A polite discourse amongst friends on the importance of MP-elements in No Man's Sky

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KillerIsJed said:
While we are on the topic of bugs and or lies about No Man's Sky, check out the games limited edition "dynamic" theme

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CWu0rAl-yk

Not so dynamic eh?
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Wow, that video's great if not just for the complete turn around both in regards to his reaction to the theme and nobody playing the game on his friends list.

Afrodium said:
Buying a game for multiplayer that says it's single player on the box and doesn't require PS+ because the online components are so minimal is absurd. The black/white 'does it have multiplayer' mindset is why there's still much confusion about the game. In all the interviews people are pointing to Sean is saying 'yeah, technically you could run into someone but you probably never will and this is by no means a multiplayer game' and people took that to mean that the game has multiplayer components.

So far we have two streamers who showed up at the same place and couldn't see each other. That doesn't. definitively mean it's impossible. It could mean, like Sean has been saying all along, that seeing another human is super rare to the point where you'll probably never experience it.
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See, I'm all for giving the dev the benefit of the doubt and suggesting that maybe in this particular case something went wrong, but if that's not the case and this is legitimately not an actual feature in the game, then there is of course reason to react the way people have been in this thread. Other people bought the game for a different reason than you did. When the dev says in multiple situations that you could technically meet up with someone else in the game, people are going to buy the game for that reason and assume the dev isn't blatantly lying.
 
depths20XX said:
The planets don't even rotate. The dude on twitch has launched multiple times from the same space station in a straight line and you end up in the same spot.
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This I can understand. Proper moment of inertia, tilt, and angular velocity would bring most machines to their knees to calculate and simulate, especially if you have that many planets in your system. Unless you just made all planets, regardless of size, tilt and rotate identically....

... which would lead to pretty funny situations with very small planets.

Easier to just make everything static, not worry about Euler angles or moments of a convoluted many-body system. And if they had, I'd have asked why they didn't simulate proper gravity!
 
Really have no idea why some people are jumping to the conclusion that Hello Games have lied about NMS instead of it just being a bug or their servers being overloaded. Seriously just have a little patience and see what happens.

Not sure what it is with NMS but people's viewpoints seem to be very extreme with all aspects of it.

Edit: Though this whole situation does further reinforce Hello Games desperately needs some kind of Community/PR Manager.
 
Why haven't Hello Games responded yet?

This is bigger than the Superformula nonsense and they responded super fast to that accusation.


I just want to know if it's a bug that:

1.) These two guys started the game really close to each other

and

2.) You can't see other players in the same spot together
 
CyberPunked said:
But planets rotations would differ in both your worlds, as well as every other moving object in the game. The state of everyone's individual instance of the universe is a function of time - like the real world -, and therefore if more time had passed in one person's universe than another, the state of their universes would differ entirely.
Time of day in this game isn't simply a skylight which moves across the skybox.
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Actually from what I've read of people playing the game it is, in fact, a skylight that moves across the surface of the planet without relation to the planets rotation.

Based on the stream earlier, in which the streamers went to the same space station with the same named npcs and such, their rotations for the planet were the same, which suggests it is a function within the procedural algorithm and not a function of the time at which a player starts the game, as opposed to daytime vs nighttime, which does seem to be independent of the algorithm.
 
Vena said:
This I can understand. Proper moment of inertia, tilt, and angular velocity would bring most machines to their knees to calculate and simulate. Unless you just made all planets, regardless of size, tilt and rotate identically....


... which would lead to pretty funny situations with very small planets.
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Yeah I honestly don't hold that against em. It's fine with me. It does make it much easier for players to find each other though. Just go to that systems space station and fly in a straight line.
 
Two questions:

1. Has Hello Games commented on this mess?

2. Why are there people pretending that multiplayer was never promised for this game when there is numerous quotes by Sean Murray available online that prove otherwise?
 
Netherscourge said:
Why haven't Hello Games responded yet?

This is bigger than the Superformula nonsense and they responded super fast to that accusation.


I just want to know if it's a bug that:

1.) These two guys started the game really close to each other

and

2.) You can't see other players in the same spot together
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It's 5:00AM where Hello Games is, they're probably not even awake yet.
 
I can't believe people are so worked up over this. Very strange. This game brings out the most extreme reactions. What did you guys expect when the store has said "Single Player" since it went up?
 
Deadly Cyclone said:
I mean, the dude that created the game tweeted the other day that this is not a multiplayer game. That's as definitive as you get.
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And that's the issue. Why wait until less than a few weeks after launch to tweet a definitive statement on if multiplayer exists in your game, as if a good portion of your player base is actually going to hear about that tweet?

Just another example of this development team having laughable communication skills.
 
Deadly Cyclone said:
I mean, the dude that created the game tweeted the other day that this is not a multiplayer game. That's as definitive as you get.
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Yeah, but the implication has always seemed to be "Its not a multiplayer game, but it is technically possible."

Theres a subtle difference there, and they seemed to go out of their way to avoid saying anything definitive about it.

Tbh, its not really a big deal. If anything it would have been a cool easter egg. It shouldn't really be a deal breaker because they *have* been clear about it not being a multiplayer focused game.
 
Walpurgis said:
Two questions:

1. Has Hello Games commented on this mess?

2. Why are there people pretending that multiplayer was never promised for this game when there is numerous quotes by Sean Murray available online that prove otherwise?
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They initially said there would be a limited MP, like Journey's ghosting effect, back when they first introduced the game, but they have backtracked on that over the past year or so to the point where Sean posted this past weekend that it's simply NOT a Multiplayer game.

Anyone who has been following the game since it's first reveal knows that they have been backing off from any form of Multiplayer since they first suggested it.

People complaining about it now made assumptions before checking up on the latest tweets and reports.
 
OCD Guy said:
It was nearly 10pm here. I'd imagine when they do respond it will be more than a quick tweet.

They'll likely prepare a well worded PR response.
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So they can be more vague again? If multiplayer is in the game should be a simple yes no question. This thread is 17 pgs deep now because people honestly have no idea.
 
Exploding8 said:
Actually from what I've read of people playing the game it is, in fact, a skylight that moves across the surface of the planet without relation to the planets rotation.

Based on the stream earlier, in which the streamers went to the same space station with the same named npcs and such, their rotations for the planet were the same, which suggests it is a function within the procedural algorithm and not a function of the time at which a player starts the game, as opposed to daytime vs nighttime, which does seem to be independent of the algorithm.
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Seriously? The planets don't even rotate? That's... weird. Are there no actual suns then?
 
So, if they reply:

"Sorry guys, it's just a couple bugs. You shouldn't start that close together and you should be able to see each other. We'll patch it asap. Your friend, Sean. <3"

...then everyone here calling them liars will apologize, right?
 
All online interactions need to be rated and classified by the ESRB during cert I believe. If this game allowed for a player to interact with another that would have come up during the cert process and would legally have to be displayed on the store front and the back of the box as well.

Journey is classified as a game that allows for 2 network players to interact, it's on the back of the box and the Playstation store.

Hello Games described the multiplayer in NMS to be similar to Journey. If that style of multiplayer existed in NMS it would have a different online rating.

Did Hello Games hide network features from the ESRB or does multiplayer not exist?

Only one answer makes sense.
 
depths20XX said:
I think that at some point they wanted you to randomly see other players in this game. This was years ago, probably in 2014.

Then they seemed to go with the whole Dark Souls angle, "It's mysterious, you will see remnants of players." Basically you will see planet names. This isn't multiplayer but they still for some reason held up that there was this "slight chance" because the universe was so huge.

Then at the last moment they tried to toss it all aside and say, "Uh hey guys, please don't think of this as multiplayer at all because it's completely single player."

Just really confusing.

https://www.reddit.com/r/NoMansSkyTheGame/comments/4x01gb/sean_interview_stating_no_instanced_mp_march_2016/Guys
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People should really watch this latest video, I didnt seen it before. It clearly states you cant see other people.
 
GankzyMcfly said:
So they can be more vague again? If multiplayer is in the game should be a simple yes no question. This thread is 17 pgs deep now because people honestly have no idea.
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Yeah to be fair this whole issue is because of Sean's responses.

When asked if someone could encounter another player he shouldn't have replied with:

Sean.png


To the majority of people that implies that people won't meet due to the sheer size of the universe as opposed to because the functionality is not there.

That was a perfect opportunity to simply say it wasn't something they had implemented at this point in time.

Now not only will he have to come out with a clear answer as to whether that is a feature of the game, but there will be questions asked as to how large the universe really is.....

ALSO take a look at the date of the tweet? Surely he knew if online multiplayer in that regard was implemented?!
 
Vena said:
This I can understand. Proper moment of inertia, tilt, and angular velocity would bring most machines to their knees to calculate and simulate, especially if you have that many planets in your system. Unless you just made all planets, regardless of size, tilt and rotate identically....

... which would lead to pretty funny situations with very small planets.

Easier to just make everything static, not worry about Euler angles or moments of a convoluted many-body system. And if they had, I'd have asked why they didn't simulate proper gravity!
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So here's another interesting tidbit with regard to planet rotation, relevant just from the standpoint of how Sean communicates:

http://www.no-mans-sky.com/2016/08/update-1-03/
Planet rotation – play testing has made it obvious people are struggling to adjust to this during play so it’s effects have been reduced further…
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So apparently the planets used to rotate, despite the issues you laid out in your post.

But he doesn't say "planets no longer rotate." He says "it's effects have been reduced further." And maybe what that actually means in Sean-speak is, planets no longer rotate.

Really seems like he's just one to avoid confrontation and doesn't want to have to make clear-but-disappointing statements. He didn't say "planets don't rotate" just like he didn't say "No Man's Sky lacks the code necessary for multiplayer."
 
Landford said:
People should really watch this latest video, I didnt seen it before. It clearly states you cant see other people.
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Yeah I think because it's a French interview many have not seen it. I certainly hadn't before a bit ago. I still feel he should have been more clear on the answer.
 
Landford said:
People should really watch this latest video, I didnt seen it before. It clearly states you cant see other people.
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4. WILL I MEET OTHER PLAYERS?

The answer to this question is similar to the one above. Yes, you may meet other players on your No Man's Sky journey, but then again, you may not. It totally depends on what you do.

But what is interesting is that even if you do bump into another player, you might not even notice.

Unlike other multiplayer games, ships belonging to real-world players won't be tagged with their name or any other indicator – a bit like Journey.

However, developer Hello Games has revealed that other players will look different from anything else in the game – especially if you spot them walking on a planet.

"You effectively see their suit, actually," said Murray. "So you won't know what's inside. It still won't answer for people whether you are an alien or whether you are a human or what you look like."

http://www.digitalspy.com/gaming/ps4/feature/a801705/your-biggest-no-mans-sky-questions-answered/
 
OCD Guy said:
Yeah to be fair this whole issue is because of Sean's responses.

When asked if someone could encounter another player he shouldn't have replied with:

Sean.png


To the majority of people that implies that people won't meet due to the sheer size of the universe as opposed to because the functionality is not there.

That was a perfect opportunity to simply say it wasn't something they had implemented at this point in time.

Now not only will he have to come out with a clear answer as to whether that is a feature of the game, but there will be questions asked as to how large the universe really is.....

ALSO take a look at the date of the tweet? Surely he knew if online multiplayer in that regard was implemented?!
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Agreed.
 
I already preordered on PC, quite sure I will love the game just from what I seen from streams (Prepatch, even), but I feel it was a feature that didnt really make in time for now. At least a bit have changed in the game since early interviews (There werent supposed to be any npcs at all, now we have them and even quests and factions and story paths). I really, really doubt this is something related to servers. Even if that is the case, I have a lot of respect for Sean and Hello, I am really cynical lately towards games (Collectors editions with no game inside, lootboxes) but it was refreshing to see a lot of passion from those guys to deliver the game.
 
Lulzwagon said:
I can't believe people are so worked up over this. Very strange. This game brings out the most extreme reactions. What did you guys expect when the store has said "Single Player" since it went up?
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It's very strange how people keep coming into this thread assuming they know what they are talking about. The dev flat out lied.
 
Landford said:
People should really watch this latest video, I didnt seen it before. It clearly states you cant see other people.
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Can you please link to where he clearly states you cannot see other people? I watched the video but just see the same vague answers, almost offended at labeling it "multiplayer" as a lot of his other videos or quotes. Basically the interpretation is yes, finding and seeing people is possible, but it will be rare, and don't expect any kind of MP emphasis. Nowhere did I see him say "oh yeah it's impossible to even see other players". He says the exact opposite of that.
 
CyberPunked said:
Seriously? The planets don't even rotate? That's... weird. Are there no actual suns then?
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure the planets rotate slowly. Rereading this: https://m.reddit.com/r/NoMansSkyTheGame/comments/4wawdw/question_on_daynight_cycle/

Suggests that the day night cycle is always the same length of time, but does seem linked to the star the planet is orbiting, so I'm guessing the rate of rotation is dependent on how far away the planet is to the star. Either way ignore what I said before about a skylight because it doesn't make sense with stars. Sorry

This does make me wonder then about the two streamers. Their times on the planet were off for sure (one day time, one was night time) but the space station they visited was in the exact same spot and when they left it and headed for the planet the same landing zone was directly ahead of them. So maybe stations orbit at the same rate as planets rotate now, so players don't lose them? Apperantly players were losing track of stations due to planet rotation at one point.

So many questions with this game.
 
RPGam3r said:
You agree that he should have said something we don't know is actually true or not?
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There is no multiplayer. Sean should have clarified this, that's the reason this thread exists afterall. What do you think that tweet means? To me it's not that clear.

I don't even know why people are debating this. I would literally bet anything that Hello Games releases a statement confirming that at this stage the functionality of being able to encounter other players in the world is not something currently implemented at this point in time.

I personally believe that anyone that thinks it's just down to server issues are "reaching".
 
The roundabout way Hello Games talked about it was enough for me to assume that we were never going to get multiplayer. I'm not that surprised tbh.

I just wish they directly said so, maybe they did and I missed it, or maybe it was a feature they wanted to add beforehand but oh well.
 
UncleSporky said:
So here's another interesting tidbit with regard to planet rotation, relevant just from the standpoint of how Sean communicates:

http://www.no-mans-sky.com/2016/08/update-1-03/

So apparently the planets used to rotate, despite the issues you laid out in your post.

But he doesn't say "planets no longer rotate." He says "it's effects have been reduced further." And maybe what that actually means in Sean-speak is, planets no longer rotate.

Really seems like he's just one to avoid confrontation and doesn't want to have to make clear-but-disappointing statements. He didn't say "planets don't rotate" just like he didn't say "No Man's Sky lacks the code necessary for multiplayer."
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Cool. Though I don't get the logic presented, humans are not somehow incapable of adjusting to slowly rotating objects... unless it has something to do with flight and a lack of a central reference frame for the player.

Unless they were really fast rotating objects... which could occur in the scenario I highlighted where you don't simulate the rotation based on any calculation of the moment of inert or angular momentum and just slap on some generic constant. This sort of scenario would lead to big planets barely moving visibly while smaller ones would look like they were spinning tops.
 
Man, this game...

I am getting the PC version, but i do not have a lot of faith that i wont be refunding it. But i am willing to give it a shot, because of said refund ability.

Everyone who likes it does not really pinpoint why. I see a lot of comments like "it felt great" and "i did some thing that surprised me like i got lost and managed to find my way out via an unexpected route" but nobody is really discussing the gameplay itself, which is concerning.

I do not doubt that people ARE in fact enjoying it, but the people who are NOT enjoying it seem to be able to articulate the reasons why they are not enjoying it a LOT better than the people who are saying that its great/fantastic/enjoying it so much.


Edit: also, about the multiplayer controversy, im not too fussed. But if the developer has openly stated "you have the potential to see other players, albeit that potential chance is extremely small" and that seems to have been disproven already, then what the hell?
 
Lemondish said:
It was never a key feature. Never once.

That's revisionist history to an extent that I can't even fathom how you could get there. Gold in mental gymnastics at Rio levels of ridiculous.
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I didn't say it was a key design feature, just one that was in fact confirmed by the dev themselves multiple times and one that is important for many people in this day and age. theyve been so careful to stress that multiplayer isn't the FOCUS of the game....which implicitly implies that it is in fact a feature. Seriously....you don't see the developers of other single player games making vague statements like 'the chances of multiplayer interactions are slim, that isn't really our focus' lol. They just say 'we don't have multiplayer'. How is this so difficult for people to comprehend. Wow.
 
OCD Guy said:
There is no multiplayer. Sean should have clarified this, that's the reason this thread exists afterall.

I don't even know why people are debating this. I would literally bet anything that Hello Games releases a statement confirming that at this stage the functionality of being able to encounter other players in the world is not something currently implemented.
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Beyond this data point do we have something definitively showing no MP? You say it so matter of factly that I assume you have actual facts.
 
Exploding8 said:
I'm pretty sure the planets rotate slowly. Rereading this: https://m.reddit.com/r/NoMansSkyTheGame/comments/4wawdw/question_on_daynight_cycle/

Suggests that the day night cycle is always the same length of time, but does seem linked to the star the planet is orbiting, so I'm guessing the rate of rotation is dependent on how far away the planet is to the star. Either way ignore what I said before about a skylight because it doesn't make sense with stars. Sorry

This does make me wonder then about the two streamers. Their times on the planet were off for sure (one day time, one was night time) but the space station they visited was in the exact same spot and when they left it and headed for the planet the same landing zone was directly ahead of them. So maybe stations orbit at the same rate as planets rotate now, so players don't lose them? Apperantly players were losing track of stations due to planet rotation at one point.

So many questions with this game.
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I think it's clear that the space stations are geostationary.
 
We've only had two people. One from reddit that says you cant, and one from GAF who said someone messaged them about seeing them.

Neither side should jump to conclusions just yet.
 
Bumblebeetuna said:
Can you please link to where he clearly states you cannot see other people? I watched the video but just see the same vague answers, almost offended at labeling it "multiplayer" as a lot of his other videos or quotes. Basically the interpretation is yes, finding and seeing people is possible, but it will be rare, and don't expect any kind of MP emphasis. Nowhere did I see him say "oh yeah it's impossible to even see other players". He says the exact opposite of that.
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The question is at 3:55 minutes, his answer at 4:00 "If me and a friend go to the same place at the same time, we could play together for a while", then he flat out says no, this is not what the game is about. Of course, he could just try to reinforce is more of a single player experience, but this is the less vague I have seen he being about mp. And the question was really what those guys seemed to have done today, go to the same place, at the same time.
 
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