• Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!

Red Dead Redemption 2 (Fall 2017, PS4/XB1, Trailer 10/20 @ 11 AM EST) announced

What will ultimately anger people the most about this game?


Results are only viewable after voting.
nah, rockstar ain't afraid to back themselves up. they can of course ignore all of this, but just like with every GTA released, they always say "don't like GTA? don't buy it, then."

Yeah, and they're the only ones entitled to do so. The protection force in these threads is kinda weird, seeing as many developers / publishers have pointed out how much they value this kind of criticism.
Just look at Ubisoft's trajectory post unity and watch dogs.
Syndicate was great, and even Watch_Dogs 2 looks like a much more ... likeable ... game.

And Rockstar's not infallible. Their "vision" included fucking bowling missions :P
 
You all should watch this little video Polygon did on Marston's voice actor, Rob Wiethoff. That he was basically a "nobody" in the acting world and did such a fantastic job as Marston is pretty amazing. Doesn't hurt that he seems like such a good guy.

Yeah, he was great. Isn't this true of 9/10 of Rockstar's casts, though? Like the three main GTA V guys were actors but dang far from big time.

PS love that Trevor Phillips is a recurring character in Westworld. So good.

Yeah especially as they will have PS4 Pro and Scorpio dev kits or launch consoles already and in development. Can you imagine what they can pull off. GTA V blew me away. As did Red Dead Redemption. Cannot wait. I wish they increae the number of random crimes. Make them dynamic. So that they always update or change. Would make me more invested to keep playing beyond campaign. Just screwing around in GTA V and you come across a No Country For Old Men type scenario etc.

Good shout. It's the one thing I want more of big-time from R*'s games. They are likely well aware of this by now. I met a member of staff from there a few years back and he said they knew it was lacking in all these sorts of elements. It's just absurdly hard to develop them.
 
Cross-posted from the hype thread, but:

If it comes down to Dutch's gang heyday I really hope they have some good framing around it as with RDR and the old west dying. The entire reason Dutch's character was interesting in the first place was because you'd finally caught up to a guy who was clearly at the end of his rope after a long life of garbage. That monologue before his suicide was/still is great.

Experiencing him as some random thug in his prime doesn't sound nearly as appealing.

Also, the 'fuck you, got mine' around diversity is fucking depressing, but what else is there to expect from the internet.
 
"Dutch was an altruistic and idealistic rogue, believing the gang could make a difference in the world. He fashioned himself into a Robin Hood figure, taking money from those who had more than they could ever need, and giving it to those who had very little, and truly needed it. He saw himself as a symbol of the romanticized Wild West, and a humanitarian champion of the people, opposing government control, supporting individual liberty and punishing general human cruelty and selfishness. His romantic image and charisma inspired his gang to believe in his vision of a "Savage Utopia", and it was in the name of Dutch and his cause that they committed crimes such as murder and robbery.

As the years rolled by, though, Dutch slowly began to realize the futility of his cause. With new technology making it easier for the government to exert control over the people, liberty had given way to bureaucracy. The violence and greed of humanity had not stopped, and no one had been inspired by his example. His work had ultimately changed nothing. Worse still, the truth of his own hypocrisy crept deeper and deeper into Dutch's thoughts. He and his gang had attempted to change the world for the better, yet in doing so, they had become the worst humanity had to offer. His idealism turned into extreme anger, and Dutch gradually descended into madness, masking his pain with meaningless violence and an unfocused hatred of everything and everyone around him. In the end, Dutch himself caused the disillusionment of the other gang members."

You know, reading that...the game really does have a chance to be REALLY interesting as a prequel. The scenarios you could create with a group and leader like that are endless.
 
Oh for god's sake just choose your games accordingly if race and gender is such an issue to you. You have a black protagonist for Mafia 3, asian dudes for Sleeping Dogs and Yakuza, a teenage white girl for Life is Strange, an half black half white woman in Remember Me... all of which (bar Mafia which I haven't played yet) I have enjoyed A LOT, despite being a white male. Why is that such an issue I'll NEVER understand

Because you just listed two games at most to represent each race/gender, one being Sleeping Dogs which came out 4 years ago, that's how far back you have to go for asian people to play a game where they are represented.

You don't even have to go back 4 days to play a game where white people are represented.
 
What will ultimately anger people the most about this game?
[ ] The 6-24 month long delay.
[ ] The platform release strategy.
[ ] The gender and/or ethnic diversity of the game.
[ ] All the DLC being for RDR Online.
[ ] The game's title being Red Dead Redemption 2.
[ ] The post Leslie Benzies quality of the game.
[X] Thor 2: The Dark World
 
it's shitty people actually feel the need to bring all of this up. It's a work of FICTION set into a FICTIONALISED wild west. I don't need any 'historically accurate' reason to ask the most influential studio of our time "how about some of them female protags / sidekicks?".
Sure, but people are calling it a "period piece", lol, and they know what the period was like because they've seen some Westerns. Obviously, Rockstar could do it no matter what but, still, posting those links certainly helps fighting the "that's just how it was" argument.
 
I haven't played GTA V yet. For those that played both GTA IV and GTA V, are the mechanics (shooting, driving, melee combat) a large improvement?

Do we think Rockstar can make great improvements to the mechanics of the first Red Dead? I didn't find those mechanics a huge problem, but also at the time I didn't know better, as I didn't have much experience with third person shooters. I did like the "Dead Eye" mechanic though, and hope it comes back.

The leap from GTAIV to GTAV is astronomical. Pretty much every single problem from GTAIV was addressed, from the controls, to the graphics, the polish, the performance, the interactivity in the world, the presentation of the open world, the design of missions, etc. Everything was a leap forward. Not everything is amazing, there are still ideas which are a bit of a dud, but even then there is a conscious effort to learn from the mistakes and feedback from GTAIV.
 
it's shitty people actually feel the need to bring all of this up. It's a work of FICTION set into a FICTIONALISED wild west. I don't need any 'historically accurate' reason to ask the most influential studio of our time "how about some of them female protags / sidekicks?".

Exactly. I love the progress we are making in games, but not every single game needs to be politically/socially correct. Games are art. Im not gonna tell the artist what they need to depict in their masterpiece.

And who knows, what if you get to create your own character this time around? Maybe you can make them male, female, black, white, green or orange. Who knows?

We are getting RDR2, guys!!! Theres no time to be mad about something you havent even seen yet.
 
I hope the protagonists are more heroic in this game.

I wanna play as outlaw heroes against like some evil douchebag or something, like Magnificent Seven, Seven Samurai, or Zorro or something
 
What will ultimately anger people the most about this game?
[ ] The 6-24 month long delay.
[ ] The platform release strategy.
[ ] The gender and/or ethnic diversity of the game.
[ ] All the DLC being for RDR Online.
[ ] The game's title being Red Dead Redemption 2.
[ ] The post Leslie Benzies quality of the game.
[X] Thor 2: The Darkness!!!

Fixed
 
red dead redemption was seriously one of the most boring games I have ever played, but it had potential.. hope this time they flesh out the game more.. and avoid shit like an entire mission based on going from point A to point B and back with only one 'interactive cutscene' in between and NOTHING ELSE
 
Really surprised that it's not gonna release on PC alongside consoles. Pretty disappointed. Though I guess by then I'll pick up a Scorpio or a PS4Pro.

In typical Rockstar fashion, it'll probably be out on PC many months later. If anything, their work on Max Payne 3 and GTA V has cemented the fact that their PC ports are incredible after the GTA IV shitshow.

We got faith! Just after a delay!
 
You're incorrect, pointing out that the characters and narrative are as the writers wish them to be is a rebuttal to the idea that they have or need a reason to tell the story they're telling.
Ok, you'd literally be kicked out of a university class trying to argue that a person creates a story without reason. Especially a story that may or may not be at least over twenty hours long, took at least 150 million dollars to create, and with a professional cast of actors and about 500-1000 of the most experienced developers in the industry.

The leap from GTAIV to GTAV is astronomical. Pretty much every single problem from GTAIV was addressed, from the controls, to the graphics, the polish, the performance, the interactivity in the world, the presentation of the open world, the design of missions, etc. Everything was a leap forward. Not everything is amazing, there are still ideas which are a bit of a dud, but even then there is a conscious effort to learn from the mistakes and feedback from GTAIV.
I wouldn't say that. GTAV is a bit more simplistic than GTAIV, presumably because of the graphics being more of a focus.
 
I haven't played GTA V yet. For those that played both GTA IV and GTA V, are the mechanics (shooting, driving, melee combat) a large improvement?

Do we think Rockstar can make great improvements to the mechanics of the first Red Dead? I didn't find those mechanics a huge problem, but also at the time I didn't know better, as I didn't have much experience with third person shooters. I did like the "Dead Eye" mechanic though, and hope it comes back.

For some reason people will tell you they are, but I don't think they are at all. Melee is still trash, character control is like 10% less janky but bleh, aiming feels a little better but Euphoria hit reactions are toned down, and driving is significantly less interesting and weighty. Gun audio is also significantly less powerful when compared to Red Dead Redemption.

I have zero faith in Rockstar's mechanics at this point, and am going into everything they make from here on out with complete skepticism until they prove me wrong. The one thing they'll always get right is the consistency of physics throughout the game world, but other than that.....
 
The leap from GTAIV to GTAV is astronomical. Pretty much every single problem from GTAIV was addressed, from the controls, to the graphics, the polish, the performance, the interactivity in the world, the presentation of the open world, the design of missions, etc. Everything was a leap forward. Not everything is amazing, there are still ideas which are a bit of a dud, but even then there is a conscious effort to learn from the mistakes and feedback from GTAIV.

Maybe this is the game were they roll in Max Payne 3's shooting. GTA:V came out not long after so was probably too far gone and they've released nothing since.
 
I still intend to buy it and replay the game there.

lkps.gif


But yeah, it was still incredible on PS3.

Heh, yeah, all I had was the PS3 version as well and I still loved it. Would really like to play it again, but I don't think I want to buy an Xbox just for that...

They've gotta be working on a remastered version, right? RIGHT?!
 
red dead redemption was seriously one of the most boring games I have ever played, but it had potential.. hope this time they flesh out the game more.. and avoid shit like an entire mission based on going from point A to point B and back with only one 'interactive cutscene' in between and NOTHING ELSE

Either you've been super lucky with games or you're being a total edgelord.
 
Good shout. It's the one thing I want more of big-time from R*'s games. They are likely well aware of this by now. I met a member of staff from there a few years back and he said they knew it was lacking in all these sorts of elements. It's just absurdly hard to develop them.

GTA V had plenty of these kinds of semi-randomized events. RDR had like ... 4? guy-who-steals-your-horse. damsel-in-distress-who-is-actually-just-bait. dude-stole-my-horse. actual-robbery?

The sheer amount of randomized things that happened when you switched back to Trevor were amazing.
 
Hmm.

Can't say i'm thrilled with the all guy cast. Not because of the lack of gender diversity (which is an issue, but not something i'm willing to get into) but because it's just plain...boring.

EDIT: The game will probably be very good, if GTAV is of any indication.
 
Thrilled to see we're finally getting a new Red Dead! Not so thrilled that no PC version was mentioned, and is likely being held back for double dipping sales.

Ugh! Guess I'm going to have to buy it on PS4.
 
I'm so happy I don't know anything about the game yet. The poster has 7 characters, giving me instant magnificent seven vibes. Still, the one in the middle being in the foreground makes me think that's the only character you play as.
 
Personal computers warriors man, so tired of them, in every thread man, they should just let the creators do with they want and stick to their vision or make the PC port themselves. So entitled, ugh.

We are all gamers and as gamers we would like to play big games on our chosen platform.

Yes there is aot of disappointment, but that's because we care about our hobby.

Just dismissing people's opinions because "entitlement" is sad and says more about the poster than anything else ;-)
 
I'm so happy I don't know anything about the game yet. The poster has 7 characters, giving me instant magnificent seven vibes. Still, the one in the middle being in the foreground makes me think that's the only character you play as.

No way it's 7 characters. They struggled with 3 characters in GTAV.
 
What makes you think you are entitled to a PC version. This is Rockstar's vision and they should be allowed to make the game for whatever platforms they choose. They don't owe you anything. Tired of this PC outrage.

I'm sorry, but the PC version will be more realistic and true to the actual setting it's trying to create. It should be about properly representing the environment and giving the tools to the developers need to tell the story faithfully. Why should we as gamers compromise with anything less? The bar should not be set to the lower end so anyone can play it. I'm tired of artists having to limit their version to the lowest common denominator to appease non-PC people.
 
GTA V had plenty of these kinds of semi-randomized events. RDR had like ... 4? guy-who-steals-your-horse. damsel-in-distress-who-is-actually-just-bait. dude-stole-my-horse. actual-robbery?

The sheer amount of randomized things that happened when you switched back to Trevor were amazing.

Glad they overcame it since RDR. Should be interesting to see how that is incorporated into RDR2.
 
The leap from GTAIV to GTAV is astronomical. Pretty much every single problem from GTAIV was addressed, from the controls, to the graphics, the polish, the performance, the interactivity in the world, the presentation of the open world, the design of missions, etc. Everything was a leap forward. Not everything is amazing, there are still ideas which are a bit of a dud, but even then there is a conscious effort to learn from the mistakes and feedback from GTAIV.

Well, i think some people agree that the physics was greatly downgraded, and also interactivity ( lack of interiors for example). They are more polished but i feel some things were downplayed in GTA V compared to GTA IV.

Also concerning for RDR 2 because the weighty and delayed animations/physics were a powerfull aspect of the gunplay, and they reminded more of GTA IV than GTA V.
 
Holding off on PC/console "remasters" worked wonders for gta5 so I'm not too surprised they're waiting on pc.

I mean it sucks, pc is pretty much expected with any major release but it's rockstar, they can do whatever
 
"Zero excuse"... So you're saying that someone creating a piece of art literally doesn't have the right to deliver their own vision? Obviously you're not referring to any actual legal requirements as there are none, so you must be saying there is some kind of universal moral imperative that any creator must obey regardless of what they actually feel like making?

I cannot stand this kind of entitled attitude. "How dare anyone create something that doesn't prescribe to my particular sensibilities!" Here's the thing: you can absolutely be disappointed if it's not what you wanted. Everyone has preferences, and you should absolutely tell a company that you are interested in (your preferred experience here). They might even do that at some point. But there is a difference between saying "I'm super disappointed this doesn't have a female protagonist! I would have really liked that" and "Fuck you dev you slimy racist bastards how dare you make the game you want and not the one I want!". That's the problem. The complaint is always that it's wrong that they didn't make what you wanted, which is the definition of entitlement.

This angers me because I want to have the freedom to make what I want to make. I don't want to be yelled at because I told a story that was on my heart, but it wasn't exactly what someone else would have created. The greatest works of art come from creators expressing their visions, because it's a story they have to tell, a picture they have to paint, music they have to write.

There is a TON of media that doesn't interest me. Things like the Saw movies disgust me. I think the world would probably be better off without that, so should I campaign to have those banned? Should I form an oversight committee to govern the direction of a sequel so that it's something I want? Or should I leave the creative direction to the people who actually wanted that to begin with?

Rockstar committed a grave sin here by releasing a picture that only has men in it, which means this is clearly going to be a horrible sexist game, right? So I'm curious. Would you go back in time and complain about Seven Samurai because the leads are men? I mean, that's seven lead characters and they are all men. That's bad, right? And yet, for some reason, as summarized by Wikipedia:



It almost seems like it might have actually been a good movie with a good story despite starring only men. How about The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings? Some of the greatest, most influential works of fiction in history, and they predominantly star men. Do you know why? Because these are the stories and the characters that the creators wanted to create.

Here's the truth: there are a lot of video games, that feature all manner of characters. Are there not as many representing what you are looking for? Here's an idea. Don't demand a creator change their vision to match yours. Instead of bitching about it, go make the game you want. That's what I'm doing. I will enjoy what media I enjoy, and will add what I think is missing.
Your examples are flawed considering we do criticize The Hobbit and LOTR for not having a lot of female characters. The Hobbit movies had to create a female character to fix that problem. And Seven Samurai doesn't star white dudes which is why we're ok with it when it comes to diversity talk, especially is the midst of whitewashing. Everyone's vision gets altered during development. Game development isn't one vision, it is a multitude of visions clashing with one another until everything is sort out. Visions can also be outdated and/or problematic. Telling people to "stop bitching and make your own" is dismissive of a person's criticism and completely misses the point.
 
Not surprised at all about no PC announcement.

History has show that they can clearly make a lot more money by delaying the PC version and getting people to double or triple dip on the game.

Millions of people will of course double and triple dip on it though I will not be one of them as I don't own (nor care to own) any of the consoles.

I am 100% confident there will be a PC version though, despite the fact that no Rockstar San Diego title has ever come to PC.

They have an engine that runs great on PC and with Xbox One/PS4 being more PC like than ever it shouldn't be too difficult to get the game on the PC.

The question is when. Is it going to be a short delay (PC in Early 2018) or a long delay (Fall 2018 or longer) for the PC version to hit?

History would tell us it's probably a longer delay though a Take Two Financial Analyst (for what it's worth) expects early 2018.
 
I'm sorry, but the PC version will be more realistic and true to the actual setting it's trying to create. It should be about properly representing the environment and giving the tools to the developers need to tell the story faithfully. Why should we as gamers compromise with anything less? The many should not suffer from the few.

:) It's sad how there aren't more who picked up on the delicious analogy he was making.
 
Exactly. I love the progress we are making in games, but not every single game needs to be politically/socially correct. Games are art. Im not gonna tell the artist what they need to depict in their masterpiece.

And who knows, what if you get to create your own character this time around? Maybe you can make them male, female, black, white, green or orange. Who knows?

We are getting RDR2, guys!!! Theres no time to be mad about something you havent even seen yet.

... that kinda makes you sound a bit insincere about diversity / representation issues. 50% of the world's population isn't 'green or orange'.
And somehow you quoted me, but i'm quite sure you don't agree with me.

I'm not #teamWaitAndSee
I'm #teamLet'sGoByWhatWeKnowAndTalkAboutIt ;)
 
I hope the protagonists are more heroic in this game.

I wanna play as outlaw heroes against like some evil douchebag or something, like Magnificent Seven, Seven Samurai, or Zorro or something

Oh man, I watched The Mask of Zorro for the first time in ages a while ago and during the entire movie I was like ...THIS NEEDS TO BE A GAME. I want a Zorro game so bad.
 
Even looking at his waistline it looks it has the fringed ends that natives have on their clothes as well.

Not saying other people don't do it but.

The facial structure, the haircut, the clothes. It's gotta be.

God damn, I hope so! It definitely looks that way, both in line with the dress and hair!
 
Personal computers warriors man, so tired of them, in every thread man, they should just let the creators do with they want and stick to their vision or make the PC port themselves. So entitled, ugh.
Lol ok. Whatever, Idk why it's so offensive, not like there's anything else about the game to talk about, it just got announced. Wtf do you want people to be ecstatic that the games not coming to where they like to play? Especially when I've given Rockstar hundreds of dollars on said platform... Yeah just an entitled brat. Not like other AAA companies can do it or anything. Sounds more like people like to be up the company's ass that any complaints about their decisions offend them deeply lol.
 
As always, Rockstar will force me to buy one of their games on console because i have no other option and then buy the game again when it finally release on PC. Ok!
 
Oh my god, YES! Duels were amazing in RDR.

Now that you mention CoJ: Gunslinger... That game has been on my "watch list" for quite some time. Would you recommend it? How's the Old West setting handled there?

I'd love to see them work out how to get duels working in MP. Imagine The Quick and The Dead style online tournaments!

Yes, I would. Completely different from RDR though. It's a slick, garish, fast-paced, arcade combo shooter that treats the Wild West in a tongue-in-cheek (almost) superhero style. Story mode is a little cliche, but surprisingly well handled, and thoroughly enjoyable. Duelling is superb. Best CoJ by a very wide margin.
 
We are getting RDR2, guys!!! Theres no time to be mad about something you havent even seen yet.
It's currently my most anticipated AAA game. Doesn't mean I can't discuss other aspects

it's shitty people actually feel the need to bring all of this up. It's a work of FICTION set into a FICTIONALISED wild west. I don't need any 'historically accurate' reason to ask the most influential studio of our time "how about some of them female protags / sidekicks?".
If Westerns always featured women and people of color as outlaws and marshals, do you think you would be making that comment about it being fiction? Or do you think that your outlook has been influenced by decades of Hollywood's portrayal of the West?

It's not mere fiction. It's fiction informed by history. Except Hollywood's West has never been very historical
 
I'm sorry, but the PC version will be more realistic and true to the actual setting it's trying to create. It should be about properly representing the environment and giving the tools to the developers need to tell the story faithfully. Why should we as gamers compromise with anything less? The bar should not be set to the lower end so anyone can play it.

🎣
 
GTA V had plenty of these kinds of semi-randomized events. RDR had like ... 4? guy-who-steals-your-horse. damsel-in-distress-who-is-actually-just-bait. dude-stole-my-horse. actual-robbery?

The sheer amount of randomized things that happened when you switched back to Trevor were amazing.

The swapping between characters stuff was flawless, absolutely loved that. I just think they haven't made enough of very simple truly random stuff. Literally just like two random groups of people getting into gunfights. I think that should happen all the time. The world needs to have some conflict injected into it. From GTA San Andreas they added random cop chases and encounters, that's cool, but I think they should go harder on that. Make it a real distraction. And in RDR you've got an even bigger excuse but there were only the 6 or so random things.

I liked GTA V's random events too but there were still only like 10-15 of them. Which is great, but you got to recognise them and they were basically one-offs.
 
Top Bottom