Perrott
Member
With each passing game, the more I get the feeling that we peaked at Tomb Raider 2013 when it comes to Lara designs:
In-Game said:
CG said:
Key Art said:
Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen
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H . R . 2
Member
easily
these devs are extremely talented
it will not, the Ascent was a looker when it came out and there were no downgrades from the intial showingDo you think it'll get downgraded? It looks too good.
they will deliver on the more linear aspects such as level design and the narrative. they did with the Ascent
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PeteBull
Member
Its made by polish dev studio so lara isnt old ugly bitch like in that other open world tomb raider game(when her face looks 50 rofl ;p), u can even asses it simply by amount of yt views(381k) and likes to dislikes ratio- 20k to only 353 atm.Thoughts on Lara's character model in Atlantis? I love how pretty she looks here. Is it next gen compared to ND or GG models? Perhaps not. But i like it.
In contrast that catalyst cgi 326k views, 15k likes to 1,2k dislikes ratio and thats supposed to be proper "big new game".
Hell in that catalist CGI lara looked worse(from tech standpoint) from the DEI villain they gave her:
vs
PeteBull
Member
With all due respect, bro, no game is a looker on switch2, at least from technical standpoind, artistically sure, just noone of the games got current gen graphic fidelity, which this topic is about after all, either games looking like from ps4 but with better IQ/framerate(mkw/dkb/kirby/metroid), or highly downgraded current gen games that look like shit in comparision to midrange (5060ti, r5 5600) gaming pc version(thats roughly ps5pr0 power)- like cp2077 or SW:O.Loving my Metroid Prime 4 playthrough and only growing more and more fond of the direction they went with the visuals the further I get into the game.
It's a looker on Switch 2, period.
Think of it like u look at bad bitches, Miami or LA 6 is 10/10 in some tiny smalltown where there is 0 competition but since we know proper 9/10 and 10/10 exist we cant take smalltown 10/10 as actual top of the foodchain - same with switch2 games- 10 years ago they would be considered amazing looking but its almost 2026 now, ppl see how games on big consoles and even midrange pc can look, so we can never take switch2 games seriously when it comes to tech aspects.
No hate- just how we see it- blame ninny for giving up arms race back at wii launch in 2006, not us who judge games graphics fairy.
You named the 2 red flags in the Catalyst trailer for me. Lara's model, especially the face and then... the villain... cmon... at this point it's just epic cringe.Its made by polish dev studio so lara isnt old ugly bitch like in that other open world tomb raider game(when her face looks 50 rofl ;p), u can even asses it simply by amount of yt views(381k) and likes to dislikes ratio- 20k to only 353 atm.
In contrast that catalyst cgi 326k views, 15k likes to 1,2k dislikes ratio and thats supposed to be proper "big new game".
Hell in that catalist CGI lara looked worse(from tech standpoint) from the DEI villain they gave her:
vs
Critical Hit
Member
That's the version that won. It was the same with Indiana Jones.
winjer
Member
Its made by polish dev studio so lara isnt old ugly bitch like in that other open world tomb raider game(when her face looks 50 rofl ;p), u can even asses it simply by amount of yt views(381k) and likes to dislikes ratio- 20k to only 353 atm.
In contrast that catalyst cgi 326k views, 15k likes to 1,2k dislikes ratio and thats supposed to be proper "big new game".
Hell in that catalist CGI lara looked worse(from tech standpoint) from the DEI villain they gave her:
vs
I bet this "villain" is going to lecture Lara on colonialism and how europeans are evil.
Pharaoh 117
Member
The gameplay might be more like Sleeping Dogs but that trailer/cut-scene is 100% Yakuza.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
The tag is killing me. Apt.
YeulEmeralda
Linux User
Death Stranding 2 best graphics? It's a PS5 game I wonder how good the PC port will look.
4k resolution, increased draw distance, ray tracing.
4k resolution, increased draw distance, ray tracing.
analog_future
Resident Crybaby
Oh I hear you. I should've been clearer, I'm saying MP4 is a looker considering it's a Nintendo game on mobile hardware. It of course isn't even in the same ballpark of any of the best looking games overall.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Its already 4k on the ps5. The pro already had a better draw distance. It won't have ray tracing because the engine doesn't support it.
RodriGames40
Member
Also, a cross-gen Nintendo game on mobile hardware. Important distinction to make right there.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
sigh. i was hoping the tide was turning.Its made by polish dev studio so lara isnt old ugly bitch like in that other open world tomb raider game(when her face looks 50 rofl ;p), u can even asses it simply by amount of yt views(381k) and likes to dislikes ratio- 20k to only 353 atm.
In contrast that catalyst cgi 326k views, 15k likes to 1,2k dislikes ratio and thats supposed to be proper "big new game".
Hell in that catalist CGI lara looked worse(from tech standpoint) from the DEI villain they gave her:
vs
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Oh btw, this whole path tracing excuse to hand out GOTYs is simply overblown. Played Indy with PT on for the first time last night, and meh. The only level that looks next gen or on par with UE5 games is the thai village on the river. The materials used to build the huts, the interior lighting and indirect lighting on characters especially looks excellent. But thats it. You get a boat and go out in the open world and the game goes back to looking cross gen. Path tracing cant save everything. I even went back to the Vatican and Giza, and it was mostly the same with some areas looking better due to better indirect lighting which again, ive seen in UE5, Anvil and Snowdrop games. But the mid RTGI implementation of the ID Tech engine keeps console owners and PC gamers who couldnt afford $1,500 cards last year from experiencing it.
And the cost is another thing. That fishing village that does look next gen runs at 40 fps on a 5080. A card that was selling for $1,500 until this september when it finally dropped down to its $1,000 MSRP. And even now at 4k dlss performance, 1080p internal resolution, its running at 40 fps in the one level that truly looks next gen. Meanwhile UE5 gets shat on constantly and is able to consistently push these materials thanks to nanite and lumen at 4k DLAA 60 fps. Even with hardware lumen, im running games at 4k dlss quality at a locked 60 fps.
Giving these games GOTY just because they push path tracing is so fucking ridiculous especially when they knocked off points because AC shadows couldnt do 60 fps on base consoles with RTGI active.
And the cost is another thing. That fishing village that does look next gen runs at 40 fps on a 5080. A card that was selling for $1,500 until this september when it finally dropped down to its $1,000 MSRP. And even now at 4k dlss performance, 1080p internal resolution, its running at 40 fps in the one level that truly looks next gen. Meanwhile UE5 gets shat on constantly and is able to consistently push these materials thanks to nanite and lumen at 4k DLAA 60 fps. Even with hardware lumen, im running games at 4k dlss quality at a locked 60 fps.
Giving these games GOTY just because they push path tracing is so fucking ridiculous especially when they knocked off points because AC shadows couldnt do 60 fps on base consoles with RTGI active.
T4keD0wN
Member
Indy looks great until you get the boat, game kind of falls apart from that point onwards, very visible in cutscenes. Vatican and Giza are superb imo. IDtech has fantastic RT quality.
Ive played Ninja Gaiden 2 and Expedition 33 (sure not the best UE5 stuff) with HW Lumen far above maximum settings (50fps territory on a 5090 at 1440p with dlss quality so 960p), shadow quality needs some refining, so ignore those please.
Even with all that the RT does far more in Indiana Jones. (the last 2 shots are from before Ray Reconstruction got added)
Straight up transformative imo.
UE5 gets too much undeserved hate, it runs good given the quality, as a whole package its definitely step above everything else, especially when it comes to materials and features, but the effects (lumen/RT) and denoising are a clear exception to that. Ive started Silent Hill 2 remake recently, trying to mod the graphics there as much as i can to get rid of the weaknesses, i think it might be possible to get some excellent results, but itll take some time.
Snowdrop is truly next level. Ubisoft is cooking hard with graphics, far better effects, but worse materials than UE5, id still put the RT here below Idtech.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Just played some Doom with Path Tracing. Meh. You cant put lipstick on a pig. The base lighting model needs to be improved. The geometry, textuers and material quality needs to be improved. Foliage quality needs to be improved before path tracing can transform a visual. Im sure it will look better indoors just like Indy but the game is mostly set in these big open world areas where path tracing does fuck all. oh and same thing as indy, mid 40s during combat at 4k dlss performance. clearly these GPUs are not ready for it, and no im going down to 720p internal resolution just to play games with path tracing.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
i didnt even know Exp 33 got a hardware lumen patch. will download it now that i have the gamepass membership again. But ninja gaiden looked very ps3 gen to me. yes, the cutscenes and some areas like the intro to the daytime jungle level looked good, but most of it felt very flat. I wasnt even sure they were using lumen or nanite.Indy looks great until you get the boat, game kind of falls apart from that point onwards, very visible in cutscenes. Vatican and Giza are superb imo. IDtech has fantastic RT quality.
Ive played Ninja Gaiden 2 and Expedition 33 (sure not the best UE5 stuff) with HW Lumen far above maximum settings (50fps territory on a 5090 at 1440p with dlss quality so 960p), shadow quality needs some refining, so ignore those please.
Even with all that the RT does far more in Indiana Jones. (the last 2 shots are from before Ray Reconstruction got added)
Straight up transformative imo.
UE5 gets too much undeserved hate, it runs good given the quality, as a whole package its definitely step above everything else, especially when it comes to materials and features, but the effects (lumen/RT) and denoising are a clear exception to that. Ive started Silent Hill 2 remake recently, trying to mod the graphics there as much as i can to get rid of the weaknesses, i think it might be possible to get some excellent results, but itll take some time.
Snowdrop is truly next level. Ubisoft is cooking hard with graphics, far better effects, but worse materials than UE5, id still put the RT here below Idtech.
indy is just not doing it for me outside of that village level. I did go back to the vatican but the open world level looks nothing like the screens you posted which do have that soft CG look to them.
Most of the time the game looks like this. its that village level that looks absolutely mind boggling.
T4keD0wN
Member
Dont, E33 doesn't have hw lumen. Its modded it in for that shot, along with ray reconstruction, super easy for UE5 games which is great. Both together kind of fix all the major visual problems for me there (RR is huge here). But youll either need to (dump the cvars) and then enable it yourself and also upgrade the lighting+draw distance to get it looking that way or find some mod on nexus that might do the same, i think this one does just that and more.i didnt even know Exp 33 got a hardware lumen patch. will download it now that i have the gamepass membership again. But ninja gaiden looked very ps3 gen to me. yes, the cutscenes and some areas like the intro to the daytime jungle level looked good, but most of it felt very flat. I wasnt even sure they were using lumen or nanite.
indy is just not doing it for me outside of that village level. I did go back to the vatican but the open world level looks nothing like the screens you posted which do have that soft CG look to them.
Most of the time the game looks like this. its that village level that looks absolutely mind boggling.
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Alex11
Member
Yeah, IDK, for me the issue is the shadows on her model, those were a bit noisy and I wasn't too impressed by the foliage, we'll see.
I'm thinking this will be a linear game, maybe some open levels type, but static time of day, being UE5, they could go big with this one.
Yeah, TR 2013 CGI model was good, with full lips, a triangular face, more in line with the Classic, then with Rise they changed for whatever reason.
This in Legacy of Atlantis, though it looks good, it clearly has some features from the Rise/Shadow model, as they themselves said they want a unified Lara.
analog_future
Resident Crybaby
Maybe something with id Tech just doesn't jive with you? You seem to really hate on DOOM and Indy and they both look fantastic tbh. Indy in particular has arguably the best implementation of PT I've ever seen:
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
the first screenshot is the only one that looks truly next gen to me. the rest look fairly cross gen albeit with accurate RTAO thats missing from last gen games.Maybe something with id Tech just doesn't jive with you? You seem to really hate on DOOM and Indy and they both look fantastic tbh. Indy in particular has arguably the best implementation of PT I've ever seen:
BlownUpRich
Member
I swear I'm not ragebaiting, but doesn't the new Control Resonant look shockingly underwhelming? Like these graphics here are PS4 era with VERY terrible character & enemy models, I am shocked & I feel contemptuous by it. Absolute disappointment! Let's hope it's unfinished & then Path Tracing could give it a very much needed flare.
Images below:
Images below:
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Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
Yes, it looks awful. Probably just early. No way a Remedy game looks like that when shipped. Even that horrible FPS game they made looks decentI swear I'm not ragebaiting, but doesn't the new Control Resonant look shockingly underwhelming? Like these graphics here are PS4 era with VERY terrible character & enemy models, I am shocked & I feel contemptuous by it. Absolute disappointment! Let's hope it's unfinished & then Path Tracing could give it a very much needed flare.
Images below:
PeteBull
Member
Looks below Alan Wake 2 quality for sure, there could be 2 major reasons for that- they as a company/dev studio experienced some srs financial troubles so had to make game's budget relatively moderate or simply they are showing game super early and in 2 years when we see proper/longer gameplay trailer it will all look vastly different/better =DI swear I'm not ragebaiting, but doesn't the new Control Resonant look shockingly underwhelming? Like these graphics here are PS4 era with VERY terrible character & enemy models, I am shocked & I feel contemptuous by it. Absolute disappointment! Let's hope it's unfinished & then Path Tracing could give it a very much needed flare.
Images below:
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Maybe it's the switch version lolI swear I'm not ragebaiting, but doesn't the new Control Resonant look shockingly underwhelming? Like these graphics here are PS4 era with VERY terrible character & enemy models, I am shocked & I feel contemptuous by it. Absolute disappointment! Let's hope it's unfinished & then Path Tracing could give it a very much needed flare.
Images below:
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
I think it could be a bullshot trailer unfortunately. That team is awfully small to have a game looking that good and polished i fear
Jinzo Prime
Member
The Ascent looked amazing for a 12 person team on UE4.
Bigger team on UE5, five years later? This tracks.
Jack Howitzer
Member
You mean xbox series s or base ps5 performance mode?
Well good enough for consoles standards I guess, kinda lame they didn't bother to make the RT quality scale up for pcs like other 3rd party titles always do before some Nvidia engineers kickin in with path tracing work. For their games part of the reasons why path tracing would make such a dramatic difference are due to the base RT are just not good enough. I mean there are many RT games who don't have the luxury for path tracing looking way more consistent , although the performance would also take a hit with advanced gi,ao, shadow ,reflection packages here and there -- but we know that's what good graphics are about, more possibilities are always a welcome on pc. You can't act like how Sony treat their low effort pc ports with just simple framerate unlock and dlss throwin in with couple of useless ps5 suited presets than call it a day
And even with 'full' path tracing on the game still has very weak water reflections in the jungle&boat sections. The art direction and scenery level design are decent, but for actual graphics quality , RT or the overall whole package, still leave a lot to be desired imo
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H . R . 2
Member
[Those screengrabs are not at all doing the game's visuals justice]The Ascent looked amazing for a 12 person team on UE4.
Bigger team on UE5, five years later? This tracks.
it was even more impressive in action and in higher resolutions, the particle effects in particular were sublime.
the bios and the districts were the most varied and true-to-concept-art I have ever seen. The music was divine
The story could use more simplicity and depth instead of just the sheer variety of characters. all in all a 9/10 experience for me
and a 9.8/10 visually for a graphics whore such as yours truly
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The Cockatrice
I'm retarded?
The tag is killing me. Apt.
Dafuq is this shit. You dont even have the balls to tag me to have a proper discussion? Pussy. Imagine thinking otherwise in regards to Decima engine, Guerilla's baby, not being a top grade engine. Brain dead.
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mrMUR_96
Member
Apparently the porting team were looking at implementing it in the horizon 2 pc port, so it wouldn't surprise me if it's in Horzion 3 at least.
mrMUR_96
Member
It's out next year, so I'm personally quite worried it's a budget decision. Maybe the Max Payne remake will look better? I hope it's just bad footage or something though because AW2 looked so good.
The Cockatrice
I'm retarded?
SlimySnake
I need to yell to someone how I'd rather have most games with cryengine and decima engine instead of ue5.
Madserb2023
Member
They aren't crazy but they don't understand that most people won't see Dark Ages as particularly impressive as they will play it on a console. Sometimes the gap between the console version and the the PC can be so big it just doesn't make sense to have it is overall graphics of the year. Should be PC graphics of the year etc. The majority of people will think Yotei looks better than Dark Ages if they have only played it on console. I think Eternal looks better on the PS5 Pro. I remember playing playing Alan Wake 2 on PC and realizing just how big the difference was. Made sense then.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Like you said, if i wanted to fight i wouldve quoted you. If you want to believe that Decima is the best engine out there, more power to you.
I need to yell to someone how I'd rather have most games with cryengine and decima engine instead of ue5.
Besides, im not going to fight people for having an opinion. I have an issue with DF because they are so-called experts who are touted around here as having some kind of expertise when they are clearly full of shit.
The Cockatrice
I'm retarded?
Which is the best in your eyes? You dont like Decima because it "supposedly" doesnt support rtgi? Just trying to figure out what you got against it aside from the DS2 hate, which I get, but HFW is still gorgeous.
Sure, but we neither are we.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
100% of UE5 games dont support RTGI on the base PS5. they use software lumen which is realtime global illumination, but not as accurate as RTGI. I dont want RTGI in every game. I just want next gen visuals. Ghosts 2 has RTGI and looks last gen as fuck.
HFW was my graphics GOTY in 2022 and Decima i guess wouldve been my favorite engine back then, but standards have changed in the last 3 years while Decima hasnt. I dont even think Decima is the issue. I think it's the developer. You can read Kojipro's interview and the tech director literally said that they didnt bother trying to update the visuals because they didnt think the leap from PS4 to PS5 was substantial enough. So in their own words, they are using last gen visuals.
As for what i wouldve liked to see in DS2, better lighting (Doesnt have to be RTGI or software based dynamic GI), way better draw distance, foliage, and most importantly better textures and geometry. Game feels dated because it has some really low quality mountains, surfaces, and rocks. the engine can easily support it. we saw it all in HFW. KojiPro didnt even try. They aimed for native 4k 30 fps and called it a day.
thats precisely why i dont have a major issue with your opinion. we both have our opinions and thats that. why fight? DF's word on the other hand is used as some kind of gospel online when they are just as full of shit as we are. If not worse because at least we arent picking 2d games as our top ten graphics.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
its been a long time coming. They chose Mario Wonder in 2023 over other more deserving games. They chose a PS3 era game (portal) as their top 3 in 2022 just because someone modded in path tracing. they chose indy over fucking hellblade 2 just because of path tracing.
Also last year, Space Marine 2 was not even given an honorable mention while Astrobot, and Penny's big adventure were given top ten spots.
no it looks mid. even on PC. even with path tracing.
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The Cockatrice
I'm retarded?
We dont know that since we technically did not get a true next-gen Guerilla game, they just helped Kojima with his game, but I'm sure they're cooking something great. I wouldnt dismiss them. Yes, Japanese devs don't really push visuals to the max sadly.
I never watch their videos or at least almost never, but are they picking based off technical aspects or just how they looks aesthetically? I would certainly rate Silksong for example higher than some generic indie UE5 game that uses rtgi any day.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I am not dismissing them. I am just judging the engine based on its current iteration.
BTW, kojiPro was given write access to the engine. they commit code to the engine and have been doing it since 2016. The water tech, character model upgrades, and other cinematic rendering upgrades in HFW were a direct result of the work kojiPro put into the engine.
The Cockatrice
I'm retarded?
I dont remember any game aside from KCD2 that looks great and runs great that would compete with it in recent times. I value performance/visuals more than just visuals alone as well as environmental details like debris and stuff that complete a level. I still consider CP2077 the king tho. What game are you considering the defining factor in current year?
Edit: AC Shadows might be a good one. Forgot about it, but it looked fantastic on PC at least, truly felt like next-gen.
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GymWolf
Member
Quintessential ragebait list.
Please put a smile emoticon reaction to whoever give credits to these clowns.
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Critical Hit
Member
I think top 3 is ok (and I'm ok if you switch ACS&Doom). But half of the rest is questionable: MP4&Earthion shouldn't be there and if there is GoY, then KCD2 must be there too.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
AC shadows is obviously the best looking game of the year. Black Hawk Down, a F2P game, looks absolutely stunning. KCD2 i really liked though it has its own issues, especially in the big city which looks fairly cross gen. MGS3 looks absolutely phenomenal most of the time. I'd rank all these games over DS2. DS2 shines in cutscenes which look a generation above the gameplay. It shines in that one fireworks chapter. And the mountains which do look next gen.
But again, my biggest issue is the exclusion of games from that top ten list. Avowed, Battlefield 6, Expedition 33, Precinct 13, Arc Raiders, Keeper, were left out because some fanboys could include switch games and 2d games that are vomit inducing.
Critical Hit
Member
Yeah, MGS3 should be in the list too (and like KCD2 it wasn't in the honourable mentions, there were more of the switch2 slop). I think it looks better than SHf.
I heard that Sega MegaDrive is still the top console in Brazil, so maybe it was for the love of their brazilian fanbase, lol.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
i have a real issue with Doom in the top 10, let alone top 3. You cannot have a game that looks that mid so often in the top 10. Especially when there are a lot more games that have higher highs and are far more consistent. I played the big dragon level last night and i was shocked at how drab and ugly it looked. The materials on all the big buildings and rocks are just so dated ive seen better last gen. And that too in Doom games last gen. i understand this one is open world so not everything can look pristine, but other open world games have far better materials and geometry.
BF6 has no ray tracing, also runs at 60 fps with an insane amount of shit happening on screen, not to mention destruction and has vastly superior building textures. Even Arc Raiders which im not a big fan of, looks better outdoors. id rate these games at the bottom of my list, so its not like im enamored with them. In fact, both of them could use some of Doom's indirect lighting in interior levels, but the visuals just jump out so much more in these games. Their impact is immediate. i dont have to force myself to go into a random room and check out some cool indirect lighting to see next gen goodness.
i am going to play yotei, silent hill f, and keeper before doing my top ten, but there is no way in hell im picking doom in the top 10 or any of the switch games. Well, maybe the Wipeout game which looks really good even on youtube. but i dont have a switch 2 so we'll see.