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DF Retro: Shenmue 2 - A Masterpiece Revisited

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Finally. Gonna give it a watch.
 
Man, Sega really is so reluctant to do anything with Shenmue. The kickstarter for the third game is still one of the highest grossing kickstarters of all time, and yet the original games are split between two slightingly obscure consoles. Granted, Shenmue 2 is available on the 360, OG Xbox and EU/ JP Dreamcast. But the original game is still a Dreamcast exclusive.

Shenmue II is an interesting game though, generally, I think it is much better than the first one. You can see so many sequences from Shenmie II present in the original Sega Saturn build of the game. Shenmue I and II were pretty much made together. They had much more time to polish the second game.

That "magic room" system is pretty incredible. The second game was pushing the hardware much harder than the first game on the Dreamcast, but it is a great looking game for the console. The lack of frame skipping is interesting. The Xbox port is the better version of the two for the most part. Though that motion blur is weird. The 360 emulation isn't too bad, but shame about the missing effects.
 
Thanks John! Haven't played the series just yet, but really looking forward to giving it a shot as soon as I can and this is hyping me up!
 
I just finished the episode. It is a good 33 minutes long, and to be honest I have no idea what that teaser is at the end of the video.
 
Easily the best DF retro yet purely for being so informative on the emulation front. My dreamcast won't live forever man, I need back up plans.
 
Great work. Fascinating stuff, that English dub sounds worse than I imagined though. The whole series has been amazing so far, hope it continues to be successful for you John
 
Hmm... amazing work on this one. I have both a Dreamcast and Xbox hooked up and now I wish I had more than just a CD-R copy of the first disc of the first game I made years ago. It's tempting to skip the first game but I think I might revisit it and play it proper if it hooks me. Definitely going with the Xbox version of the 2nd game after watching this though - the bloom looks really good and I can patch in the Japanese audio track too, plus I imagine it would load even faster from a hard drive too.
 
Such a shame that they didn't include the Japanese voices for the Xbox release; the English dub is truly horrendous. That aside though, I didn't realise how many improvements there were to the that version - I only ever touched the DC release.

If Sega ever gets around to releasing the HD versions, I wonder if they'll have dual-language options. I'd like to go back through the original with the Japanese voice work (and still understand what is being said).

Also, great work from John and the DF team. This is turning into a wonderful little series. From a personal perspective, I'd love to see future episodes take a look at Panzer Dragoon Orta and Jet Set Radio Future. The former in particular was such a stunning game.
 
Well I'm on shenmue2 right now and found two textures with mip map on the dreamcast version, the ground before the man mo temple and the ground of the da yuan apartments.
161127112847574720.png
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Click to expand...
Also please map the free camera on the right stick if you play on emulator with a controller, thank you.
 
N.A said:
Fantastic episode as always :)

Shenmue 3 will almost certainly be shown as PSX on Saturday too :)

https://twitter.com/CedricBiscay/status/802201635854368768
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:-O

That would be fantastic.

Well I'm on shenmue2 right now and found two textures with mip map on the dreamcast version, the ground before the man mo temple and the ground of the da yuan apartments.
Click to expand...
That's fascinating, actually. I missed that. Weird that they only used that feature in a select few areas.
 
Killer episode. Shenmue II got the video it deserved.

I still cry every time I see or remember the Shenmue III anouncement.
You should have added the crowd reaction in the conference for maximum tears on my side.
 
dark10x said:
:-O

That would be fantastic.


That's fascinating, actually. I missed that. Weird that they only used that feature in a select few areas.
Click to expand...

Hey John do you think a laptop with a 5700hq and a 965m would be enough to run that dreamcast emulator decently? I only ask because you said it'd need a beefy system, oh and great work on this episode man you absolutely killed it.
 
Sooo, will there be an amendment on the video if SEGA do a HD release? ;)

Good critical analysis of Shenmue II, really highlighted what masters AM2 were on both versions. Dreamcast edges it out for me since I live in the UK and got to play it back in the day on release day (all the way back in 2001!). The English VA really is that bad in the Xbox version for me. Plus I felt like the bloom and other effects were a bit too much overall, I toggled the setting to the Shenmue 1 style filter instead and played it on that (murkier colour scheme).
 
Amazing episode. You just keep raising the bar man.

Btw John, a while back I suggested Sonic R on twitter and you said there was a good chance, I hope it happens eventually.
 
Man, those textures... YIKES!

Kind of sad that a definitive version doesn't exist. You either deal with horrible texturing, or horrible motion blur.

It's quite an achievement for the Dreamcast, but I'm not sure I would have been that impressed if I saw it back in 2001.

Would be great if we can get a version that combines the best of both versions into one product with small tweaks to the bloom. The Xbox version is very nice to look at.
 
Great stuff. I replay Shenmue 1 & 2 on the DC every year but I've never played my Xbox copy, maybe I'll break it out and give it a look.
 
Cow Mengde said:
Man, those textures... YIKES!

Kind of sad that a definitive version doesn't exist. You even deal with horrible texturing, or horrible motion blur.

It's quite an achievement for the Dreamcast, but I'm not sure I would have been that impressed if I saw it back in 2001.

Would be great if we can get a version that combines the best of both versions into one product with small tweaks to the bloom. The Xbox version is very nice to look at.
Click to expand...

It was still pretty impressive for a 2001 release. Yeah, you could still see the limitations of the Dreamcast RAM being stretched with those textures. But to be honest, in comparison to something like Max Payne 1 (also released in 2001, and showcased some rather high resolution textures for the time on PC), or the Unreal Engine 1 games, it still held its own. But then again, it was much harder to be impressed by the Dreamcast in 2001, when the original Xbox and Nintendo GameCube were released that year as well.
 
Next saturday going to be a very special day for Shenmue fans:
-The release of Shenmue 2 The movie and a possible trailer of Shenmue 3 on PSX.

I want to see what those fortunate guys have seen:

5m1bXqO.jpg
 
Yay!

I won't get a chance to watch this until tonight but does it cover the weird, almost arbitrary differences in signs and other geometry between the Xbox and Dreamcast versions, like this? It always seemed more work than simply porting so I assumed there was a technical reason.
 
NekoFever said:
Yay!

I won't get a chance to watch this until tonight but does it cover the weird, almost arbitrary differences in signs and other geometry between the Xbox and Dreamcast versions, like this? It always seemed more work than simply porting so I assumed there was a technical reason.
Click to expand...

I remember you!

You used to run that shenmuefansite.com (or whatever the url was) way back in the day? That used to be my go to resource for everything Shenmue related when I was about 10 years old before you closed it down and I had to migrate to the Shenmue Dojo. If you are who I think you are, your Shenmue 1 walkthrough was also integral in me managing to beat that game as it was the only FAQ on the internet at the time that addressed the "disc 3" bug where a certain cutscene won't trigger if you take the "wrong" route when driving a forklift into one of the warehouses, so thank you for saving me from the purgatory of having to redo that day over and over again like Bill Murray.

Of course, little did I know at the time that Ryo would have to undergo a second, much longer purgatory inside that cave, but such is life...
 
Fantastic episode. This longer video reminds me of a more technical version of Gametrailers' old retrospective videos, which were hands-down my favourite thing on the internet at the time.

Shenmue II's technical achievements were overshadowed due to its limited release and the launch of PS2, so it's good to see it get the love it deserves.

I wish I could be as positive about the Xbox version as this video, but sadly the smoother framerate and improved texture rendering mean very little when you have to suffer through the English dub. The trade-off just isn't worth it if you want to be immersed in the experience. It's a shame, too, because some of the main characters have decent voices in Shenmue II, with Ryo being a noticeable upgrade from the first game. However, all the smaller parts (and some of the big ones) are just bottom-of-the-barrel, quick ask the janitor, cheap anime game, levels of terrible.
 
Another great video; Shenmue was a series I never played myself but I did watch (and assist with gameFAQs) my younger brother play through the two games back in the mid-2000s. Sure the games had some rough spots, and I'm not sure I could have seen myself playing through them alone, but it is something I look back fondly on.

I do wonder about the US rights of Shenmue 2 though. Hopefully whatever arrangement that was done between SEGA and MS doesn't keep an offical remaster from happening. Maybe if such a release did well enough we could see Panzer Dragoon Orta (would love to see some PD on DF: Retro) come back as well.
 
Great job on the video!

I have both 1 & 2 on my Dreamcast, but I actually chose to complete the second one on the original Xbox. If I remember correctly, it was due to the framerate being better on that one.

There are sequences in the game where you follow people around, and when playing on Dreamcast i looked straight up in the sky to get a smoother experience :)
 
DF Retro keeps getting better and better. Had no idea Shenmue 2 had procedurally generated room layouts. I guess it makes the most sense but back then everyone thought everything was hand made and hand placed.

Suggestions for future episodes: Metal Gear Solid 1-4.
 
I loved the smooth frame rate of the XBOX version, but I just couldn't stand the use of bloom lighting. It felt unnecessary and ridiculously overused.
 
Seriously your game selection is superb. Except for when you pick weird old PC games.

YOU BETTA SHOW WALKING ACROSS PLANKS
 
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