Razgriz-Specter
Member
Resident Evil 5 was an amazing game IF you played co-op on Professional.
Halo ODST tied with CE are the best Halo games.
Halo ODST tied with CE are the best Halo games.
Raise the flame shield: Your "controversial" gaming opinion.
- Thread starter Laughing Banana
- Start date
Fimbulvetr
Member
Because it had great gameplay?MesserWolf said:
Riposte
Member
I don't think Bayonetta is sexy, but calling the protagonist of Heavenly Sword sexy... lol.
Can't fathom that. Bring it down to something more understandable: How were the facial animations??
Can't fathom that. Bring it down to something more understandable: How were the facial animations??
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
I'd agree with a lot of this. I wasn't a big fan of the MP gameplay, but more importantly I thought the maps sucked compared to what we had in previous games. Online Halo 2 Maps >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Halo 3 Maps. Since maps mean so much in a MP shooter that kind of killed Halo 3 for me.
Rahxephon91
Banned
I guess Heavenly Sword had good face animation. Too bad the game is quite ugly outside of that. It also runs pretty terribly. Lets not speak about the gameplay.
I do like that the criticisms for Bayonetta are never it's gameplay. Just that the female character looks bad and is silly. But then again setting, tone, and subject matter can turn someone off. I'm sure Kingdom of Amalur is a good game, but it's seemingly generic fantasy setting is just a huge turn off. If it was the same game, but with SMT-esque visuals in a cyberpunk world I would be so much more interested.
I do like that the criticisms for Bayonetta are never it's gameplay. Just that the female character looks bad and is silly. But then again setting, tone, and subject matter can turn someone off. I'm sure Kingdom of Amalur is a good game, but it's seemingly generic fantasy setting is just a huge turn off. If it was the same game, but with SMT-esque visuals in a cyberpunk world I would be so much more interested.
AcceptableGhost
Member
I will simply repeat what I said earlier.
People who like the game Bayonetta (atleast the hardcore action-game fan, which Bayonetta is pretty much a love letter to) mostly don't give a shit about what/who the main character is. Bayonetta the character could be replaced with Tofu from Resident Evil and it would still be one of the best games released this gen.
That was merely infuriating.
perfectnight
Banned
Bayonetta is a game that rewards its players via instant gratification in the form of easily performed combos. The enemies have brain dead AI and are in the world for the sole purpose of being punching bags whom you can unload your combos on. Of course this changes as you amp up the difficulty, but not by much. The game is still at its core about watching your character spaz out on retarded AI. I think that spending more than 20 minutes coming up with combos in a game like this is a complete waste of time and I'd rather play a game where the enemy can actually fight back (see: fighting games or even just Ninja Gaiden which is an AI puzzle game). This (and things like the awful mini games, cut scenes, art, etc) is the reason why Bayonetta is boring as fuck.
Man I hope you don't like GoW
Bayonetta definitely does have some braindead enemies (though nowhere near as bad as DMC3 on this front) and shitty minigames. It still seems like a great game to me, but one that I wish I could have started on Hard mode.
Overall, I think the best 3D action games of this gen and last gen (DMCs, Ninja Gaidens, Bayonetta, God Hand) are great, but I don't think they're as good (or as skill-based) as the best arcade belt scroll games. I guess that might be a controversial opinion.
Overall, I think the best 3D action games of this gen and last gen (DMCs, Ninja Gaidens, Bayonetta, God Hand) are great, but I don't think they're as good (or as skill-based) as the best arcade belt scroll games. I guess that might be a controversial opinion.
Rahxephon91
Banned
I never claimed Bayo to be anything. Just that most criticisms are never about the gameplay, which is true. Obviously you have actual criticisms. But I don't care, because the game you are describing isn't what I played. I find it hard to argue when a key part seems to be the person did not find the game challenging and thus the game is not good. I know I found Bayo challenging and so for me I did not find it to be a waste if using different combos in fighting enemies that were dumb. So this is a useless argument, better served by someone who understands the game better then me. Sure it is a combo heavy and isn't played like Ninja Gaiden, which is an obviously more defensive game. But I sure didn't find it boring thanks to carful timing of witch time and use of combos as I try to kill the enemy the fastest and most effective way possible and for that reason I did not find learning the combos to be a waste. But you obviously did and well whatever.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
The Sheva ledge part at the end was, but that was about it imo.
Whenever your buddy screwed up, pretty much, for my part.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
The Jill part we failed frustratingly 2 times, we just said screw it started using magnums.. became fun again.
Riposte
Member
My experience with Bayonetta, at least on the harder difficulties (which I see everyone agreeing is where the game reaches to meets its lofty reputation), is that enemies are not punching bags who stay in hit-stun all day. They'll usually snap out of it and put on some hyper armor to interrupt you (assuming their friends don't). This bit of difficulty ends up making dodge offset matter. Maybe I'm remembering something wrong? I doubt it. Calling the AI dumb doesn't really phase me, but I have to admit Ninja Gaiden may have the best (rival) boss battles in the business because of exceptional enemy patterns.
How much do you feel that has to do with how challenges are structured in terms of modern "console" design vs arcade design?
In any case that's (EDIT: belt-scrolling vs 3D action) always a hard comparison for me to make. I have this idea in my head concerning how depth scales as games become wildly more complex. I can't really word it well, but basically the less tighter designs of 3D games are able to be equally or almost as fun as the older classics because less optimal mechanics are not equally meaningless (e.g. a completely shitty move vs a very situational move, not to bring in stuff like colors and cutscenes into this), which helps cover some of the distance. I certainly don't mean to say meaningless complexity can just overcome a (steep) lack of depth. Sounds dumb when I type it out and read it, but that's what I got lol. Hopefully this isn't some petty bias unknowingly peeking its head. I will say I find that difficulty matters way, way more in 2D action games than they do in vast strategy games (polar opposites in sheer complexity), which gave them this idea to begin with.
How much do you feel that has to do with how challenges are structured in terms of modern "console" design vs arcade design?
In any case that's (EDIT: belt-scrolling vs 3D action) always a hard comparison for me to make. I have this idea in my head concerning how depth scales as games become wildly more complex. I can't really word it well, but basically the less tighter designs of 3D games are able to be equally or almost as fun as the older classics because less optimal mechanics are not equally meaningless (e.g. a completely shitty move vs a very situational move, not to bring in stuff like colors and cutscenes into this), which helps cover some of the distance. I certainly don't mean to say meaningless complexity can just overcome a (steep) lack of depth. Sounds dumb when I type it out and read it, but that's what I got lol. Hopefully this isn't some petty bias unknowingly peeking its head. I will say I find that difficulty matters way, way more in 2D action games than they do in vast strategy games (polar opposites in sheer complexity), which gave them this idea to begin with.
Dr Frasier Crane
Member
Halo ODST is the best Halo by a mile.
Every Final Fantasy pales in comparison to FF12.
Burnout 2 is the best in the series and the takedown element has sent the series downhill ever since.
Every Final Fantasy pales in comparison to FF12.
Burnout 2 is the best in the series and the takedown element has sent the series downhill ever since.
Tarin02543
Member
In regards to Deus Ex Revelations
I totally agree! The dumbest game I've ever bought, and not dumb as in funny dumb.
I totally agree! The dumbest game I've ever bought, and not dumb as in funny dumb.
I enjoyed it a lot, but I probably couldn't really explain WHY I thought it great. Probably because game design wise... it STILL had much of what made FF FF to me, like the side quests and (broken) customization. I may not even like it as much now, half because of how it aged, and I may've liked it in the first partially because of lowered expectations, but as a result I'll defend it as not being one of the worst games ever. Well, and I played FFII, it's hard to take any "worst FF EVER" statement seriously unless it involves that and, going by most accounts, FFXIV.
I don't think this really goes into OPINIONS though. The first is wrong, I believe, purely because of Sega's own screwed up issues, the loss of at least one key individual, and the PS2's undeniable clout. At best looking ahead to the GC and Xbox made Sega decide they really didn't stand a chance when they may have otherwise kept fighting, and even then the GC would've probably been enough to scare them out. As for Halo, well, I see that more as a FACT given Microsoft wanted them for a Xbox killer app in the first place, at worst you would've gotten the same (or at least very similar) FPS for Mac then PC rather than on Xbox, with maybe PS2/GC ports much like Oni getting ported to PS2.
That would be your OPINION
Fact? Really? If Microsoft hadn't got involved with Bungie we'd have ended up with exactly the same halo but on Macs and PC. I don't think so.
Well I only thought HS was average for the time period it came out in, despite the impressive advances in voice acting and animation. But pretty much everything is better than Bayonetta. I still can't play that because it's so insulting as a game that I feel like a giant piece of dumb shit when I play it. Like that game is one of the games non gamers would point to as to why this industry is still so juvenile.
People like it though because of the fighting game style combat. If you can pull off ridiculous combos with 15 button inputs then that's all you need to make it a good game to those people.
Prophet Steve
Member
Uh, yeah sure. Bayonetta is something you need to take not seriously. The game looks from a game design perspective so much better than Heavenly Sword, although I must admit I have not played that game.
The game is very rewarding, full with things to unlock, powerful weapons you get with effort, skins. The difficulty is great. The fighting system most likely blows that of Heavenly Sword out of the water, by offering a fight system that is very deep and hard to master. Not because you can get great combo's, even though the "stylish action" is also an appealing aspect of the game.
I can understand the game is very polarising, because of the art, main character and music, but the fighting system and game design seems way ahead of Heavenly Sword.
First person > third. I can't think of any game I've looked at and thought "fuck yeah, its in 3rd person, now I can see what my back looks like all the time". 3rd person is awful, there's a lot of detail and minutiae that's missed when you're in 3rd as opposed to 1st. 1st brings you into your characters head, to see what he sees and provides for a more absorbing experience. It's unfortunate that I can't see what my character looks like when he rolls about on the floor, but I can live without that.
Riposte
Member
The videogame part of a videogame is pretty unimportant when I'm trying to not look juvenile in front of totally mature non-gamers peers. Looks like I'll have to find better means to prove to other people I'm not a child, after all you wouldn't be able to tell naturally. This is extremely important to me.
EDIT: Currently trying to think up of sentence to end this post with that explicitly shows games make me feel like a dumb piece of shit when I play them and I hardly understand them.
EDIT: Currently trying to think up of sentence to end this post with that explicitly shows games make me feel like a dumb piece of shit when I play them and I hardly understand them.
More like I'm going off the top of my head. Losing a major investor WOULD make you stop and reconsider if you can really keep going like you did, nevermind the US/Japan fights that left them weaker than a better organized company like Nintendo.
I was saying (or trying to say anyway) you were absolutely right, and if Microsoft weren't involved we either would've seen that game, though it's possible they may've come to the conclusion to just make an FPS anyway at some point and stuck with that even if it weren't to be a console game, FPSes WERE a big deal in the late 90s on PC and they made one of the biggest earlier ones in the Marathon series. Doesn't help I seem to always remember it being a shooter from when I first heard about it in PCXL.
That's really more about gametype though, isn't it? Unless this statement really is only meant for games like Gears of War and not, say, God of War or something, in which case... Nah, I see a point because of needing to duck behind cover and see what's past the cover, though one of the originators of that design (RE4) could plausibly have been fully first person with little difference (assuming cutscenes and maybe key QTEs were third person).
Prophet Steve
Member
Well, although I have played Bayonetta in front of an audience with other tastes, it is not something you have to do. It is a (very) Japanese game and I assume you find the game juvenile because it is so sexualized, but in Japan they seem to be acceptable to that.
Calling the game worse than Heavenly Sword on almost every front, because you think it's juvenile, shows that you are biased and haven't given it much thought.
Riposte
Member
I see you haven't given this page much thought or time.
Prophet Steve
Member
Oh wow, a different person, my apologies.
The biggest problem with Bayonetta is it requires you to actually understand the game mechanics, make use of the tools provided and lessons learned, and apply your own skill, judgement and flair to an increasingly spectacular and challenging series of situations.
I mean, what the fuck? Haven't games advanced at all since the 16-bit days?
I mean, what the fuck? Haven't games advanced at all since the 16-bit days?
It's not like I'm afraid of playing certain games in front of other people. I wouldn't hesitate playing god of war (I'd just avoid the sex parts) or Gears in front of people. But my patience for inane dumb shit has limits and Bayonetta passed it in about 30 minutes, even with the supposedly good gameplay.
I just care about playing the game however the developer balanced it. If, like say with RTS, they designed the game with the assumption that you have a 360 degree view of your surroundings, then that's how I want to play.
MesserWolf
Member
Exactly .
I would add that I'm aware of the limits of Heavenly sword, it isn't a masterpiece for sure, I'm just saying that despite those limits, the end product was pretty enjoyable and even very good under specific aspects.
I would take HS over Bayonetta every single day. The story & the setting in HS was pretty good, a masterpiece if compared to the latter. But of course to each his own taste.
what's so funny ? do you think she is ugly ?
Weskerlover
Member
Okey here we go:
- Kingdom Hearts gameplay is broken beyond believe. Concept etc. is very,very cool though!
- Mass Effect is, indeed, a tech demo compared to Mass Effect 2.
- The first Roller Coaster Tycoon is one of the best games ever made.
- Resident Evil 5, I finished the game on co-op, is a really medicore game. I never really enjoyed it.
That is it for now!
- Kingdom Hearts gameplay is broken beyond believe. Concept etc. is very,very cool though!
- Mass Effect is, indeed, a tech demo compared to Mass Effect 2.
- The first Roller Coaster Tycoon is one of the best games ever made.
- Resident Evil 5, I finished the game on co-op, is a really medicore game. I never really enjoyed it.
That is it for now!
That's actually a pretty good description now that I think about it, even though I had no idea who that was back when I played HS.
perfectnight
Banned
Aw I wanted to hate you and your opinions but you av makes it impossible for me to do so. I will say that I don't believe the point of KH's combat is to be balanced or even non-broken. They just wanted you to do the things that anime kids.. do. Like flying and shooting shit from their eyeballs and whatnot.
I thought this was a fact?
Even I could believe this depending what you mean by that. If you're talking in tech terms, then yeah. ME1 was ambitious and Bioware's first game this gen, it didn't run well on 360 at all. The engine was a mess.
But in terms of gameplay? It's far more ambitious than ME2.
Weskerlover
Member
Yep. That is what I mean. ME1 was very ambitious and the gameplay concept was pretty unique imo. I enjoyed the game but the engine was bad and ruined the experience for a significant part!
Weskerlover
Member
I know he is so cute! The opinions are meant to be controversial so no room for hate in this thread
But you might be right about that!
Oppo
Member
Ok here's mine:
After reading years worth of arguments, I'm quite convinced that the rabid proponents of asymmetrical sticks are crazy. There's no good reason for it other than to not look like Sony or Nintendo.
To each his/her own, it's not a big deal, but I think people who consider asymmetrical analog stick placement to not just be OK, but actually superior, are really just big Xbox fans. I've read countless justifications for it and none of them make any sense to me at all. Not the Dreamcast argument, not the FPS argument, none of it.
No trouble switching between the two myself, but the 360 controller always feels weird because of those sticks. And people get really defensive about it for some reason.
After reading years worth of arguments, I'm quite convinced that the rabid proponents of asymmetrical sticks are crazy. There's no good reason for it other than to not look like Sony or Nintendo.
To each his/her own, it's not a big deal, but I think people who consider asymmetrical analog stick placement to not just be OK, but actually superior, are really just big Xbox fans. I've read countless justifications for it and none of them make any sense to me at all. Not the Dreamcast argument, not the FPS argument, none of it.
No trouble switching between the two myself, but the 360 controller always feels weird because of those sticks. And people get really defensive about it for some reason.
But my arms naturally behave like spaghetti, so being able to have one arm resting on a shoe and the other arm on my dogs face feels so right to me.
Oh wow, i read that wrong. LOOK over there at THAT
LOOK AT THAT, NOT THIS
Phonomezer
Banned
No, we wouldn't have Sega hardware because they ran out of the means to create, support, distribute, etc.
Nobody would've given a shit about Halo if it was on the Mac.
Agreed. RE 5 is much more fun on Veteran, and certain parts of RE 5 Professional are actually easier played solo like the boss battles in 2-3 and 5-3.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Correctomundo said:
What I like about FF8:
* Excellent battle system once you get past the need to "farm" magic off the first wave of new enemies as they appear. So much of the fun is juggling stats to get the optimum effect.
* The addition of the "refine" options based on GF's and card acquisition is a brilliant touch to mitigate the farming grind later on. The stats side of the battle system is a massive improvement over the clunky materia system in FF7.
* Speaking of cards, Triple Triad is brilliant little game in its own right. The way it interfaces with the main game makes it even better.
* The "love" theme that runs throughout the game isn't always entirely successful, but it has some genuinely affecting moments. Winhill with its fleeting ghosts and air of gentle melancholy is one of the most memorable locations in any game I've ever played.
* Overall the world is very well designed, with lots of interesting and distinctive locations; Fisherman's Horizon is unique, and I found a genuine wow factor at the time when the futuristic metropolis of Esthar is revealed.
* Exploring the map was rewarding too, the voice of Obel lake hints at a world with real history, the islands closest to heaven/hell offer a real tough battle workout, the omega ruins is a kick-ass extra dungeon... etc.
* I also happen to think FF8 has the best end-dungeon in any FF game, everything following the time compression boss-fights with its melting worlds through Ultimecia's gothic castle is solid gold.
* Bottom line, I like the story and the characters a great deal. I love the idea that the price of junctioning a GF involves memory loss; yes its a contrivance that sets up FF8's equivalent of 7's "can't get off the train we're on" moment but it fits so well thematically (the storyline is filled with echoes of the past, as might be expected from a tale where time-travel plays such a major role) that it simply works in my opinion.
FF8 is a truly great game. The fact that some people place derivative drivel like FF9 above it disappoints me greatly.
Reading the last couple of pages, I guess my controversial opinion is that both supporters and detractors of Bayonetta are right. The gameplay was great and it was a thrill to get a really well flowing combo going, but the characterizations and story were hammy and increasingly embarrassing (though less so than Vanquish, Platinum really needs to get their act together for future games). The game also dragged on quite heavily and refighting the bosses was annoying. However, given all this, the sheer joy of when it did get it right makes it one of the top games of two years ago for me.
Correct.