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Batman > Superman: Dawn of Justice |OT| Enter the Knightmare
- Thread starter MisterHero
- Start date
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Terareflection
Member
The problem is that I tend to agree with the naysayers. I need a decently paced movie.
Pretend you are a filmmaker. You are given like twenty ideas for your movie. You throw them all in there without any sort of coherence, pacing, or reason. Seven people know those ideas and just like the fact they are there.
/scene
DeadlyVirus
Member
Half of the movie is good, half is bad.
Could have been much better, could have been worse.
Afleck kills it, not much else to rave about though.
The final fight has more CGI than Star Wars. Overkill really
Could have been much better, could have been worse.
Afleck kills it, not much else to rave about though.
The final fight has more CGI than Star Wars. Overkill really
sunshine and gasoline
Banned
Really disliked how Superman was in here and Lex was pretty damn cringe worthy at times. Batman's parts were pretty much the only parts that I enjoyed. Will have to digest the movie a bit more but currently I'm of the opinion that the movie was pretty mediocre.
Inferno313
Banned
This is the weirdest fucking mainstream comic book movie I've ever seen.
I have no idea how I feel about it.
It's bizarre.
I have no idea how I feel about it.
It's bizarre.
More_Badass
Member
Seems kind of reductive to say that people who were surprised or enjoyed the movie only did because of familiarity or whatnot
Wow that bad huh?
H2intensity
Member
Just saw it..and i ilke it better than Man of Steel. I think it has the same pacing problem with Man of Steel, but this time fortunately it has Batman and Wonder Woman and other things interesting in mid part so it much enjoyable. And the finale in my opinion more epic than Man of Steel,love it.
My only complaint is Cavil and Adams is still boring to watch just like in Man of Steel.
Can't wait for Justice League and Batfleck movies.
My only complaint is Cavil and Adams is still boring to watch just like in Man of Steel.
Can't wait for Justice League and Batfleck movies.
nah it's better than mos by a lot, though still not a great film
suffers from the same problems as asm2 and im2 but feels more disjointed
Based on what I've been reading and the theater reactions it is very close. Still early though.
It's similar in pattern. They had a film that wasn't completely terrible, but not good by any means. Went right into a sequel thinking they could plug the holes and set the ship straight. Ended up just sinking the damn ship in almost the same patten.
KoruptData
Member
I will also say the whole theatre clapped and cheered after the movie.
spootime
Member
I didn't word that very clearly. I meant to say that it's the second worst movie in the modern era of superhero movies (that era starting with the first iron man). I loved iron man
Schweinehund
Member
Re-posting from the DCU thread:
I just saw it, I love it. Firm 8.5/10.
It's really really hard to explain why people are misleading in some of the things they are saying about the movie without spoiling it.
It does have some issues, I'm not going to lie and say it's perfect. But these issues are really minor and more about certain scenes feeling... inappropriate? The knightmare (minor spoilers)
The things I liked: the fights, Lex, Batman (Vague ass spoilers
), Superman's role in the story, Lois (I'm actually surprised she isn't getting more praise, but she's not perfect), the dialogue feels so much more natural for whatever reason, the jokes landed.
The things I disliked: a lot of plot threads going on in the beginning, many ideas being presented quickly in snap bites, its easy to get lost in the movie if you're not paying attention, I would have liked a little longer fight scenes, maybe one more action scene in the first 90 minutes.
The things people may not like: Characterizations (there is a lot of character growth in this movie, it's a central theme), not a lot of exposition, many themes and they may send a conflicted message.
Tonally the movie is fine, the best way I can describe the movie is it's transformative? It's certainly very dark at parts, but one of the core themes... well there is a much brighter future.
The movie is great as is, but man I think they could have easily split it into two and had two stellar movies with the material they have.
ok
AUDIENCE RECEPTION
I went to a 6:00 opening premiere for 2d regular. It was a variety of people, some family and some older people, surprisingly not a lot of people in fan t-shirts, I was one of the few. I would say the theater was 3/4th's full.
People laughed at 5-6 parts I would say. There are jokes in the movies, a couple between Alfred/bruce. Perry has some, Gadot. They're not really quips but more like gags.
I would say half or more of the audience clapped at the end. There's one part in particular where kids were happy, I can't really say but you'll probably know which one it is when you see it. People loved wonder woman, they clapped and got excited for her appearance. Her theme is also really really good.
I know most of the major plot points before I saw the movie, so I came in with reasonable expectations. I think I agree with Verendus's criticisms the most.
TL;DR I want Snyder/Terrio on JL. I'm not even a huge snyder fan, I thought MoS had glaring issues.
I feel like I've seen a completely different film from the critics
I just saw it, I love it. Firm 8.5/10.
It's really really hard to explain why people are misleading in some of the things they are saying about the movie without spoiling it.
It does have some issues, I'm not going to lie and say it's perfect. But these issues are really minor and more about certain scenes feeling... inappropriate? The knightmare (minor spoilers)
is cool, but it really has zero relevance to the plot at hand. It's purely setup for JL. It would have been great as an ending credit scene, as much as I feel those take away from the movie. The scene after it is also a bit out of place.
The things I liked: the fights, Lex, Batman (Vague ass spoilers
I've come to terms with his methods... people were a bit misleading...
The things I disliked: a lot of plot threads going on in the beginning, many ideas being presented quickly in snap bites, its easy to get lost in the movie if you're not paying attention, I would have liked a little longer fight scenes, maybe one more action scene in the first 90 minutes.
The things people may not like: Characterizations (there is a lot of character growth in this movie, it's a central theme), not a lot of exposition, many themes and they may send a conflicted message.
Tonally the movie is fine, the best way I can describe the movie is it's transformative? It's certainly very dark at parts, but one of the core themes... well there is a much brighter future.
The movie is great as is, but man I think they could have easily split it into two and had two stellar movies with the material they have.
ok
AUDIENCE RECEPTION
I went to a 6:00 opening premiere for 2d regular. It was a variety of people, some family and some older people, surprisingly not a lot of people in fan t-shirts, I was one of the few. I would say the theater was 3/4th's full.
People laughed at 5-6 parts I would say. There are jokes in the movies, a couple between Alfred/bruce. Perry has some, Gadot. They're not really quips but more like gags.
I would say half or more of the audience clapped at the end. There's one part in particular where kids were happy, I can't really say but you'll probably know which one it is when you see it. People loved wonder woman, they clapped and got excited for her appearance. Her theme is also really really good.
I know most of the major plot points before I saw the movie, so I came in with reasonable expectations. I think I agree with Verendus's criticisms the most.
TL;DR I want Snyder/Terrio on JL. I'm not even a huge snyder fan, I thought MoS had glaring issues.
I feel like I've seen a completely different film from the critics
Father_Brain
Banned
I swear to god, that was my theater's reaction at the end of Ang Lee's Hulk. For what that's worth.
people liked lex luthor?
i hated him - terrible performance by eisnberg, a real shame. honestly everything superman needs to go and this universe shapes up real fast. theres good stuff in here to dig into.
also not sure what the talk is about "brighter future" - the movie is grim throughout and doesn't bode well for what happens next
i hated him - terrible performance by eisnberg, a real shame. honestly everything superman needs to go and this universe shapes up real fast. theres good stuff in here to dig into.
also not sure what the talk is about "brighter future" - the movie is grim throughout and doesn't bode well for what happens next
brandonh83
Banned
Yes. Regardless of how this turns out, the DC universe needs to be its own thing. IMO it should be a lot more dark/gritty. The contrast is necessary to me so that not everything ends up feeling like the same thing. Not everyone will be on board with it but I liked how Man of Steel was done and this sounds like the same sort of thing.
Tal Shiar Agent
Banned
That was really really good. It had some pacing issues, but it was great. Fuck the haters.
To score it I would give MoS a hard 8/10 and this a loose 8.5/10.
To score it I would give MoS a hard 8/10 and this a loose 8.5/10.
I think it is personal taste. There are different ways to tell a story. Like in MoS how they keep jumping back to Clark`s childhood in the beginning as opposed to just doing it as one continuous progression. I liked breaking it up with the current story of adult Clark. Many hated it with a passion and were confused. I never was.
Some people unironically like Ang Lee's Hulk. It does something very different from other comic book movies. I personally am not super fond of the movie, but I can see how people could like it enough to clap at the end.
Ang Lee's Hulk wins because it can stand alone. This film needed to shoehorn everything it could to ape Marvel.
Ben and Irons did some Superhero shit trying to carry the shit that Snyder created. The only thing I'm positive about is that I'm looking forward to their solo movies. Ben and co will salvage in their own solo movies, that's all I'm sure about.
Such a weird, mess of a movie outside of that. Like, wow. I can't even explain it more than that. It was something. It's not as bad as the RT score suggests, it's better than MoS at least (mostly due to the Ben).
Such a weird, mess of a movie outside of that. Like, wow. I can't even explain it more than that. It was something. It's not as bad as the RT score suggests, it's better than MoS at least (mostly due to the Ben).
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
I'm about to experience Snyder all over my face in a couple of minutes.
My theatre cheered and clapped at only two things:
WonderWoman looking badass while saving Batffleck from the Zodoomsday death ray
... Spiderman appearing at the end of the CW trailer.
Because
she does jack-shit in the movie.
my crowd freaked out at the Civil War trailer
as it turns out, Snyder's dark aesthetic and weighty, kinetic fight scenes suit Ben's Batman really well
as it turns out, Snyder's dark aesthetic and weighty, kinetic fight scenes suit Ben's Batman really well
TheSlySoul
Member
Same, even got more applauds than the ending in my packed theater.
Honestly though go see it, I think it is bliss.
Same things funny enough, four people clapped at the ending in a theatre of probably 80 people.
This dude on reddit saw it 5 times in a row
https://www.reddit.com/r/DC_Cinemat..._post_so_i_went_and_saw_bvs_5_times_straight/
https://www.reddit.com/r/DC_Cinemat..._post_so_i_went_and_saw_bvs_5_times_straight/
The flashback structure in MoS is confusing because the flashbacks don't often connect with or inform what's happening in the present.
With Snyder movies....and maybe Superman movies.
Same, particularly when Spidey showed up.
They don't need to nor are they attempting to. It's just another way of storytelling. It's less linear and I like that but judging from reactions about 25% of the audience has a big problem with it. But.... I don't want yet another MoS debate. Haha. It's been done to death.
Just got home after watching it tonight. It was one hell of a ride. I enjoyed the hell out of the film. I'm so glad I'm going back tomorrow around noon to see it again with more family. If I were to critique it I could find things wrong like any film. Just going off my initial and gut reaction I loved it. The audience reaction to the film was really positive before it started and after it ended. Many were disappointed though that there wasn't an after credits scene. Especially how it ended but you could see and feel they wanted the next entry. There were several scenes where the audience was laughing, myself included. There was clapping at the very end and when Wonder Woman first shows up.
Going to put my thoughts down as they come. Might go back and better organize it.
Once done my sister and I both have no clue how negative critics can honestly be as over the top they've been regarding this film. That BS makes no F'n sense after seeing this film. I wouldn't even say the film is overly dark or "dark" in general. Somber is the word I'd use for it. It's not even that violent either. I was expecting a lot more on that front. There area lot of heroics in this film as well. When someone says there was none of that I question if they really watched the film. People are also misleading with some of the Batman stuff I feel.
Can one have issues with Lex? Sure but that's a matter of taste of the direction but not the acting. One should look at the performance not what they want. That's the problem with reactions to Man of Steel. People were knocking that film at times for it not giving them what they wanted, when it never set out or said it would and wouldn't judge it on it's own merits. The acting in the film is really good across the board.
Can you call into question some of the editing from scene to scene? It did not break up the flow of the film for me. I was actively looking to see if that would be an issue and I think that's only a problem or could be confusing with how the Knightmare scene is presented. The scene makes sense I believe and overall is great. How you get to it and out of it could have been done better. I have a theory for it's trigger and something at the end reinforces that for me. The out of it that might be somewhat sloppy.
The film is just quick to move things along and doesn't bother with lengthy changes of the scene. I'm fine with that and I don't believe it was jarring. It's more of a case of us being moved to a scene that is already in progress because time is passing for these characters even when you're not really with them. You don't need to see the characters arrive to said scene. That's one way of doing it but it's not necessary. It doesn't come off as bad editing that maybe the Ultimate Edition will fix but a choice. Due to characters doing different things, at the same time, independent of each other I don't see how you can transition between them as smoothly as some would want. I am curious if the Ultimate Edition changes this but I don't see it as a big fault as some are making it out to be. That's why I asked earlier if the priest to floating above the army in Man of Steel was an example of these scene changes and it is for the most part.
I do think the film at points ask you as a viewer to think and pay attention a little. There are some things that aren't spelled out because it assumes you understand what is happening based on what has happen already. That scene you watched earlier in the film is having it's pay off right now and you should able to recognize that due to all the visual clues being shown to you and what the characters are saying. It shouldn't have to repeat it for you. This is why I don't think there are any holes in the plot. Now if you weren't paying attention that's a problem and why I do think seeing the film at least twice is a good recommendation if something seemed weird. The big question is do you knock the film for this because the film is asking you to pay attention?
I thought the action, music, acting, and visuals were great. I enjoyed the overall story a lot. It's more complex then I thought it would be. The film leaves you with a nice number of questions about what is to come. I'm super excited for Wonder Woman, Justice League, and whatever the Batman solo film will be. There is a good reason as well why the full titles is Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice. I think to many people focused on just Batman v Superman. I think that second trailer really was Snyder trying to make it clear the film wasn't just about that. I'm glad the push back happen though as it likely forced them to ignore a lot of other things story wise that they might have been tempted to spoil in another trailer.
As a final thought. The "Bat is dead" scene we were shown before the film always felt off to me and clunky. I never really liked it that much. It still feels that way in the film and they should have done something else there. That really stands out to me.
Going to put my thoughts down as they come. Might go back and better organize it.
Once done my sister and I both have no clue how negative critics can honestly be as over the top they've been regarding this film. That BS makes no F'n sense after seeing this film. I wouldn't even say the film is overly dark or "dark" in general. Somber is the word I'd use for it. It's not even that violent either. I was expecting a lot more on that front. There area lot of heroics in this film as well. When someone says there was none of that I question if they really watched the film. People are also misleading with some of the Batman stuff I feel.
Can one have issues with Lex? Sure but that's a matter of taste of the direction but not the acting. One should look at the performance not what they want. That's the problem with reactions to Man of Steel. People were knocking that film at times for it not giving them what they wanted, when it never set out or said it would and wouldn't judge it on it's own merits. The acting in the film is really good across the board.
Can you call into question some of the editing from scene to scene? It did not break up the flow of the film for me. I was actively looking to see if that would be an issue and I think that's only a problem or could be confusing with how the Knightmare scene is presented. The scene makes sense I believe and overall is great. How you get to it and out of it could have been done better. I have a theory for it's trigger and something at the end reinforces that for me. The out of it that might be somewhat sloppy.
The film is just quick to move things along and doesn't bother with lengthy changes of the scene. I'm fine with that and I don't believe it was jarring. It's more of a case of us being moved to a scene that is already in progress because time is passing for these characters even when you're not really with them. You don't need to see the characters arrive to said scene. That's one way of doing it but it's not necessary. It doesn't come off as bad editing that maybe the Ultimate Edition will fix but a choice. Due to characters doing different things, at the same time, independent of each other I don't see how you can transition between them as smoothly as some would want. I am curious if the Ultimate Edition changes this but I don't see it as a big fault as some are making it out to be. That's why I asked earlier if the priest to floating above the army in Man of Steel was an example of these scene changes and it is for the most part.
I do think the film at points ask you as a viewer to think and pay attention a little. There are some things that aren't spelled out because it assumes you understand what is happening based on what has happen already. That scene you watched earlier in the film is having it's pay off right now and you should able to recognize that due to all the visual clues being shown to you and what the characters are saying. It shouldn't have to repeat it for you. This is why I don't think there are any holes in the plot. Now if you weren't paying attention that's a problem and why I do think seeing the film at least twice is a good recommendation if something seemed weird. The big question is do you knock the film for this because the film is asking you to pay attention?
I thought the action, music, acting, and visuals were great. I enjoyed the overall story a lot. It's more complex then I thought it would be. The film leaves you with a nice number of questions about what is to come. I'm super excited for Wonder Woman, Justice League, and whatever the Batman solo film will be. There is a good reason as well why the full titles is Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice. I think to many people focused on just Batman v Superman. I think that second trailer really was Snyder trying to make it clear the film wasn't just about that. I'm glad the push back happen though as it likely forced them to ignore a lot of other things story wise that they might have been tempted to spoil in another trailer.
As a final thought. The "Bat is dead" scene we were shown before the film always felt off to me and clunky. I never really liked it that much. It still feels that way in the film and they should have done something else there. That really stands out to me.
Fuck, this movie was sloppy. The connectivity between scenes was just poor. Gonna see it again on Saturday with family to see if I like it more with a second viewing. Ben Affleck is great and I like this portrayal of Batman, but dear god, Lex Luthor was just weird, and not in a good way. Jessie Eisenberg is a good actor so I'm blaming the writing and direction.
The tie ins to Justice League were terrible and really unnecessary.
The tie ins to Justice League were terrible and really unnecessary.
Saw it and liked it, its not the masterpiece it could have been, it had all the ingredients but didn't reach greatness sadly and I don't know if its Snyder's fault for the pace and editing, in the first half the movie is all over the place jumping from scene to scene I didn't mind it much but I can see why a lot of people are bothered with it, or maybe it was WB's fault for making him cram so much into the movie wanting to launch a whole cinematic universe in a hurry, also if Snyder knew he was going to make an Extended cut for home release he should've cut the theatrical release shorter and leaner, here are my pros and cons
Pros
I liked all the cameos especially
Wonder Woman was amazing loved the effects used for the lasso
Batman, best version of the character in movies
Perry White and Alfred
Superman I think Cavill did a great job and you can see the character evolving little by little he doesn't get enough credit
The fights and action scenes
Cons
The Knightmare sequence as cool as it was came out of nowhere and they never explained why they where happening, people that aren't well versed in comics are gonna wonder WTF is going on
The Pacing
The film is too grainy in some scenes
Undecided until further viewings
Lex Luthor I don't know what to make of this version of Lex sometimes he shines but sometimes it's like a completely different character sometimes even laughable
Final verdict the movie is good it's far from the worst movie ever Hyperbole some would like you to believe, I give it an 8/10 and say to everyone that's on the fence go see it and make your own judgement
Pros
I liked all the cameos especially
future Flash
Wonder Woman was amazing loved the effects used for the lasso
Batman, best version of the character in movies
Perry White and Alfred
Superman I think Cavill did a great job and you can see the character evolving little by little he doesn't get enough credit
The fights and action scenes
Cons
The Knightmare sequence as cool as it was came out of nowhere and they never explained why they where happening, people that aren't well versed in comics are gonna wonder WTF is going on
The Pa Kent scene left me scratching my head
The Pacing
The film is too grainy in some scenes
Undecided until further viewings
Lex Luthor I don't know what to make of this version of Lex sometimes he shines but sometimes it's like a completely different character sometimes even laughable
Final verdict the movie is good it's far from the worst movie ever Hyperbole some would like you to believe, I give it an 8/10 and say to everyone that's on the fence go see it and make your own judgement
TheStruggler
Report me for trolling ND/TLoU2 threads
That type of scene though is used in a LOT of films I believe. Would have thought everyone would have understood what was happening there and I think they make it clear by the end.
MisterHero
Super Member
AAAUUUGGGHHHHHHHHH A FALSE MOD has desecrated my monument to this movie!! I wanna give em the chair! Just kidding, this Batman's A-OK.
I fucking loved it. By no means perfect, but the hype was nuts. There are plot aspects that are downright amateur but the big parts work.
BEAUTIFULLY SHOT. I wish there was more of that in the marketing.
I fucking loved it. By no means perfect, but the hype was nuts. There are plot aspects that are downright amateur but the big parts work.
BEAUTIFULLY SHOT. I wish there was more of that in the marketing.
keltickennedy
Member
Just got back. It was.....alright. All the stuff they nailed they later drop the ball with. Some stuff made me even think, "why the fuck are they even showing this? Oh, cause Snyder liked this part in a comic"
They say that there is a longer R-rated version. I think they could of cut out even more.
I hate number rating shit...but i would say 7.5/10.
They say that there is a longer R-rated version. I think they could of cut out even more.
I hate number rating shit...but i would say 7.5/10.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Most boring superhero film I've ever seen. The Batman v Superman fight was good for the short time it lasted. But it was just boring.
Okay I liked MoS, read the reviews and such...final question before I make a final decision just because of the varying opinions.
Is it an enjoyable time? I for the record am somewhat easy to please, the allure of seeing Batman and Superman together in a movie is just so strong!!
Is it an enjoyable time? I for the record am somewhat easy to please, the allure of seeing Batman and Superman together in a movie is just so strong!!
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