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[Ricky Ricardo]

I am not arguing a source, I am just musing how 6 is the number paraded, when 5 is every bit as relevant. And judging by the story breaker, it is not too surprising a happy medium wasn't even chosen. Is all.

It's about Ethics in Game Journalism.

 

[jbug617]

Here is what Jason (Kotaku). They updated their story

In an article this afternoon, Polygon corroborated many of the details we reported as well as one that we didn’t: Microsoft is aiming to get Scorpio running at 6 teraflops, which we’ve also heard from one source. (5-6 is what we heard.) Sources have insisted that Scorpio’s exact specs have not yet been finalized, though.

http://kotaku.com/sources-smaller-xbox-one-coming-this-year-more-powerf-1778634446

 

[DeepEnigma]

It's about Ethics in Game Journalism.

I chuckled.

 

[Kaako]

Here is what Jason (Kotaku). They updated their story

http://kotaku.com/sources-smaller-xbox-one-coming-this-year-more-powerf-1778634446

Now why would someone or source throw that 6TF number out there? Hmmm...

 

[spanks]

Hard to be excited if developers are going to be forced to make all the games compatible with the older models. They won't be able to really push the hardware at all. Feels like differences are gonna be superficial. Textures, models, nothing that affects actual gameplay.

Basically crossgen again, but with a smaller power increase.

 

[Clear]

Once again though, however powerful the next Xbox is, if they keep the baseline set at the standard of the current Xbone... its just the same stuff with a few extra bells and whistles.

If they abandon the current base-line, then they just screwed over all their early adopters this gen by redirecting much needed software support.

Looking longer term, is this sort of incremental power-creep actually all that valuable when both Sony and MS are taking their technology from the same provider and architectural tree? Essentially meaning that whoever gets their nose in-front is only going to retain that advantage until their competitor releases their next iteration.

It all seems a bit pointless to me, especially considering the lead times required to develop AAA titles that really leverage the power these systems offer is going to ensure relatively small libraries within each increments life-time.

 

[WadeitOut]

Uhhh, did you forget that the Xbox One had, and indeed still has, the shackles of god awful policy (DRM, DRM, DRM) and hardware decisions (Kinect, $499) that MS made dragging it down? Marketing blunder after marketing blunder?

PS4 would be the same because most people didn't want an Xbox One when it launched. It was $100 more expensive and had one of the worst pre-launch hype periods of all time. Now it might be the same price/cheaper, but momentum doesn't work that way. You screw the pooch early, you're playing catchup the rest of the gen. Simple. Power is a realllllllllllly small factor in why the XBOne is failing.

Do you honestly think more than like 2% of all current gen console owners even know anything about the DRM policy stuff?

 

[chubigans]

Now why would someone or source throw that 6TF number out there? Hmmm...

bwahaha

 

[AmyS]

 

[LukasTaves]

The difference was that the PS4 was the stronger between two consoles released at virtually the same time. This Scorpio box is rumored to be coming out up to a year later than the Neo is rumored to be coming out. Not exactly the same situation.

It is almost closer the original XBOX plan. It released later than PS2 and was more powerful and that didn't seem to help them one bit, the die was already cast. I feel they need a full generation reset before you can just snatch market share like they did with the 360 (at least in NA and also released first). These incremental updates won't allow anyone to push the reset button so to speak and you would have to win market share over time. Depends on if we are counting this 2017 release as a new generation or an iteration. Also nothing stopping sony from roadmapping a 2018 8TFLOP Trinity console. Kind of interesting times ahead.

Aren't the rumors saying spring 2017?

I don't think it will be a full year, also I'm sure eventually the super xbone was schedule to this year, but it got delayed along Redstone 2, among the next round of all Ms devices.

The Redstone 2 delay was known since march: https://www.thurrott.com/windows/wi...til-new-microsoft-hardware-hits-in-early-2017

The Redstone 2 update will allegedly bring many improvements on continnum and synergy across windows devices, something that has kinda leaked today as well, so it's all adding up to spring 2017, not the best time to launch new hardware, but Ms can't afford to wait much longer than that (and not just on consoles).

 

[icespide]

This gets a 0% accuracy rating. There is no way in hell the PS4 would be doing so much better than the Xbox One had it not had the "it's more powerful" argument from day one.

wrong

 

[rokkerkory]

Would take a 5tf console. VR and 4k would be better.

 

[cheezcake]

If true then the relative performance difference between Scorpio and Neo will be almost the same as the relative performance difference between PS4 and XB1, which people seem to consider pretty significant.

 

[MuchoMalo]

You already have a gaming PC? Then you would be crazy to go with Xbox.

Out of the Xbone exclusives ported to PC this year so far, only one runs well. One. This is only going to get worse with a faster Xbox on the way. Xbox is still viable for exclusives unless you upgrade to two of a flagship card every year to play on a 1080p monitor. Nobody sane does that. I refuse to buy their crap personally, though it's turned me off to their games completely on any platform.

 

[orochi91]

Now why would someone or source throw that 6TF number out there? Hmmm...

This rumour seems to be specifically targeting NEO hype, or at least attempting to torpedo it.

Scorpio not launching for another ~16 months, yet non-finalized specs are already leaking?

MS with that calculated power-play.

 

[HUELEN10]

After reading some more, and setting up my systems and PC in new setup, I gotta say, resolution is just a number, so are specs. That being said, it feels great to know that my non-Nintendo platform of choice is potentially making a move like this. It's really exciting to see the platform you love, with beefier hardware. Would I get it? nah, resolution's only a number.

What matter to me are exclusives and framerate. I'll get one when games for my One are no longer at least 30 FPS locked, or there's an exclusive I REALLY want.

 

[AmyS]

I'll buy a PS4 Neo relatively soon, an Xbox Scorpio next year, and PS5 several years after that.

 

[Striek]

Do you honestly think more than like 2% of all current gen console owners even know anything about the DRM policy stuff?

The specifics, no, the basics, abso-fucking-lutely. Waaaaaay more than who know that the PS4 is more powerful than the XBOne, or more importantly, care. The DRM controversy poisoned the well. It was all over social media, all over mainstream game sites, all over mainstream press, and even made national news in some countries.

Pretending that most console buyers are ignorant luddites is just lunacy. People hear the news about the $400-500 toys they want to buy, lol, and they talk to friends.

 

[bobbytkc]

Hard to be excited if developers are going to be forced to make all the games compatible with the older models. They won't be able to really push the hardware at all. Feels like differences are gonna be superficial. Textures, models, nothing that affects actual gameplay.

Basically crossgen again, but with a smaller power increase.

There is no new gameplay benefit with the extra power we got from ps3 to ps4. I'd say the problem of games is with the design now and less the technology.

BTW, what is an equivalent 5-6 tflop GPU on the PC scene?

 

[rokkerkory]

I'll buy a PS4 Neo relatively soon, an Xbox Scorpio next year, and PS5 several years after that.

Same right way to do it

 

[Goofy]

As a PS4 owner, I might skip the Neo for this if this is true and specs are really that agreesive.

Its great to see some real competition pop up again - even if it is in between generations, which - depending how you look at it - may be unfortunate.

Regardless, I'll take it - i'm the type that would much prefer a console to be higher priced at launch to ensure the best available specs, because we all know technology prices fall pretty quickly and everyone (or most everyone) will be able to purchase it sooner or later.

 

[Ricky Ricardo]

If true then the relative performance difference between Scorpio and Neo will be almost the same as the relative performance difference between PS4 and XB1, which people seem to consider pretty significant.

At exactly 4 times the power of the Xbox One, the Scorpio at 5.28TF is more than 1TF over the Neo.

That's the twice the delta between the base PS4 and XB1, a delta which has been played up as a large gap.

That's why its entertaining watching this narrative spawn about how 6TF is too generous a number. The greater the delta, the harder it is to move goalposts, I guess.

 

[orochi91]

I'll buy a PS4 Neo relatively soon, an Xbox Scorpio next year, and PS5 several years after that.

I'm gonna skip out on launch models altogether.

Will be buying the PS4.5K/Neo this year and keeping it till the PS5.5K is released.

That way I'll still be experiencing a "traditional" console cycle, with respect to length.

 

[thehillissilent]

Out of the Xbone exclusives ported to PC this year so far, only one runs well. One. This is only going to get worse with a faster Xbox on the way. Xbox is still viable for exclusives unless you upgrade to two of a flagship card every year to play on a 1080p monitor. Nobody sane does that. I refuse to buy their crap personally, though it's turned me off to their games completely on any platform.

Uh, Quantum Break is the main game that is not running that well. The rest of the games Gears UE, Forza Apex, and KI run fine.

 

[Maximilian Kolbe]

This rumour seems to be specifically targeting NEO hype, or at least attempting to torpedo it.

Not launching for another ~16 months, yet non-finalized specs are already leaking?

MS with that calculated power-play.

Next spring seems not 16 months away?

 

[orochi91]

Next spring seems not 16 months away?

I was referring to Scorpio's Fall 2017 release window.

 

[Reagan's BR]

If Xbox OS is coming to PC then I don't see myself buying anymore Xbox consoles.

 

[AmyS]

I'm gonna skip out on launch models altogether.

Will be buying the PS4.5K/Neo this year and keeping it till the PS5.5K is released.

That way I'll still be experiencing a "traditional" console cycle, with respect to length.

That's another really good way to go, for those that don't own a current PS4 or XBone.

 

[etta]

This rumour seems to be specifically targeting NEO hype, or at least attempting to torpedo it.

Not launching for another ~16 months, yet non-finalized specs are already leaking?

MS with that calculated power-play.

6TF ballpark doe.

 

[trutrutru]

The domino effect of nintendo putting out the nx mid cycle. By the time the nx is released, we'll have far more powerful hardware on the horizon.

 

[bobbytkc]

Next spring seems not 16 months away?

The title clearly says Fall 2017

 

[Maximilian Kolbe]

I was referring to Scorpio's Fall 2017 release window.

Don't think it will be that far, or if it's that far, then i bet we won't see any news about Scorpio in this E3.

 

[Xone9]

so my SE Halo 5 XBox One - should I trade it in now for a slim?

such a cool looking console ... argh

 

[thehillissilent]

If Xbox OS is coming to PC then I don't see myself buying anymore Xbox consoles.

That is cool with MS, because they will make money off of you from their Windows 10 store if you decide to buy them on PC. The ecosystem is more important than the device you use to access it.

 

[cheezcake]

At exactly 4 times the power of the Xbox One, the Scorpio at 5.28TF is most than 1TF over the Neo.

That's the twice the delta between the base PS4 and XB1, a delta which has been played up as a large gap.

That's why its entertaining watching this narrative spawn about how 6TF is too generous a number.

I meant relative as in percentage wise, PS4 is ~50% more powerful than the XB1. At 6tflops, Scorpio will be ~50% more powerful than a Neo. But yeh the difference could be pretty significant, won't matter if the price ain't right though

 

[CrispyBoar]

Power and the word of mouth is absolutely a key factor as to why Sony has sold a crazy amount of PS4's. No denying that.

No, it wasn't. It was word of mouth from social media & from average consumers how Microsoft fucked up with the advertising of Xbox One in general.

If Microsoft thinks that power was the reason why they lost, they're in for a rude awakening.

Uhhh, did you forget that the Xbox One had, and indeed still has, the shackles of god awful policy (DRM, DRM, DRM) and hardware decisions (Kinect, $499) that MS made dragging it down? Marketing blunder after marketing blunder?

PS4 would be the same because most people didn't want an Xbox One when it launched. It was $100 more expensive and had one of the worst pre-launch hype periods of all time. Now it might be the same price/cheaper, but momentum doesn't work that way. You screw the pooch early, you're playing catchup the rest of the gen. Simple. Power is a realllllllllllly small factor in why the XBOne is failing.

Exactly what I've been saying.

 

[AmyS]

The domino effect of nintendo putting out the nx mid cycle. By the time the nx is released, we'll have far more powerful hardware on the horizon.

Yes, but Nintendo potentially has a wildcard, if they see their patent(s) to fruition.

1. A gaming system, comprising: a game console comprising one or more processors configured to locally execute a game and provide video output of the game to a display and audio output of the game to a speaker, the game console including a physical network interface and a wireless communication interface; and a supplemental computing device configured to detachably couple to the game console via the physical communication interface, the supplemental computing device comprising: one or more processors configured to provide, over the physical communication interface, processing resources to the game console to assist the game console in locally executing the game; and memory for receiving data associated with the game from the game console and storing the data for later access by the game console wherein the game console is further configured to couple, via the wireless communication interface, to another supplemental computing device, the another supplemental computing device including one or more processors to provide processing resources to the game console and memory for providing storage resources to the game console.

6. An apparatus comprising: a housing; an interface for coupling the apparatus with a game console; one or more processors residing within the housing; and logic residing within the housing and configured to cause the one or more processors to perform acts comprising: receiving, while the apparatus is coupled to the game console via the interface and while the game console is executing a game, a first request from the game console to process first data associated with the game; processing, at least partly in response to the first request, the first data to create a result; providing the result back to the game console; receiving, while the apparatus is coupled to the game console via the interface and while the game console is executing the game, a second request from the game console to store second data associated with the game; and storing the second data at the apparatus at least partly in response to the second request.

FIG. 1 illustrates an example environment that includes a game console locally executing a game, as well as a supplemental computing device coupled to the console for supplementing processing and storage resources of the game console. In addition, the environment includes multiple other game console and supplemental computing device combinations, such that the game consoles may utilize nearby supplemental computing devices to even further supplement the game-console resources.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1150086

 

[Jumeira]

Uhhh, did you forget that the Xbox One had, and indeed still has, the shackles of god awful policy (DRM, DRM, DRM) and hardware decisions (Kinect, $499) that MS made dragging it down? Marketing blunder after marketing blunder?

PS4 would be the same because most people didn't want an Xbox One when it launched. It was $100 more expensive and had one of the worst pre-launch hype periods of all time. Now it might be the same price/cheaper, but momentum doesn't work that way. You screw the pooch early, you're playing catchup the rest of the gen. Simple. Power is a realllllllllllly small factor in why the XBOne is failing.

Disagree, power was central to Sony marketing, 3rd parties demo thier games on PS4 by default, Reviewers use PS4 version in thier assessments, being the most powerful and at the same price as x1 made it difficult to recommend x1. Even then we'd see people say they bought ps4 for superior multiplats.

MS have big names brands, they have a reknown service but they fumbled on price, vision and power. This will certainly mend parts of what they lost, and I can't see how holding the title for best looking games isn't going to help them.

At least here on NeoGAF, should be interesting reading based on DF threads.

 

[DeepEnigma]

At exactly 4 times the power of the Xbox One, the Scorpio at 5.28TF is more than 1TF over the Neo.

That's the twice the delta between the base PS4 and XB1, a delta which has been played up as a large gap.

That's why its entertaining watching this narrative spawn about how 6TF is too generous a number. The greater the delta, the harder it is to move goalposts, I guess.

PS4 = 40% more flop performance over X1

Scorpio at 4x= 27% more flop performance over Neo

Twice the delta, 27% vs. 40%, I know, I know, semantics or goalposts or something.

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

This gets a 0% accuracy rating. There is no way in hell the PS4 would be doing so much better than the Xbox One had it not had the "it's more powerful" argument from day one.

Considering the bulk of the of PS4 is in markets where the Xbox one is a moot point, actually yeah. Power is not the defining factor here.

But yeah. Let's pretend this will be the first time Microsoft has the most powerful console on the market.

 

[orochi91]

Don't think it will be that far, or if it's that far, then i bet we won't see any news about Scorpio in this E3.

The rumour says it will be unveiled soon, which would likely be E3 2016, hence my immense confusion as to why anyone would announce their new hardware so far out from launch.

6TF ballpark doe.

If it's actually not finalized yet, then the final number could be higher.

 

[Dovahking]

Now why would someone or source throw that 6TF number out there? Hmmm...

Yeah, seems like a "controlled" leak.

 

[Sword Of Doom]

The teraflop wars have begun!

At exactly 4 times the power of the Xbox One, the Scorpio at 5.28TF is more than 1TF over the Neo.

That's the twice the delta between the base PS4 and XB1, a delta which has been played up as a large gap.

That's why its entertaining watching this narrative spawn about how 6TF is too generous a number. The greater the delta, the harder it is to move goalposts, I guess.

Whatever I don't want to get involved in a bullshit argument but more important is the percentage isn't it?

 

[orochi91]

At exactly 4 times the power of the Xbox One, the Scorpio at 5.28TF is more than 1TF over the Neo.

That's the twice the delta between the base PS4 and XB1, a delta which has been played up as a large gap.

That's why its entertaining watching this narrative spawn about how 6TF is too generous a number. The greater the delta, the harder it is to move goalposts, I guess.

This won't be the first time MS will be having the most powerful console on the market, so the power of these boxes is moot, with respect to potential effects on market-share.

Barring any catastrophic fuck-up on Sony's part, akin to the PS3 launch, then we're looking at the PS2 gen all over again, where the strongest box will be a distant second.

The teraflop wars have begun!

My heart goes out to the NX.

What a terrible time to launch a new console.

Right in the middle of the other 2 big platform holders :/

 

[cheezcake]

No, it wasn't. It was word of mouth from social media & from average consumers how Microsoft fucked up with the advertising of Xbox One in general.

If Microsoft think that power was the reason why they lost, they're in for a rude awakening.

The narrative of being cheaper while also being more powerful did way more for PS4 than the DRM business

 

[etta]

PS4 = 40% more flop performance over X1

Scorpio at 4x= 27% more flop performance over Neo

Twice the delta, 27% vs. 40%, I know, I know, semantics or goalposts or something.

You mean 36% instead of 40%?

Not to mention that sources said "over" 4 times, and ~6 TF.

 

[bobbytkc]

That is cool with MS, because they will make money off of you from their Windows 10 store if you decide to buy them on PC. The ecosystem is more important than the device you use to access it.

This puts them in a position where they are hardly different from steam. There is nothing MS can offer that is better than steam at this point.

 

[Infernostew]

After Neo comes out and Scorpio is soon to launch then Sony will leak their specs for their next one... and the cycle will continue endlessly.

 

[IcyRhythms]

No, it wasn't. It was word of mouth from social media & from average consumers how Microsoft fucked up with the advertising of Xbox One in general.

If Microsoft think that power was the reason why they lost, they're in for a rude awakening.



Exactly what I've been saying.

Oh stop lol

They've corrected most of those mistakes and are still having their asses handed to them. People that think the intial marketing/DRM thing from THREE FUCKING YEARS AGO is still a factor in 2016 have lost it lol

 

[Granadier]

I am not arguing a source, I am just musing how 6 is the number paraded, when 5 is every bit as relevant. And judging by the story breaker, it is not too surprising a happy medium wasn't even chosen. Is all.

It's about Sony fanboi tears. That's all.