Rise of the Tomb Raider is available on Windows Store: Who bought it here ?

Draklawl said:
I had a $50 windows store gift card from some random promotion so I could get the windows store version for $4 out of pocket, so that's what I did

My immediate impression of the way they are handling games was pretty negative. The store doesn't ask you where you want to install it, and automatically installs to your C: drive, which didn't have enough space. I realized this quickly, but let it go to see how it would handle it. Rather than telling me, it just installed 8 gigs of the game and then failed. The store itself has no option to change the default download location so a google search led me to the discovery that the option to change the download location was buried in the general windows options, and even then it just lets you decide the drive, not the actual location.

Downloaded the game, it launched fine with no issues. no overlays seem to work with it, which is a bummer (fraps, rivatuner ect). I was able to get the fps counter from shadowplay to work eventually, but I have no idea how. I just kept turning it off and on and eventually it popped up once.

Next, as I tried to add the game to steam as an non steam game, I discovered my major issue I have with this system. The game files themselves seem to be in a folder in the install drive that, even as my own computer's administrator, windows isn't allowing me access to. I haven't put any real time into actually getting in there outside of double clicking and getting a "you don't have permission to do that" error, but I shouldn't have to.

The interesting thing is, and I would love someone else to take a look at this to see if i'm not crazy, my performance seems to be a bit better than those with similar systems are reporting in the main PC performance thread. I'm getting pretty consistent 60fps with some dips into the 50s and high 40s occasionally on a 2gb GTX 680SLI setup, on high with shadows on medium, which is higher than most benchmarks are saying I should be getting. I'm seeing about 80% utilization on my GPUs

The download/installation location issue is enough of a problem for me that I wouldn't recommend going the windows store route unless you have a significant reason to do so (as I did). I would like someone else to check into that performance thing, as I'm going to assume that there is some other factor in play unless someone else comes back noticing the same thing
Click to expand...

The no folder location is a feature of the new app platform, all apps and games are a single package that can be gracefully removed from your computer without messing with registry or any other stuff. You can even uninstall completely by just right clicking the live tile and uninstalling it.

I can see why it can cause problems with mods, adding to steam and other stuff, though I'm not sure what they are planning to do with that.
 
Draklawl said:
If you work with people on the windows store team, i'm curious if you have any insight as to why a few decisions were made.

1. how you cannot (outside of which drive) choose the location that the game downloads or installs outside of having to edit the registry

2. how users don't have permission to view the game files without editing permissions

3. Why overlays such as rivatuner or fraps fps counters don't work with the windows store version.

I'm just curious why these decisions were made, because I wasn't particularly thrilled with them

Thanks!
Click to expand...

1. Because this is not a Win32 exe, it's an UWP app like any other Windows 10 app. Install locations for apps are system-managed for security and stability purposes. It also prevents things like end-users accidentally installing a software in their documents or desktop and having the uninstaller wipe all their personal data alongside with it (I've seen that happen).

2. That's because a bunch of UWP apps are actually core parts of the system (the start menu, the action center) and this prevents "accidents" like "delete C:\Window".

3. Because overlays work by injecting themselves into other processes' memory (DLL hooking). Since UWP apps are supposed to be secure by design this is not allowed (since that can be used for all sorts of malicious purposes, like keyloggers and hijackers).

In short: UWP apps are meant to be a secure and idiot-proof way of installing, updating and uninstalling applications. With that comes limitations compared to random exe files scattered all over the HDD with broad read and write access to anywhere in the RAM and filesystem, but if you're not okay with that, the Steam version exists.

LukasTaves said:
The no folder location is a feature of the new app platform, all apps and games are a single package that can be gracefully removed from your computer without messing with registry or any other stuff. You can even uninstall completely by just right clicking the live tile and uninstalling it.

I can see why it can cause problems with mods, adding to steam and other stuff, though I'm not sure what they are planning to do with that.
Click to expand...

A UWP game can supports mods (to an extent), but it must be done explicitly: the game would need to allow players to pick a folder where the mod content resides in order to load it. However, it would only work for "content" mods: it wouldn't be possible to perform EXE modifications and DLL injection, for example.
 
Synth said:
It now costs the same as Steam. In regards to limit number of devices, you can install the software to 10 devices without the Steam like restriction of only 1 being able to use it at a time (plus one offline machine)... so it's actually far, far better in that regards, seeing as you can deactivate a device later.

In fact the 10 device stuff is so ridiculously good, that I can see it actually preventing games from hitting the store.
Click to expand...

But I've installed Steam on multiple machines. That 10 installed thing doesn't mean 10 people can play simultaneously.
 
flaxknuckles said:
But I've installed Steam on multiple machines. That 10 installed thing doesn't mean 10 people can play simultaneously.
Click to expand...

I've not tried with ROTTR, but I've played store bought games on different devices simultaneously. I think that's the reason they have the "10 install" limit, as otherwise it wouldn't make sense.
 
M3d10n said:
1. Because this is not a Win32 exe, it's an UWP app like any other Windows 10 app. Install locations for apps are system-managed for security and stability purposes. It also prevents things like end-users accidentally installing a software in their documents or desktop and having the uninstaller wipe all their personal data alongside with it (I've seen that happen).

2. That's because a bunch of UWP apps are actually core parts of the system (the start menu, the action center) and this prevents "accidents" like "delete C:\Window".

3. Because overlays work by injecting themselves into other processes' memory (DLL hooking). Since UWP apps are supposed to be secure by design this is not allowed (since that can be used for all sorts of malicious purposes, like keyloggers and hijackers).

In short: UWP apps are meant to be a secure and idiot-proof way of installing, updating and uninstalling applications. With that comes limitations compared to random exe files scattered all over the HDD with broad read and write access to anywhere in the RAM and filesystem, but if you're not okay with that, the Steam version exists.



A UWP game can supports mods (to an extent), but it must be done explicitly: the game would need to allow players to pick a folder where the mod content resides in order to load it. However, it would only work for "content" mods: it wouldn't be possible to perform EXE modifications and DLL injection, for example.
Click to expand...

TIL. Appreciate the explanation. It makes sense, it's just inconvenient for a few different things, like adding it to steam to play via steamlink. The game itself runs flawlessly though, so I can pretty much forgive it.
 
flaxknuckles said:
But I've installed Steam on multiple machines. That 10 installed thing doesn't mean 10 people can play simultaneously.
Click to expand...

That's exactly what it means. The 10 device thing is like having 10 "Home Xbox" devices. You own it but anyone who is on the device can play it. So yes, in theory, you could give 10 people your login info (high not recommended) and all of them download the game under your account (you still have to authenticate those machines as they should send a 2 auth way of authenticating), they logout of your account, login into theirs, play the game for the FRAY!

I do see this limit getting smaller...but we'll see. I think it was lower before.
 
Zedox said:
That's exactly what it means. The 10 device thing is like having 10 "Home Xbox" devices. You own it but anyone who is on the device can play it. So yes, in theory, you could give 10 people your login info (high not recommended) and all of them download the game under your account (you still have to authenticate those machines as they should send a 2 auth way of authenticating), they logout of your account, login into theirs, play the game for the FRAY!

I do see this limit getting smaller...but we'll see. I think it was lower before.
Click to expand...

Actually I think in Windows 8 raised the limit to something insane like 81 (was 5 initially). I imagine they didn't really care at the time, as the store didn't have anything that people would really care to abuse.

I definitely see the limit decreasing for Windows 10 though, or at least a separate tier for Xbox games... because 10 devices is a pretty big deterrent for putting your games on it tbh.
 
I thought KI would be the first title to release this way. Glad to see it was successfully implemented.

Next on the agenda.
  1. If you're not going to offer crossbuy atleast offer a discount for people that already digitally purchased it on Xbox One. I'd buy it again.
  2. If the version exists on Xbox One I want synced saves
 
Synth said:
Actually I think in Windows 8 raised the limit to something insane like 81 (was 5 initially). I imagine they didn't really care at the time, as the store didn't have anything that people would really care to abuse.

I definitely see the limit decreasing for Windows 10 though, or at least a separate tier for Xbox games... because 10 devices is a pretty big deterrent for putting your games on it tbh.
Click to expand...

Ah yes, I do remember the 81 amount. Yea, I see them doing something like 3-5 or something. I think the market is going to determine if 10 is too much once they get feedback from sales and such. Since it still takes people logging into an account for that download to happen. One or two people, I can see happening...but 10. That's a lot of sharing...especially with the amount of information is saved on those accounts.

Still, exciting to see a big game on the store and more to come this year. This year shall be interesting.
 
hwalker84 said:
I thought KI would be the first title to release this way. Glad to see it was successfully implemented.

Next on the agenda.
  1. If you're not going to offer crossbuy atleast offer a discount for people that already digitally purchased it on Xbox One. I'd buy it again.
  2. If the version exists on Xbox One I want synced saves
Click to expand...

Yeah it'd be nice to sync saves between the Xbox and Win10 versions. In that case though why not just do cross buy?
 
Herp Derpington said:
Yeah it'd be nice to sync saves between the Xbox and Win10 versions. In that case though why not just do cross buy?
Click to expand...

That article posted earlier says it takes advantage of Xbox Live cloud saves. I was just about to ask if anyone double-dipped and if the saves work between devices. That'd be nice.
 
Caayn said:
I did.

One major downside of it is that MSI Afterburner/RTSS doesn't seem to work with Windows Apps :(

And for some reason the 361.75 Nvidia driver is very prone to crashing when running this game >.>
Click to expand...

Thanks for sharing. I had a feeling RTSS wouldn't play nice with the Win Store games. Definite deal breaker for me at this point, as I need my frame limiter for stable frame times. Hope that gets worked on, as I'm sure there are going to be some exclusives there down the line that I'd want to buy.
 
Asd202 said:
Those Windows Store prices are a fucking joke.
Click to expand...

You mean this price? The first price was a bug. It's been fixed.

L1vQdoO.png
 
Zedox said:
Hey, thanks for the information. I want to know if you know if the game was made with UWP from the beginning or was the game using Project Centennial (bridge for Win32 apps to UWP) for its development. Obviously, that's if you know.
Click to expand...

This is not using Centennial, as far as I know.
 
Personally I'm a little weary of games being Windows 10 exclusive, but from what people are saying, the Windows Store + XBL is actually a legit competitor to Steam.
I just wish they'd support more OS's, and flesh out the Xbox menu to include chat and other things.
 
cakely said:
Microsoft would rather use ROTR as an incentive for you to upgrade to Windows 10 instead of actually making the sale on the OS that you already own.

And, yeah ... look! There's a Windows 8 version already waiting for you in the Steam store. I don't think they thought this through.
Click to expand...

Haha! Yes. You're right.

Wait. No.

The Win32 API on Windows 7/8/etc and the UWP API on Windows 10 are two completely different, incompatible things.

So for those who have not upgraded to Windows 10, there's the Steam version. They've already thought things through and can now successfully cater to two sets of end-users.
 
Saw a review on the Windows store that you can't play this game without an internet connection. If that's true I can't buy anything off this store no matter how cheap.
 
flaxknuckles said:
Saw a review on the Windows store that you can't play this game without an internet connection. If that's true I can't buy anything off this store no matter how cheap.
Click to expand...

Well, that review was wrong because I just completely disabled networking on my machine and the game launched and loaded into gameplay without any issues.
 
bananafactory said:
It was $60 on Steam and $80 on the Windows store

Nah fam
Click to expand...
Price bug as mentioned before. I can confirm that it's really easy to get your money back from MS if you bought it for the old price.
flaxknuckles said:
Saw a review on the Windows store that you can't play this game without an internet connection. If that's true I can't buy anything off this store no matter how cheap.
Click to expand...
Review is incorrect. I just unplugged the ethernet cable from my PC during gameplay and the game didn't stop or crash. Also I could boot the game like normal with the ethernet cable still unplugged.

It might need a working internet connection for the first boot though.
 
@dLMN8R

It's quite an achievement seeing a very complex game as an app. Great work.

But how many will port their games to the universal platform? I thought the whole point of Win10 was to make Desktop apps possible on the store so you will have an easier time convincing devs to port them there.
 
dLMN8R said:
If that was the case, wouldn't Microsoft have blocked the Steam release entirely? Of course not. The reality is that Microsoft's publishing partnership with Square Enix both gave most PC gamers what they want (a Steam release), and also a version from the Windows 10 Store for those already on Windows 10.
Click to expand...
Microsoft would have had to pay SE a far greater sum if they wanted to prevent a Steam release. Because what other incentive would SE have to agree to forgo the bulk of the market for PC games?
 
flaxknuckles said:
Saw a review on the Windows store that you can't play this game without an internet connection. If that's true I can't buy anything off this store no matter how cheap.
Click to expand...

Jesus. Some sites should just shut their mouth when they don't know what they are talking about. So much misinformation on the net. *sigh*
 
I just got this because I was curious.
Has anyone else who bought it from the Windows store been able to disable v-sync? My only two options are double and triple buffered.

I haven't been able to take ownership of the folder successfully nor get the shadowplay overlay working either. It seems to run well, better than the Xbox One version from what I can tell, but I'm so used to a framerate counter or overlay when first playing a new PC game.
 
Draklawl said:
I had a $50 windows store gift card from some random promotion so I could get the windows store version for $4 out of pocket, so that's what I did

My immediate impression of the way they are handling games was pretty negative. The store doesn't ask you where you want to install it, and automatically installs to your C: drive, which didn't have enough space. I realized this quickly, but let it go to see how it would handle it. Rather than telling me, it just installed 8 gigs of the game and then failed. The store itself has no option to change the default download location so a google search led me to the discovery that the option to change the download location was buried in the general windows options, and even then it just lets you decide the drive, not the actual location.

Downloaded the game, it launched fine with no issues. no overlays seem to work with it, which is a bummer (fraps, rivatuner ect). I was able to get the fps counter from shadowplay to work eventually, but I have no idea how. I just kept turning it off and on and eventually it popped up once.

Next, as I tried to add the game to steam as an non steam game, I discovered my major issue I have with this system. The game files themselves seem to be in a folder in the install drive that, even as my own computer's administrator, windows isn't allowing me access to. I haven't put any real time into actually getting in there outside of double clicking and getting a "you don't have permission to do that" error, but I shouldn't have to.

The interesting thing is, and I would love someone else to take a look at this to see if i'm not crazy, my performance seems to be a bit better than those with similar systems are reporting in the main PC performance thread. I'm getting pretty consistent 60fps with some dips into the 50s and high 40s occasionally on a 2gb GTX 680SLI setup, on high with shadows on medium, which is higher than most benchmarks are saying I should be getting. I'm seeing about 80% utilization on my GPUs

The download/installation location issue is enough of a problem for me that I wouldn't recommend going the windows store route unless you have a significant reason to do so (as I did). I would like someone else to check into that performance thing, as I'm going to assume that there is some other factor in play unless someone else comes back noticing the same thing
Click to expand...

Thanks, really informative. Sounds like a total mess in terms of the filling system.
 
flaxknuckles said:
Saw a review on the Windows store that you can't play this game without an internet connection. If that's true I can't buy anything off this store no matter how cheap.
Click to expand...
Reading this as a joke, its got to be a joke right. If you have no internet connection you cant even buy it or download it, therefore cant play it.
 
I'll buy it on Steam. Given MS previous PC ventures I don't trust their store that I'll be able to use software I bought there in a couple of years. Got more trust in Steam tbh.
 
Draklawl said:
I had a $50 windows store gift card from some random promotion so I could get the windows store version for $4 out of pocket, so that's what I did

My immediate impression of the way they are handling games was pretty negative. The store doesn't ask you where you want to install it, and automatically installs to your C: drive, which didn't have enough space. I realized this quickly, but let it go to see how it would handle it. Rather than telling me, it just installed 8 gigs of the game and then failed. The store itself has no option to change the default download location so a google search led me to the discovery that the option to change the download location was buried in the general windows options, and even then it just lets you decide the drive, not the actual location.

Downloaded the game, it launched fine with no issues. no overlays seem to work with it, which is a bummer (fraps, rivatuner ect). I was able to get the fps counter from shadowplay to work eventually, but I have no idea how. I just kept turning it off and on and eventually it popped up once.

Next, as I tried to add the game to steam as an non steam game, I discovered my major issue I have with this system. The game files themselves seem to be in a folder in the install drive that, even as my own computer's administrator, windows isn't allowing me access to. I haven't put any real time into actually getting in there outside of double clicking and getting a "you don't have permission to do that" error, but I shouldn't have to.

The interesting thing is, and I would love someone else to take a look at this to see if i'm not crazy, my performance seems to be a bit better than those with similar systems are reporting in the main PC performance thread. I'm getting pretty consistent 60fps with some dips into the 50s and high 40s occasionally on a 2gb GTX 680SLI setup, on high with shadows on medium, which is higher than most benchmarks are saying I should be getting. I'm seeing about 80% utilization on my GPUs

The download/installation location issue is enough of a problem for me that I wouldn't recommend going the windows store route unless you have a significant reason to do so (as I did). I would like someone else to check into that performance thing, as I'm going to assume that there is some other factor in play unless someone else comes back noticing the same thing
Click to expand...

Yikes.

On topic, if I ever buy the game I'll get it on Steam. I used GFWL and still remember it.
 
Whelp.

Just got a refund submitted for this.
I wanted to see how this game would work as an "app," but not being able to use overlays, not being able to keep ownership of the folder (I could take ownership, but it wouldn't stay that way when I closed the properties box), not being able to disable Vsync made me not want it anymore. It ran well from what I played of it while I had it, for what it's worth (textures and shadows lowered to "high" and AA on SMAA).

Think I'll go buy the steam version now...
 
Justinh said:
Whelp.

Just got a refund submitted for this.
I wanted to see how this game would work as an "app," but not being able to use overlays, not being able to keep ownership of the folder (I could take ownership, but it wouldn't stay that way when I closed the properties box), not being able to disable Vsync made me not want it anymore. It ran well from what I played of it while I had it, for what it's worth (textures and shadows lowered to "high" and AA on SMAA).

Think I'll go buy the steam version now...
Click to expand...

Could you let us know if you notice any performance differences with the Steam version? You may be the only person to actually try both on the same PC.
 
Synth said:
Could you let us know if you notice any performance differences with the Steam version? You may be the only person to actually try both on the same PC.
Click to expand...

I'll say what I can notice, but I don't know how informative it'll be. I couldn't get an overlay working with the app and other than when I pumped up all the settings and the AA and it felt slower all I can really say is that it felt great (compared to the Xbox One version). I'll play the first hour or two without overlays and the same settings with steam and try and see if I can notice anything.

One thing I can say now, is from just going by the task manager: The Windows 10 store download was coming in at around and less than 40 Mbps, right now as I'm downloading from steam the task managers indicates that I'm downloading from between 109-120 Mbps.
 
Justinh said:
I'll say what I can notice, but I don't know how informative it'll be. I couldn't get an overlay working with the app and other than pumping up all the settings and the AA when it felt slower all I can really say is that it felt great (compared to the Xbox One version).

One thing I can say now, is from just going by the task manager: The Windows 10 store download was coming in at around and less than 40 Mbps, right now as I'm downloading from steam the task managers indicates that I'm downloading from between 109-120 Mbps.
Click to expand...

Yea, just if there's anything noticeable would be helpful enough really. It'd be nice to have a proper DF comparison between them to see if the Win10 version incurs any sort of penalty compared to a Win32 application of the same game... but simply knowing if the difference is noticeable or not would be helpful enough in the meantime.

The download stuff sounds like a familiar story though. It seemed like forever downloading the Fable Legends beta compared to downloading that same game (which weighed in at the same size) on the Xbox console.
 
Synth said:
Yea, just if there's anything noticeable would be helpful enough really. It'd be nice to have a proper DF comparison between them to see if the Win10 version incurs any sort of penalty compared to a Win32 application of the same game... but simply knowing if the difference is noticeable or not would be helpful enough in the meantime.
Click to expand...
I'd love to see a DF comparison of the two versions. I mean, I'm really curious if there's an advantage to the game being a Windows 10 app versus the Win32 steam version. I'm sure they have the right video capture tools that could do a proper good comparison.

Another thing is that I didn't get that weird SLI water bug (wait one, lemme get a link). Makes me wonder if it was fixed, or if the Windows 10 version doesn't or won't support SLI at all. I'll try it with and without the Nvidia inspector thingy with the steam version.

Windows 10 store download was 26 GB. I didn't think to check the folder size when I had it installed.
Steam download is 17.3 GB with a folder size of 18.4 GB.
 
Justinh said:
Another thing is that I didn't get that weird SLI water bug (wait one, lemme get a link). Makes me wonder if it was fixed, or if the Windows 10 version doesn't or won't support SLI at all. I'll try it with and without the Nvidia inspector thingy with the steam version.
Click to expand...

I reported that I was getting decent utilization in my first post, it turns out my monitor wasn't reporting correctly. I'm not seeing more than 10-15% utilization on the 2nd GPU with the game ready patch on the windows 10 version. Tried the fix from the performance thread and saw no difference. Looks like might not be working correctly
 
Considering that CDkeys.com was offering the Steam version during preorder for $30 and GMG has been offering the same Steam version for $40 after launch, I have no idea why someone would pay $60 for it on Windows Store.
 
BennyBlanco said:
Does this version have that 360 achievement audio cue?
Click to expand...

I played up until a little after (game spoiler:)
the bear
, and I didn't get any achievements. I don't know if there was something wrong or anything. I mean I (achievement spoiler:)
translated a monolith
at least once, and that should've popped as an achievement.

I don't know what I can say about the two versions other than they both "felt pretty good." I think I noticed that in the steam version, the framerate felt a little "chunkier" during parts when shit would get crazy and the camera would shake around.
I noticed while playing through this time that I had SLI disabled for some reason (which made me feel stupid) but I played the same part with it disabled in this version, too. I also haven't tried playing with vsync disabled yet (which I'm going to do going forward. Only had it enabled now because I couldn't turn it off in the Windows version)

Draklawl said:
I reported that I was getting decent utilization in my first post, it turns out my monitor wasn't reporting correctly. I'm not seeing more than 10-15% utilization on the 2nd GPU with the game ready patch on the windows 10 version. Tried the fix from the performance thread and saw no difference. Looks like might not be working correctly
Click to expand...

I didn't even think about running something in the background and looking at the graphs later. huh...
 
With Microsoft's track record of software support (GFWL and now the dying Windows Phone), why would anyone choose the Windows Store over Steam?
 
jsnepo said:
With Microsoft's track record of software support (GFWL and now the dying Windows Phone), why would anyone choose the Windows Store over Steam?
Click to expand...

Because MS are allowing people to change their location in settings, and buy the games cheap? You can set your location to India, and get the game for less than £10.

I expect them to stop this practise soon enough, but that's a pretty big saving over Steam.
 
M3d10n said:
1. Because this is not a Win32 exe, it's an UWP app like any other Windows 10 app. Install locations for apps are system-managed for security and stability purposes. It also prevents things like end-users accidentally installing a software in their documents or desktop and having the uninstaller wipe all their personal data alongside with it (I've seen that happen).

2. That's because a bunch of UWP apps are actually core parts of the system (the start menu, the action center) and this prevents "accidents" like "delete C:\Window".

3. Because overlays work by injecting themselves into other processes' memory (DLL hooking). Since UWP apps are supposed to be secure by design this is not allowed (since that can be used for all sorts of malicious purposes, like keyloggers and hijackers).
Click to expand...
I'll make this shorter:
Windows "apps" turn your PC into an overpriced console.
 
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