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Kindle Fire or wait for Asus Transformer Prime...

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SUPREME1

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...and look like a complete ass on Chrsitmas? This would be my wife's gift. I doubt she cares much about the top of the line specs of a Transformer Prime, but I'm sure she'd prefer the screen size and the speed.

However, I risk looking like a dick if I don't snap the Fire up at Best Buy or Target as she won't have anything to open in Christmas... AS BOTH OUR FAMILIES ARE COMING OVER TO OUR HOUSE TO OPEN GIFTS.

Survival instincts say just go with the Fire and be done with it, but I would hate knowing I... we... she, could've had a Prime instead.


I won't be double dipping, so it's one or the other. FYI, the Prime won't ship for a few weeks apparently. So, yeah. it'll be a while.


What's the smart thing to do?
 
You should just get the prime. Just print a card with the picture of the thing on it and wrap that or something. Unless your family are uptight about not getting presents or something.
 
Get the present you can actually give to your wife on Christmas. It seems like the Prime would be a self-indulgent present in this case.
 
KF is terrible, it has no damn volume buttons. And Amazon will replace it with an unbroken model next year.

Prime is at least somewhat future proof.
 
I've got an excellent idea.

Ask your wife which one she would rather have

Unless you're going for the "omfg surpiseses" stuff I guess.
 
The prime looks to be all kinds of awesome.

It got me to jump into the Tablet market, (and finally shipped! yay!)

It all depends on what it will be used for really...
If it's going to be used more casually, and the smaller size is acceptable, you may be happy with the kindle. But in the case of the Prime it's the full size, and still incredibly light.... but also almost 3 times the price of the kindle.
 
Prime for sure. The kindle fire is serviceable at best. Its fine for reading books and checking a basic website or two but that's it. I'm on it right now and will be stuck using it for the next week or so at relatives and its not that enjoyable at all. Its buggy, unresponsive, poorly designed and lacks a lot of key features necessary to enjoying a tablet. Really my HTC Inspire is a much smoother and enjoyable experience save for the kindle having a larger screen, otherwise my phone beats it at everything.
 
Your instincts are correct. When your wife opens a picture of a Asus on Christmas it'll be a disappointment. And she'll have to explain to everyone that what she got isn't actually going to be in her hands for a couple of weeks. Here's what you do; you buy the Fire, and get a gift receipt. Then, she gets to unwrap it, hold it in her hands, and be excited about it, but before she opens the actual Fire box you tell her that what you really wanted to get her won't be out for a few weeks and you have a gift receipt if she wants to wait. From there, it's up to her, and you've got her the best item available right now. If she wants to wait, that's on her, but if she can't help but tear into it, well that's a happy ending too.
 
get her the Prime. if she's someone who gets upset about not having that one thing on that one day, then maybe she isn't wife material anyway? and who cares what her or your parents think!? the two things aren't even a comparison!
 
It's really awesome that ASUS has put you and thousands of other prospective holiday gift-givers in such an awkward situation.

Good going, ASUS. Way to fuck up another product launch.
 
Get the Prime, it'll last longer in the end. I got my girlfriend a new HTC phone but when it was time to pick it up they had no stock and mailed it out. She didn't care she won't have it until after Christmas.
 
Isn't Prime like $500 - $600? The Fire is $199. Regardless whether you get any accessories, you are looking at $300 - $400 difference in price. How can you even compare?

If you can afford the Prime and that's what she wants, not you, order the Prime. I don't think you can go for $199 and a Fire though. That's what I got my parents. I want the Prime, my parents are going to flip when I give them the Fire.
 
Your instincts are correct. When your wife opens a picture of a Asus on Christmas it'll be a disappointment. And she'll have to explain to everyone that what she got isn't actually going to be in her hands for a couple of weeks. Here's what you do; you buy the Fire, and get a gift receipt. Then, she gets to unwrap it, hold it in her hands, and be excited about it, but before she opens the actual Fire box you tell her that what you really wanted to get her won't be out for a few weeks and you have a gift receipt if she wants to wait. From there, it's up to her, and you've got her the best item available right now. If she wants to wait, that's on her, but if she can't help but tear into it, well that's a happy ending too.

I like this idea.
 
You couldn't choose two more different tablets.

If she wants something to browse the web with and do a little reading around the house , then the KF I guess would be better because it's a lot cheaper. If she wants something that can be her main computing device, then I would recommend the prime because of the bigger screen, more horsepower, and ability to have a keyboard dock if she wants.

But it might be better to just do what slo said and get a kindle for now and return it if the transformer better fits your wife's needs. I am personally getting the prime since I'm looking for something to replace my laptop.

How sure are you that your wife really wants a tablet though?
 
I brought my gf a fire. Good starting point into the tablet world. Casual web browsing, netflix, books, etc.

Edit- you could buy it at best buy. They have some plan($20) that let's you trade it in if, and when a fire 2 comes out.

Edit 2- to be more clear, the trade in value would be 60% if its within the first 6 months of purchase. 40% afterwards.
 
According to a couple of reviews I've read, the Prime's web browser is only about as fast the original transformer's, and that is not very fast. For something as expensive and powerfull and the prime, that's pretty disappointing performance.
 
If she wants something that can be her main computing device, then I would recommend the prime because of the bigger screen, more horsepower, and ability to have a keyboard dock if she wants.
I find the concept of someone using an Android tablet as their 'main computing device' laughable
 
I find the concept of someone using an Android tablet as their 'main computing device' laughable

You may be completely disconnected with how a great many people use computers (ie Facebook, email, browser). Nothing laughable at all. In fact most people buy far far more powerful PCs than they ever utilize with their limited needed functionality.
 
Even with a quad core, the thing stutters like Mel Tillis. The ultra-bright screen is the nicest thing about it.

Stutters? Do you own one? Or just played with a demo at gamestop?


According to a couple of reviews I've read, the Prime's web browser is only about as fast the original transformer's, and that is not very fast. For something as expensive and powerfull and the prime, that's pretty disappointing performance.
The browser isnt optimized for tegra 3 IIRC.
 
iPads have 3rd party keyboard stands don't they?

what's the main selling point of the transformer prime besides the awesome detachable keyboard.
 
iPads have 3rd party keyboard stands don't they?

what's the main selling point of the transformer prime besides the awesome detachable keyboard.

-360/ps3/wii controller compatible.
-keyboard dock doubles as a screen protector, battery, mouse, sdcard reader, usb port.
-tegra 3 = good performance, better battery life.
-transformer is thinner/lighter.
-hdmi out, or remote desktop.
-good camera (8mp), with flash.
-file support. plays 1080p MKV's.
-IPS+ display
-ICS is coming.


I could go on...

Honestly, my only beef with it is the speaker placement and the micro sd cards stick out too far.
 
iPads have 3rd party keyboard stands don't they?

what's the main selling point of the transformer prime besides the awesome detachable keyboard.

It's not just a keyboard. It's a keyboard and trackpad that, when connected, makes the transformer work just like a laptop. Plus the keyboard attachment has a battery, USB port, etc.
 
iPads have 3rd party keyboard stands don't they?

what's the main selling point of the transformer prime besides the awesome detachable keyboard.

Mainly the faster CPU and better screen.

Even with a quad core, the thing stutters like Mel Tillis. The ultra-bright screen is the nicest thing about it.

I don't recall any stuttering in any of the video/written reviews, although Trent Strong's complaint (and I'm guessing yours too) was that the web browsing wasn't much faster than the original Transformer. The weak wifi signal was actually a known issue with some of the review units though and I believe that is what delayed the release of the device so hopefully it's settled.

Anandtech wrote a very comprehensive review of the tablet that praised everything about it except that the wifi speeds were way slower than the original Transformer. Asus sent them a replacement Prime with a fixed antenna and they wrote a follow-up article:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5178/an-update-on-transformer-prime-battery-life-wifi-issues

Also the ICS update is around the corner and it's supposed to have a faster browser. Considering it has the most well endowed ARM based processor available, hopefully there are no more potential antenna/software issues standing in the way of making this the smoothest tablet available.
 
-360/ps3/wii controller compatible.
-keyboard dock doubles as a screen protector, battery, mouse, sdcard reader, usb port.
-tegra 3 = good performance, better battery life.
-transformer is thinner/lighter.
-hdmi out, or remote desktop.
-good camera (8mp), with flash.
-file support. plays 1080p MKV's.
-IPS+ display
-ICS is coming.


I could go on...

Honestly, my only beef with it is the speaker placement and the micro sd cards stick out too far.

It's not just a keyboard. It's a keyboard and trackpad that, when connected, makes the transformer work just like a laptop. Plus the keyboard attachment has a battery, USB port, etc.
Oh shit.

Think Apple will go this route?

In the past before Asus entered the market I said the obvious, that there should be keyboard attachments. It'd be really awesome to have a macbook/iPad fusion to boot into iOS or OSX depending upon needs.

Same goes for future Windows 8 Tablets.

Not sure what full OS would make sense for Android tablets.
 
Or just a regular Transformer. I just got one; love it. Price will probably drop soon too.

In my opinion, Asus is easily the better company for the nerd who wants bang for their buck. I'll probably get the successor to the Prime.
 
Yeah, I think you're going to find a Transformer 1 a lot easier. My mom actually is getting one for xmas, nothing wrong with going that route. Asus will continue to support it. And I doubt she will really care for the extra performance and size.

Then again, moms might hate me when she actually sees my Prime next to her tablet.
 
Given I've had a Transformer w/ keyboard dock since launch, you shouldn't

Doesnt mean anything. Do you know what the vast majority of people actually use their computers for? Heres a hint, not much. Thats why a tablet PC will suffice as a primary computing device for so many people. Most people only use them for light stuff to begin with.

Does you wife actually want one of these crap tabs, or would she rather have an iPad, and you are just projecting your Apple hate at her expense?

Work on your subtlety man, jesus christ.
 
Fire is crap IMO.

Screen is garbage compared with Nook Tab or anything more expensive. Weak weak specs....made passable for the joe-6pack by Amazon optimization, barely.

Why get a fire why? There are two things going for it....Amazon prime streaming and price. Granted both are pretty big plusses, but IMO Netflix streaming on something else is better.

If you can stretch to a Transformer, how is this even a comparison? A thread should be...do I get a Kindle Fire with the crap hardware but Amazon streaming love...or do I get a stretch for Nook Tablet at the expense of the Amazon goodness?

Advice...get an ipad 2 if you must give one today (assuming this isn't an option for you?) or wrap up a card / picture of the Prime and say it was slightly delayed.
 
Web browsing and word processing is pretty much all I do.

You may be completely disconnected with how a great many people use computers (ie Facebook, email, browser). Nothing laughable at all. In fact most people buy far far more powerful PCs than they ever utilize with their limited needed functionality.

Doesnt mean anything. Do you know what the vast majority of people actually use their computers for? Heres a hint, not much. Thats why a tablet PC will suffice as a primary computing device for so many people. Most people only use them for light stuff to begin with.
I suppose I should have expected these responses. That's what I get for responding to an ambiguous statement with an even more ambiguous (and easy to construe as blanket) statement. Sorry for that. Let me detail where I'm coming from.

First off I am aware that for many people, their needs are actually pretty simple. It's mostly email, facebook, some browsing and some media consumption. I can respect that. Hell, I have some friends that have mostly relegated their computer usage to when at work and doing stuff like bills. The vast majority of their personal computing is done on their phone.

However the poster I was responding to stated 'main computing device. It's a bit ambiguous, but I take the connotation of 'computing' to mean things a bit more intensive. Yes it's semantics, but given the context of also mentioning more horsepower and the availability of a keyboard dock ... it appeared to me her wants were likely a bit more than the above sort of use-case. Obviously I made an assumption there ... and I'm not trying to excuse my lack of detail in the response ... just trying to explain where I was coming from when I initially replied.





So assuming the use-case is intended to be a bit more I do have general reservations with current tablet offerings. But given that this a thread is about the Transformer though, let me concentrate on where I think it has problems:

The Keyboard - It can be a nice addition in some situations, but I think the usefulness at its price is questionable. I can appreciate ASUS had constraints in order to engineer a solution that would work in its 'laptop' form-factor. There are obviously size limitations. However that doesn't change the fact it creates some real-world usability issues. By utilizing this form-factor they were relegated to a chicklet (island) style with limited travel. Some people are used to or can get used to it, but obviously it's not ideal for people that need to do a lot of typing. It's pretty easy to miss-hit or over-hit. And while the amount of travel is due to its sizing, Asus certainly could have produced something with better tactile response to help out things.

A bigger issue though is the general cramped layout it forces. Even though the touchpad is small (which presents its own problems), if I have a nickel for every time I unintentionally moved the cursor and started accidentally typing ... wherever ... I'd be retired. They really should turn off the mouse pad when typing like many netbooks and laptops offer. Maybe it wouldn't be so bad if you could adjust the sensitivity - but to my knowledge you can't. Instead I'm constantly turning off the touchpad, especially when posting online (a pretty common use-case for a tablet).

This brings up a more general complaint. While I applaud their attempts to make the OS act more like a laptop/netbook when the keyboard is docked, it's a bit half-baked. Why didn't they implement some sort of general cut/copy/paste hotkeys for when text is selected? Speaking of hotkeys, what they do offer is generally flaky. Sometimes they work, sometimes not. Actually most of the keyboard functionality can be seen in this light. Out of nowhere the top row function keys just stop working. It's this lack of refinement and features that make using the dock frustrating for anything more than casual use (and even then it can be annoying). Is it better than using the touch keyboard? Yes, at least when it's functioning properly. Does that really make it a good solution though? I'd say generally no. A better keyboard and functionality like in many netbooks or true laptops is the way to go if you think you'll be typing more than a little. If it worked better and was cheaper, I'd recommend it automatically, but it's kind of hard to given its realities. The extra battery and USB support does make it nice, but wouldn't it be preferable if the tablet itself simply had better battery life and USB?

Android Itself - Well, I knew what I was getting into. I didn't really buy this to replace anything ... more for convenience and tinkering ... but it's hard to not be concerned by how little things have really improved over time. Obviously I haven't had a chance to use Ice Cream Sandwich, and hopefully it rectifies some of the problems, but it's concerning that over a few Honeycomb iterations many of the well-known general problems still exist. Further, many issues with Android proper have remained over a much longer duration, making it hard to assume things will magically resolve any time soon.

There's the general UI itself. Whether you like it is subjective (I don't hate it, but it's not great either), but the fact it's generally laggy is simply something you have to live with. Given the amount of horsepower the Transformer (let alone the Prime) has, it's pretty disconcerting. I could accept this if things were actually polished though. But they aren't - far from it. The OS and many apps are flaky - in some cases, absurdly so.

The fact the browser is such a crash-happy mess after several iterations is ridiculous. I can almost accept it when rendering a gif-happy, memory hog of a page. The problem is that while that will almost assuredly cause issues, the thing regularly crashes for no obvious reason at all. I mostly use mine for gaf ... and it crashes ... a fucking lot ... on regular pages ... in a forum. Even then, I could almost get past that and my previous complaints about the keyboard's physical and functionality issues if typing in the browser wasn't such a laggy mess. The delay is so frustrating, I'm not sure what's better when typing online - the physical keyboard or the touch keyboard. Either way, it's so bad that I now much prefer using my WP7 phone for portable forum usage. A fucking phone - with a 4" screen. I don't know if Android 2.x phones are as bad. If they are, I feel bad for its users.

Of course then we move on to the marketplace. While some things have improved, it's still a fucking mess. Lot's of incompatible apps depending on your hardware, and a pretty terrible overall tablet-specific set of app offerings. Thank god they've finally offered an easier way to find tablet-specific apps - I don't want to even state how annoying things were before - but it's still a mess.

With all of this in mind, I simply find it near impossible to recommend an Android tablet over an iPad - even if I do love the concept of Transformer's form-factor. It tries ... but it just ain't there. Unfortunately for Asus, much of it is Google's fault even if they did bring in some problems of their own. Hopefully ICS and future updates rectify many of the OS-level performance issues. But even if they do, how long will people wait for a good catalog of tablet specific apps? Particularly more serious, larger-scale apps? What about production apps? The problem is these tablets aren't selling all that well. Stuff like Nook and Fire is what's selling on the Android front - but their size and typical use-case isn't going to draw those sorts of apps. They're more about consumption - basically glorified phone apps.






Summary - Sorry if this has turned into a serious tl;dr post. But since I was annoyingly brief and ambiguous in my initial post (and many responded in kind) ... I figure I should attempt to detail where I'm coming from.

If I had to do it again, I likely wouldn't have bought my Transformer and dock (especially at launch pricing). It simply isn't ready for primetime. Instead I should have waited to compare next year's Windows 8 netbooks/ultrabooks/tablets versus iPad 3. Actually I'll probably wait until the following year to see how the gen 2 Windows 8 offerings stack up (and maybe iPad 4). At that point they'll be a number of offerings with SoC's utilizing a smaller fabrication process (better battery life) as well as more pricing competition.


I'm not going to say Android is useless as a tablet OS. But given it's current state and trend, as well as dev support, I think it was a lot of weaknesses. Where I think it will work best is for smaller media consumption devices. 7"-8" tablets that specialize in specific use-cases. Stuff like Nook and Kindle Fire (once they get all the kinks out). For more serious duties though, I haven't seen anything to make me assume it will compete all that well versus iPad and W8 in the long run. It's behind - arguably far behind - and doesn't appear to be really gaining in many areas. If anything it seems to be losing ground for general tablet usage.
 
-360/ps3/wii controller compatible.
-keyboard dock doubles as a screen protector, battery, mouse, sdcard reader, usb port.
-tegra 3 = good performance, better battery life.
-transformer is thinner/lighter.
-hdmi out, or remote desktop.
-good camera (8mp), with flash.
-file support. plays 1080p MKV's.
-IPS+ display
-ICS is coming.


I could go on...

Honestly, my only beef with it is the speaker placement and the micro sd cards stick out too far.

Other than chip and SD slot, you could get a solid tablet in the Blackberry Playbook for $199 and be at basically the same place, worlds above the Fire, but honestly she'd hate that for reasons we'll never understand. In other words, give up. Not an 'iWhatever', you're just pretending to give a gift. Oh, except that there's much better devices out there, but ignore sanity, math and all that 'logic vs hype' jazz (marketing is so awesome).


BTW, thanks for spending the time to type that, Raistlin. Android is what it is, and a good first person perspective on anything like this is unusual to come by.
 
-360/ps3/wii controller compatible.
-keyboard dock doubles as a screen protector, battery, mouse, sdcard reader, usb port.
-tegra 3 = good performance, better battery life.
-transformer is thinner/lighter.
-hdmi out, or remote desktop.
-good camera (8mp), with flash.
-file support. plays 1080p MKV's.
-IPS+ display
-ICS is coming.


I could go on...

Honestly, my only beef with it is the speaker placement and the micro sd cards stick out too far.
While I agree with some of those, a few ... not so much.

Thinner/lighter? Do you honestly think many people are basing their purchase decision on a half millimeter of depth and a difference of 14 grams (14 paperclips)? I kind of doubt that small of a difference is entering peoples' minds.

Also the battery life is bullshit. Asus advertises '12 hours' but gives no mention of what's it's actually doing to reach that. The 10 hour claim for iPad on the other hand is for 'surfing the Web on Wi-Fi, watching video, or listening to music' ... and tests show it actually gets pretty close to that. Transformer Prime? Not so much. It's behind iPad 2 with a similar use-case, and even in power-saver mode.

While the new architecture in Kal-El has made some small improvements over Tegra 2 in this regard, it isn't quite what we were originally hoping. Originally the plan was to use a new fabrication process, but unfortunately there were delays at TSMC hitting usable yields. The production Tegra 3 is still sitting at Tegra 2's 40nm fab process unfortunately.







BTW, thanks for spending the time to type that, Raistlin. Android is what it is, and a good first person perspective on anything like this is unusual to come by.
No problem. I probably should have written something like that up anyway given what an advocate I was of the Transformer's feature-set and Android's openness in past threads.

Having gotten past the honeymoon and actually living with it for some time now, the real-world reality has changed my tune. Not that I'm saying alternatives are anywhere near perfect either (hell, W8 ain't even production-worthy) ... but my perspective has certainly changed on what use-cases I feel are best suited for the different platforms. Many of the things I thought would make the Transformer and Android better for certain situations just don't really live up to the promise in the light of day.
 
Apples and oranges. A $500+, top of the line device vs. a bare bones 1st gen, Android market-less tablet?

Hopefully you got what would appeal to her more.
 
I got a HTC Evo View 4G for $230. 1.5Ghz single core Snapdragon 32GB storage and a 7" screen. Two cameras for videochatting which is probably the most important thing about a tablet to me as I'm giving this to my grandparents to Skype them with. It's on Gingerbread, Honeycomb is supposed to be around the corner for it.
 
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