas's love of Kurosawa and Westerns. Would have preferred it if the last shot with Luke and Rey had been a wide, static shot, instead of a helicopter flyaround. Found myself really missing shots like these:
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No I totally agree, I think most of the film looked great but the final shot in particular seemed like a bad choice to end on (probably not easy to do a long shot of that moment without the chopper though).
 
foxtrot3d said:
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eerily similar to my thoughts, including thinking ren was the highpoint.

i think in the end i got what i thought i was going to get until i saw the trailer and wondered about the possibilities of something more.

JJ's camerawork goes a long way to cheapen the action. nothing breathes. nothing just exists without the audience being reminded we're looking at it through a lens. the final shot of the film being the crowning example of this.
 
UpDownLeftRight said:
I'm guessing I'm the only one who hates the fact the villain was unmasked already? I was reallyliking Kylo Ren's character but having the mask come off and the characters origins dropped in a single movie took the mystery away and he just lost all of that ominous vibe Vader had, which he also had until then IMO.
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the fact that he was Hans son was really unsettling to me actually--the entire state of the galaxy seemed grave almost at once after that was revealed

like...yea...Luke goofed.
 
Frog-fu said:
She really is a Mary Sue. I like her a lot but her lack of flaws is in and of itself a flaw.

What should have happened in that interrogation was Kylo getting his way but then feeling a sudden push back that unsettled him and him report to Snoke to inform him.

What we got instead was Kylo talking shit, getting mentally beat and then running off like a bitch.

The duel in the forest was pretty disappointing too. Injured or not, Kylo should've had them both easily. Finn vs Kylo is what Rey vs Kylo should have been like. A short confrontation wherein she acquitted herself well - all things considered - but still ended up having to make a tactical retreat.

Rey fucking up Kylo really was the nadir for me.
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Mega said:
He's awkward and a nerd, trying REALLY hard to be a badass like the stories he heard of Vader. You can tell the upper members of the First Order see him as a sniveling shit who hasn't been shot out of an airlock because of his powers. Remember when Luke got away at the end of ESB and every single person on the bridge is dead silent and frozen in place? Vader did nothing and he still has that effect. Kylo doesn't command that level of fear and respect.
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yeah i think its clear snoke was holding him back because he wasnt sure he was committed to the dark side but now that he has committed i'm sure he will come back significantly more powerful and intimidating

would not put my money on rey for the rematch in episode 8 and i'm thinking it'll take finn and rey together to take him down
 
Ithil said:
Maul stood there and let a man jump over him (when he had the high ground) then slice him in two. All his flips are negated when he has that lame a death. And no one, I repeat, no one is wimpier than General Grievous in Episode 3.

In any case, Ren is clearly not meant to be that kind of Vader badass villain.
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It is hard to top the shit ass death Boba Fett had.
 
MGrant said:
I liked some of the camera work (in the opening 30 minutes or so the editing and cinematography are spot-on), but I did think the shots were a bit close overall in the middle and at the end. I wanted a few more contemplative, painterly shots like those that were influenced by George Lucas's love of Kurosawa and Westerns. Would have preferred it if the last shot with Luke and Rey had been a wide, static shot, instead of a helicopter flyaround. Found myself really missing shots like these:
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latest
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My favorite shot in the saga
 
Blader said:
No I totally agree, I think most of the film looked great but the final shot in particular seemed like a bad choice to end on (probably not easy to do a long shot of that moment without the chopper though).
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They were filming on Skellig Michael (I recognise the beehive huts) which is a heritage sight and a tiny island, so they are probably limited in what kind of set-up they can put on there.
 
foxtrot3d said:
I agree.

I disagree, mostly. I loved the duel in the forest and people forget that Ren was fucking wounded from a shot to his abdomen, he was bleeding quite seriously and thus not at his best while dueling. The only thing I disliked was Rey tapping into the Force and "winning." I accepted Finn not getting immediately dismembered since as a Stormtrooper he likely got some melee combat training, however, we know nothing about Rey and thus have to assume she's never fought with such a weapon. Thus, her tapping into the Force and the immediately being imbued with fencing lessons is kind of ridiculous to me.

That said, I still loved the choreography of the duels. Fuck all that flashy prequel nonsense and give me back my ESB type duels.
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Rey did have that staff, at least.
 
Ithil said:
I don't think Snoke will be Plagueis, it felt very much like they were sweeping the PT under the rug for this and I don't think they will have their main villain be an element from the PT. I think he is probably just a new character.
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I agree with this.

I think going forward they will simply act like the prequels didn't happen at all.
 
I thought they revealed Kylo as a lost son way too early. The first scene he's in and they started playing it up. Way too early imo.
 
itsjustsurvival said:
I actually liked the villain not being a master. Something really compelling about both the main protagonist and antagonist still having so much to learn.
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Agreed. Both sides starting fresh. Snoke probably knows Ren isn't all that but he has no other choice. Han was also a main driving force for Ren's struggle with Light and Dark. Now that he killed him his real training can begin as said by Snoke at the end.

But yeah, Ren is laughably underpowered compared to past Sith Lords.
 
ryan299 said:
I thought they revealed Kylo as a lost son way too early. The first scene he's in and they started playing it up. Way too early imo.
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I was glad they didn't make a big deal out of it as some super played up twist. Star Wars has already done the Father/Son Good/Evil thing
 
UpDownLeftRight said:
I'm guessing I'm the only one who hates the fact the villain was unmasked already? I was reallyliking Kylo Ren's character but having the mask come off and the characters origins dropped in a single movie took the mystery away and he just lost all of that ominous vibe Vader had, which he also had until then IMO.
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Eh, he never felt as big as Vader to me before he was unmasked, and that was probably the point. But I completely stopped taking him seriously when he took off the mask the first time.
 
MGrant said:
I liked some of the camera work (in the opening 30 minutes or so the editing and cinematography are spot-on), but I did think the shots were a bit close overall in the middle and at the end. I wanted a few more contemplative, painterly shots like those that were influenced by George Lucas's love of Kurosawa and Westerns. Would have preferred it if the last shot with Luke and Rey had been a wide, static shot, instead of a helicopter flyaround. Found myself really missing shots like these:
Click to expand...

For me, TFA lacks a certain otherworldly fairytale magic which even the Prequels were able to retain. I like how TFA looks, but it feels sparse, gritty, and 'real' in comparison. The fact that it's such an impatient movie also means that the mood-setting of the prior movies takes a back seat.

Frog-fu said:
She really is a Mary Sue. I like her a lot but her lack of flaws is in and of itself a flaw.
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She has trust issues (regarding Finn) and responsibility issues (regarding BB-8). True, they're remedied pretty quickly, but for me they're enough to offset the fact that for the rest of the movie she doesn't put a foot wrong.

I wouldn't write off some sort of Dark Side temptation in VII/IX either.
 
Stabbed by a lightsaber.
Fell down a mineshaft.
Planet blows up, obliterating all traces.

"Oh my god, do you think he'll be back for the next movie?"

Neff said:
For me, TFA lacks a certain otherworldly fairytale magic which even the Prequels were able to retain. I like how TFA looks, but it feels sparse, gritty, and 'real' in comparison. The fact that it's such an impatient movie also means that the mood-setting of the prior movies takes a back seat.
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100%. I noticed/felt that, too. Even the prequel stuff.

But.. at the same time, this felt like a really different kind of Star Wars. I was diggin' it.
 
Sanke__ said:
also pretty pissed they are holding back on who rey's parents are
its gotta be either luke or han and leia
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Im pretty sure its Luke. I think he put her on a planet to learn how to scrap, maybe he felt nostalgic about how he was raised. After Ben turned and killed his Jedi order, he couldn't take a chance with his daughter.
 
ryan299 said:
I thought they revealed Kylo as a lost son way too early. The first scene he's in and they started playing it up. Way too early imo.
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I think it would've been much more effective if you would've found out when Han confronted him on the bridge and after he puts the lightsaber through him...
 
foxtrot3d said:
I agree.

I disagree, mostly. I loved the duel in the forest and people forget that Ren was fucking wounded from a shot to his abdomen, he was bleeding quite seriously and thus not at his best while dueling. The only thing I disliked was Rey tapping into the Force and "winning." I accepted Finn not getting immediately dismembered since as a Stormtrooper he likely got some melee combat training, however, we know nothing about Rey and thus have to assume she's never fought with such a weapon. Thus, her tapping into the Force and the immediately being imbued with fencing lessons is kind of ridiculous to me.

That said, I still loved the choreography of the duels. Fuck all that flashy prequel nonsense and give me back my ESB type duels.
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Again, I think there's some hinting that she has already been trained and has "forgotten." Those latent skills have been coming out in her staff fighting skills though.
 
foxtrot3d said:
I agree.

I disagree, mostly. I loved the duel in the forest and people forget that Ren was fucking wounded from a shot to his abdomen, he was bleeding quite seriously and thus not at his best while dueling. The only thing I disliked was Rey tapping into the Force and "winning." I accepted Finn not getting immediately dismembered since as a Stormtrooper he likely got some melee combat training, however, we know nothing about Rey and thus have to assume she's never fought with such a weapon. Thus, her tapping into the Force and the immediately being imbued with fencing lessons is kind of ridiculous to me.

That said, I still loved the choreography of the duels. Fuck all that flashy prequel nonsense and give me back my ESB type duels.
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She was fighting off thugs near the beginning. And the guy trying to steal BB8 backed off without a fight. She can hold her own from growing up alone on a rough world. I thought the worst was her using Force mind control. That I could not swallow. The rest was understandable. Kylo Ren is basically a very weak and untrained Anakin-Vader.

itsjustsurvival said:
I actually liked the villain not being a master. Something really compelling about both the main protagonist and antagonist still having so much to learn.
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Agreed. This is the absolute weakest either side has ever been. I'll take the three scrubs with lightsabers in this movie over anything in the PT.
 
robotrock said:
Who's the old dude in the opening scene that Kylo Ren slashes?
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He is a less effective Obi-Wan character. A guy that is so trusted by Luke that he has his own piece of the map is within walking distance of a girl with massive force powers. Oh and by the way, she was abandoned by her parents on a desert planet when she was young.

Rey is in my mind clearly Luke's daughter and she was left there as a kid with this old guy to look after her. She was probably supposed to get the map piece if she ever developed force powers but Kylo moved shite along faster than expected.
 
Anyone have a link to that thread about Disney getting some pictures of new toys taken down? I'm interested in knowing what got spoiled by the toys.
 
Plagueis died according to Palpatine:

"Unfortunately, he taught his apprentice everything he knew. Then his apprentice killed him in his sleep. Ironic. He could save others from death, but not himself."

So that is all we know, now Snoke has a huge fucking cut down the middle of his forehead, it looks like a lighsaber slash, so to me that was Palpatine attempting to kill him.

Its possible Plaguies backed away from the scene because he feared Palpatine and returned after Palpatine had died.
 
Jerm411 said:
I think it would've been much more effective if you would've found out when Han confronted him on the bridge and after he puts the lightsaber through him...
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I think revealing Ren as Han's son, revealing his name to be Ben, and then killing Han would have been too much to deliver to the audience all at once.

I was surprised, but in a good way, that they revealed Ren's parentage in this movie. And I thought it worked -- it's set up long enough that it doesn't feel ridiculous, and it isn't teased out over multiple movies before it became too obvious.
 
Mega said:
He's awkward and a nerd, trying REALLY hard to be a badass like the stories he heard of Vader. You can tell the upper members of the First Order see him as a sniveling shit who hasn't been shot out of an airlock because of his powers. Remember when Luke got away at the end of ESB and every single person on the bridge is dead silent and frozen in place? Vader did nothing and he still has that effect. Kylo doesn't command that level of fear and respect.
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Yeah basically exactly what I thought (god I'm so happy to be able to read this thread now!!!!)

I actually felt bad for Ben starting with his confession to Vader. All he wants is greatness, as is his family birthright, and he has absolutely no idea how to do that.

Interestingly my daughter pointed out early on in the movie "he really is vader's grandson. He's whiny just like Anakin.........."

But yes, he wants his birthright and will do anything to get it, with the tragic part being that he's never fully committed, and thinks killing Han is that showing of commitment.
 
Future PhaZe said:
the fact that he was Hans son was really unsettling to me actually--the entire state of the galaxy seemed grave almost at once after that was revealed

like...yea...Luke goofed.
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Oh yeah I think overall it's a good plot point. I dunno, I guess I just didn't want to know it just yet. Maybe have that helmet come off at the end of the second movie so the mystery could remain, at least for a while, but obviously with the situation with Han that couldn't really work.
 
Einchy said:
Anyone have a link to that thread about Disney getting some pictures of new toys taken down? I'm interested in knowing what got spoiled by the toys.
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That Rey gets the lightsaber. I had a feeling that was going to happen anyway, so it's not that big of a deal.
 
Jerm411 said:
I think it would've been much more effective if you would've found out when Han confronted him on the bridge and after he puts the lightsaber through him...
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I know why they didn't do that bc it would've been the same as Luke/Vader. They should've done it when Han sees him take Rey and then talks to Leia about it. I think that would have had more shock value.

When Snoke reveals it, we haven't seen enough of Kylo and Han to be that shocked by it.
 
Maoyama said:
He is a less effective Obi-Wan character. A guy that is so trusted by Luke that he has his own piece of the map is within walking distance of a girl with massive force powers. Oh and by the way, she was abandoned by her parents on a desert planet when she was young.

Rey is in my mind clearly Luke's daughter and she was left there as a kid with this old guy to look after her. She was probably supposed to get the map piece if she ever developed force powers but Kylo moved shite along faster than expected.
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I hadnt thought about that either, so it intensifies the feeling that she is Luke's.
 
Ziltoidia 9 said:
Im pretty sure its Luke. I think he put her on a planet to learn how to scrap, maybe he felt nostalgic about how he was raised. After Ben turned and killed his Jedi order, he couldn't take a chance with his daughter.
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thats what I was thinking but my question about a potential son/ daughter for luke has always been who in the world would the mother be?

also i could see him convincing leia to do the same to her daughter/ his niece
she may have never even told han about her because he def wouldnt have been down to abandon her like that
 
Jerm411 said:
I think it would've been much more effective if you would've found out when Han confronted him on the bridge and after he puts the lightsaber through him...
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And we only really see his face after he gets the scar from Rey. Like she slashes his face and breaking part of it, and then he takes it off completely for the first time. Would've been more impactful.
 
I love that Rey called Kylo out on the fact that he's just a Vader wannabe.

Also, did he crush Vader's helmet when he slammed his down? It looked like the same pedestal and there were ashes beneath it.
 
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