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[Rentahamster]

As someone who's listened to most of his speeches lately, the idea that he's suddenly gone negative is media spin.

It's his constant attacks (or up until recently) and insinuations on Hillary that's she's corrupt, accusations of voter fraud and refusing/being unable to provide the receipts. And of course the recent, and weak condemnation he made of the shenanigans from Nevada days ago.
http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/bernie-sanders-nevada-dem-chair_us_573b4b8de4b0aee7b8e7dfa2

He's accused her of money laundering, and of voter fraud in every state he lost basically, also he's been going after the Democratic Party more than the GOP

Interesting responses. I'm not sure what to think now lol. Perception is a huge factor here.

 

[Suikoguy]

Yeah, that's fine and all. I'm not really at all concerned with decorum. What's the harm in seeing how our primary candidates fare face-to-face with the actual opposition before we choose one? Are we afraid the Republicans will make us look bad? Then we've lost already, as far as I'm concerned. That's the weakness I'm alluding to.

It's an interesting argument. I'm not sure where I actually stand if both candidates had a chance of winning the primary. If pressed to give an opinion, i'd probably lean against the idea.

But what bothers me this case; Sanders can't win without outside help, that door closed with Oregon and the Washington Non-Binding Primary. I don't think a candidate should be muddying the waters when in such a situation.

 

[Outtrigger888]

They are just gonna get to know each other before they run against hillary.

Trump/Sanders 2016!

 

[steine]

I'm not from the US... but just so be clear, are there any Trump supporters around here? No, right? please

 

[Aselith]

I think there's a .000000001% (approximately... That's not exact) chance that he'll win the nomination and I'd be ecstatic to see this happen. It's not about winning for me, it's about getting his message out to as many people as possible.

Signal boosting Trump? Lol. Trump is Verizon with the signal. Dude has had 4 bars since he announced he was running. Do you own a television?

You can always have more press

 

[Suikoguy]

I'm not from the US... but just so be clear, are there any Trump supporters around here? No, right? please

Oh there are some, and I suspect a few of them are Sanders supporters simply because being a Trump supporter on here is flying really close to the fire.

Then again, Republicans have been ostracized here since Bush. But Trump takes it to another level of shit, one I did not foresee being the last vestiges of a major party of a two party system.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

Whoever came up with this idea gave a big FU Hillary not debating Sanders

 

[D.Lo]

That was before she won. She's won and there is no need. If Bernie were in his position he would do the same. Any other politician that won would not debate against a corpse.

This is a pathetic excuse.

She is 100% going back in her word. She agreed and broke that promise because fulfilling it doesn't suit her situation anymore.

Do election promises work like that?

"I promise a tax cut!"

*wins election*

"Hey where's my tax cut"

Big Baybee: "that was before she won!"

 

[B-Dubs]

This is a pathetic excuse.

She is 100% going back in her word. She agreed and broke that promise because fulfilling it doesn't suit her situation anymore.

Do election promises work like that?

"I promise a tax cut!"

*wins election*

"Hey where's my tax cut"

Big Baybee: "that was before she won!"

Oh please. She's some 70 delegates from the finish line, what is another debate going to change? This isn't Obama/Clinton where an expanded margin in the right state could change the game. This has been over for a long time. Bernie's just looking for a way to raise his profile before California in the hope that'll be enough, it's the same move he pulled with the Vatican visit.

 

[Prodigal Son]

GOAT election

 

[Bearthgar]

I'm not from the US... but just so be clear, are there any Trump supporters around here? No, right? please

Trump is champ! You furry fool!

 

[SolicitorPirate]

I think I've given up. America, if you want to actually want to elect one of these two idiots, you go ahead. I'll be busy working on a way to migrate to the Moon.

 

[Jobbs]

I think I've given up. America, if you want to actually want to elect one of these two idiots, you go ahead. I'll be busy working on a way to migrate to the Moon.

I hope no one mistakes my lack of passion for hillary clinton for me believing that her and trump are equally bad

that is a laughable thought. trump is a hundred times worse, anyone who say otherwise is being lazy

 

[minor effort]

This is a pathetic excuse.

She is 100% going back in her word. She agreed and broke that promise because fulfilling it doesn't suit her situation anymore.

Do election promises work like that?

"I promise a tax cut!"

*wins election*

"Hey where's my tax cut"

Big Baybee: "that was before she won!"

Frankly, even if she is going back on her word, she's making the right decision. A debate against Bernie Sanders, a candidate who has already effectively lost the campaign and is currently in a bitter personal battle against her and the DNC, hosted by Fox News, a conservative news outlet who would love to further the divide between the Democratic candidates just isn't worth it. This wouldn't be an issues debate, it would be personal, negative, and ugly.

Her skipping this debate will be largely forgotten before long. It isn't worth it.

 

[Toxi]

And hopefully I can get it in a few days with Bernie, who will be many times more effective against Trump

Sanders can talk about the ideas and challenge Trump in a way that seems authentic. Hillary almost certainly can't. I have nothing against her and I'll vote for her in November, but she won't be particularly good in a debate against Trump

This is if you watch debates for gut instinct and not for actual evidence-supported dialogue.

 

[SolicitorPirate]

I hope no one mistakes my lack of passion for hillary clinton for me believing that her and trump are equally bad

that is a laughable thought. trump is a hundred times worse, anyone who say otherwise is being lazy

The idiots I were referring to were Sanders and Trump

 

[Lenz44]

GOAT election

I want fireworks and a halftime show of epic proportions!

 

[rob305]

I want fireworks and a halftime show of epic proportions!

Flyover plz

 

[Prodigal Son]

I want fireworks and a halftime show of epic proportions!

If Trump is prez that's basically what each state of the union will look like.

 

[D.Lo]

Oh please. She's some 70 delegates from the finish line, what is another debate going to change? This isn't Obama/Clinton where an expanded margin in the right state could change the game. This has been over for a long time. Bernie's just looking for a way to raise his profile before California in the hope that'll be enough, it's the same move he pulled with the Vatican visit.

Is it a broken agreement? Just answer the question.

Hillary supporters worm out of that question by saying "But it's not needed/not in her best interests".

It's still a broken agreement. She's got trustworthiness issues with the electorate and has now broken a very public agreement.

 

[Lenz44]

Flyover plz

I mean does that even need to be said? We'll have like four flyovers! and people parachuting in and a marching band. Maybe get some guest stars to do the coin flip- like Ross Perot and Bob Dole.

 

[B-Dubs]

Is it a broken agreement? Just answer the question.

Hillary supporters worm out of that question by saying "But it's not needed/not in her best interests".

It's still a broken agreement. She's got trustworthiness issues with the electorate and has now broken a very public agreement.

I expect the president to make the right decisions, even if it goes against a promise.

 

[ShooterMcGavin]

This Bernie heel turn is going really well.

 

[Frozenprince]

Trump is only doing this debate because he can use it as a 2 hour long platform to shit on Hillary on national TV.

This has nothing to do with Bernie, you're, quite frankly, an idiot if you think it does.

 

[Big Baybee]

Is it a broken agreement? Just answer the question.

Hillary supporters worm out of that question by saying "But it's not needed/not in her best interests".

It's still a broken agreement. She's got trustworthiness issues with the electorate and has now broken a very public agreement.

Did Obama weasle out of debating Hillary in 2008? Was it needed there too? Did he show that he wasn't trustworthy?

 

[Prodigal Son]

Trump is only doing this debate because he can use it as a 2 hour long platform to shit on Hillary on national TV.

This has nothing to do with Bernie, you're, quite frankly, an idiot if you think it does.

Aren't we not allowed to call each other idiots? If we are...

Whenever Trump says a sentence with the word Hillary in it every media outlet talks about it for days on end. If you think a debate between a far left and far right candidate will result in two hours of them agreeing on how much they don't like Hillary, I don't think people who think it's a genuine debate are the ones who need to do some thinking.

 

[Link]

Like I mentioned in a previous thread, Sanders supporters just want to see the whole system burned down. They really don't give a shit what's built on the ashes.

 

[Mully]

Yes let's silence the candidates so people will fall in line.

The candidate lost. He should not be debating a nominee when he already lost. It's not about silencing him, it's about not antagonizing and giving his supporters false hope for a candidate that already lost.

 

[Makai]

Like I mentioned in a previous thread, Sanders supporters just want to see the whole system burned down. They really don't give a shit what's built on the ashes.

Winning elections requires coalition-building. You are doing the opposite by comparing 40% of Democrats to arsonists.

 

[norm9]

GOAT election

King Trump wouldn't show up and poor Bernie will be left at the altar.

 

[Adaren]

Imagine if Hillary debated McCain after it became clear that she wasn't going to be the nominee.

Sad!

 

[Godslay]

Winning elections requires coalition-building. You are doing the opposite by comparing 40% of Democrats to arsonists.

I got laughed at in the Poligaf thread for suggesting that Hillary and the DNC should be courting rather than pushing away Sanders voters.

This was before the Nevada DNC Gavel and Run that that Lange pulled. Now it seems like they are trying to win the hearts and minds of Sander's Democrat and Independent voters by insulting them. It's a bold strategy.

 

[Prodigal Son]

The candidate lost. He should not be debating a nominee when he already lost. It's not about silencing him, it's about not antagonizing and giving his supporters false hope for a candidate that already lost.

Except he hasn't already lost and is still running. No matter how unlikely his nomination is, we still don't have a nominee. That is reality and your well-placed pessimism about Bernie's dismal chances doesn't change that Clinton isn't the nominee yet. Nothing you say changes that reality.

It's like saying Jill Stein has already lost the presidency because of how unlikely it is that she will win. She hasn't 'lost' yet just like he hasn't 'lost' yet. Impossible odds =/= defeat. They both should actively seek to appeal to as many voters as possible because they're both still running for President.


OT: The Sander's campaign is on its last legs. The only shot they think they have at this is through convincing the supers that he is the better general-election candidate. This debate is obviously just another example of them attempting to make that case. He's not only trying to show Californian voters that he can hold his own against Trump, he's trying to show the superdelegates this as well.

 

[B-Dubs]

Except he hasn't already lost and is still running. No matter how unlikely his nomination is, we still don't have a nominee. That is reality and your well-placed pessimism about Bernie's dismal chances doesn't change that Clinton isn't the nominee yet. Nothing you say changes that reality.

It's like saying Jill Stein has already lost the presidency because of how unlikely it is that she will win. She hasn't 'lost' yet just like he hasn't 'lost' yet. Impossible odds =/= defeat. They both should actively seek to appeal to as many voters as possible because they're both still running for President.

Clinton is 70-ish delegates from the finish line, he'd have to make her non-viable in every single remaining contest to stop her from winning at this point. She's going to be called as the presumptive nominee when the polls close in the East on the 7th.

 

[Link]

Winning elections requires coalition-building. You are doing the opposite by comparing 40% of Democrats to arsonists.

I got laughed at in the Poligaf thread for suggesting that Hillary and the DNC should be courting rather than pushing away Sanders voters.

This was before the Nevada DNC Gavel and Run that that Lange pulled. Now it seems like they are trying to win the hearts and minds of Sander's Democrat and Independent voters by insulting them. It's a bold strategy.

Most of us are tired of dealing with children.

 

[Prodigal Son]

Clinton is 70-ish delegates from the finish line, he'd have to make her non-viable in every single remaining contest to stop her from winning.

Did my post say anything about him getting a plurality? Cut the defensiveness out and actually try to read what I said.

Oh please, he's been mathematically eliminated for a while now. He's lost. Where's his path to victory?

Did you even read my post?

 

[B-Dubs]

Did my post say anything about him getting a plurality? Cut the defensiveness out and actually try to read what I said.

Oh please, he's been mathematically eliminated for a while now. He's lost. Where's his path to victory?

Did you even read my post?

Yes and if you think he hasn't lost then I don't know what to say to you.

 

[Clockwork5]

The candidate lost. He should not be debating a nominee when he already lost. It's not about silencing him, it's about not antagonizing and giving his supporters false hope for a candidate that already lost.

He has not lost. He is going to lose, but Hillary has yet to secure the nomination.

 

[enzo_gt]

GOAT election

Or do it on TYT.

 

[Prodigal Son]

Or do it on TYT.

TYT says they'll give one million to charity if Trump agrees a a debate on their show.

Ugh. Bernie pls

Oh please, he's been mathematically eliminated for a while now. He's lost. Where's his path to victory?



Yes and if you think he hasn't lost then I don't know what to say to you.

We should leave it at that then. The ability to differentiate a likely future occurrence from the present is something I assumed most people were capable of sorting out in their head. I suppose loyalty is blinding, something I'm certain you assume is ironically true of me.

 

[Box of Kittens]

Superdelegates aren't going to switch and Sanders knows it. They're not going to tell minorities their vote doesn't matter by giving the nomination to the person who lost the primaries. Especially when that person has antagonized the superdelegates and the candidate who won the majority of the vote is popular among them.

Sanders is keeping up the appearance of a campaign that can win the nomination, but his goal at this point is to try and get as much influence as possible at the convention.

 

[LudicrousSpeed]

Superdelegates aren't going to switch and Sanders knows it. They're not going to tell minorities their vote doesn't matter by giving the nomination to the person who lost the primaries. Especially when that person has antagonized the superdelegates and the candidate who won the majority of the vote is popular among them.

Sanders is keeping up the appearance of a campaign that can win the nomination, but his goal at this point is to try and get as much influence as possible at the convention.

If that was his point, he'd stick to the issues instead of tearing Clinton down. That's not how he's campaigning of late.

Bernie really thinks he can turn this around and get the superdelegates to overturn the result of the primaries.

Which is why I've flipped from rooting for Bernie in his lost-cause primary attempt to a new attitude of "Fuck off, Bernard".

EDIT: This debate is a great example of how Bernie is going scorched earth on this. The debate isn't going to do a damn thing for his positioning. Meanwhile, the reason Trump is taking the debate is because he's trying to re-inforce the paranoid delusions of Sanders' supporters that the election has been stolen from Sanders. No one is better at playing off paranoid delusion than Donald Trump, and if he's successful, he might be able to peel off some voters into voting for him, and those he can't get that far, he can probably push them into buying this "stolen primary" nonsense to ensure that they won't for Clinton in a primary, despite her being the obvious choice for getting most of Sanders' policy objectives achieved.

 

[jack_package_200]

GOAT election

Of course you like fucking Shaun King.

 

[minor effort]

Winning elections requires coalition-building. You are doing the opposite by comparing 40% of Democrats to arsonists.

That will happen, but there's only so much energy you can spend trying to convince the most fanatical supporters who say they'll never vote for Clinton in a million years before you just move on without them.

 

[Godslay]

Clinton is 70-ish delegates from the finish line, he'd have to make her non-viable in every single remaining contest to stop her from winning at this point. She's going to be called as the presumptive nominee when the polls close in the East on the 7th.

Is it a possibility that the Superdelegates can cast their vote before July?

Yes or No?

Most of us are tired of dealing with children.

Yeah, you aren't helping yourself.

Look we get that everyone wants to call them Bernie Bros or low information millennial voters, or people that don't understand how the system works.

That's a pretty big blanket statement to make, and it doesn't help your cause at all. Clinton isn't going to win if she doesn't court those voters. I would readjust that outlook.

 

[Prodigal Son]

Of course you like fucking Shaun King.

?

I don't? I don't think those little names are necessarily names you've liked. I have a few friends who like him, I think. Fucking Ray William Johnson showed up on another post. I sure don't like that dude.

 

[Clockwork5]

I love debates. I have the best debates.

 

[B-Dubs]

Is it a possibility that the Superdelegates can cast their vote before July?

Yes or No?

In that case Cruz could still overtake Trump.

 

[jack_package_200]

?

I don't? I don't think those little names are necessarily names you've liked. I have a few friends who like him, I think. Fucking Ray William Johnson showed up on another post. I sure don't like that dude.

I am pretty sure it shows people whose pages you liked or friends you have added.

Maybe I am wrong.

 

[Suikoguy]

Is it a possibility that the Superdelegates can cast their vote before July?

Yes or No?

The only way you're semantics argument works, is if the Supers were to change their mind and override the popular vote and pledged delegate vote.

Why would they do that? Sanders and his campaign have attacked most of them, some of them personally.