What do they need to explain ?
Brexit |OT| UK Referendum on EU Membership - 23 June 2016
- Thread starter QuicheFontaine
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What do they need to explain ?
PJV3
Member
Explaining isn't their thing.
ferrasvansen
Member
They have to explain why one of the people picked to represent them and ask questions was lying. This was an audience specifically selected by both sides so it was even, he got on national TV and point blank lied, I expect they should at least distance themselves from him, don't you or is it okay to be so dishonest in such an important arena.
Oh and here he is campaigning for vote leave......
https://mobile.twitter.com/sturdyAlex/status/745368221591674882/photo/1
They most likely selected people on the simple basis of if they are voting IN or OUT doubt very much employment background checks were involved, they have nothing to explain. Only person with some explaining to do is that bloke.
Looks like he got an entry level job as an actor.
ferrasvansen
Member
ferrasvansen
Member
Turns out he has had a some pretty decent jobs in law so far, yeah really working class entry level stuff eh.
lol
Silent Chief
Member
Yes, but when's the next referendum on Scotland leaving the UK?
Is this thing on Farm subsidies actually true?
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/21/waste-cash-leavers-in-out-land-subsidie
If true then yeah. This is orthogonal to the EU debate as it would probably be kept in place if the country left, but still, not great. (I'm not even saying whether or not Farmers should get subsidies, but at least make sure actual farmers are receiving them!)
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/21/waste-cash-leavers-in-out-land-subsidie
If true then yeah. This is orthogonal to the EU debate as it would probably be kept in place if the country left, but still, not great. (I'm not even saying whether or not Farmers should get subsidies, but at least make sure actual farmers are receiving them!)
When has a comparison with Nazis ever gone down well?
Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
Check out the Poll on that page:
"Do you trust Economic Experts Who Are Warning Against Brexit?"
62% of voters in that poll do not trust the Experts. Truly a terrible time to assess the intelligence of British People.
Well, what would they know? They've only dedicated their professional career to a particular subject. I could totally reckon something more accurate than them.
There's a lot of thick people out there and almost all of them think they know best. It's quite scary.
its why I am scared, sometimes we underestimate just the sheer amount of ignorant and clueless people there are out there
Kotetsu534
Member
It is. I have a personal enmity towards the EU as my grandfather was a lifelong crofter and he got royally screwed as his (vastly larger) competition received massive subsidies while he barely scraped by and saw the value of his crop decline year-on-year (to the point where by the end it was essentially a hobby and he made more money by watching his fields go up in value than by selling raspberries). As I understand it, the EU subsidies made a certain degree of sense in France, but they grossly distorted the market elsewhere. I imagine something similar is happening today in Romania, judging by Monbiot's piece.
Doesn't affect the vote as such since the leave campaign have pledged to protect the subsidies (of course they did).
Psychotext
Member
Good vid that. Covers a lot of concerns I have, and some I'd not considered.
Psychotext
Member
Dunno if this was posted yet...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36592782
...filthy goddamn business experts.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36592782
...filthy goddamn business experts.
Maybe I shouldn't be so complacent (although, to be frank, it's not like I'm politically active outside of voting anyway), but I don't quite share Jones' sense of urgency given that the polls seem to show a slight victory for Remain (and that most people whose jobs involve reading the polls, such as market traders and bookmakers, seem to agree with that).
Admittedly, the FT's poll of polls does have leave on 51% and remain on 49%, but even that doesn't concern me much. Plus, I don't find his comparison with Clinton's experience in the US election campaign so convincing. Certainly, the popularity of both Trump and Sanders is evidence of reactionary politics at work, but Sanders is now supporting Clinton and Trump seems to be a less credible threat to her with each passing day - it's not as if Trump seems to be standing any chance of winning in the general election!
(And, I guess, even at the best of times I really don't like Owen Jones.)
Psychotext
Member
No, but a shitload of people could end up losing their jobs or finding themselves struggling to make ends meet... which frankly feels like the end of the world.
Glitchfire
Banned
Brother economics is one of the quackiest pseudosciences out there. Alan Greenspan totally predicted the 2008 recession. Top economists literally have no merit when it comes to big macroeconomic predictions. Literally none.
UK economy will take a short speculative dip if they leave, but will be fine in the long run. It is a matter of how much autonomy they want over their own government.
A who's who of everybody. It's falling on deaf ears though. Leave voters aren't basing their vote on this. Seems like it's English Nationalism.
Remain voters just have to make sure they vote. It may be very tight.
I've got some words for you, but I fear they'd get me banned, so I'll just put you on my Ignore List instead. Fucking dog whistles.
I do like the point he makes about anti establishmentism and how naive it is to think that "Taking back control" equates to individuals in this country actually having control, regardless of what happens there will still be a gulf between those with power and the system that keeps them in power and the working classes.
I think its one of the leave points that has irked me slightly is that some people, and I say some, are trying to turn this into a different issue than what it is.
anonymous_abc
Member
Brutal.
nah, everyone can stit down with a cup of tea and talk it out.
anonymous_abc
Member
You cannot force me to have tea with tak3n, please!
VendettaRed07
Member
Any chance this will turn out like the scottish referendum and the "silent majority" shows up and the leave campaign is just more of the vocal minority?
anonymous_abc
Member
Linkstrikesback
Member
This kind of bullshit being pushed as a legitimate opinion by politicians during this poll is the worst thing.
Stupid people (nope. Not gonna mince words) who believe this might be about to doom the country.
phisheep
NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
The little shit must have hid my polling card. I hope my local authority has no problem telling me where my polling station is without hours of waiting in line.
Leavers do what it takes I guess.
Maybe I just lost it.
Just ask a neighbour?
I know it's some primary school at least. Going to call when the phone line opens to be sure.
-Plasma Reus-
Service guarantees member status
Sure, our economy will be affected for the worse for an unspecified amount of time and to an unspecified degree. But after this, it will be better than it was before!
How exactly does voting leave achieve this?
Do these people also not realise the EU will have a legitimate reason to discriminate against the UK? You will essentially have the world's largest trading block - right at your doorstep - competing against you trying its best to prove to its member states that leaving the EU is a bad thing.
How exactly does voting leave achieve this?
Do these people also not realise the EU will have a legitimate reason to discriminate against the UK? You will essentially have the world's largest trading block - right at your doorstep - competing against you trying its best to prove to its member states that leaving the EU is a bad thing.
anonymous_abc
Member
Because Norway!
It's times like this when I realise that democracy is an incredibly flawed model of Government.
You have thousands of experts doing hours of research into the economic repercussions of Be it or Brechin and when presented to the general public, folks go "yeah but Boris Johnson is funny so now I don't believe the experts"
I think time and time again we have proven that, probably the majority, of people don't actually understand all of the arguments, benefits and downsides of either outcome.
They should do a test beforehand for your vote to count to prove that you actually have a Scrooby what you are voting for.
You have thousands of experts doing hours of research into the economic repercussions of Be it or Brechin and when presented to the general public, folks go "yeah but Boris Johnson is funny so now I don't believe the experts"
I think time and time again we have proven that, probably the majority, of people don't actually understand all of the arguments, benefits and downsides of either outcome.
They should do a test beforehand for your vote to count to prove that you actually have a Scrooby what you are voting for.
Linkstrikesback
Member
Yeah. If we actually relied on 'the people' in democracy for important decisions, rather than the expert politicians hired for that job (hang on a minute...) we'd probably still be burning witches at the stake.
Oh I'm not for a minute saying I trust the politicians, if they actually did their job folks would actually be informed on what we are voting for.
-Plasma Reus-
Service guarantees member status
This is exactly why you need the EU. People in masses voting is unreliable at best. You need to have informed democracy in key parts of governing. MEP's vote for what happens in the EU. The EU is essentially then run as a massive coalition government with various MEP's arguing for and compromising with each other.
And this is why Gove et al. are against it, because they want final say of legislation in Britain.
VendettaRed07
Member
Wait, Boris Johnson is the most popular politician in the UK?
That was a joke, right? Like, that isn't seriously actually true
That was a joke, right? Like, that isn't seriously actually true
I think people should be quietly left to think about this.
It's useless to say people on either side are stupid. They merely process the world differenly.
There are 420million+ people outside the UK who have no say on what happens to our collective Union. And it was only today, that this hit me.
So do think carefully about whether you want to Remain or not.
I am for Remain. But that has been true from when I first sat down to think about all this.
It's useless to say people on either side are stupid. They merely process the world differenly.
There are 420million+ people outside the UK who have no say on what happens to our collective Union. And it was only today, that this hit me.
So do think carefully about whether you want to Remain or not.
I am for Remain. But that has been true from when I first sat down to think about all this.
Jimbob Smalls
Banned
The EU is a shit house of high unemployment and squeezed out smaller economies.
I haven't seen any explanation how that's going to be sorted either. Probably because their isn't one as long as Germany and France is happy with the current economic arrangements.
Linkstrikesback
Member
Oh yeah, I absolutely agree. I certainly don't need any convincing to stay in. If nothing else, so we don't kill science in the country.
Had to go to Paris last week for work, and discussed with my collaborators there to check that potentially leaving wasn't about to fuck up my phd that I'm coming to the end of, which couldn't have happened without the ease of EU collaborative works.
But as team leave says, expert opinions are worthless. But better pop down the pub and get a real opinion
Jimbob Smalls
Banned
Looking at the EU economy that could happen either way, only problem is if the EU economy really goes down the shitter (more than it is at the moment) we have no way of looking to the rest of the world to find new business.
'People aren't voting the way I want, so we should ban them from voting '
What is it with this casual flirting with authoritarianism in this thread?
But we're part of the EU. We've got record employment levels.
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