Logan |OT| Children of (X)Men (SPOILERS)

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Bobby Roberts said:
Again, it's continuity-fretting in a movie that doesn't really give a fuck about continuity. The movie doesn't really care much about what happened before it starts past the extent of its emotional effects on the characters. What's important isn't the particulars of how these vague catalysts occurred, it's how those catalysts have affected (and still affect) the characters, and informs their actions.

The questions you're asking largely don't have much to do with how this story plays out. They'd be more relevant for a movie that happens BEFORE this one, but not really for what this one is doing.
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The movie who's explicit mission is to send off two characters originated on screen fifteen years ago, while making several clear nods to past movies from the franchise, doesn't care about continuity?

Ok.
 
Brakke said:
The movie who's explicit mission is to send off two characters originated on screen fifteen years ago, while making several clear nods to past movies from the franchise, doesn't care about continuity?
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Yes.

James Mangold said:
Den of Geek: I found the tone really refreshing - a superhero film with that gritty, western kind of tone.

James Mangold: In many ways, the congratulations in that department should go to the studio, because I just tried to make a movie like the others I've made, which are naturalistic in tone. The only thing I can take credit for in that endeavour was Hugh [Jackman] and I, straight up at the beginning, saying, "We only want to make this film if we get to make it our way. We'll gladly make it for less, but we want to rate it R and we want to make a movie that... is darker and disconnected. Not serving any future X-movie or picking up the baton from the last one, but exists in its own space from beginning to end.

I mean, that's nothing that wouldn't be true of anything else I've made, it's just that within the realm of superhero movies... they've become something else. Almost not movies. They've become platforms to sell things - including the next movie.

DoG: They become adverts for themselves.

JM: And unwittingly, not very different from our politics, the very people who are demanding better movies - the fans - have become unwitting accomplices, in my opinion, of the undoing of the quality of these movies. Because they bought into the idea that you're supposed to cut all these movies into some giant mega-movie. Then they're all supposed to fit together in a way that the fucking comic books never fit together. I mean, the comic book authors reinvented their worlds 28 times - they even drew the characters different. They changed the outfits, the looks, the height, the muscularity - they changed these characters.

For some reason, people have been programmed with the idea that the interpretive act by a film director is a violation of a canon as opposed to fulfilling one. In comic books, from Frank Miller to Joe Quesada, that's different. From Joe Kubert to Craig Claremont, those are different worlds - different worlds, different visions - and no one expected to be able to interchange panels from those different artists and writers and have the things hold 100 percent true.
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Again, what happened before isn't really the point. It's how what happened has affected the people for the time we spend watching them.
 
I don't ever want to see Logan in any other x-men movie.
I don't want to see old Xavier either.
Both these characters are done.
This is what you get when you have a director who doesn't have a fetish for Mystique.
 
Just watched this and.... wow.

easily the best X-MEN movie and probably up there with the best comic book movie tie in's. The story of Wolverine and Xavier as two souls struggling in a world where the social backdrop is so close to this day and age of our own. Rather than having another X-MEN movie that deals with apocalyptic situations it deals with more tender and political issues from chronic illness to the treatment of migrants this movie is the most anti-trump movie to come out so far. Just look at the background issues this movie covers and you will be amazed, especially at the start as Logan goes about his day job.

It;s a fitting way to end the story of Wolverine, probably the most maturest comic book movie to come out since The Dark Knight
 
Beltrami's score is really interesting to hear on its own. It's like Red Dead Redemption or Max Payne 3's ambient music with jazz accompaniment.
 
Damn, I kinda want a sequel. They had good chemistry. Great film. Great sendoff. The action beats were great. The comedy bits were fucking hilarious (You talk? Si, *incoherent screaming*. SHUT THE FUCK UP!). The movie played into hope pretty well too. For a minute there, I thought that maybe he'd start a school in Canada. Maybe... The cross into an X got me good. Tears flowed.

Is Stan lee dead for good now?
 
Dude when out like an X-Man, what a ride.

The last bit where Laura changes the position of the the cross to X
ECSklEf.gif
 
Really enjoyed this movie a lot. Not looking forward to going back to mostly crap X-men movies again after this. I would've loved to have a whole Logan series of films instead of those.
 
Watched it this morning, fantastic film. Was there a post credits scene? Had to piss and left in the middle of the credits.
 
They better never get Hugh Jackman or Patrick Stewart to reprise their roles, this was a perfect ending for both of them.

Cpt.Underpants said:
Dude when out like an X-Man, what a ride.

The last bit where Laura changes the position of the the cross to X
ECSklEf.gif
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The whole ending was emotional as fuck.
 
Einchy said:
They better never get Hugh Jackman or Patrick Stewart to reprise their roles, this was a perfect ending for both of them.
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I could see Hugh Jackman making a cameo is deadpool 2 just as himself and deadpool looks at him and says you remind me of someone and then Hugh Jackman says fuck off, which then deadpool would say you sound just like him too! But that's all I would hope for. I can't picture anyone else being wolverine though :(
 
MetroidPrimeRib said:
Wolvy ain't immortal or invincible, but he is extremely resilient. Even without that, its clear that his adamantium body was beginning to fail him, like how Xavier could still have a degenerative brain disease with his WMD level brain.
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I know exactly why he died.

Aging has taken a toll on his body and the Adamantium is beginning to poison him. His healing factor is slowing down and then he super charged himself with that drug and had a massive side effect when he came off of that high. He was very slowly dying.


But even then I would've expected him to die more heroically or violently/creatively than that. The old Wolverine (the one that has been established for the past decades in these movies) would've shrugged this off as a flesh wound but this stab killed him straight up (well not the only stab but still it was the final blow).

Oh well it's a minor nitpick anyway... I expected grander when it came to putting down the legacy of Hugh Jackman's Wolverine.
 
One thing that kept annoying me was the last ten minutes of the movies. The kids should have been using their powers more frequent on the soldiers chasing them instead of just running they're quite a few of them they could of ganged up on soldiers. Same with the last fight, all these kids are around the main bad guy killing him instead of helping wolverine, if even a few of those kids helped wolverine his death could of been prevented. Oh well that's my rant on the ending.
 
It really feels like a TLOU movie.

If the TLOU movie has this caliber of acting and set pieces I would be very happy.

I didn't expect Logan would die in the end, I got a little bit emotional right there.
 
Jackman may be the first character to have killed himself without committing suicide in a film.

I thought the film was fantastic. I'm glad they didn't spend too much more time in the woods because that part really felt like it was from another film.
 
I'm more than willing to ignore the horrible continuity of the X-Men films for the sake of a great one, but I do have one nitpick.

These two characters seem to exist more in a world where the events of all the movies were almost entirely made up by people, because the movies' collective goal was to evoke the spirit of the comics.

So if the comic books exist within the world of the films, and by Logan's own admission they're bullshit, then what exactly have these characters been through?
 
Really liked how they all knew his haircut from the comics, enough to give it to him when he was sleeping, and that the kid at the end had a Wolverine toy. All those kids thought Logan was a hero and looked up to him, it wasn't just Laura.
 
Speevy said:
I'm more than willing to ignore the horrible continuity of the X-Men films for the sake of a great one, but I do have one nitpick.

These two characters seem to exist more in a world where the events of all the movies were almost entirely made up by people, because the movies' collective goal was to evoke the spirit of the comics.

So if the comic books exist within the world of the films, and by Logan's own admission they're bullshit, then what exactly have these characters been through?
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In Logan the comics are essentially based on events but made more palatable/reader friendly vs. the harsh realities

You can assume that the films happened as there's nothing really directly conflicting with anything. Logan isn't worried about those pictures and isn't retconning anything. They're also meant to have occurred so long before that it doesn't matter. They've lived long lives and been through a lot and it's all catching up to them
 
Through the entire movie I was wondering if Logan was some how purposely killing himself like taking medicine that fucked with his organs to the point it was killing his healing factor. The ending was rough, seeing him die was rough, seeing her cry for Daddy was rough. These are all broken people, having Xavier remember that he killed a load of people, including what sounds like a lot of xmen right before he died was rough. Ugh.
 
Come into a Neogaf thread after watching a movie to instantly make you feel like shit for really liking it, jesus christ.

This was easy one of the best comic book movies ever made, despite any inconsistencies. The guys nit picking this incessantly are the worst kind of people.
 
Just walked out of the theater a few minutes ago.

Generally loved the movie but I feel like they should have gone for this ending

Wolverine-Dead.jpg
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in the current ending Wolverine sort of dies like a chump. Yes I know the point is his healing factor was wearing off and the adamantium was poisoning him, but still ..

They could have done it so that all the kids get captured, Logan has to find the facility, he goes in there, see's more clones like himself with adamantium being pumped into their bones, has a fight and during it accidentally or intentionally gets all covered in adamantium while either he or Laura delivers the final blow to his clone.
 
chandoog said:
Just walked out of the theater a few minutes ago.

Generally loved the movie but I feel like they should have gone for this ending


in the current ending Wolverine sort of dies like a chump. Yes I know the point is his healing factor was wearing off and the adamantium was poisoning him, but still ..

They could have done it so that all the kids get captured, Logan has to find the facility, he goes in there, see's more clones like himself with adamantium being pumped into their bones, has a fight and during it accidentally or intentionally gets all covered in adamantium while either he or Laura delivers the final blow to his clone.
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I mean, the kind of hidden meaning of this movie was for Logan to realize there was more to life than just him. His "daughter" made him realize that. Doing that final sequence where Logan basically saves everyone and is a super badass would heavily undermine that. The kids did a lot of the heavy lifting in that final fight scene, that's the point.
 
I'm kind of coming to terms with my viewing of the movie.

It wasn't the grandiose or cool/glamorous/triumphant ending I was expecting. I mean in Unforgiven
Clint Eastwood's character kills all the bad guys, avenges his friend, and is free to live in peace with his children.

I had kind of let-down feeling after seeing it, but I am thinking it's more because the movie's brutal, pull no punches treatment of the characters established over 17 years. Characters and actors whose performances I've really cherished over the years. It's almost like a feeling grief. And its uncomfortable.

Charles Xavier getting blindsided and murdered thinking he was repenting/apologizing through an emotional revelation sat uncomfortably with me, but probably for the right reasons.

I also felt oddly disturbed by Eric LaSalle's family getting murdered in a similar manner to the old couple in Wolverine Origins, but through much more disturbing framing, where the filmmakers actually earned some humanity and connection through moments like the son giving Laura his Ipod.

The X-24 character was very off-putting to me, but I think it was because he was so sinister in being able to infiltrate the protagonists in his introduction. It was such a psychologically difficult image. It was uncomfortable seeing a Hugh Jackman's face murdering Professor X. On a personal level as a fan, I guess. I think overall, the character of X-24 was earned, and it wasn't as out of left-field as the Silver Samurai in The Wolverine. He's kind of like the Albert character in the Wolverine comic?

And the scene with the physically and emotionally ailing Logan going toe-toe with Murderbot-Logan in the front of the farmhouse was tense, extremely viscerally violent, but really well choreographed.

The whole part of the film at the end of the farm house just had an uncomfortably abstract but downtrodden emotion to it. Charles not being able to find true rest, and a tragically unable to reconcile with Logan, Logan getting torn apart like crazy in a impossible fight, a family getting murdered, and Logan being unable to really put either his beloved mentor or Eric LaSalle at peace before they died was fucking downer. I guess it does a lot in driving the stakes up and solidifying how vulnerable Logan is to everything going on around him, but it give me an ill feeling.

It stung seeing Logan looking legitimately vulnerable and disadvantaged through moments of danger, and it resonated even more in smaller, human moments, like seeing him looking very unwell and falling asleep at the wheel of the car. Really, just him genuinely unwell the entire movie.

When they found that make-shift Eden, I thought Logan was going to start a new X-Men with the kids.

But yeah, the end of the movie earned perfect closure to what Hugh Jackman did for the character of Wolverine. Authentic, loyal, truly caring, nurturing, and protective to his loved-ones.

His succinct final worlds to allow Laura live without rage/baggage, and his his painfully under-dog and self-sacrificing last stand, was less of a grand stand but more profound than anything he's done for the character.

And that symbolic cross to X was the feels.

I'm bummed the run is over, but I'm so happy he didn't go out on X-Men: The Last Stand, or X-Men Origins: Wolverine.

Hell of a run. Hats off to Hugh Jackman and his tireless effort to make an emotional resounding tribute to Wolverine.
 
I read the last page and it's nearly entirely complaining about the x-men universe continuity and the fact that we don't have a perfect timeline of what killed the mutantverse. I wonder if these people are the same ones that complain about the MCU.
 
Bobby Roberts said:
Nah.

Like, how "chumpy" is what he did? Or how he went out?
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Well .. he takes care of the regular henchmen after taking the green juice just fine but is thoroughly outmatched by his clone.

Being the last Wolverine movie, I was hoping for one last berserker rage, a rage filled segment to end all segments.

I didn't say I disliked the way it was in the movie, it's just that my expectation was maybe something different.
 
saw the movie a few hours ago, its amazing, it beat first class as my favorite xman movie by far. there were a lot of ppl in my theater crying at the end :( although if we're being honest, it did bother me a bit on how theres no real explanation on how all the mutants were killed. Like cmon, really? :| you can't just drop that on me and expect me to just accept it like that lol, but yea thats really the only issue i had with the entire movie, its an easy 10/10 for me
 
chandoog said:
I didn't say I disliked the way it was in the movie, it's just that my expectation was maybe something different.
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I get you, I just don't know how that last charge of his, that stupid, berserker charge of his, could be considered "chumpy" was all. I feel like the movie sets it up pretty clearly that dude is long past his prime, and the hero moments like the kind we used to get in the comic books are not on the table for this movie.

I figured people would be a little taken aback by how perfunctory the deaths are. People just die in this movie. There's no real buildup to it. That's not normally done, and it's really not done in superhero movies. Moments are typically very heavily telegraphed. They don't do it here. But I also feel like the atmosphere of the movie makes it clear you shouldn't expect it by the end battle. If people find themselves in the wrong spot, they're just going to get got.

And that ends up including Logan.
 
Hero Prinny said:
saw the movie a few hours ago, its amazing, it beat first class as my favorite xman movie by far. there were a lot of ppl in my theater crying at the end :( although if we're being honest, it did bother me a bit on how theres no real explanation on how all the mutants were killed. Like cmon, really? :| you can't just drop that on me and expect me to just accept it like that lol, but yea thats really the only issue i had with the entire movie, its an easy 10/10 for me
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It's pretty much inferred that Charles' failing mind did it, and that no new mutants were born due to growth hormone/genetically modified food and drink. I would like to know how Magneto died (if he did) or what became of him.
 
Holy FUCK is this good. I mean, I expected it to be good but jesus.

The story was great. The characters were great. The acting was great. The CG was great. The backstory was great. The setup for future movies was great. The stakes were great. The setting was great. Man when they first showed Xavier in the tank acting all crazy, that shit got real. Easily one of the best superhero movies I've ever seen.

Hats. Fucking. Off.
 
chandoog said:
Well .. he takes care of the regular henchmen after taking the green juice just fine but is thoroughly outmatched by his clone.

Being the last Wolverine movie, I was hoping for one last berserker rage, a rage filled segment to end all segments.

I didn't say I disliked the way it was in the movie, it's just that my expectation was maybe something different.
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It's almost like the regular henchmen aren't shit compared to a clone of fucking peak Wolverine

Also, the green juice wore off before the clone even showed up

This was an entire movie of Berserker Rage man
 
demosthenes said:
There was a guy in my theatre that was REALLY whenever claws went into a head. Was very vocal.

Also, deadpool got a lot of cheers.
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There was a guy who was extremely vocal in our audience, he finally shut up when someone shushed him really loudly.

Shit was super annoying.
 
chefbags said:
I don't think you finished your sentence. Really what?
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Haha, I'm really tired, I need to go to sleep, long week of work after a long week with the flu, glad I got to see this movie tonight though.

I was trying to say that there was a guy that was super into the movie. Whenever Wolverine was killing someone I would hear "OH SHIT" and stuff like that. I thought it was funny.
 
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