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[Vawn]

Euh... How does Phil making me believe that MS prioritizes other metrics to measure success have any impact on sales, business growth and or profit whatsoever?

Genuinely confused what they gain in "making" me believe that

Seriously? Why do you think product manufacturers rush out to advertise great sales? Because good sales = better sales. If something sells, it becomes more popular as consumer confidence grows. If something struggles, consumers become weary and it gets worse.

This is news to you? You honestly think there was another reason Xbox bragged all generation about Xbox 360 numbers and stopped even disclosing them very early on in the Xbox One gen?

Or do you really believe they started caring only about stuff like the number of skeletons slayed instead of actual sales?

 

[HeresJohnny]

But the Game Pass strategy can result in so much more money than the console business...

Let's say the XSX will sell for $500 the first year. You'll only need 3 people that will subscribe for 1 year on Game Pass to generate the same amount of money. (3 people * $15 GP subscription * 12 months). Knowing that Game Pass is available on PC AND Xbox, I understand that he says that selling Xbox consoles isn't the only metric onto which Nadella will grade his performance.

There's no evidence that MS can make money on this model, and the last time I checked it looked like it was going to be damn hard.

 

[ethomaz]

Keep saying that maybe one day you will believe it Phil.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

There's no evidence that MS can make money on this model, and the last time I checked it looked like it was going to be damn hard.

It's not like we know how much cost their goes into Game Pass. Pretty sure they ran the numbers and that it's viable IF they reach a certain target of users.

 

[Kumomeme]

MS strategy onward probably revolves on how many people use their 'services' instead

 

[SuperLupeRap]

Well, let's stick with the topic and discuss why it makes sense to anyone that if a company is going to go into hardware and develop partnerships based at least (probably more) on that hardware, to say that they're not concerned with how many they sell in its launch year.

Huh, knew it! Zero arguments

Maybe another armchair analyst can help here?

 

[longdi]

Make good sense. The economic fallout will shit bricks in the coming months. When people realize corona restricts everything for a good while.

Phil is building the Xbox around everyone, games will continue to work, old and new. Gamers centric, software games for everone

Didnt they just sold the 1X Cyberpunk for $299? That is a whole lot of value to play tons of games! A Ryzen + Motherboard already close in at $299.

 

[Vawn]

Didnt they just sold the 1X Cyberpunk for $299? That is a whole lot of value to play tons of games! A Ryzen + Motherboard already close in at $299.

That's called phasing out hardware. They are discontinuing the One X. That's why they had to sell a Cyberpunk console months before Cyberpunk even released.

 

[Self]

I was playing DMC5 on my phone the other day at silly smooth 60fps with my controller attached. It was fantastic.

Honestly, this scenario gives me the chills.

 

[Elder Legend]

I think Jonny does not realize that the market and business models change overtime as technology progresses lol.

360 was 15 years ago. Things will change in that time frame. How do people not realize that i have no clue.

 

[Three]

The thread title is a little misleading even if it is ultimately true.

It was never their strategy. They don't care because they are milking subscriptions. During the 360 to xbox one transition it was the same but what they didn't see is a group of people switching to another service.

I mean look at this quote

And if now is not the time for you to buy a new console, and you're going to stay with the console you have, we're going to keep supporting that console.

This is essentially a sugarcoated we've got a console for you it's called the xbox 360. They didn't care if you were on an old machine then and they don't care now. Why? Because you're paying the same damn subscriptions.

 

[SuperLupeRap]

Seriously? Why do you think product manufacturers rush out to advertise great sales? Because good sales = better sales. If something sells, it becomes more popular as consumer confidence grows. If something struggles, consumers become weary and it gets worse.

This is news to you? You honestly think there was another reason Xbox bragged all generation about Xbox 360 numbers and stopped even disclosing them very early on in the Xbox One gen?

Or do you really believe they started caring only about stuff like the number of skeletons slayed instead of actual sales?

Lmao. What mattered 14 years ago doesn't necessarily matter the same way more than a decade later. Digital and services matter 1000X more today than in 2006 in every industry and media. Netflix, Spotify, everything as service, digital in videogames being more important than physical discs in in gaming revenue.

MS have shown already by actions NOT words that their priority is not how many consoles they sell. That's why all their games are on PC and their focus is Gamepass and Live.

They care how much money they make from SW and services not HW sold.

Keep on trying to convince yourself that they're doing all this just to prove people like you (LOL) wrong. They didn't give a sh!t about what you think. They're in the business of making money.

 

[HeresJohnny]

Huh, knew it! Zero arguments

Maybe another armchair analyst can help here?

I've already stated them. The reason Microsoft wants to pretend that sales don't matter is because they've been getting rekt for the entire generation. What else can they say? Problem is, dudes like you are doubling down and guzzling the Spencer-Aid and believing his manure about hardware sales not mattering, which is fucking stupid from a business standpoint. You can try to argue the case about GamePass; at least that's a strategy but you guys are sitting here trying to sell the idea that it's okay for the next Xbox to tank. Everyone knows that's bullshit, including Spencer. He's probably sitting there, amazed that people actually bought his PR.

 

[oldergamer]

Microsoft shifted company strategy after the current CEO was found. This was across the board, from MS Office to Xbox. There's a lot of fanboys in this thread that refuse to agree with what spencer is saying, and they can go ahead an argue, but the fact is, MS is making money on software sales. No console maker wants to sell a console at a loss, especially if you aren't selling enough software, but have done so in the past.

Bottom line is consoles only exist as a way to sell you MORE software. So sales wars means nothing when you focus on the place you see money. Also btw, Microsoft is the only one out of the big three that are selling game software on competitors consoles and PC. Not all of thier games, but some of them. There's also a reason sony is selling some first party titles on PC to generate more revenue. As highly as their games are regarded, they typically don't continue to be system sellers long after release.

So MS will keep making new hardware, just like they make Surface notebooks, and other hardware, but to them its not a walled garden like it is to Sony. Note nintendo makes cellphone software now, so they have also changed approach. Think about it, MS right now has the number one selling game on the Nintendo Switch. Do you really this this is a bad strategy? If you do, you need to move away from the traditional console market of 15 years ago.

 

[SuperLupeRap]

I've already stated them. The reason Microsoft wants to pretend that sales don't matter is because they've been getting rekt for the entire generation. What else can they say? Problem is, dudes like you are doubling down and guzzling the Spencer-Aid and believing his manure about hardware sales not mattering, which is fucking stupid from a business standpoint. You can try to argue the case about GamePass; at least that's a strategy but you guys are sitting here trying to sell the idea that it's okay for the next Xbox to tank. Everyone knows that's bullshit, including Spencer. He's probably sitting there, amazed that people actually bought his PR.

Yo I don't care about all the rubbish you just posted. Didn't get past the 1st few words.

 

[OmaeWaMouShindiggity]

People: Xbox doesn’t care about hardware

also people: Xbox made the strongest hardware console to date

 

[SuperLupeRap]

.

 

[HeresJohnny]

Microsoft shifted company strategy after the current CEO was found. This was across the board, from MS Office to Xbox. There's a lot of fanboys in this thread that refuse to agree with what spencer is saying, and they can go ahead an argue, but the fact is, MS is making money on software sales. No console maker wants to sell a console at a loss, especially if you aren't selling enough software, but have done so in the past.

Bottom line is consoles only exist as a way to sell you MORE software. So sales wars means nothing when you focus on the place you see money. Also btw, Microsoft is the only one out of the big three that are selling game software on competitors consoles and PC. Not all of thier games, but some of them. There's also a reason sony is selling some first party titles on PC to generate more revenue. As highly as their games are regarded they typically don't continue to be system sellers long after release.

So MS will keep making new hardware, just like they make Surface notebooks, and other hardware, but to them its not a walled garden like it is to Sony. Note nintendo makes cellphone software now, so they have also changed approach.

How convenient of them to decide to transcend the traditional approach after getting smashed for a generation. How would Microsoft be acting were its roles with Sony reversed, I wonder? I'm going to suppose that they'd be leaving everything as is. Which is really my point: the only company finding fault with an otherwise killer traditional market is Microsoft. Sony and Nintendo both occupy the same space and have been tremendously profitable. Why not Microsoft?

 

[Dnice1]

Considering the approach PlayStation has already committed to aka fast conversion to PS5 the contrast will be stark and I'm guessing if Sony touts their sales, this type of sentiment kinda falls flat. THe problem is XBOX has always touted console and games sales and while they may be trying to move on from a metric of success that they created, I don't think the broader audience cares, understand, or gives a fuck about these new metrics, especially when XBOX refuses to say how many PAYING subscribers they have for any of their services.

Phil Spencer already told yall stop worrying about things that don't concern you.

"The thing at the highest level, which will probably get me in trouble, is as gamers you should focus on what you want, not focus on, like, my P&L [profit and loss statement], or the P&L of the console you chose to invest in. I see this dialogue about somebody worried that somehow Xbox is gonna make less money, or their console is gonna make less money if they tell me a game is going to be on a different platform before it actually comes out, or it's gonna be in a subscription, which is really what I want, but somehow that's gonna mean less money for them so I don't want them to do that because I'd rather pay more money so...

You should focus on you as a gamer and the things that matter to you. We as the people running the business - I am incented to run a good business inside of Microsoft and in the long term. I've been here for 31 years. I don't know that I'll make 31 more, but I'm not going anywhere tomorrow. We're building an Xbox business for the long run. I'll tell you, Game Pass today is a strong part of that, and it continues to get stronger, and it supports the building of great IP."

The big XO19 interview: Xbox boss Phil Spencer on Game Pass, streaming and Project Scarlett

At Microsoft's big XO19 event in London yesterday, Xbox boss Phil Spencer told the gathered press all about Game Pass, …

www.eurogamer.net

 

[SuperLupeRap]

Yo I don't care about the all the rubbish you just posted. Didn't get past the 1st few words.

I owned a 360 and I own an Xbone. I can confidently testify that they don't seem totally fine.

I asked you to explain this. Been several posts now you´re dancing around the question

 

[Kokoloko85]

I wonder how his software partners who are investing heavily in the Xbox feel about such a stupid statement.


It really is, but they've been bending over for this guy's bullshit for half a decade now.

that phil spencer has actually convinced some people they don't care about how many xboxs they sell is honestly impressive

No point arguing with some people on here. As long as Spencer says there not losing, then there not losing right.
“We’re wining the subscription battle” is more than enough for the xbox fan boys to be happy about.

Spencer is just all smiles and BS.

But numbers aren't important to him and the investors because he doesn't even have competitors.....right?

Xbox Boss Phil Spencer Doesn't See Sony As Competition Going Forward

Convenient

www.pushsquare.com

But at the same time mentions how they have a strategy to win the next generation or something.....

Im guessing there pretending they only care about cloud wars now. Pretty sure they can tell from the level of interested the Xbox Series X is having is nowhere near close the PS5. The 360 era excitement isn’t coming back...

Im guessing its not much more interest than what the Xbox One X had 2 years ago?

 

[HeresJohnny]

I asked you to explain this. Been several posts now you´re dancing around the question

Let's start with sales numbers and overall brand standing. Would you say this generation has been on par with the 360 for Microsoft regarding either?

 

[DrAspirino]

Back in the day Microsoft actually made computers. They quickly went away from that model though to just offer Windows OS to computer manufactures. Nowadays Microsoft makes their money off of software and OS (although yes, I know they do still sell computers and other electronic devices.)

It really does sound like they are wanting to turn XBOX into the Windows OS model. The model that makes them the big bucks. They want to replicate that, even though it may not be successful. They just want to turn XBOX into that, no matter what the cost really.

This makes me sad. Gone will be the days of a dedicated box, made for a dedicated purpose.

Or maybe they'll keep releasing the Xbox console, although just as a "reference" box, like they've been doing with the Surface devices. Subscriptions and licensing makes them really big bucks, as you said.

But at the same time mentions how they have a strategy to win the next generation or something.....

Im guessing there pretending they only care about cloud wars now. Pretty sure they can tell from the level of interested the Xbox Series X is having is nowhere near close the PS5. The 360 era excitement isn’t coming back...

Actually, that's Satya Nadella's entire focus: the cloud.

Microsoft’s CEO looks to a future beyond Windows, iOS, and Android

Satya Nadella is looking at the next 46 billion internet-connected devices for the future of Microsoft.

www.theverge.com

“What do you think is the biggest hardware business at Microsoft?” asked Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella last week during a private media event. “Xbox,” answered a reporter who had been quizzing Nadella on how the company’s hardware products like Surface and Xbox fit into the broader ambitions of Microsoft. “No, it’s our cloud,” fired back Nadella, explaining how Microsoft is building everything from the data centers to the servers and network stack that fit inside.

 

[Kokoloko85]

So why release a console? Why not just be a streaming service?

People here acting like Ms doesnt care how many consoles they sell? Well lets put it this way.
If MS sell under 30 million I doubt they will sell another console again......
More console = more subscriptions, more software sales.

 

[Nikana]

Im sure it wont take long for this thread to be resolved into garbage but ill throw my opinion out there anyway.

This sounds a lot like their surface model in that they definitely care about how much hardware they sell, but it doesn't end there with the sale of the hardware. The Surface was always just meant to be a reference design on leveraging the strengths of Windows in both a consumer and business mentality. But that was during the Balmer era and they have pivoted from that and turned surface into the gateway to get people subscribed to their services. The business crowd have Office and Skype and now the consumer side has Game Pass.

So yeah, I totally believe what he is saying. Hes not saying he doesn't want to sell boxes, but the strategy isn't the same as it used to be. You used to have to sell a box to get people to buy the software but the struggle is to keep them buying software. If somebody buys an xbox 360 but never got online with it and bought 2 games then they basically didn't make any money on them. Where they made the money was XBL and keeping players subbed to XBL by giving them new software.

Series X looks to take the Surface model. Give people a high end or low end entry point and get them using your services.

 

[HeresJohnny]

So why release a console? Why not just be a streaming service?

People here acting like Ms doesnt care how many consoles they sell? Well lets put it this way.
If MS sell under 30 million I doubt they will sell another console again......
More console = more subscriptions, more software sales.

Someone gets it.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

Does this guy ever stop talking? I mean fuck, how many interviews and appearances does he want to make?

I think he should concentrate on delivering, not talking

 

[IntentionalPun]

Oh God.. people are gonna keep claiming MS doesn't care how many Xboxes they sell now...

Phil this BS just makes forums worse, please stop.

AT BEST this is Phil saying the economy has forced them not to focus too much on new console sales... but he's just kinda full of shit here. MS cares, because that's largely how they sell games and services.. via XBox. PC is a side hustle.. their games don't sell as well, Gamepass is half the price... Windows Store barely sells shit (and has a lower cut of sales), etc.

Sell Xboxes is how they get growth, shut up Phil.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

So why release a console? Why not just be a streaming service?

People here acting like Ms doesnt care how many consoles they sell? Well lets put it this way.
If MS sell under 30 million I doubt they will sell another console again......
More console = more subscriptions, more software sales.

He said, and I quote:

But our strategy is centred around the player, not the device"

Where does that mean they don't care about how many consoles they will sell? That too is part of the bigger strategy.

 

[Nikana]

So why release a console? Why not just be a streaming service?

People here acting like Ms doesnt care how many consoles they sell? Well lets put it this way.
If MS sell under 30 million I doubt they will sell another console again......
More console = more subscriptions, more software sales.

He never said he doesnt care about how many boxes they sell. Ever. He has never and will never say that.

All he has ever said is that. the strategy isn't simply getting the box into the home anymore. Its not his fault the internet takes every word spoke and twists it more than a Ben's Pretzel .

 

[SuperLupeRap]

How convenient of them to decide to transcend the traditional approach after getting smashed for a generation. How would Microsoft be acting were its roles with Sony reversed, I wonder? I'm going to suppose that they'd be leaving everything as is. Which is really my point: the only company finding fault with an otherwise killer traditional market is Microsoft. Sony and Nintendo both occupy the same space and have been tremendously profitable. Why not Microsoft?

Yeah but Sony can transcend the traditional approach to console hardware that´s based on pure physics by claiming it´s all about the SSD now all of a sudden and you´re fine with that right?

Wonder why Phil´s comment have you guys so triggered. Like he insulted all your momma´s or something.

 

[HeresJohnny]

Yeah but Sony can transcend the traditional approach to console hardware that´s based on pure physics by claiming it´s all about the SSD now all of a sudden and you´re fine with that right?

Wonder why Phil´s comment have you guys so triggered. Like he insulted all your momma´s or something.

SSD's are a hardware refinement. I'm totally cool with that. Saying you don't need to sell hardware is sticking your head up your ass and commenting on how nice the view is. Two totally different issues.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Interesting. I mean, really, if I am MS, I gotta realize I am probably never going to outsell Sony box-per-box basis. I am sure the goal is bridge the gap this generation, slowly, over the course of the gen, and not expect some huge lead to materialize right out of the gates. But, it is clear, that MS and Sony are taking a different approach to this upcoming gen in more ways than one.

 

[longdi]

That's called phasing out hardware. They are discontinuing the One X. That's why they had to sell a Cyberpunk console months before Cyberpunk even released.

It is still a damn good hardware to play tons of games.

Like $299 and get major stepup from your iPhones. Can you play RDR2 at 4K on your mobile phones? Thats the idea, to smoother the transition and get more newbies to jump in.

I think 1X $299 could be a reason why lockheart is not seen.

 

[DarthFeanor]

You have to remember that Microsoft is a company that keep investing in a web browser that has less than 20% of market share.
Bing was mocked for years because it couldn't overtake Google.

However, when you look at the numbers in their financial reports you can understand how much money they make from those products.

This give Microsoft a saying in the future of web/api/code/standarts, etc... even when they are clearly inferior.

 

[The_Mike]

Spencer's words sounds like its coming from someone who clearly lost this generation. Hey, wait a minute...

Im happy Xbox is behind, because I doubt we would see their previous exclusives on pc if it wasn't the case.

 

[Metnut]

If I was trying to compete with PS5’s best in class SSD, I/O solution and stable of first party developers, I’d be downplaying sales expectations to Wall Street and my bosses as much and as soon as possible also.

He knows what he’s doing here folks.

 

[Nikana]

SSD's are a hardware refinement. I'm totally cool with that. Saying you don't need to sell hardware is sticking your head up your ass and commenting on how nice the view is. Two totally different issues.

Except Phil has never said he doesn't need to sell hardware.

 

[MarkMe2525]

Because the suggestion that the strategy isn't to sell a ton of Xboxes is fucking dumb on its face and irresponsible and insulting for people who've put their eggs in the Microsoft basket and partnered up with them.

Irresponsible and insulting.. huh. So you suggest that these third parties that signed up to develop software for xbox are not aware of their future plans and microsoft somehow bamboozled them. Sounds like a pretty dumb on its face and insulting conclusion to come to.

 

[The Hamburglar]

I sell? I always knew he was trying to sell them down the market used.

If Phil Doesn’t personally doesn’t drop me off an Xbox, they’ve lost themselves a customer.

 

[SleepDoctor]

Statement is a bit ironic considering they invested in a more powerful console than their competitor. But ive felt subscriptions and services will play a bigger role this gen. As of right now Ps Now is (or at least when i saw yesterday) $40 for the year at Best Buy.

Of course we have the same culprits concern trolling another ms thread tho. It's understandable considering Sony's lack of information on their console.

 

[HeresJohnny]

Except Phil has never said he doesn't need to sell hardware.

It's right here in the title, "Our strategy doesn't revolve around how many Xboxes I sell this year." So are you positing that hardware sales will matter to him next year?

 

[Vawn]

MS have shown already by actions NOT words that their priority is not how many consoles they sell.

Well, you got me there. They sure have!

 

[NullZ3r0]

Phil cares about selling GamePass subs. Thats where the money is and that's right up Satya Nadella's alley. That sweet, sweet monthly recurring revenue. Its like PCs. You don't see MS bragging anymore about how many copies of Windows they sold. They have Office 365 and Azure. The future of Xbox includes GamePass and Xcloud.

If Xcloud runs anything like Stadia, its a game changer. Stadia's biggest knock is its catalogue. A Stadia-like service with the GamePass library is a Black Swan, iPhone-like earth-shaking event.

 

[longdi]

He never said he doesnt care about how many boxes they sell. Ever. He has never and will never say that.

All he has ever said is that. the strategy isn't simply getting the box into the home anymore. Its not his fault the internet takes every word spoke and twists it more than a Ben's Pretzel .

Yep! We are in extraordinary situation, which he mentioned as part of this move. Corona-corona-corona.

This is about providing as much choices and less pressure to make a big bad launch party. Besides launch titles...how many do you remember over the years?

 

[Nikana]

Interesting. I mean, really, if I am MS, I gotta realize I am probably never going to outsell Sony box-per-box basis. I am sure the goal is bridge the gap this generation, slowly, over the course of the gen, and not expect some huge lead to materialize right out of the gates. But, it is clear, that MS and Sony are taking a different approach to this upcoming gen in more ways than one.

Are they though? Theres more and more reports/rumors that Sony is bringing more games to PC in attempt to sell more software and adopted some of the game pass features. It seems they both are chasing the same thing.

It's right here in the title, "Our strategy doesn't revolve around how many Xboxes I sell this year." So are you positing that hardware sales will matter to him next year?

Where does it say that hardware doesnt matter? It doesn't. It says the strategy does not rely on simply selling the xbox and calling it a day.

 

[zcaa0g]

You are correct sir.

 

[HeresJohnny]

Irresponsible and insulting.. huh. So you suggest that these third parties that signed up to develop software for xbox are not aware of their future plans and microsoft somehow bamboozled them. Sounds like a pretty dumb on its face and insulting conclusion to come to.

Not as dumb as "Less money is awesome!" As a company, you want as many people in the pool as possible. You want as many people spending money on your ecosystem than others. Why is this so alien to you guys? How can you honestly believe that they're okay with not selling as many units as they can make this year?

 

[SuperLupeRap]

Well, you got me there. They sure have!

So witty

 

[HeresJohnny]

Are they though? Theres more and more reports/rumors that Sony is bringing more games to PC in attempt to sell more software and adopted some of the game pass features. It seems they both are chasing the same thing.


Where does it say that hardware doesnt matter? It doesn't. It says the strategy does not rely on simply selling the xbox and calling it a day.

Which is what every company says when they are shoveling shit. It sounds like a losing political candidate on election night. I may not have gotten all the votes, but this campaign was never about that, it was about changing the message.
Whatev, dude.