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The Autumn Wind
Who even knows with him. Regardless of whether he's serious or not, no network is going to pay $10 million to do it. They have strict policies against that sort of thing.
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Trump v. Bernie Debate
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BlastProcessing
Member
Did you know that website is still up and it's turned to Trump worship?
minor effort
Banned
The tragicomic history of that site is something to behold.
Aaron Strife
Banned
I mean, draw your own conclusions obviously, but it never hurts to look around and see who's on "your side."
Do people think Trump is really concerned and outraged about Sanders being cheated by the DNC? Or would he be orchestrating this for his own personal gain?
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
I'm out for the evening (going to watch a movie or something).
If I got a bit heated, please don't take it personally. I'll debate you all later once things have calmed down in a month or so
Have a good evening or whatever timezone you are in.
One last side note bit,
The Hillaryis44 website runner is pretty shady.
I can't find the article right now, but the current theory is it's run by a libertarian IIRC.
If I got a bit heated, please don't take it personally. I'll debate you all later once things have calmed down in a month or so
Have a good evening or whatever timezone you are in.
One last side note bit,
The Hillaryis44 website runner is pretty shady.
I can't find the article right now, but the current theory is it's run by a libertarian IIRC.
Reading posts like the one you quoted makes me depressed. So much negativity about this.
It's fair that they can have a debate. I don't see the issue. It seems like a lot of people are actually scared that their chosen candidate's reputation will be tarnished.
I don't think that's going to happen. Let them debate if they want. It should be quite an interesting show.
Besides, I think Hilary should have accepted. She's going to be the nominee, after all.
Unknown Soldier
Member
If Hillary didn't want Bernie to debate with Trump, she should have fulfilled her promise to have a debate with him in California.
She's welcome to break promises, like any other person on Earth. But this time she's actually going to face an actual consequence for breaking a promise, which probably isn't something she's used to but she better get used to it. People remember when you make a promise and then break it when you're President of the United States and they won't let you forget it ever.
She's welcome to break promises, like any other person on Earth. But this time she's actually going to face an actual consequence for breaking a promise, which probably isn't something she's used to but she better get used to it. People remember when you make a promise and then break it when you're President of the United States and they won't let you forget it ever.
This.
Even CNN is calling the IG report a "damning report" on AC360, that this report completely negates her response that she has done nothing wrong - and being trustworthy is already a huge issue for her. There's commentators who think super-delegates will think twice about Clinton with this IG report and if Bernie's able to win California, and saying that this race is not over. So when I see people here so completely dismissive to the slim possibility of Bernie winning to the point of downright nastiness and contempt, and saying that no one will care about this IG report, when even CNN and MSNC are saying otherwise, it just comes off to me as fanatical from the Clinton camp.
I just really think there needs to be more of a balance in this thread.
One of her speeches was already dug up by an employee attendee and posted on YT and linked in PoliGAF or one of these threads I believe a few weeks back. It was boring, by the numbers and a complete non-starter.
Which is why it was pretty much glossed over and ignored. People don't want to admit it, but they don't care or even think there's anything to these speeches. Their gun is just running a little low and they need a reload but Hillary isn't playing ball.
There's a reason this kind of thing is unprecedented: it undermines the party's nominee. The fact that it or anything similar didn't happen even in far more contentious nomination fights (see: GOP in 1976, Dems in 2008) should tell you that Sanders's actions here have more to do with spite than policy.
As to the other point, I'm not sure how much more magnanimity Clinton is expected to show. She has debated Sanders nine times, and Sanders has lost the nominating contest decisively.
The way you're using "...even CNN.." makes me think you think CNN hasn't been riding Clinton's ass about the email server scandal from the moment it became a "thing" for views and hits. It's a story that gets shared a lot so they cover it a lot.
And coverage from CNN certainly doesn't mean the email stuff is not one of the weakest political scandals this side of, well, the Benghazi attack and subsequent hearings.
She's legitimately scared, and even flip flopping on her own quotes from 2008.
EB: You dont buy the party unity argument?
http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2008/05/23/clintons-remarks-on-the-kennedy-assassination/
So... why are the Hilldawgs pushing for Bernie to drop out, when Hillary herself wouldn't support that?
Unknown Soldier
Member
It's not an issue of magnanimity, avarice, mercilessness, munificence, or any other large multi-syllabic word you care to use. It's an issue of honesty and integrity, two simple concepts that Hillary Clinton is severely lacking in perception of these days. She promised she would have a debate with Bernie in California. This promise wasn't contingent on how much she was winning or losing by, the phase of the moon, or how many banks there were on Wall Street that day. It was a promise without pre-conditions, and she has now broken it.
That promise being broken, Bernie is ready for a debate in California but has no one to debate with. Now Trump shows up and says, sure I'll debate you. Bernie wants a debate. Hillary won't play. So what's he going to do? The obvious thing is to have a debate, and Trump is available, so they'll debate. There's no deeper meaning here other than Bernie was owed a debate which wasn't pre-conditioned on whather he was winning or losing in the primary race and then his debate partner changed her mind. He still wants a debate and now he's going to get one with a different candidate.
Also makes the people of California feel they weren't "worthy" of a debate with the glorious Hillary Clinton. Could also be she lost every single one of the debates and came out looking so much worse than before.
i'm a people of california and i don't give a shit since this is a done deal.
you are but 1 person, i think if used correctly this could be a decent boon for her
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The Autumn Wind
You don't know what you want. Let Bernie's supporters tell you. They've been election experts for nearly a year now.
sturgboski
Member
Yep I agree. Perhaps my time didn't come across right as others have thought I am supportive of this debate with this comment.
Is this serious. It made me laugh.
CA is fine not hosting a debate. You'll get to enjoy us during the primary with the glorious "YouTube debates" or if you miss those, the prestigious "Facebook debates". Not to mention all the great times we have with candidates on Google Hangouts and Facetime. We laugh. We cry. We love.
Seriously, Californians are just kinda happy they actually get to have a primary this time, but I don't think many of us are sitting around going "I just wish I could watch the two of them answer the same questions 10 more times on televison".
i think a party would have been a decent boon for her. i mean it still will be, but you get the picture.
i don't really care about hillary versus bernie. i'll be real honest here - i care about not having a republican in the white house from 2017-2021. i'm super worried about the supreme court more than anything else.
I'm not sure what I did to offend you, but my point is that Sanders has stayed in this nominating contest far longer than any candidate with no plausible path to victory has in recent memory, if ever. The 2008 contest was much closer, but if you want to analogize it, Clinton didn't take Obama's refusal to debate her in May as a cue to debate McCain.
Well, no, the obvious thing to do would be to recognize that he will not be the nominee and to refrain from doing anything that will undercut said nominee going forward. The fact that he wants to carry his campaign to the convention to ostensibly advocate for his issues is fine if more than a little unusual, but I don't see why he feels the need to hold the party hostage in order to do that.
Lastly, what he wants beyond that is, frankly, irrelevant. The party's voters have chosen someone else.
jack_package_200
Banned
http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/trump-sanders-debate-talk-awkward-for-clinton-693901891555
Trump/Sanders debate talk awkward for Clinton: Rachel Maddow reports on the newly discussed possibility of a debate between Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders and what that would mean for each candidate's profile in the race, particularly Hillary Clinton's.
Rachel Maddow explains how nothing like this has ever happened before in history and what an incredibly bad idea it is.
Although she is a dirty establishment shill so this will likely be ignored.
Trump/Sanders debate talk awkward for Clinton: Rachel Maddow reports on the newly discussed possibility of a debate between Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders and what that would mean for each candidate's profile in the race, particularly Hillary Clinton's.
Rachel Maddow explains how nothing like this has ever happened before in history and what an incredibly bad idea it is.
Although she is a dirty establishment shill so this will likely be ignored.
Jack Remington
Banned
SolicitorPirate
Member
That's hardly a surprise
Hillary's chances must be abysmal then because Bernie polls far higher than Trump while Hillary and Trump have been in a virtual tie lately.
EDIT: Sorry, I thought you meant in a general election.
Well, what you say is wrong anyway. No surprise hearing this from someone with a Hillary Clinton avatar though.
Discussing GE polling this far out is really rather pointless.
But if you want an explanation for that gap, the balance of it is due to the fact that Clinton supporters are currently more likely to declare a willingness to support Sanders as the nominee than vice versa. The unanswered question is whether Sanders supporters will coalesce around Clinton once Sanders concedes.
BlastProcessing
Member
For a start, Sanders is way, way further behind than Clinton was in 2008. Clinton was even ahead in popular vote at the time she said that.
And it's really not about Sanders staying in or leaving. He can stay in, it's all about how he does it. This seems to be a pretty big disconnect between myself and a lot of Sanders supporters. They seem way less interested in how.
this is a real non-sequitur to the point that Bernie is going to lose
Jack Remington
Banned
He has a 0% chance of winning the primary.
Well considering your avatar, you are wrong because reasons.
Cesare Borgia
Banned
lol
She is under no obligation to debate now that her path to the nomination is secure. Obama did the same thing in late May 2008.
Sanders sounds desperate. It doesn't take a mastermind to figure out Trump was playing games and had no intention of debating. He controlled the media narrative for a few hours at Sanders' expense. Pretty surprising timing too given that the email issue gained some traction before this interrupted it.
Simply untrue.
Nobody cares and in 2 weeks it will be forgotten about. I've watched every debate and each candidate were just repeating themselves ad nauseam. Don't make me sit through another boring debate. Most people don't watch the debates and those that do are just cheering for their guy or gal to win. Each side goes back to their respective camps claiming victory when in the end no one cared about the Democratic Race because the writing on the wall was in April.
This talking point about Clinton going back on her word is just a bunch of last minute:
COME AT ME BRO!
TOO SCARED TO FIGHT! HUH! HUH!"
WHERE ARE YOU GOING!
OH SO YOU THINK YOU'RE TOO GOOD FOR US!
NO! COME BACK PLZ!
DON'T LEAVE ME HERE WITH MY BROKEN DREAMS!
I'm sorry Sanders supporters. I know it hurts but the the fat lady is doing her vocal exercises.
This talking point about Clinton going back on her word is just a bunch of last minute:
COME AT ME BRO!
TOO SCARED TO FIGHT! HUH! HUH!"
WHERE ARE YOU GOING!
OH SO YOU THINK YOU'RE TOO GOOD FOR US!
NO! COME BACK PLZ!
DON'T LEAVE ME HERE WITH MY BROKEN DREAMS!
I'm sorry Sanders supporters. I know it hurts but the the fat lady is doing her vocal exercises.
CloudyTuba
Member
If nothing else this will be entertaining as hell. Hope it happens.
Yeah, some real embarrassing posts in this thread by people I hope I never meet. Great thread for the ignore list.
Yeah, some real embarrassing posts in this thread by people I hope I never meet. Great thread for the ignore list.
Jack Remington
Banned
He just needs to win California by 120%.
He needs to win the remaining 9 states together by about 70%.
If it's any comfort, 0% does not mean it will not happen!
But you are right -- I'm guessing the probability of most models would be somewhere around... 1% or so?
How many states has he won so far by 70%?
Jack Remington
Banned
Totally doable. /s
streetsahead123
Banned
Bernie supporters are the most insufferable group of people on the planet. I caucused for him in February but after months of the relentless circlejerking on Reddit, I just can't stand it anymore and want nothing to do with him. I'd love to see some kind of study on how many Bernie supporters have been driven away by the intensity of the fanbase because I'd bet I'm far from the only one.
He's won one primary with more than 70% of the vote (VT).
Heavy_D206
Member
As an Independent voter I think both parties are the most insufferable groups that I've been around. Their blind party loyalty has them supporting terrible people who don't give a damn about them. It's about time politicians start get called out for their decades of incompetence instead of being defended like they are some victim.
BlastProcessing
Member
Demographics are destiny. Look at the Demographics of the states that Sanders has done the best in, look at the demographics of the states that are left. New Jersey, California and Puerto Rico in no way resemble states he has done well in.
Sanders has had real trouble reaching some core demographic constituencies of the Democratic Party. To change that performance he would need to change something about his message and approach, what changes have you seen that would allow you assume a different outcome?
There is no reason to entertain the fantasy that he will win Puerto Rico (high, almost exclusively Hispanic population), the Virgin Islands (high, almost exclusively black population), New Jersey and California (two of the most demographically diverse populations in the country) with margins even approaching 2-to-1. Neither should you.
40% of Bernie Sanders's supporters didn't believe Hillary Clinton was likely to win the nomination at the beginning of this month according to YouGov, so if you are surrounded by pro-Sanders media... You can absorb certain viewpoints.
But it is now impossible for Bernie Sanders to win the majority of the remaining pledged delegates.
Clockwork5
Member
I like you.
Because we don't have to be polite and magnanimous and camera friendly in the face of overwhelming facts.
Also there really aren't any hilldawgs, just passionless pragmatists holding their noses.
5 - Vermont, Idaho, Utah, Alaska and Washington. He got ~69% in Hawaii, so I'd give him that one too. Only one (Vermont) was a primary, the others were caucuses.
North Dakota is the only caucus state left on the schedule, and most of the remaining primaries are closed. Polling in the larger primary states shows Bernie losing nearly all of them. Even if he wins a couple, we're talking 52-48 type wins, not 70-30. Anyone who still thinks he has a path to the nomination is delusional.
googleplex
Member
The biggest disservice Bernie has done, had been to convince an entire segment of voters that you don't need facts based on objective reality. You can need to ignore math, and history and just rely on passion and shouting over people that disagree with you.
If you lose? Its because the game is rigged.
If someone doesn't endorse you? Its because their part of the establishment.
They don't vote for Bernie? Well, That's the south(read: black voters) and they don't matter anyway.
Breaking the rules and stealing data is fine because it was your opponents fault anyway.
You were mathematically eliminated a month ago? No! Super delegates are now cool and its not over until the last vote and the last $27 dollars is collected.
What a terrible campaign and even worse candidate.
Agent Icebeezy
Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
The bolded is all we are. All I care about are policies and Supreme Court votes. Bernie has proven a million times over that he'd get less shit passed than Obama did and Trump is a fucking loon. A lot of us don't want Hillary, but we'll take her. I'll and millions of others will take a virtual third term of Obama any day. Bernie is one of the worst things to ever happen to the Democrats during an election cycle and I sincerely mean that.
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