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Sonic 4 Ep 2 2 info revealed, New Physics Engine, new Graphics engine, playable Tails
- Thread starter ShadiWulf
- Start date
carbonbased
Member
brb gotta find my noose
I thought this was you for a second VJC
Diablohead
Member
sonic 4 concept art is like drawings sketched in the back of a maths book in school.
GreggTheGrimReaper
Member
Fuck Generation's physics.
Even Act 1's physics?
PeakPointMatrix
Member
Don't worry bro, I feel ya.
Sonic 4 is can be enjoyed for sure; but hyperbole GAF will have you believe it is the most unplayable pus spewing cyst in gaming. The controls are fine, visuals are okay, level design in competent. Nothing too spectacular at the end of the day, but not the cancerous abomination so many people love to label it as.
It's failings mainly come from claiming to be a classic Sonic sequel, and people are totally right to rail on the game for that. Inaccurate physics, homing attack, green eyes, etc. But on it's own the game itself is merely competent, albeit unfaithful to it's lineage. But not a shitty game. I'd love to see this game renamed to Sonic HD to alleviate some of the pressures of following up S3&K. Although yeah, stuff like the moonwalking and standing on walls should disappear for sure, even though you need to go out of your way to trigger it at times.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
Its basically the same reaction I had in real life to reading that post, so you're more right then you know.
The rolling physics were still atrocious, and there was a lot of scripting to fake physics. They still have a lot of room for improvement, no reason to settle.
GreggTheGrimReaper
Member
It might be because of input lag or something like that (other 2d games don't make any problems though) but Sonic feels unresponsive. I can't put my finger on it but the physics always felt strange from the beginning and through the whole game.
DICKS AHOY
Banned
The rolling was the only thing that bothered me, and even then there's only a handful of situations where it feels like rolling will help you out but instead you slow down and get hit (there's a big slope in Rooftop Run where you either have to stop and spindash or know before hand to jump over a long row of badniks since rolling won't get you through all of them). Everything else like the Spindash on STEROIDS and different bouncing mechanics were fine since the levels were genuinely built around those quirks, and the scripted hills are so unnoticeable I didn't even see it noted until people started hacking the PC-version.
I mean they weren't perfect by any means but you seem to be exaggerating how bad Generations' were and ignoring that in Generations those physics more often than not feel perfectly fine, as opposed to S4's where boosters and the homing attack just seemed to be there to make the game semi-playable with Rush's physics. Though I'll agree I'd prefer something closer to the older games physics than Generations in Episode 2, but Generations was billing itself more as a 'remix' of old stages than a sequel in the first place. It can sort of get away with being a bit different.
Also new badnik designs instead of Episode 1's rehashes (though in comparison to series like Mario which will always have goombas and similar cases, it wasn't too big a deal for me) make me
The prospect of a re-skinned Marble Garden makes me D: (though damn if that level didn't have a nice tune)
nintendoman58
Member
I honestly don't see what the big deal about rolling is. I mean, sure it's screwed up, but it's not like we use it often. I only used rolling for Casino Night Zone when you have that huge half-pipe to get over.
DICKS AHOY
Banned
It's used a ton in Sonic 1 and CD, and if you're familiar with a level in any of the original games then it's usually a more ideal way to build up speed since you have to slow down to a halt to spindash (which isn't as much of an issue in Generations since you can use the Spindash without being perfectly still). Plus in tight quarters it can be a safer alternative to trying to jump on an enemy.
TheCongressman1
Member
Found a tidbit over at Sonic Retro, seems we have a piece of a screenshot:
The banner on the top shows what look to be the pillar designs of Aquatic Ruin zone.
The banner on the top shows what look to be the pillar designs of Aquatic Ruin zone.
TheCongressman1
Member
...What dimension did you escape from man? In this dimension, Sonic 4: Episode I is only praised because it's attempt at nostalgia. It fails in nearly every way as a good platforming game, a good Sonic game, and especially a throwback to the 16-bit games.
Perhaps you should have showed us this super version of the game.
Aaron Strife
Banned
So they're re-using zone tropes again.
Guessing Aquatic Ruin will be the intro zone.
Guessing Aquatic Ruin will be the intro zone.
My bad, I forgot that in this dimension people aren't allowed to have their own opinions. >_>...What dimension did you escape from man? In this dimension, Sonic 4: Episode I is only praised because it's attempt at nostalgia. It fails in nearly every way as a good platforming game, a good Sonic game, and especially a throwback to the 16-bit games.
Perhaps you should have showed us this super version of the game.
But seriously, I don't see how it fails to be good platformer. It may be a different type of Sonic game than your used to, but being different doesn't equal bad.
The funny thing is, I said that I prefer newer Sonic games over classic Sonic games in the controversial video game opinions thread, and no one said anything at all. But when I say the same thing in a thread full of Sonic fans (classic Sonic fans, rather), the shit hits the fan.
Azure Dream
Member
No. That statement may work for the Sonic CD fans, but it doesn't work here.
Sonic 4 is not a "different type" of Sonic game. It is simply a bad implementation of existing mechanics and concepts. The game is supposed to be classically-structured, and with the exception of each act having a specific gimmick focus (some more obvious than others), it doesn't do much outside that.
TheCongressman1
Member
There are many reasons it's a mediocre platformer, but what's more is that it's a bad Sonic game. It's not so much that it's kind of janky, but because it's not what Classic Sonic gameplay should be, which is what was promised.
That's not funny, that's just how it is. What do you expect? There is a large concentration of people with the oposite of your opinion. You liked it, and that's fine, but if you are going to come and post about it don't expect us to keep quite. This is place for discussion after all.
The gimmicks were overbearing and out of place, too. In the classic games, level gimmicks were more organically ingrained into the level design and not overused, (though I still don't understand the weird pulley lift things in Mushroom Hill). Sonic 4 is like "HOLY CRAP THIS LEVEL IS ABOUT SWINGING ON VINES HERE ARE A BUNCH OF VINES FLOATING IN MID AIR!!!" "THIS LEVEL IS ABOUT CANNONS HOLY CRAP LOOK AT ALL THESE CANNONS DON'T LET GO OF THE D-PAD!" "TORCH LOL!"
Azure Dream
Member
I actually liked the torch, other than the one puzzle later on that was a bit awkward to do. Considering the level it replaced (minecart.gif), I do chalk that up to an improvement.
I have of course repressed the level that was themed entirely around a giant crushing wall.
I have of course repressed the level that was themed entirely around a giant crushing wall.
There were 2 of those.
You can have your own opinion, man. It's not like I'm gonna dropkick you for it. :3
One big thing for platformers, to me, is how the core mechanics work. The mechanics for Sonic 4 seem awfully hollow, devoid of any sense of true precision and weight. There's no momentum in the game, either, which is a big issue for a Sonic game.
And there's nothing wrong with liking some elements in newer Sonic's over older ones. I think the 'GOTTA GO FAST BOOST TO WIN' stuff in Unleashed, Colors, and Generations is very good. Level design is lacking, and I think a number of the games can occasionally have weak design decisions (the awful way you get Chaos Emeralds in the Advance games for one) but they're not awful all the time.
The key issue with Sonic 4 is as a platformer, it doesn't hit any of the sweet spots you get in other platformers. There's no sense of weight when jumping, bouncing off of things feels too loose, and other things really make the inner workings of the game seem poorly strung together. None of it is polished and done well, making the game feel incredibly unfinished.
Azure Dream
Member
I just (don't) remember Act 3 of Mad Gear.
Edit: Ah, right, Lost Labyrinth Act 3. But that just ends with a crushing wall, it's not entirely themed around one.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
I shouldn't be getting on your case for personal preference like this, but yeah, it is necessarily a bad thing, given the intent of Sonic 4. Sonic 4 is a retro throwback; it's meant to recapture the spirit of the Sega Genesis games. Everything about the game was constructed towards this goal.
Which is why it's objectively a failure, because it completely halfasses just about everything. It was made by a team who seemingly did not want to understand the "right way" to do things (in the sense they adapted gameplay concepts in completely the wrong way).
But... everything from Episode 1 is just ripped out of a Sega Genesis game. It can be the best copy in the world, but it's still just a copy, and in Sonic 4's case, it's not even a very good copy.
It's like you're saying freeze-dried instant potatoes are better than the real thing.
I will say one thing, I'm not hung up on the physics as much as the hardcore Genesis fans. Yeah, they're important to some extent. But they don't really make or break the game for me. For instance, I loved Classic Sonic in Generations even though the physics were off.
My biggest problem with Sonic 4 (Episode I anyway) is how lazy and cheap everything about it is, not just the physics. It's suppose to be a sequel to the classics, yet it rips level tropes, level gimmicks, badniks, boss fights, special stages, and even the frigging title screen straight from the old games. Like one big nostaglia cash-in. That and the completely uninspiring level design/music just killed it for me. I guess Sega was trying to follow in NSMB's footsteps. Ugh.
I already got my nostaglia fix from Generations, and that game actually had good level design and stuff. I want new things from Sonic 4. Unfortunately though, the logo pic and concept art makes it seem like Episode II will be another lazy trip down memory lane. If that's the case, then I'll be skipping it again.
My biggest problem with Sonic 4 (Episode I anyway) is how lazy and cheap everything about it is, not just the physics. It's suppose to be a sequel to the classics, yet it rips level tropes, level gimmicks, badniks, boss fights, special stages, and even the frigging title screen straight from the old games. Like one big nostaglia cash-in. That and the completely uninspiring level design/music just killed it for me. I guess Sega was trying to follow in NSMB's footsteps. Ugh.
I already got my nostaglia fix from Generations, and that game actually had good level design and stuff. I want new things from Sonic 4. Unfortunately though, the logo pic and concept art makes it seem like Episode II will be another lazy trip down memory lane. If that's the case, then I'll be skipping it again.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
You are absolutely allowed to have your own opinion. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
For example, I don't mind the Modern Sonic games from Unleashed onwards. I think parts of them are nice (particularly because the most recent games don't emphasize boosting all the time), the art direction and lighting are fantastic, and they're just really fun to play. I know a lot of other people don't feel the same way, of course.
The problems I have with Sonic 4, however, are that: I dislike the aesthetics a lot, it seems as though it's supposed to be more of something that was designed to evoke nostalgia rather than being an actual "game" (and imo, with those aesthetics, I don't think it did that well), and the level design was boring. Personally, I didn't find the game very fun.
A lot of other people covered why the gameplay in terms of moving forward and gaining momentum doesn't feel right at all (and given that most of Sonic 4's level art direction was very similar to the art direction in the Genesis Sonic games, the gameplay part of the game felt like it should have been similar as well).
PeakPointMatrix
Member
Yep, those are badnicks.
(neo underwater stage?)
(neo underwater stage?)
Ahoi-Brause
Banned
And the worst part is that it's even more outdated now, while the original has stayed timeless.
Mama Robotnik
Member
Aren't they the Aqua Lake Zone and Gimmick Mt. bosses?
Infernal Monkey
Member
Same base creatures, but the designs are completely different.
Plus, no one at Sega remembers that the 8-bit games exist.
Mama Robotnik
Member
http://uk.gamespot.com/sonic-the-hedgehog-4-episode-1/previews/sonic-the-hedgehog-qanda-6216990/
Only when they want something to hate on. The charming "Sonic Chaos" the worst ever Sonic game? Stop talking shite Sega!
I don't think Sonic 4 Episode 2 is an Iizuka-san game like Sonic Generations was, he just gets his name slapped on it since hes in such a high position at Sonic Team.
Yeah the worthog reminds me of the Gimmick Mountain boss, while the walrus reminds me of the Aqua Lake boss...which was a robot walrus! (Can't believe I still remember the names of those zones after all these years)
:O Sonic 4: episode 2 is a Sonic 2 8-bit remake?
Edit: Beaten like you wouldn't believe! What I get for posting at work in between patient runs! >_<
TheCongressman1
Member
First thing that came to mind.
Hmm, doesn't really feel Sonic-y. That's not surprising though.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
^That's exactly what I thought of too.
lol, I still can't believe that they think releasing concept art is a good idea of marketing and building up interest in the fanbase for this game.
Er, not that there's a lot of interest in this game in the first place, but still...
lol, I still can't believe that they think releasing concept art is a good idea of marketing and building up interest in the fanbase for this game.
Er, not that there's a lot of interest in this game in the first place, but still...
PeakPointMatrix
Member
Fight the
ower!
fl