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[Chris1]

We all know a new iPhone is coming out every year, does that kill sales?

MS are most likely going down the yearly console route most likely. When Scorpio comes out, are people going to be like I will wait next year as they'd release a new one. You'd be waiting forever.

Nintendo announced the NX basically a year in advance.

I don't understand this kill sales. PS3 sales were good when Sony announced the PS4 back in Feb 2013.

As long as MS support the Xbox one with good games then the sales will good. Then you got a game like red dead redemption and Mass effect, which could launch before the Scorpio. GTA V launched before the PS4 and that boosted PS3 sales.

Also the Scorpio won't be for everyone. It's going to a high price entry console. Where as Xbox one will be low entry and that should boost its sales.

Consoles aren't phones. Wii U has been dead for years, announcing NX doesn't really matter, you can't kill what's already dead and GTA V is another beast all together & RDR will help Sony way more than it will help MS.

High price entry console? Consoles have limits, it's not going to be >$399, any higher and they are killing Scorpio themselves. I don't see the console getting dropped to $250 so we're looking at $299 weak box vs $399 next year over 4x more powerful if rumours are true, why would anyone buy the current weak box when you can wait a year and get something far more powerful for a few $ more?

The only system seller they have coming out before Scorpio barring any big third party exclusive money hat like RDR or something is Gears 4 and to be honest I'm not even sure how much of a system seller that is if even Halo barely moved the needle (which had it's own problems admittedly, but still).

 

[Darryl M R]

We all know a new iPhone is coming out every year, does that kill sales?

MS are most likely going down the yearly console route most likely. When Scorpio comes out, are people going to be like I will wait next year as they'd release a new one. You'd be waiting forever.

Nintendo announced the NX basically a year in advance.

I don't understand this kill sales. PS3 sales were good when Sony announced the PS4 back in Feb 2013.

As long as MS support the Xbox one with good games then the sales will good. Then you got a game like red dead redemption and Mass effect, which could launch before the Scorpio. GTA V launched before the PS4 and that boosted PS3 sales.

Also the Scorpio won't be for everyone. It's going to a high price entry console. Where as Xbox one will be low entry and that should boost its sales.

Just throwing in my $0.02.

I think a phone purchase is different than a console purchase especially when you think of user utility.

If I currently do not own a Xbox One and I hear at E3 the Xbox Two is coming out in a year I would not feel compelled to buy the Xbox One, but instead save for the better console. I would think that sales would slow down with people thinking about the next big thing coming up.

 

[wachie]

Those people are crazy the TDP for that thing is 150watts and that is just the GPU .
Something like that is not going to find it's way into a console this year .

The TDP should be below 150W, it should be fine.

 

[SpotAnime]

We all know a new iPhone is coming out every year, does that kill sales?

I can't find a specific quote on that, but the graph below shows that there is a downward trend of iPhone sales every year, leading up to the big spike with every new iterative hardware release [From TC]:

 

[gundamkyoukai]

You use the word this year when the rumor is next year...

Also consumer card requirements =/= custom built console hardware.

I know the rumor is next year .
The post i quote was talking about why some people think it might be this year .
Also it being custom hardware don't change certain aspect of the TDP.

 

[icespide]

I know folks are tried of the smart phone argument but I can't help but get a little annoyed when someone says "consoles aren't phones"

like, that is the entire point of this, consoles aren't phones yet but they're about to be, if that succeeds or fails remains to be seen

 

[x-Lundz-x]

If they really do reveal the Scorpio at E3 I don't see how this could possibly be released Fall of next year. It would have to be coming this Fall or in the Spring of next year.

What is the longest gap between a console reveal and actual release been in the past? Has anything ever been longer than a year?

 

[SpotAnime]

https://twitter.com/majornelson/status/738027693833375744

so the X1 price cut last until june 13? I thought it was permanent.

No, the language released yesterday did say it was limited, but this is the first I'd heard of until when. Lining up with E3 does make this interesting. Since there is precedent for subsequent hardware revisions to take the former's price point, I'm thinking MS is going to announce new hardware to take the former's $349/$399 price point, and phase out the older models at the new $299 price.

But would a Slim warrant a $50 increase? What will it offer that the current model does not? It might not be Scorpio levels of graphic performance, but I'm thinking there will be a new model to offer enhancements above the current one. UHD/4K perhaps?

 

[Chris1]

If they really do reveal the Scorpio at E3 I don't see how this could possibly be released Fall of next year. It would have to be coming this Fall or in the Spring of next year.

What is the longest gap between a console reveal and actual release been in the past? Has anything ever been longer than a year?

XB1 was revealed in May, released in November.

I know it doesn't answer your question but going from a 6month window to potentially 18 month window is long. By the looks of things, they're gonna announce it at E3 (phil's comments, rumours, etc). Honestly it makes me think they might actually release this bad boy this year, I don't know how they'd do it without taking a hefty loss but revealing Scorpio 18 months out is stupid as hell.

 

[FordGTGuy]

I know the rumor is next year .
The post i quote was talking about why some people think it might be this year .
Also it being custom hardware don't change certain aspect of the TDP.

Well sure it does, if they lower the clockrate it lowers the amount of watts needed.

Even if it does run at 150 Watts.. why not? People want more powerful hardware and that's going to come with a higher power demand.

 

[darkinstinct]

You use the word this year when the rumor is next year...

Also consumer card requirements =/= custom built console hardware.



Well I think the controller revision at E3 is going to be a microphone, I also expect a remote control for the streaming devices with a mic installed too.

But still a Kinect has it's place for people that want it.

Do you believe they will build the Kinect port into every Slim console or every Scorpio? That's gonna be millions of dollar that go to waste for people that don't own and/or want a Kinect. These consoles are built around saving cost. The best case scenario for Kinect owners is that they offer an adapter (Kinect->USB) for $49 so Kinect owners can continue using their device with the new console. But I doubt they will even do that. Kinect is dead.

 

[FordGTGuy]

Do you believe they will build the Kinect port into every Slim console or every Scorpio? That's gonna be millions of dollar that go to waste for people that don't own and/or want a Kinect.

This is a joke right?

That's gotta be a joke.

What's a Kinect port on a Xbox One console cost? 20 cents? 10 cents per console?

On the grand scheme of things it is nothing, that goes for the HDMI-in port too.

 

[cackhyena]

I know folks are tried of the smart phone argument but I can't help but get a little annoyed when someone says "consoles aren't phones"

like, that is the entire point of this, consoles aren't phones yet but they're about to be, if that succeeds or fails remains to be seen

The point is phones have become necessities that filter through a lot of your daily life. Absolutely nothing about a console qualifies in the same way. It's a luxury time. The comparison (and why it's out of whack) sticks.

 

[icespide]

kinect port will stay but I could see the HDMI-in going away, not for money or space reasons, but just another notch on the "look we care about games no for real" belt

 

[Bitch Pudding]

Do you believe they will build the Kinect port into every Slim console or every Scorpio? That's gonna be millions of dollar that go to waste for people that don't own and/or want a Kinect. These consoles are built around saving cost.

This is a joke right?

That's gotta be a joke.

What's a Kinect port on a Xbox One console cost? 20 cents? 10 cents per console?

On the grand scheme of things it is nothing, that goes for the HDMI-in port too.

Well, 10 Cents means 1 million costs per 10 million Units sold.

 

[FordGTGuy]

kinect port will stay but I could see the HDMI-in going away, not for money or space reasons, but just another notch on the "look we care about games no for real" belt

I heavily doubt that.

That's like saying Sony shouldn't support Vue with the Neo so they don't give off the idea of it not being a gaming device.

Well, 10 Cents means 1 million costs per 10 million Units sold.

If you ignore that they make a profit on every console sold and only consider the sale of each console a complete loss... sure.

As I said before, compared to the cost of the full device to build, ship and sell it is a complete non-issue.

 

[x-Lundz-x]

XB1 was revealed in May, released in November.

I know it doesn't answer your question but going from a 6month window to potentially 18 month window is long. By the looks of things, they're gonna announce it at E3 (phil's comments, rumours, etc). Honestly it makes me think they might actually release this bad boy this year, I don't know how they'd do it without taking a hefty loss but revealing Scorpio 18 months out is stupid as hell.

I don't think anything in recent memory has been more than about 9 months. 18 would just be insane....

 

[icespide]

I heavily doubt that.

That's like saying Sony shouldn't support Vue with the Neo so they don't give off the idea of it not being a gaming device.

Vue wasn't as controversial and tied to the original reveal of the console like the HDMI-in TV stuff with the xbox one was. "TV TV TV TV TV..."

 

[FordGTGuy]

Vue wasn't as controversial and tied to the original reveal of the console like the HDMI-in TV stuff with the xbox one was. "TV TV TV TV TV..."

People honestly consider the HDMI-in port to be controversial?

What a bunch of cry-babies.

The PS4 and Xbox One are consoles that also serve a purpose as media devices and both offer ways to watch live TV through them now. People are just going to have to get over that fact.

The controversy was how the Xbox One was initially revealed, it isn't the continued existence of an HDMI-in port.

 

[icespide]

People honestly consider the HDMI-in port to be controversial?

What a bunch of cry-babies.

it absolutely was at the time of the reveal

 

[AmuroChan]

The point is phones have become necessities that filter through a lot of your daily life. Absolutely nothing about a console qualifies in the same way. It's a luxury time. The comparison (and why it's out of whack) sticks.

A phone is a necessity. A $400 iPhone is not. You can get a cheap, low-end smartphone. The top of the line iPhone is absolutely a luxury item. Apple has just done a great job at making people feel like they must have an iPhone.

 

[WadeitOut]

it absolutely was at the time of the reveal

To hardcore Internet communities. That's about it.

 

[FordGTGuy]

it absolutely was at the time of the reveal

The problem was the way they marketed at the reveal.

The controversy is not the continued existence of the HDMI-in port.

 

[Armadilo]

I don't want to start another thread since you know, but these new upgraded consoles have given people excitement. Especially with the new Xbox being a potential beast.

Brings back stuff that was said about the ps4 and X1 being stop gap consoles, they couldn't keep up with todays standards.

Greatness is almost here

 

[Neuromancer]

I love how the stoy of iterating hardware that has been console gamer's #1 reason for never going PC, is now suddenly the best thing since sliced bread.

I mean, I agree... I just find it amusing that now everyone agrees too, you know, once consoles started doing it

This is the smartest move consoles have made in a very long time, as has been just about EVERY move they copied from PC gaming since the release of the Xbox.

I think you're projecting here a bit.

 

[icespide]

To hardcore Internet communities. That's about it.

and to everyone else, the most use the HDMI-in port probably gets is when people accidentally plug in there instead of the out port when hooking up their xbox

 

[Chris1]

and to everyone else, the most use the HDMI-in port probably gets is when people accidentally plug in there instead of the out port when hooking up their xbox

Guilty as charged lol

They really fucked that up, I think they updated the stickers later on though?

 

[FordGTGuy]

and to everyone else, the most use the HDMI-in port probably gets is when people accidentally plug in there instead of the out port when hooking up their xbox

If you think that's true then I have some ocean front property in Arizona to sell you.

 

[WadeitOut]

and to everyone else, the most use the HDMI-in port probably gets is when people accidentally plug in there instead of the out port when hooking up their xbox

You think the TV focus at E3 was controversial to the general population? And your example is people accidentally plugging their HDMI cable into the wrong clearly labeled port?

Everyone I know with an Xbox One uses their HDMI in port.

 

[SicSemperTyrannis]

If they really do reveal the Scorpio at E3 I don't see how this could possibly be released Fall of next year. It would have to be coming this Fall or in the Spring of next year.

What is the longest gap between a console reveal and actual release been in the past? Has anything ever been longer than a year?

Plenty of consoles have been known about over a year before launch, the most recent and disastrous example was the Wii U which was shown at E3 in 2011 and not being launched until November 2012. The PlayStation 3 pulled the same shtick, revealed at E3 2005, released November 2006. If memory serves me correctly, the original Xbox was first shown at CES in 2000 and wasn't launched until Nivember 2001.

Edit: Xbox wasn't shown that early, it was CES in 2001, my bad.

 

[cackhyena]

A phone is a necessity. A $400 iPhone is not. You can get a cheap, low-end smartphone. The top of the line iPhone is absolutely a luxury item. Apple has just done a great job at making people feel like they must have an iPhone.

But when year 3 rolls around, whatever the price, you can justify taking that hit because one is vital to your everyday goings on. The average person doesn't look at the two remotely the same, nor should they.

 

[e-gamer]

That's what MS dreams of but it will probably be more like Xbox vs PS2.

Or not.

Sega didn't get support even from EA, one of the (if not the) most relevant publisher of that time, that used to support (and get relevant after Genesis).

Microsoft has EA, Activision, Ubisoft (all of them in a great shape) and Square, Namco, Capcom and even Konami with all of its principal series. Its quite different today.

Let PS4Neo one year (i believe in 6 months at most) alone in the market (with Xbox Slim, PS4 and perhaps Nintendo NX) will not be so bad for them.

 

[icespide]

You think the TV focus at E3 was controversial to the general population? And your example is people accidentally plugging their HDMI cable into the wrong clearly labeled port?

no I'm saying it probably wasn't controversial to normal people and normal people don't care about HDMI in

 

[FordGTGuy]

no I'm saying it probably wasn't controversial to normal people and that normal people don't care about HDMI-in. it's niche

Uh... yeah... yeah they do.

They aren't going out of their way to buy an Xbox One for it but I know a lot of people that actively use it over their set top boxes.

 

[icespide]

Uh... yeah... yeah they do.

we'll have to agree to disagree there

 

[cackhyena]

Uh... yeah... yeah they do.

Do they? I kinda figured it was a lesser used thing. So many cutting the cord and all.

 

[FordGTGuy]

Do they? I kinda figured it was a lesser used thing. So many cutting the cord and all.

Of course there are cord cutters but you still have a lot of people out there with tv services and those that I know that do use the feature actively. I'm sure Microsoft have the data for this also which is why they'll keep HDMI-in.

They aren't going to get rid of it because some cry babies whining about how it makes it look like they aren't a "real" gaming console.

 

[cackhyena]

I guess we'll find out.

 

[Welfare]

https://twitter.com/majornelson/status/738027693833375744

so the X1 price cut last until june 13? I thought it was permanent.

Most likely the new slim model will have the permanent price.

 

[Branniganz Love]

and to everyone else, the most use the HDMI-in port probably gets is when people accidentally plug in there instead of the out port when hooking up their xbox

Dude, you are way off base on the HDMI-in. Do you own an xbox one? The thing is in use all the time in my home and everyone on on my friends list is constantly watching TV on their Xbox. The way they presented and revealed the xbox one was the issue the existence of the HDMI-in was not. I would be seriously annoyed if they removed it because it is one of the most convenient features on the xbox one.

 

[icespide]

Dude, you are way off base on the HDMI-in. Do you own an xbox one? The thing is in use all the time in my home and everyone on on my friends list is constantly watching TV on their Xbox. The way they presented and revealed the xbox one was the issue the existence of the HDMI-in was not. I would be seriously annoyed if they removed it because it is one of the most convenient features on the xbox one.

I do have an Xbox one.

 

[Compsiox]

https://twitter.com/majornelson/status/738027693833375744

so the X1 price cut last until june 13? I thought it was permanent.

That's when they'll cut the price further. Guaranteed.

 

[Samurai G0SU]

Hdmi in is great for families who have cable/satellite.

 

[Theonik]

It wont cost them 199.... not when they are buying millions of chips

That depends on what margins AMD is making on the chip ultimately, chips like this don't become cheaper to produce with volume but makers are willing to compromise on margins for hight volume orders. However, a $199 chip like this is very likely to be a very low margin chip for AMD already.

Doesn't mean the custom APU based on the 480 will hit 150

It does if you want the same performance. (ie unless they clock it lower which means lower performance also)

 

[kingwingin]

Slim at a good price is the answer until then along with great games and exclusives. Everyone will know that a more powerful machine than PS4k is not too far off so buy into the xbox ecosystem now and everything will be forward compatible. Even with Oculus.

Next to no one will buy a console only to buy the better version a year later.

This year we are going to get titanfall, battlefield and call of duty. How can you convince people to buy the 720p version now and then spend more money to upgrade, when they can jump right into 1080p and beyond.

Either they both release this year or they both release next year. I cant see neo this year and scorpio next.

 

[JaggedSac]

Yea, Kinect they will have to support because they said many times Cortana will be able to be used with Kinect.
And HDMI in also has to happen because of the rumored DVR feature. Not to mention all the TV features already in place.

DVR will likely only work via the usb tuner.

 

[MilkyJoe]

Hdmi in is great for families who have cable/satellite.

Or just plug it into your TV, then you don't have to waste money with the Xbox on?

Or not, I never used it. Never will.

 

[icespide]

Next to no one will buy a console only to buy the better version a year later.

This year we are going to get titanfall, battlefield and call of duty. How can you convince people to buy the 720p version now and then spend more money to upgrade, when they can jump right into 1080p and beyond.

Either they both release this year or they both release next year. I cant see neo this year and scorpio next.

next year will have call of duty and battlefield as well. Xbox could just as easily push their power advantage next year

 

[Lord Error]

But they weren't, TLOU (never played but looks good graphically), Halo 4, GTA V etc all pushed the last gen consoles to the limits because they were focusing on them for so long. The next gen versions are upscaled last gen game, that much is clear and not the other way around. That's a bit different to them running crap because developers stopped caring about those consoles.

There's no doubt that in progression of UC2 -> UC3 -> TLOU, the visual fidelity has risen, but at the expense of the performance. More to the point, if say, TLOU was released on PC, you wouldn't call it an upscaled last gen game, it would simply be a PC version of the game, so I see the PS4 release in a similar light.

 

[WadeitOut]

Or just plug it into your TV, then you don't have to waste money with the Xbox on?

Or not, I never used it. Never will.

Then don't? Not every feature of every product is targeted at every demographic. It's called value proposition.