Support NeoGAF

[NeonZ]

Goku was sent to earth to destroy humanity anyway right? So actually this is almost the Goku that would have existed if he hadn't hit his head and turned 'nice'.

As of Dragonball Minus that isn't really right anymore. It's revealed that Bardock and Ginne sent him to Earth just because it was a remote and weak planet, and so it'd be easier for him to survive there. The goal was to get him away from the Freeza stuff, not conquer the planet for him. The Galactic Patrol detects his ship though, and think that he was sent to conquer the world.

So, I think the new backstory pretty much rules out Goku Black from being just "Kakarot" from some alternate timeline. His earrings, which have a design like the ones of the gods, also clash with that idea.

 

[Unspeakable Evil]

Heh. maybe it was her role DB evolution?
anyway. What i could find about it

Huh that paid off.

Don't even joke about Raditz returning. He's arguably my favourite character design

Could you imagine a Dragon Ball with Raditz doing everything Vegeta did? XD

 

[SolVanderlyn]

Raditz got robbed. Two-three episodes for the main character's brother? Man.

 

[Ashodin]

Wait,

Spoiler

Black can't be all that strong considering Future Bulma took half a year to charge the time machine. Someone SSJ God tier would have obliterated the entire planet in seconds.

Nah, it just takes time

Spoiler

finding and killing every last human

 

[NastyBook]

It's gonna be funny hearing evil Goku with his high pitched screaming

Tree of Might?

 

[Enter the Dragon Punch]

Raditz got robbed. Two-three episodes for the main character's brother? Man.

And his lasting legacy was that he got the shit kicked out of him by a little kid.

I love Dragon Ball but FUCK Toriyama for wasting such an awesome character design and background on an excuse to power up Goku.

 

[ElFly]

Huh that paid off.

http://neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=201161896&postcount=12167

And his lasting legacy was that he got the shit kicked out of him by a little kid.

I love Dragon Ball but FUCK Toriyama for wasting such an awesome character design and background on an excuse to power up Goku.

Shit like this is what makes Dragon Ball good tho.

 

[Unspeakable Evil]

http://neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=201161896&postcount=12167
.

Hit is the new Piccolo.

 

[The Silver]

Nah, it just takes time

Spoiler

finding and killing every last human

not if you're Super Buu

 

[Ashodin]

not if you're Super Buu

Yes but that's uncontrolled destruction.

This could be systematic torture on a planet-wide scale.

"I could kill you all in a moment's notice, but I'll do it slowly and agonizingly."

vs.

"I have no restraints on my power, let me show you what I can do!"

 

[Acerac]

So I guess that stuff about spoilers from the OP is just not a thing we care about now? Might as well talk about what is going to happen in the thread title at this point.

 

[KidA Seven]

Fuck raditz. So he's Goku's brother. That doesn't mean he should be really important.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

Fuck gohan. So he's Goku's son. That doesn't mean he should be really important.

basically

 

[Icyflamez96]

Fuck raditz. So he's Goku's brother. That doesn't mean he should be really important.

That's what I'm sayin

 

[Host Samurai]

Some theories

1) Saiyan from future Universe 6
2) Demon from Demon Realm pretending to be Goku
3) Somebody wishes Goku to be revived as an evil being with the Super Dragonballs
4) Helped revive Majin Buu, kills Buu, Babidi & Dabura now going rogue

 

[DiipuSurotu]

At least Raditz is canon unlike Tarble.

 

[Zero-ELEC]

At least Raditz is canon unlike Tarble.

Tarble is canon, what are you talking about? They mention him in Battle of Gods.

 

[Stalk]

Tarble is canon, what are you talking about? They mention him in Battle of Gods.

They don't mention him in Super do they?

 

[Zero-ELEC]

They don't mention him in Super do they?

I'd argue the movies are more canon.

 

[FStubbs]

Yeah, the main thing that allowed Goku to go Super Saiyan was the death of Krillin.

Close but not quite. IIRC after Freeza kills Krillin he says "who will be next? How about your son?" THAT made Goku go Super Saiyan.

 

[Slaythe]

Close but not quite. IIRC after Freeza kills Krillin he says "who will be next? How about your son?" THAT made Goku go Super Saiyan.

Hahaha.

No. It was Krilin.

 

[FStubbs]

Some theories

1) Saiyan from future Universe 6
2) Demon from Demon Realm pretending to be Goku
3) Somebody wishes Goku to be revived as an evil being with the Super Dragonballs
4) Helped revive Majin Buu, kills Buu, Babidi & Dabura now going rogue

5) Turles

 

[FStubbs]

Hahaha.

No. It was Krilin.

Yeah, try again. EDIT: Removing the link but chapter 317.

See what's left of Krillin there. Goku's shocked, then he just turns away. Freeza threatens Gohan. The next panel Goku snaps and goes SSJ.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

Fuck raditz. So he's Goku's brother. That doesn't mean he should be really important.

no

basically

nope

That's what I'm sayin

absolutely not

Bad taste and opinions all up in here

 

[Turin]

Raditz had a short but good run. Leave him be.

 

[Zero-ELEC]

Yeah, try again.

First, don't post links to scan websites.

Second, what is that supposed to prove? Krillin dies, Goku gets angry, Freeza says 'you're next' or something to that effect and Goku finishes going SSJ. No indication that it's a threat to Gohan that pushed him over the edge.

Also, was Dragon Ball always so compressed, storytelling wise? I remember that taking longer. I mean obviously the cartoon added stuff but I swear even the comic had more to Goku's transformation...

 

[FStubbs]

First, don't post links to scan websites.

Second, what is that supposed to prove? Krillin dies, Goku gets angry, Freeza says 'you're next' or something to that effect and Goku finishes going SSJ. No indication that it's a threat to Gohan that pushed him over the edge.

Also, was Dragon Ball always so compressed, storytelling wise? I remember that taking longer. I mean obviously the cartoon added stuff but I swear even the comic had more to Goku's transformation...

Dragonball moves really quickly. It's a much shorter manga than Bleach, Naruto, or One Piece. Heck I think Fairy Tail is pretty close to passing it.

To answer what it proves - it proves everything. Goku isn't in a rage after Krillin's dead. He flies into a rage after Freeza looks at Gohan and says it's his turn. If Krillin dying made Goku go SSJ, what happens in the next panel should've happened immediately.

 

[Kagari]

So I guess that stuff about spoilers from the OP is just not a thing we care about now? Might as well talk about what is going to happen in the thread title at this point.

The discussion now comes after an official promotional art and news release from Toei so it's fair game - including speculation talk. The stuff that needs to stay spoiler tagged are upcoming episode summaries - which should leak in the next few days or so.
Ultimately we still know very little about the new arc.

 

[Alienous]

Raditz got robbed. Two-three episodes for the main character's brother? Man.

Every so often I think about how awesome that is.

Fuck Raditz. He sucks so bad that he's the main character's brother and is offfed, never to be seen again, like the Saibaman scrub he is.

 

[Nikokuno]

Goku go crazy when Krilin died in front of him. Goku go SSJ because of his best friend passed away. There is no other reason. It's pretty much logical by the way.

 

[Slaythe]

Dragonball moves really quickly. It's a much shorter manga than Bleach, Naruto, or One Piece. Heck I think Fairy Tail is pretty close to passing it.

To answer what it proves - it proves everything. Goku isn't in a rage after Krillin's dead. He flies into a rage after Freeza looks at Gohan and says it's his turn. If Krillin dying made Goku go SSJ, what happens in the next panel should've happened immediately.

You are completely delusional.

Which has also a precedent, where Goku got mad and his hair spiked up for the first time.

Goku turns his head away after Krilin explodes, he completely ignores Freeza's comment, and turns Super Saiyan the page right after the explosion.

Believe what you want, I'm not gonna debate over this. Everyone can choose what they think happens. There is an obvious answer.

 

[Daingurse]

Raditz had a short but good run. Leave him be.

Yeah, forget Raditz. Instead, give me Nappa!

 

[Turin]

Rehashing villains isn't cool.

 

[Acerac]

The discussion now comes after an official promotional art and news release from Toei so it's fair game - including speculation talk. The stuff that needs to stay spoiler tagged are upcoming episode summaries - which should leak in the next few days or so.
Ultimately we still know very little about the new arc.

Duly noted. I'm just one of those crazy spoiler-phobes, but if Toei wants it public I can't argue with it being out there, this ain't like the episodes leaked.

Thanks for the breakdown, I'll admit the little I've heard does have me hype.

 

[ElFly]

Get me Ghost Nappa.

 

[Turin]

As long as he's only haunting Vegeta.

I'd rather have Nail & Kami in Piccolo's head.

 

[Daingurse]

Rehashing villains isn't cool.

Who said he would be a villain? I want him back in the fold, bouncing off other characters lol. If Vegeta can become a Z-Fighter, anyone can. Because god knows how many planets he life-wiped during his Freeza Force tenure.

 

[Kagari]

Duly noted. I'm just one of those crazy spoiler-phobes, but if Toei wants it public I can't argue with it being out there, this ain't like the episodes leaked.

Thanks for the breakdown, I'll admit the little I've heard does have me hype.

That's really why Toei puts out these sort of things... to get people excited. They haven't really spoiled much though and it's good to see people talking about different theories because no one knows what will happen with no manga to reference.

 

[DiipuSurotu]

I'd argue the movies are more canon.

How so? Super is the newer version of that story, it is arguably the "more canon" version.

Besides, the Tarble special clashes with both BoG/RF and Super (Goku's family living off Satan's fortune, Abo and Kado existing, Goku and co. encouraging Trunks and Goten to fight the villains instead of hiding them like in RF, etc.).

 

[Vex_]

Oh they had the same Japanese Goku voice?

It's gonna be funny hearing evil Goku with his high pitched screaming

Can't wait for sean to voice evil goku. I know he can do it.

I know he can.

 

[TheRealTalker]

hopefully Gohan does something this arc because I don't want to pull up this image again

 

[Vex_]

hopefully Gohan does something this arc because I don't want to pull up this image again

Oh god lol

 

[NeonZ]

How so? Super is the newer version of that story, it is arguably the "more canon" version.

Besides, the Tarble special clashes with both BoG/RF and Super (Goku's family living off Satan's fortune, Abo and Kado existing, Goku and co. encouraging Trunks and Goten to fight the villains instead of hiding them like in RF, etc.).

Up to now, it hasn't been clear how much involvement Toriyama had in the changes done to the movies. And, considering how he's the one writing the main plot, we might get elements that have been removed or changed in Super's remakes suddenly popping up as relevant, with the anime team suddenly having to struggle to make them fit. Right now we might just be seeing that with Trunks/Mai, which had beem completely removed from Super so far, in spite of Toriyama referencing it just earlier this year in his Revival F script.

 

[Inuhanyou]

What has Toriyama done with Dragonball!?

I just saw a poster and apparently blue haired trunks(???) and Mai randomly of all people, even though that should technically not even be possible because bringing Pilaf back was only in GT and the extended new "Super"+ new movies canon?

Even with Mai, the dragonballs should be destroyed, and she should be way older, so how exactly did they screw up the timeline so bad? That's without even mentioning having turles come back even though he was not even apart of canon fiction!?

My head hurts......he can't even remember that Mai's eyes were blue and not black!? She looks like an older Pan, which would atleast kinda make sense since we don't know what Gohan was up to most of the time

 

[Enter the Dragon Punch]

What has Toriyama done with Dragonball!?

I just saw a poster and apparently blue haired trunks(???) and Mai randomly of all people, even though that should technically not even be possible because bringing Pilaf back was only in GT and the extended new "Super"+ new movies canon?

Even with Mai, the dragonballs should be destroyed, and she should be way older, so how exactly did they screw up the timeline so bad? That's without even mentioning having turles come back even though he was not even apart of canon fiction!?

My head hurts...

- Trunks has blue hair now. It's a design decision - nothing more, nothing less. Probably to help differentiate him from Kid Trunks.
- Pilaf and the Gang were brought back because everyone else was.
- We don't know why Mai is younger and with Trunks yet. The episodes haven't aired. Even Arale has had an appearance.
- That's not Turles, that's "Goku Black". We don't know how or why he exists.

 

[Kagari]

What has Toriyama done with Dragonball!?

I just saw a poster and apparently blue haired trunks(???) and Mai randomly of all people, even though that should technically not even be possible because bringing Pilaf back was only in GT and the extended new "Super"+ new movies canon?

Even with Mai, the dragonballs should be destroyed, and she should be way older, so how exactly did they screw up the timeline so bad? That's without even mentioning having turles come back even though he was not even apart of canon fiction!?

My head hurts......he can't even remember that Mai's eyes were blue and not black!? She looks like an older Pan, which would atleast kinda make sense since we don't know what Gohan was up to most of the time

It's definitely Mai but we don't know any of her circumstances yet.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

It could also be Mai's daughter or present Mai. We literally don't know shit about anything besides that picture

Blue hair Trunks could also be a new form, it could be a design decision, it's a mystery

 

[NeonZ]

If they're really changing Future Trunks' hair to blue, it makes me think that they might actually be planning a time skip for later. That would be the only reason they'd need to change a detail like that in order to differentiate present and Future Trunks.

What has Toriyama done with Dragonball!?

I just saw a poster and apparently blue haired trunks(???) and Mai randomly of all people, even though that should technically not even be possible because bringing Pilaf back was only in GT and the extended new "Super"+ new movies canon?

Even with Mai, the dragonballs should be destroyed, and she should be way older, so how exactly did they screw up the timeline so bad? That's without even mentioning having turles come back even though he was not even apart of canon fiction!?

My head hurts......he can't even remember that Mai's eyes were blue and not black!? She looks like an older Pan, which would atleast kinda make sense since we don't know what Gohan was up to most of the time

Regarding Mai, it's just speculation, but it can work if they actually ended up becoming babies before the Androids' first attack, rather than children between the Buu Saga and Battle of Gods. It'd explain why they messed up the wish and couldn't just use another wish to fix it right afterwards, since at that point there would be only one wish. It could also be used as an excuse to explain why they weren't around during Z, but now started popping up again.

 

[Inuhanyou]

- Trunks has blue hair now. It's a design decision - nothing more, nothing less. Probably to help differentiate him from Kid Trunks.

But then, why not just have him wear different clothes and make him more battle worn instead of changing his biological hair color for no reason and most likely no explanation!?

- Pilaf and the Gang were brought back because everyone else was.

Uh wat, since when was it possible for people to come back to life later than a year? And when exactly did that happen in the future!?

- We don't know why Mai is younger and with Trunks yet. The episodes haven't aired. Even Arale has had an appearance.

Is the explanation going to be make it look any better than how dumb it looks right now for this kind of development?!

- That's not Turles, that's "Goku Black". We don't know how or why he exists.

Oh boy...so they just reused Turles's design and concept(evil version of goku) and i'm guessing, made him some dimension hopper guy.

Oh man...this is.....i just don't get Dragonball at all after the "Yo Goku and friend's return" OVA from before the new movies came out.

I mean, you can explain it to me, and it still doesn't make sense in my head...

I grew up with the original story from start to finish, and i just can't reconcile what this new extended fiction is with what i've known.

 

[foxuzamaki]

Were we ever given a time period of when the pilaf gang got turned into kids? If this happened whilst trunks was still young, potentially Piccolo might not HAve been killed yet, they probably wanted to do the trunksxmai relationship like Originally planned and decided to do it with future trunks as they might not have super go so far in time skips as to make it have meaning