[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens - It's True. All of it.

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I'm surprised that people are questioning the fact that Finn had some proficiency with the light saber (though obviously not much).

They show the one storm trooper with the electrified beam weapon thingy. To me that says that Storm Troopers have had some training in hand to hand melee combat, which means Finn would have had that training too.

He obviously wasn't that good, but the skill he demonstrated seemed to be perfectly reasonable.
 
Does Phasma even do anything in the movie besides walk around? I don't remember her doing anything in the village.

So she's the Boba Fett pretty much?

I'm just hoping to see her have a really cool arc in VIII and/or (hopefully and) IX. I mean, she must be pretty taken aback by this upstart traitor!
 
Star Wars was never as black and white as you're stating ever since Empire Strikes Back. See: Lando's betrayal in Cloud City, the twist that the Great Jedi Master is the silly little creature, conflicted Vader as a prisoner to his more powerful master, "I am your father." And even then, Eps IV had Leia being tortured and that whole business with Alderaan and Luke's parents gruesome remains clearly on display.

Um, yes it was. How is Lando some grey area? Lando was basically Han Solo before he joined the Rebellion, a thief with a heart of gold. All the other evil things you are mentioning was done by the Empire. In order for the OT to not be black and white you would have to give examples of the Rebels doing evil or questionable things. However, that never really happens. The only questionable part of the OT was Yoda and Old Ben, especially when Yoda was telling Luke he should let Leia and Han die so he could finish his training. But, in the end he ignores that and goes anyway.

So she's the Boba Fett pretty much?

I'm just hoping to see her have a really cool arc in VIII and/or (hopefully and) IX. I mean, she must be pretty taken aback by this upstart traitor!

See I don't get her comparison to Boba Fett since he was an actual menacing character who did stuff. He talked shit to Vader, tracked Han Solo, and captured him and Leia. He also ambushed Luke. All of this was done in one movie. He only gets "cheapened" in ROTJ with his "death." Although, I always liked his twist death, the most badass dude ever taken out by total accident. Phasma did nothing.
 
just got back from the movie, will need to think about it a bit, but my first impressions are pretty positive overall. I definitely do agree that the ending scene was pretty weird, that helicopter shot was not my cup of tea. Needed a line from Luke, or just end the movie 2-3 minutes earlier with the Falcon jumping to hyperspace.
 
So she's the Boba Fett pretty much?

House-ohsnap.gif~c200
 
just got back from the movie, will need to think about it a bit, but my first impressions are pretty positive overall. I definitely do agree that the ending scene was pretty weird, that helicopter shot was not my cup of tea. Needed a line from Luke, or just end the movie 2-3 minutes earlier with the Falcon jumping to hyperspace.

I think it's so much more powerful that he said nothing. It says to me that he was shocked to see another person, let alone his lightsaber of all things.
 
Not wanting to complain, but just asking, wasn't there a Star Wars game where a regular stormtrooper was a main character and eventually became a Jedi, I loved that Finn reminded me of this, but I forgot the name of the Star Wars game.
 
I went in seeing pretty much only 2 of the trailers, and man I was fucking impressed.

I just had a lot of fun, got plenty of chuckles out of me, and I even had some sadness thrown in.

Rey is an awesome character and I really can't wait to see how she develops in the next movie.

I needed more than that ending though. And Luke just sitting there in silence, I was waiting with baited breath. I wonder if she's going to end up being his daughter?
 
Also, why does Kylo scream Traitor at Finn when they're dueling at the end?

It's probably meant as a gesture to drive the point home that he's (trying to be) EVIL, but it just....seems like it falls flat.

It seems like it's personal, but why would Kylo care, specifically, about the First Order's baby-kidnapped-grunt troops?
 
Her being Palpatine's offspring would be interesting
Get some lightning thrown up in here

Haha that was our theory yesterday after the movie. Her being a skywalker being too obvious, and her being a Kenobi would need some major retconning.
 
Just got back from seeing it and I'm not sure that it was even as good as Return of the Jedi. I sat through the majority of the movie waiting for it to actually show something (other than a small twist) new that we had not already seen in the original trilogy (more than once...). Seems like the movie is more of a bridge to bring in new fans with a bunch of nostagia stuff for the old, and a setup for the next two.

Wasn't he wanting to be found with the maps?

It's pretty obvious that he was since R2 had the main map, and had been in standby mode since Luke had departed.

Does Phasma even do anything in the movie besides walk around? I don't remember her doing anything in the village.

She has like three lines in the movie, and they made a huge deal about her character in the press. Oh, because it's a female stormtrooper commander! Yet her she was a noncharacter overall.
 
DId anyone else think blowing up the Senate was too much? Was it a direct jab at the prequels? lol

Wait, what? I was sure that it was a random planet, not Coruscant itself. If this turns out to be true, I will be seriously disappointed. Coruscant was awesome and one of the first elements of the old Expanded Universe to be incorporated into the official films, IIRC. I understand the need to move away from the prequels, but they are part of the franchise and set up valuable parts of the lore of this world, I hope they aren't as consistently ignored in the next two films.
 
Also, why does Kylo scream Traitor at Finn when they're dueling at the end?

It's probably meant as a gesture to drive the point home that he's (trying to be) EVIL, but it just....seems like it falls flat.

It seems like it's personal, but why would Kylo care, specifically, about the First Order's baby-kidnapped-grunt troops?

Probably because not only did he defy the First Order and give them the piece of the map to Luke, but he also wields the power of the Light Side, I would guess.
 
I'm kinda digging Snoke

He's got room to grow, and I wanna see it happen. Of course, that just means that they have to make him very interesting. He can't just be the Emperor. I hope he is actually very small, Yoda-sized, and operates very anti-Yoda in his principles (thus the reason why he projects himself to such a great size).

Not wanting to complain, but just asking, wasn't there a Star Wars game where a regular stormtrooper was a main character and eventually became a Jedi, I loved that Finn reminded me of this, but I forgot the name of the Star Wars game.

Was it this?

Star_Wars_Super_Bombad_Racing_boxart.jpg


Wasn't he wanting to be found with the maps?

Did he? I thought that people were just looking for him and tracking down clues. Why did he leave if he wanted to be found?
 
Just got back from seeing it and I'm not sure that it was even as good as Return of the Jedi. I sat through the majority of the movie waiting for it to actually show something (other than a small twist) new that we had not already seen in the original trilogy (more than once...). Seems like the movie is more of a bridge to bring in new fans with a bunch of nostagia stuff for the old, and a setup for the next two.

I think you posted this in the wrong thread.
 
The movie is definitely Star Wars. I loved it but I thought the echoing of the OT was a bit overdone. I understood it, coming full circle and all, but FUCK ME build better protection for your mega-weapon, dammit! Third time definitely wasn't the charm!

Other than that - amazing cast. Everyone was perfect. Kylo turned out to be a lot more badass than I thought. You can tell he has a lot going on and I think Snoke is going to work him over the same way he did Palpatine, or at least try to.
 
Does Phasma even do anything in the movie besides walk around? I don't remember her doing anything in the village.

She was completely wasted and why would a captain know anything about how to turn off the shields, let alone why she would do it cause she has a blaster pointed to her head?

I'm surprised that people are questioning the fact that Finn had some proficiency with the light saber (though obviously not much).

They show the one storm trooper with the electrified beam weapon thingy. To me that says that Storm Troopers have had some training in hand to hand melee combat, which means Finn would have had that training too.

He obviously wasn't that good, but the skill he demonstrated seemed to be perfectly reasonable.

Well seeing as Finn was a janitor at one point and that every single other Stormtrooper did not carry that lightning beam weapon, it's easy to jump to the conclusion that that one trooper is specially trained and it was not given to all of the troopers.
 
Also, why does Kylo scream Traitor at Finn when they're dueling at the end?

It's probably meant as a gesture to drive the point home that he's (trying to be) EVIL, but it just....seems like it falls flat.

It seems like it's personal, but why would Kylo care, specifically, about the First Order's baby-kidnapped-grunt troops?

Because he's a traitor...not only to The First Order, but to the Dark Side.

Seemed obvious.

Also has no one read any of the comics/books directly dealing with Fiinn? Yeesh.
 
Also, why does Kylo scream Traitor at Finn when they're dueling at the end?

It's probably meant as a gesture to drive the point home that he's (trying to be) EVIL, but it just....seems like it falls flat.

It seems like it's personal, but why would Kylo care, specifically, about the First Order's baby-kidnapped-grunt troops?

Maybe he's taking to the lightsaber.

Nah, it's about betraying the First Order and the Dark Side.
 
This movie just makes me upset that Harrison Ford phoned in so many of his most recent roles because we can clearly see from this movie that when he gives a shit, he's still one of the most charismatic and likable actors you'll ever see on film.

It's going to be a tragedy whenever Ford succumbs to death for real :(
I'd focus less on these more morbid aspects of the situation and more on the fact that the real Han Solo is back on the silver screen right now at your local cinema.
 
It's probably meant as a gesture to drive the point home that he's (trying to be) EVIL, but it just....seems like it falls flat.

It seems like it's personal, but why would Kylo care, specifically, about the First Order's baby-kidnapped-grunt troops?

Hes a frustrated, emotional wreck.
 
Rey is definitely Luke's kid. Too much talk about family and too much power in the Force not to be. You might say it's too simple but Star Wars was never all that complicated.

I just can't wait for Episode VIII. VII did a great job whetting the appetite for more Star Wars.
 
That would absolutely ruin Finn's character, and make him a gigantic idiot.

He signs up for the Order because he's young and naive, because he needs a job, because insert whatever. Then see's them shooting a bunch of innocent people and bolts.

How is that a giganitc idiot or even change the character much at all?
 
Not wanting to complain, but just asking, wasn't there a Star Wars game where a regular stormtrooper was a main character and eventually became a Jedi, I loved that Finn reminded me of this, but I forgot the name of the Star Wars game.

Dark Forces was similar to this. Kyle Katarn wasn't a storm trooper though. He was more a Han Solo type in the first game. In the second and third games, he becomes a Jedi.
 
I'm surprised that people are questioning the fact that Finn had some proficiency with the light saber (though obviously not much).

They show the one storm trooper with the electrified beam weapon thingy. To me that says that Storm Troopers have had some training in hand to hand melee combat, which means Finn would have had that training too.

He obviously wasn't that good, but the skill he demonstrated seemed to be perfectly reasonable.

Especially for a rank and file/sanitation trooper.
If only they'd done something similar with Rey's force prowess. How hard would it have been to change the "sitting in the sand wearing a pilot helmet" scene to a "sitting in the sand frustratingly trying to use nascent force powers on a pilot helmet" scene.
 
Well seeing as Finn was a janitor at one point and that every single other Stormtrooper did not carry that lightning beam weapon, it's easy to jump to the conclusion that that one trooper is specially trained and it was not given to all of the troopers.

Him being a janitor was irrelevant. They all have some sort of combat training outside of their day to day duties. I don't see why it's unreasonable to presume that they all get some basic melee training.

Regardless, he was defeated pretty much immediately, so it's not even a plot hole even if they didn't get any training like that.
 
I loved it. Didn't notice many real plot holes. Most can be explained by the audience not knowing everything which is totally ok.

The movie felt a bit too packed though. Felt more like two movies cut into one. Never really got a chance to breathe.

I really really liked Kylo.
Oh and Billie Lourd actually had a line! <3

[edit] I don't know why but I absolutely loved the line about Kylo being seduced by the light side....

You literally have no idea how much I loved that part as well. Dude was crazy conflicted, and it was pretty chilling hearing him talk to Vaders helmet asking for advice on being a full on sith badass like his grandpa.. He seemed so committed/showed a lot of passion on becoming a sith lord. Its interesting to see a "padawan" type of apprentice from a Siths point of view. Maul/Dooku/Vader/Etc all had their sith shit together during the movies, Kylo is still just a wannabe sith and it'll be awesome to see his development into one.
 
I'm kinda digging Snoke

He's got room to grow, and I wanna see it happen. Of course, that just means that they have to make him very interesting. He can't just be the Emperor. I hope he is actually very small, Yoda-sized, and operates very anti-Yoda in his principles (thus the reason why he projects himself to such a great size).

I actually had this thought. I don't think Snoke will be physically intimidating when we actually see him but his power will be insane.
 
Luke probably blocked out her memories and experience while suppressing her Force powers in order to make her undetectable to the new enemies. Luke did not have full Jedi training before his mentors died and probably knew he would get stomped by Snoke, leaving Rey to die easily.

This is like PT/fanfic level goofiness.
 
One of the things I was worried about was how they'd end up trying too hard to make me like the new cast and really fall flat... But I thought they did a fantastic job. They really managed to sell me on them and I have to say i'm a big fan of the newbies.
 
You still don't get it. All the stuff you mentioned is simple good guys vs bad guys. No grey. No ambiguity.

Solution? Finn is a regular dude who signed up for the Order and once he saw what they were really all about fled. The rest of the Troopers are evil space nazis.

Easy. Done. Doesn't change anything about Finn's character and doesn't make me pause when a starkiller is blow up and wonder how many brainwashed child soldiers were in that explosion.

Like I said, apparently child soldiers are a thing now. Big fucking deal. This to me is not at odds with a universe that has plenty of misery: slave laborers, sex slaves, serial killers, bounty hunters, and even good guys like Han who regularly kill without flinching. Why do you want to be coddled? Who promised you this movie franchise was rated G?
 
The movie is definitely Star Wars. I loved it but I thought the echoing of the OT was a bit overdone. I understood it, coming full circle and all, but FUCK ME build better protection for your mega-weapon, dammit! Third time definitely wasn't the charm!

Other than that - amazing cast. Everyone was perfect. Kylo turned out to be a lot more badass than I thought. You can tell he has a lot going on and I think Snoke is going to work him over the same way he did Palpatine, or at least try to.

To be fair, there were a couple neat things about the Starkiller beam.

1. Visually, it was cool. The buildup to the actual destruction had me interested, whereas the Death Star was just a point-and-shoot deal. The wait for the shot was pretty rad.

2. it actually did something, whereas in Jedi the mission was to make sure that the Death Star didn't do a thing.

And double to be fair, it wouldn't be as bad if Jedi didn't straight up reuse it in the literal sense!
 
Let's get to it:

The good:

Fin: Having one of the main protagonists be a Stormtrooper turning good who was also a janitor on Starkiller Base? It works. Way better than expected. He is written well and has great chemistry with Rey.

Rey: Love her. She's vulnerable but tough. Naive but smart. She's Solos successor and Lukes in one person. She cares and you instantly care about her. It will be interesting to see, if they really go through with her being Luke's daughter. There is much possibility there with Vaders grandchildren going at each others throat, but it may also fail very easily.

Kilo Ren: He's Hans son, Vaders grandchild and conflicted. It's alluded that he seeks this much power to do something grand, even if we don't know yet what and why. He is overestimating himself and at the same time frightened that he doesn't live up to his own expectations. He's a Vader fanboy in the best sense. His design alludes to Vader, but doesn't copy it. The helmet seems to be his burden and literally of much weight.
He was set up great and I hope he stays for a while.

In short: I really liked most characters. They were well written and set on an interesting path I want to see played out.

Harrison Ford: First time in over 10 years he showed some range and gave a damn. I loved seeing him getting back into the role and he nailed it.

The practical effects: Every time they could have used CGI and used a practical effect instead I wanted to applaud JJ and friends. In the first half of the movie it works really well and immerses you way more than an CGI could have managed.

BB 8: The best update R2D2 could have gotten. He's the same character, but done in a very good way. I'd love to see the making off of this guy. I'm sure some things were insanely hard to figure out in a practical way, but I'm glad this little guy kept rocking back and forth.

The first half of the movie:
For me this was perfect Star Wars. Yes, there was this insane coincidence of Han finding the Falcon, but everything else was perfectly set up. The bad guys, especially Ren had a phenomenal introduction. Poe's short journey was fun. The main characters are set up really well and even the excuse for using the Millennium Falcon again made perfect sense.

The Lightsaber fight: It was a really good fight and maybe the best in the movies so far. The raw power approach and the wounded dangerous animal behaviour of Ren really came through. He was powerful and dangerous but not at the height of his abilities. Fin and Ren made the best of the situation they could and even if Rey had the situation a little bit too much under control in the end, I really enjoyed the way this fight played out.

The Bad:
Starkiller Base: Everything about this thing dragged the movie down. It doesn't make much sense from a practical point of view, it's literally the same idea already failed twice for the Empire, it still takes up too much time for introduction and is hokey at best nevertheless. It's destruction doesn't make much sense the way they explained it. And the destruction of the 5 planets was way worse than the destruction of Vulcan in ST:09 - we were just not invested in any of them. We've seen nothing of them. We don't care for them. A simple chase story from a Star Destroyer would have made much more sense.

R2D2/Card stuff: Minor point, but didn't make much sense the way they presented it. The way I understood it, R2 was using his energy for finding or reconstructing the card? And nobody understood what he was doing to the point that C3PO had to explain the plot point to another droid? Not very elegantly solved.

The Chrome Trooper/Plasma: Nicely set up, but badly used. She just took the shields down because some Ex-Trooper points a weapon at her? She cooperates way too easily for such a high rank.

Pandering to nostalgia: I expected high levels of nostalgia, but the way the story was set up, it was a bit too much. They played it a little bit too safe. It was at times just Episode IV retold with sprinkles of V throughout.

So aside form Starkiller Base it's only minor stuff I don't want to nitpick about too much - some things didn't make too much sense, but they fit the atmosphere.

The Ugly:
Snoke: Why CGI? Why use him at all at this point? Because you have to have a imperator like figure? It would have been really interesting with Ren as the highest up, being the tormented characters he is, but oh well.

In the end I liked it. It's not the best Star Wars, that title still belongs to V, but this could become my second favorite one. Depends on the rewatches. And I can't wait for more. That's always a good sign.

I agree with most of it, you get it!
I love the film, it´s not better than any of the original trilogy movies but it is lightyears above the prequels.
However I do have a few things to say.

Finn: felt like his role was meh. Could have been better. Also he aint a jedi so it just feels wrong that he even landed a hit on Kylo in that saber fight.

Snoke, totally agree wit you there, why not make him more interesting looking and not use damn CG. Could have been handle so much better.

Rey: Skywalkers daughter no doubt. Awesome character and she nailed it! Best new Character along with Poe and Kylo IMO.

Kylo: Liked him a lot, him killing off Han was a great for his character buildup in the next 2 movies. Ultimate evil and no turning back now. Loved it.

Luke: well he is bad ass looking, cant wait to see him in EP8.

R2D2: this was so poorly handled in the movie, these idiots are looking for Luke but dont check R2D2 that mysteriously shut down as Luke left? really? thats not suspicious at all?
 
The way Han and Leia referred to Snoke made it sound an awful lot like they were personally familiar with him. I wonder if he isn't just some ultra malevolent entity and is actually trying to do some good.

They try to obfuscate Rey's history way too much for to just be some random ultra force sensitive person. She might not be Luke daughter, but she has history with some else the audience is familiar with.
 
Rey is definitely Luke's kid. Too much talk about family and too much power in the Force not to be. You might say it's too simple but Star Wars was never all that complicated.

the second part of this new trilogy will allow Luke to say "I am your father"

check and mate 100% confirmed
 
Best Star Wars film since the original... mainly because it was basically a structural copy-paste job. Not that I mind, I still loved it.

- My girl Rey is a leftie!

- Where does the First Order get these resources lol. And how does the Republic let them build a giant sun-powered-planet-killing-planet right under their nose?

- Loved how they handled the Force "awakening" in Rey, with voices and visions. Really cool stylistic territory here that the other films never go into.

- Lots of loose ends that I hope will be addressed in the future, such as Luke's disappearance, Kylo's history, Rey's family, and how Luke's lightsaber ended up in that bar (which feels like they pulled it out of their ass but since this is a trilogy I'll give them the benefit of the doubt).

- Had a feeling that Han was going to die as soon as he stepped onto that bridge. RIP you wild space cowboy.

- So Kylo doesn't even need the mask, he just wears it for style points! What a pretender! Rey was right when she said he was insecure.
 
Rey is definitely Luke's kid. Too much talk about family and too much power in the Force not to be. You might say it's too simple but Star Wars was never all that complicated.

How? With whom?

Would luke betray his training after all he has learnt and experienced?

I understand the logic, with the flashback scene and everything, but I hope its not true.
 
Just came back from seeing this. Random thoughts.

- Acting was kinda bad for the first half I thought. Especially Finn. Daisy got better over the course of the film.
- I wish Snoke was actually a giant dude and not a hologram.
- Adam Driver killed it. Loved him.
- Was the movie too jokey? I found it a bit too humorous.
- I don't think Finn is force sensitive at all.
- What was the point of Captain Phasma?
- Dominic Gleeson was bad as Hux. Might have been the writing too, which was all over the place for me. Some good, some quite bad.

7/10 I guess.
 
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