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[Dee Dah Dave]

That's why MS will go full next gen. No way will they release Halo 6 on both XB1 and the new 6TF machine.

Beyond a transitionary year with a few cross platform games and multi plats, Scorpio will be different in implementation to that of the rumoured Neo.

In my humble, humble opinion!

 

[Strootman]

I think that of course they won't show the new console at this E3, but they will announce it coming next year and will just say something like: "Our strategy is to give player choice, for those who don't want to spend too much, here's the xbox one slim at 249/299$, for those who want better performance and graphics, next year we will be launching a new hardware piece"

 

[Strootman]

can you imagine?

6TF Halo...

Spoiler

oh yeah.

6TF Scalebound...

6TF Elder Scrolls...

 

[Nictel]

Here is the big issue: I don't understand how people think MS will announce a XBox Slim for this year and a Xbox One Scorpio for next year. Unless the Slim is priced at 249,- or in that area.

Messaging will be very important, Sony has the advantage of being second with their conference. They can adjust their messaging to counter Microsoft.

If Sony adjusts their pricing of the Neo to the Slim then Sony again has the superior product. (The PS4 is seen superior to the One so any upgrade will automatically be seen as superior.) Then later the can announce a competitor to the Scorpio and again the two companies are in sync release schedule wise.

On the other hand if Sony build the Neo as a more expensive product they can't price it competitive to the Xbox One Slim. Which creates a question: will PS4 owners update theirs to a Neo or decide to buy a second console in the form of a Xbox One Slim?

The success of the Scorpio depends on the product itself but also on the success of the Occulus Rift and if Sony has a competitive product right away or a year later.

I am looking forward to E3, Microsoft will have learned from the Don Mattrick school of 'do exactly the opposite of what I do' and I expect them to have their messaging completely in order. Which means Sony needs to do more than go "yeah we are the fun gaming company that doesn't want to go all Orwell on you".

 

[Fess]

It doesn't work like that though. Sony's not gonna upgrade their console in a number of hours.

The leaked Scorpio specs has probably been at Sony's HQ for quite some time, and the launch date is not set in stone yet, so I definitely think they'll try to one up MS somehow at E3, especially since their press conference is after MS and they have time to counter some of their bullet points like they did at the PS4 unveil.

 

[Putty]

I think that of course they won't show the new console at this E3, but they will announce it coming next year and will just say something like: "Our strategy is to give player choice, for those paupers who don't want to spend too much, here's the xbox one slim at 249/299$, for those who want better performance and graphics, next year we will be launching a new hardware piece"

Fixed.

 

[SOR5]

6TF Scalebound...

6TF Elder Scrolls...

It just dont stop

 

[nekkid]

That's why MS will go full next gen. No way will they release Halo 6 on both XB1 and the new 6TF machine.

Beyond a transitionary year with a few cross platform games and multi plats, Scorpio will be different in implementation to that of the rumoured Neo.

In my humble, humble opinion!

It'll upset a lot of people, but I really hope this is true.

 

[BlazinAm]

I guess this is what the console cycles will be going forward. half steps over and over again. Microsoft and Sony can't risk full player-base acquisition methods anymore.

 

[EvB]

The leaked Scorpio specs has probably been at Sony's HQ for quite some time, and the launch date is not set in stone yet, so I definitely think they'll try to one up MS somehow at E3, especially since their press conference is after MS and they have time to counter some of their bullet points like they did at the PS4 unveil.

If they are aiming for a spring release, then we may not hear specifics until gamescom in August

 

[Strootman]

I guess this is what the console cycles will be going forward. half steps over and over again. Microsoft and Sony can't risk full player-base acquisition methods anymore.

But this is not an half step...

 

[Bits N Pieces]

can you imagine?

6TF Halo...

Spoiler

oh yeah.

You see I'm kind of on the fence with these new consoles, then I see a post like the above and all of a sudden I'm screaming internally like a 5 year old on Christmas morning ripping the wrapping paper off of every present under the tree.

theypullmebackin.gif

 

[Dee Dah Dave]

It'll upset a lot of people, but I really hope this is true.

I don't think it will. The XB1 will have been on the market 4 years by the time of Scorpio's release, same as the first Xbox. I would imagine the bulk of core Xbox fans will be quite happy to move on to a much better machine after the mistakes of the XB1. Particularly if the new machine is backwards compatible, which is almost a certainty at this stage.

It makes much more sense for MS to go full next gen in terms of game releases and marketing campaign, than it does to be an extension of the XB1, which is esentially a failed product.

 

[Kordelle]

I just hope the Elite Controller will work on Scorpio (and the Kinect would be cool too).

 

[MilkyJoe]

I just hope the Elite Controller will work on Scorpio (and the Kinect would be cool too).

I'd expect it to come with the elite, or a variation. Kinect will most likely work, but won't be in the box.

 

[Obscuritas]

That's why MS will go full next gen. No way will they release Halo 6 on both XB1 and the new 6TF machine.

Beyond a transitionary year with a few cross platform games and multi plats, Scorpio will be different in implementation to that of the rumoured Neo.

In my humble, humble opinion!

Halo 6 will be released on X1 too, period. They won't alienate their userbase like that. And since it is a 3 years development cycle, the Scorpio crowd won't be the majority in the 2018 fall season.

 

[BrokenIcarus]

That's why MS will go full next gen. No way will they release Halo 6 on both XB1 and the new 6TF machine.

Beyond a transitionary year with a few cross platform games and multi plats, Scorpio will be different in implementation to that of the rumoured Neo.

In my humble, humble opinion!

I don't think it will. The XB1 will have been on the market 4 years by the time of Scorpio's release, same as the first Xbox. I would imagine the bulk of core Xbox fans will be quite happy to move on to a much better machine after the mistakes of the XB1. Particularly if the new machine is backwards compatible, which is almost a certainty at this stage.

It makes much more sense for MS to go full next gen in terms of game releases and marketing campaign, than it does to be an extension of the XB1, which is esentially a failed product.

4 years is a horrible time, and the leap from 360 to XB1 would be far far greater than the leap from XB1 to Scorpio. Combine that with the fact, that a 6TF machine would cost a LOT even in 2017 and you get a device that's really really indesirable. MS will have to keep forward compatibility to really compete IMO.

 

[justsomeguy]

6TF Scalebound...

6TF Elder Scrolls...

Streetfighter 6.

Spoiler

too soon?

 

[SOR5]

4 years is a horrible time,.

 

[Obscuritas]

Streetfighter 6.

Spoiler

too soon?

The real question here is "if", not "when".

 

[gofreak]

So, if these rumors are true, can't see Sony accepting the power difference and Sony's E3 briefing is after Microsoft's so what will they change to make MS look like fools this time? Twice the RAM? Two CPUs? Earlier launch and super powerful PS5 out in late 2018 with upgrade plans for Neo buyers?

Scorpio only looks bad for Neo if they are releasing at the same time. If Neo releases well ahead of Scorpio, this year, along with a lower price PS4 standard, I think that will be enough 'catching MS off-guard' for Sony for one day.

Any surprises vs the leaked Neo spec would be welcome of course!

 

[nekkid]

I don't think it will. The XB1 will have been on the market 4 years by the time of Scorpio's release, same as the first Xbox. I would imagine the bulk of core Xbox fans will be quite happy to move on to a much better machine after the mistakes of the XB1. Particularly if the new machine is backwards compatible, which is almost a certainty at this stage.

It makes much more sense for MS to go full next gen in terms of game releases and marketing campaign, than it does to be an extension of the XB1, which is esentially a failed product.

I still think forwards compatibility is an important part of the Scorpio story. I'm the sort of gamer that would buy the newer console day 1, so I want new games to be all-in on it, even if that means 720p 30fps on XB1 to mean we get the best performing games on the newer hardware.

 

[Maximilian Kolbe]

Scorpio only looks bad for Neo if they are releasing at the same time. If Neo releases well ahead of Scorpio, this year, along with a lower price PS4 standard, I think that will be enough 'catching MS off-guard' for Sony for one day.

Any surprises vs the leaked Neo spec would be welcome of course!

It's pretty much Sony can't "catching MS off-guard" anymore if even us know PS4 Neo have chance release this year, hell the rumor comes with "Neo will release this fall" at first, then some other Neo rumors comes with "Neo will release spring 2017" recently.
But MS can't "catching Sony off-guard" too anyway, because Scorpio comes with release next fall since beginning.

 

[BrokenIcarus]

Yeah that already was quite awful on their part, but the Xbox Brand was still in it's infancy and the Leap from OGXbox to 360 was much larger then the Xbone to Scorpio Leap ever will be.

 

[nekkid]

Yeah that already was quite awful on their part, but the Xbox Brand was still in it's infancy and the Leap from OGXbox to 360 was much larger then the Xbone to Scorpio Leap ever will be.

OG Xbox was not awful...

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

A console rushed to market that had historically awful issues with built quality?

 

[gofreak]

It's pretty much Sony can't "catching MS off-guard" anymore if even us know PS4 Neo have chance release this year, hell the rumor comes with "Neo will release this fall" at first, then some other Neo rumors comes with "Neo will release spring 2017" recently.
But MS can't "catching Sony off-guard" too anyway, because Scorpio comes with release next fall since beginning.

Obviously they do both know each other's plans already, more or less. I was referring more to the perception of one-up-man-ship that I think the post I was replying to was talking about.

 

[Sidewinder]

I still think forwards compatibility is an important part of the Scorpio story. I'm the sort of gamer that would buy the newer console day 1, so I want new games to be all-in on it, even if that means 720p 30fps on XB1 to mean we get the best performing games on the newer hardware.

It is important if you release new hardware after 2 or 3 years, but after 4 years and with an almost generational leap in power (5x) I don't think it'll make much sense anymore. Maybe during the first year after Scorpios launch, but after that, the games on One will look like garbage compared to the Scorpio versions pretty fast, so why even bother? Because that's not forward compatibility, just transition phase like the 1-2 years after PS4/One release.

Unless the raw power advantage will mostly be used for 4K and or VR that is. Backwards compatibility is a must no matter what though!

 

[SOR5]

A console rushed to market that had historically awful issues with built quality?

Sony would still be there, selling millions of budget PS4 or Neo or whatever it is without feeling the urge to fuck up everything like they did with the PS3, so yeah, this comparison doesn't prove anything.

They can't upset their already shrinking userbase, they don't have this privilege (nor do Sony).

Hey, im just saying its happened before

Yeah that already was quite awful on their part, but the Xbox Brand was still in it's infancy and the Leap from OGXbox to 360 was much larger then the Xbone to Scorpio Leap ever will be.

It's still a chunky next-gen leap that people adapted to

 

[Obscuritas]

Sony would still be there, selling millions of budget PS4 or Neo or whatever it is without feeling the urge to fuck up everything like they did with the PS3, so yeah, this comparison doesn't prove anything.

They can't upset their already shrinking userbase, they don't have this privilege (nor do Sony).

 

[Chris1]

Honestly I agree 4 years is too early, should be a minimum of 5. But Since Sony is coming out with a new machine this (next?) year they can probably get away with starting a new gen.

I don't think an upgraded xbox one is going to help, it's a new gen they need I think. Get rid of the name and start fresh without all the stigma attached to the XB1. So I think jumping into next gen rather than a .5 upgrade is a smart move for them at least.

 

[SOR5]

I don't think an upgraded xbox one is going to help, it's a new gen they need I think. Get rid of the name and start fresh without all the stigma attached to the XB1.

Watch them get this completely mixed up and just call it "one." with lowercase trendy letters as well

 

[blastprocessor]

Considering the next generation of GPU let's assume the 1080ti / Titan X are around 12tflops. So a 1070GTX would be a midrange GPU, which is around 6.5tflops.

Assuming 6 tflops, Scorpio will be what PS4 was i.e., midrange.

PS4 Neo appears to be above low end.

As a PS4 owner the Neo is not looking as exciting a proposition, will it even be minimum VR spec which is a 970 GTX?

Scorpio not only appears to address the performance issues but looks to have enough grunt for good VR too.

Interesting times.

 

[Nictel]

Considering the next generation of GPU let's assume the 1080ti / Titan X are around 12tflops. So a 1070GTX would be a midrange GPU, which is around 6.5tflops.

Assuming 6 tflops, Scorpio will be what PS4 was i.e., midrange.

PS4 Neo appears to be above low end.

As a PS4 owner the Neo is not looking as exciting a proposition, will it even be minimum VR spec which is a 970 GTX?

Scorpio not only appears to address the performance issues but looks to have enough grunt for good VR too.

Interesting times.

I secretly think that the Neo will actually be lower in production cost than the PS4. It will be marketed more at new customers than existing PS4 owners as a low entry point to VR.

I hope that this deal between MS and Occulus is not too set in stone. Word on the street is that the Vive is better than the Occulus. This of course can change but the initial message is important, as we saw with the Xbox One always online kerfuffle. I just hope MS isn't betting all its VR money on one horse.

 

[thuway]

I wonder what the cost to manufacture Scorpio is. Sony is definetely using cheaper components if they are sticking with GDDR5 and Jaguar cores. If Microsoft does come in with Scorpio at $399, I imagine Microsoft is using some pretty good stuff. HBM2, Zen cores, and a GPU solution that should equate to around a 390X!

As a PS4 owner the Neo is not looking as exciting a proposition, will it even be minimum VR spec which is a 970 GTX?

Scorpio not only appears to address the performance issues but looks to have enough grunt for good VR too.

Interesting times.

Two huge problems in your rationale:

1. You are comparing AMD teraflop ratings to Nvidia teraflop ratings. Nvidia's teraflops are by definition more powerful. Look to AMD cards to better identify your power concerns, and btw, it looks even more grim when comparing those numbers. Short answer: the Scorpio is no where NEAR the GTX 1070. Scorpio hovers around the GTX 970 in Nvidia comparisons.

And

2. You are also talking about nearly 2 years from now (16 months) when Scorpio is set to launch. 2 years in GPU land would mean by the time Scorpio launches it'll be an enthusiast range for AMD cards, and probably in the under enthusiast bracket for Nvidia. Don't try and compare yourself to PC because you'll always lose and come out looking even more anemic as the months go by.

 

[blastprocessor]

You are comparing AMD teraflop ratings to Nvidia teraflop ratings.

We won't know until the updated AMD architecture is compared as there are significant updates.

 

[thuway]

We won't know until the updated AMD architecture is compared as there are significant updates.

Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not saying their aren't significant updates, I'm just saying it isn't an apples to apples comparison to abritrarily take the TF number and compare it to the Nvidia line of GPUs. Because it becomes a completely different ballgame there.

 

[Three]

The xbox 360 did not sell that well in its early years. It only picked up steam later. Whether that was due to RRoD or people waiting for the PS3 release before making a choice is anyones guess but the short lifespan of the OG Xbox and it's failure to gain market traction certainly did burn a few.

Whether they would announce a product thats still prototype or very early concept at E3 is debatable though. My guess is that they won't but considering that they want to show anything thats a long way off just to stop playstations momentum they just might. Just look at all the time hololens got at past E3s.

 

[Milly Osworth]

Guys I want to play Call of Duty, which version of Playstation or Xbox shall I get? Or shall I wait? When is a new version coming out? #consolegaming

 

[pitchfork]

I know its just a codename, but i'd actually love for them to call this thing 'Scorpio'

 

[Ushay]

I know its just a codename, but i'd actually love for them to call this thing 'Scorpio'

Would be awesome, but I think going with OG 'Xbox' with version numbers coming after that would make the most sense. Example.. Xbox Mark I, Mark II etc since it's becoming iterative by design now.

 

[Obscuritas]

It will be marketed more at new customers than existing PS4 owners as a low entry point to VR.

No way PSVR can be so influential right now, Neo (as Scorpio) will be marketed as a premium model with better overall performance and that's it. Heavily promoting the Neo-PSVR combo would be just ridiculous with that price point (~$800).

 

[-ImaginaryInsider]

Because he has never ever, not even once, been correct with his crazy predictions.

He speculated the Neo rumors were just insiders confused over an upcoming firmware update that would massively increase sales... statements like that absolutely earn him the criticism he gets.

 

[Number_6]

1. You are comparing AMD teraflop ratings to Nvidia teraflop ratings. Nvidia's teraflops are by definition more powerful.

What? A teraflop is a measure of speed. It's universal.

What you are saying is like saying that Chevy mph is by definition more powerful than Ford mph. It makes no sense. Miles per hour is a universal measure of speed.

 

[thuway]

What? A teraflop is a measure of speed. It's universal.

What you are saying is like saying that Chevy mph is by definition more powerful than Ford mph. It makes no sense. Miles per hour is a universal measure of speed.

How do I put it - Nvidia cards generally perform better than AMD cards when you factor in Teraflops as your rubrick of comparison. Example-


The 980ti and 290X are both 5.6 TFLOPS. However, the Nvidia cards kicks the living hell out of the AMD card. The 980ti performs TWICE AS GOOD as the AMD part, yet both are around 5 teraflops. Point? You can't compare the Teraflops of an Nvidia card and expect similar performance for an AMD part. Why? If we just took TF ratings in a vacuum the Nvidia cards are performing much better. Here's a benchmark:

 

[Ushay]

How do I put it - Nvidia cards generally perform better than AMD cards when you factor in Teraflops as your rubrick of comparison. Example-


The 980ti and 290X are both 5.6 TFLOPS. However, the Nvidia cards kicks the living hell out of the AMD card. The 980ti performs TWICE AS GOOD as the AMD part, yet both are around 5 teraflops. Point? You can't compare the Teraflops of an Nvidia card and expect similar performance for an AMD part. Why? If we just took TF ratings in a vacuum the Nvidia cards are performing much better. Here's a benchmark:

Wouldn't this be down to the software running on the hardware, or do vendors just flat out lie about the speed? Because that is exactly what this sounds like.

Anyway back OT - I'm thinking a Neo announcement with no sign of a MS console wouldn't be good news at all. So confusing how they will congest so much into this conference.

 

[...Scatter...]

can you imagine?

6TF Halo...

Spoiler

oh yeah.

If we can get 3 wardens on 1.32 Terraflops that means we'll get like 13.63 Wardens at 6 Terraflops. That's a huge Warden increase!

Spoiler

I still love Halo 5 and day 1 for Halo 6

 

[thuway]

Wouldn't this be down to the software running on the hardware, or do vendors just flat out lie about the speed?

Thats way beyond whatever the hell I understand, but as a general rule of thumb from PC GAF- do not compare Nvidia Teraflops to AMD Teraflops. That's why when people are automatically assuming Scorpio will perform like a GTX 1070- I cringe a little because the 1070 is 6.5 Teraflops and performs slightly better than a Titan X which throws another curveball. A more realistic expectation is to expect something that performs between a 290X and 390X with much better performance caps at 4K ^_^.

The reality is- you can't really extrapolate performance when comparing different generations but more importantly- you can't use an isolated metric when comparing different vendors because the numebrs are all scrwey

 

[bidguy]

If we can get 3 wardens on 1.32 Terraflops that means we'll get like 13.63 Wardens at 6 Terraflops. That's a huge Warden increase!

Spoiler

I still love Halo 5 and day 1 for Halo 6

they did some magic with halo 4 on xbox 360 so i expect them to totally blow us away on scorpio

halo 5 was 60fps so ill forgive them for the small jump

 

[Markoman]

What? A teraflop is a measure of speed. It's universal.

What you are saying is like saying that Chevy mph is by definition more powerful than Ford mph. It makes no sense. Miles per hour is a universal measure of speed.

Do two different car models with the exact same horse power specification reach the same max mph?

That's how it works.