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[Salazar]

They're niche, at best.

It's exceptionally clear to the folks in charge that they're not going to supplant or even markedly unsettle American popular music. But performing on major American tv shows is an opportunity for exposure that it would be obtuse to turn down.

A whole lot of people in countries that aren't the US watched those performances, in any case.

 

[Tenck]

Tiff at the beginning of this...melts my heart.

Soo Young also has great legs :3

 

[SmokyDave]

Calm your Daily Star PHWOAR instincts, Dave.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAIUNSTH9HI

Consider me appreciatively pacified.

 

[Xilium]

On the whole, there is virtually no appeal for North Americans. I question why they're even bothering performing here. The whole girl band gimmick reeks of the 1990s, complete with the choreographed dancing.

Did boy/girl groups ever actually become unpopular in the west? There was always the detractors that made fun of them all throughout the 90's but I always thought the primary issue with boy/girl groups was that if they became really successful, after their contract was finished, the lead singer would inevitably bail out and go solo. The group would die without their lead singer and, more often than not, the lead singer wouldn't go very far without the group.

I just assumed that because groups had a tendency to break up upon reaching the height of success, record labels just gave up in trying to make it work. The Korean music industry seems to not have that issue (I hear the contracts there are pretty long and binding).

 

[GrizzNKev]

Making this English ruined it, and them. That's all there is to it.

 

[Salazar]

Consider me appreciatively pacified.

That performance wouldn't ordinarily fly.

There's a government department for the promotion of patriotic and family virtues that straight up censors Kpop, occasionally to the point of absurdity. Which is in part why people who describe it as hyper-sexed in its appeal are probably unfamiliar with the way it goes about 75% of the time.

 

[Rice-Eater]

Why are there so many of them? Being Asian already hurts them(although being a hot Asian female is better than a attractive Asian male), but the group having so many members would probably make them look like more of a joke to America and the rest of the west. 3-5 is cool, but 8? Does everybody even have a role or is it just a couple of lead singers while the rest are there to just look good?

I admire them for trying but Asians making a real break through in the American entertainment industry is slim to none.

 

[Finaika]

Why are there so many of them? Being Asian already hurts them(although being a hot Asian female is better than a attractive Asian male), but the group having so many members would probably make them look like more of a joke to America and the rest of the west. 3-5 is cool, but 8? Does everybody even have a role or is it just a couple of lead singers while the rest are there to just look good?

I admire them for trying but Asians making a real break through in the American entertainment industry is slim to none.

More legs to ogle at.

 

[Salazar]

Does everybody even have a role

Yeah. If you watch the variety shows and interviews and stuff - which is really almost the bulk of their entertainment work, then you start to get what each one offers. That's something that they can't offer a foreign audience that consumes music in a more discrete (less linked up with tv shows) way. It's the chemistry and interaction between different personalities in the group that makes the tv appearances funny and interesting and sweet. 9 members is a lot, but if you approach the entertainment as the package it was initially designed to be, then it sort of works.

That package won't travel to a mass audience, and the execs aren't kidding themselves that it will. Hence the (somewhat misjudged) emphasis on American production. To compensate.

 

[Xilium]

Why are there so many of them? Being Asian already hurts them(although being a hot Asian female is better than a attractive Asian male), but the group having so many members would probably make them look like more of a joke to America and the rest of the west. 3-5 is cool, but 8?

The Pussycat Dolls did alright for a while...until the lead singer left. As long as the music is good/catchy, I really don't think people care that much about group size.

 

[ramyeon]

Why are there so many of them? Being Asian already hurts them(although being a hot Asian female is better than a attractive Asian male), but the group having so many members would probably make them look like more of a joke to America and the rest of the west. 3-5 is cool, but 8? Does everybody even have a role or is it just a couple of lead singers while the rest are there to just look good?

I admire them for trying but Asians making a real break through in the American entertainment industry is slim to none.

Because with 9 different personalities, types of girls and looks there's bound to be at least one that appeals to everyone.

It's interesting that people are calling them soulless or whatever, because a lot of what draws fans into these girls is their personalities and appearances on TV outside of music shows. I guess that is something that probably won't translate into their American career (If it actually gets anywhere).

 

[TurtleSnatcher]

Their first single here should have been 'Run Devil Run'

 

[M.J. Doja]

My comments:
Hot girls, I can see where the obsession comes from. These girls are basically lifers, trained from kids to perform and be looked at, they've got the moves and the appeal, all you need is a shred of talent when you have that together.
Their personalities and appeal account for a high percentage of why people obsess over them. Dudes seriously think "man I wish i had a girl like that" (I dont blame you though), and girls just want to be them.
Manufactured pop groups were always annoying but it's just eye candy.
"youre a hater" defense and tumblr pics are starting to annoy me.
its a SHAME that Teddy Riley produced The Boys, hes one of my all time faves, and it did nothing for me, tuned it out after a bit. that Rania song was a lot better.
I really wish a lot of pop music around the world was just better somehow, the quality has gone way down.
I'm really not into techno-pop or bubblegum in general these days, so I'm definitely not the audience.
Disappointed that I didnt like the song, since I used to be a lot more receptive to older K-pop, as far as asian music goes theirs sounds the most soulful to me.
Hot hot hot girls though.
Pop/Idol obsession in any country is weird.

So many logical jumps in this thread, not even worth listing all of them. I can't watch these videos if the songs arent catchier though, dammit.

 

[Kusagari]

The Pussycat Dolls did alright for a while...until the lead singer left. As long as the music is good/catchy, I really don't think people care that much about group size.

As you said though, Pussycat Dolls weren't so much the Pussycat Dolls as they were Nicole and these other chicks. It was the same thing with Beyonce and Destiny's Child. If there's a girl group in America, the media needs to anoint one female as the only one that matters.

 

[Salazar]

"youre a hater" defense and tumblr pics are starting to annoy me.

We're trying to do better than that. Some of it ain't worth responding to, to be fair.

I can't watch these videos if the songs arent catchier though, dammit.

T-ara basically dominated the last year. Catchier than The Boys.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-midICbtOE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzB6PZ-m6Y4

 

[G-Fex]

Mr. Taxi is a catchy song

 

[lenovox1]

As you said though, Pussycat Dolls weren't so much the Pussycat Dolls as they were Nicole and these other chicks. It was the same thing with Beyonce and Destiny's Child. If there's a girl group in America, the media needs to anoint one female as the only one that matters.

En Vogue? TLC? Spice Girls? Danity Kane (not even in the same league as the other three, but they're the only mildly successful "recent" ones I could think of)? While you're generally right, this K-Pop thing is bleeding into mainstream popular culture (thanks, Internet!). There's no reason that they can't break into the US with their current model.

 

[Salazar]

Mr. Taxi is a catchy song

Those outfits tho. Regis would have been a broken man.

 

[Ferga]

All the hate!!!

 

[cityhunter]

Soo Young also has great legs :3

/high five

 

[questionmark]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-midICbtOE

I see what you did there Sal, very clever.

 

[Salazar]

I see what you did there Sal, very clever.

#Be strong for Hwayoung

Seriously though. Kpop-GAF - if I can confidently assume how a bunch of the folks who post in the thread feel - want no part of lame OT stan wars.

 

[M.J. Doja]

Didn't like Mr. Taxi really, I wanted to. Vid was hot though.

I liked both of those T-ara songs instantly a lot more. Thanks for the linkage.

I'm gonna have dreams of korean girls with sexy eye makeup.

 

[MidgarBlowedUp]

Kind of a dry performance.

It was a sticky situation for me.

 

[Tacitus_]

I'm gonna have dreams of korean girls with sexy eye makeup.

Like this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MrjOZlmLUe0&feature=related

 

[broadwayrock]

Like this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MrjOZlmLUe0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OiqOUUiD34&t=0m16s

 

[RedAssedApe]

It would help if more than two of them were fluent in English. I don't even see how you can market the "9 different personalities" angle. The other 7 might as well be background dancers. :\

 

[Salazar]

It would help if more than two of them were fluent in English. I don't even see how you can market the "9 different personalities" angle. The other 7 might as well be background dancers. :\

Sooyoung tries, lol.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8i_ttyke6A

 

[W_Dreamer]

Taeyeon has her english moments...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQ_Y8W3Ded4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbp8fqYDALo





....maybe.

 

[DarkFlow]

Not bad, not really my cup of tea but It's entertaining. Seems kinda crazy to have so many members, you would just get lost in a group that size save for one or two stand outs.

 

[thefro]

Clearly whoever's managing them doesn't understand the US market at all. Letterman & "Live" don't have the demographics they're looking for. They needed to translate whatever their best song is and show some legs off.

By the way, this is a real performance on Letterman

 

[Phonomezer]

WSJ piece about Girls' Generation ^_^
http://online.wsj.com/video/korean-...man/82F5878D-C513-44B7-9DF7-E8A37149A0B0.html

Like creepy-gaf, kpop gaf is so last year.

I expected someone with a Robyn avatar to be exercising better judgement

 

[Salazar]

They needed to translate whatever their best song is.

Translating the songs more often than not breaks them, tbh.

The members joke about how messed up their Engrish is.

 

[DGRE]

I don't understand how it's any different than 80% of pop music in America or any other country? Is American Idol disingenuous? The artists of kpop have to go through auditions and then several years of training. What's disingenuous is promoting someone who has absolutely no talent, like Miley Cyrus or Justin Bieber.

And it's not like the Korean government is doing this. It is entertainment COMPANIES wishing to create music and a brand that people will like so they can make money. Please show me the difference between that and say, Dr. Dre "raising" Eminem.

http://rawr6127.wordpress.com/2010/11/03/fans-outraged-because-of-snsd-controversy/#more-3241

The show featured a famous critic named Chen Ling Ling and Taiwanese idol Lin Wei Ling. The stars claimed, “Korean female celebrities must provide sexual favors and are forced to undergo plastic surgery.” An image of SNSD along with a large caption stating “Sexual Favors” was then brought up, which gave viewers the impression that SNSD was the most representative case.

Chen Ling-Ling explained, “There are numerous rules in the Korean entertainment industry, and one of them is providing sexual favors. Agencies teach singing, dancing, and acting, and heavily manage their celebrities. Once their schedules are completed, however, they call the celebrities back out in order to participate in a dinner. This is usually considered the ‘first meeting’, and tends to be just a dinner. However, once dinner is over, the person will call the agency representative and express their desire to see her again. The next meeting is when the sexual favor takes place. Korean celebrities are forced to commit such acts, even at a young age.”

She continued, “I think that this is really unfortunate. Why must a celebrity receive such a phone call? But regardless, this is universal in Korea’s industry. Their agencies place an immense amount of pressure on the girls and force them so that they cannot refuse. It’s such an unfortunate case, but I heard that agency representatives force their celebrities to providing sexual favors, even driving some to the point of suicide.”

A few months ago, Lin Wei Ling (Estrella Lin) made a shocking confession when she revealed that she was canvassed to barter her body in exchange for an opportunity to make it in Korea. Lin reiterated her story on the show, saying, “I was requested to provide sexual favors while promoting in Korea.” Additionally, the Taiwanese singer claimed that she was forced to go under the knife: “I had to undergo plastic surgery while working in Korea. They told me to put fat in my face. I told them that I didn’t want to, and they stated that it was my responsibility as a celebrity to do so.”

You don't understand how it's any different??? Look at the industry you support. It's disgusting. Sexual favors happen in America, but I can tell you with confidence it isn't the industry standard. If you like it, fine. But don't even try to pretend that the way the Korean entertainment industry has ANY semblance of America's.

N Sync is like a Picasso painting compared to this manufactured drivel.

 

[ramyeon]

http://rawr6127.wordpress.com/2010/11/03/fans-outraged-because-of-snsd-controversy/#more-3241

You don't understand how it's any different??? Look at the industry you support. It's disgusting. Sexual favors happen in America, but I can tell you with confidence it isn't the industry standard. If you like it, fine. But don't even try to pretend that the way the Korean entertainment industry has ANY semblance of America's.

N Sync is like a Picasso Painting compared to this manufactured drivel.

Did you read the article you linked to? Just sayin'.

 

[Salazar]

You're really going to take an obviously trashy and mean-spirited and hyperbolic Taiwanese tabloid tv report about Korea as gospel.

C'mon son. Industry has a shady side but you're parroting some amazing shit.

lol, and you're the dude who posted in the Kpop thread saying you could hook people up if they wanted to send idols stuff.

 

[DGRE]

You're really going to take an obviously trashy and mean-spirited and hyperbolic Taiwanese tabloid tv report about Korea as gospel.

C'mon son.

That's cute. You want to do this? You will not win. It's a well-known "secret" that no one talks about.

 

[ramyeon]

That's cute. You want to do this? You will not win. It's a well-known "secret" that no one talks about.

Of course it's well known, and there's so many articles about it out there. I really can't understand why you used THAT one. That is tabloid quality stuff.

That said, there's nothing implicating Girls Generation specifically. And I think you'll find that sexual favours within companies like SM, YG and JYP (The top dogs) are not as standard as you think they are. As far as I've heard from Korean sources it's only common within smaller agencies (Often pretty dodgy) and also more common in acting agencies.

 

[DGRE]

You're really going to take an obviously trashy and mean-spirited and hyperbolic Taiwanese tabloid tv report about Korea as gospel.

C'mon son. Industry has a shady side but you're parroting some amazing shit.

lol, and you're the dude who posted in the Kpop thread saying you could hook people up if they wanted to send idols stuff.

Nice edit.

http://angrykpopfan.tumblr.com/post/4057622792/the-ugly-reality-of-kpop-idol-auditions

One trainee was found stating, “Even I knew that I wasn’t able to show off my full potential during my condition, but they gave me a positive review. But after I passed the audition, they demanded that I pay $2,700 USD.”

The trainee was also asked to call the director of her agency without alerting him that he was being recorded. When asked about the contract fee she was forced to pay, he replied, “There are no agencies these days that support you financially 100%. Since we do support you 100%, don’t leave us. Even if you say that we forced you to provide sexual favors, you really have nothing to say in the end.”

Another trainee hoping to become an actress later gave her own account, revealing, “The agency said they were looking for a small role and wanted to meet me in person. They instead dragged me to their home and force fed me various drinks, claiming that they needed to check my limit. After a while, they taped my mouth shut so that I couldn’t scream, and further claimed that in order to become a celebrity, I needed to have sex with him.”

What was even more shocking for viewers was that this all happened before she entered her third year of junior high school. (credit: allkpop)

Of course it's well known, and there's so many articles about it out there. I really can't understand why you used THAT one. That is tabloid quality stuff.

That said, there's nothing implicating Girls Generation specifically. And I think you'll find that sexual favours within companies like SM, YG and JYP (The top dogs) are not as standard as you think they are.

Says who? Your wishful thinking?

 

[ramyeon]

Says who? Your wishful thinking?

I have a friend who is currently a trainee in a talent agency in Korea as well as a friend who trained in the same agency as Sunny from Girls Generation before she was recruited to SM by her Uncle.

 

[Salazar]

Nice edit.

You're exaggerating to the point of outright lying.

Every explanation I can think of for you posting the way you are is unkind.

 

[Jake.]

no woori, but still - damn.

who did bill murray get to tag?

 

[DGRE]

You're exaggerating to the point of outright lying.

Wow. Do you also think it's normal for celebrities to make next to nothing and live in dorms and sleep in bunk beds?

It's not.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-13760064

 

[Red Liquorice]

On the whole, there is virtually no appeal for North Americans. I question why they're even bothering performing here. The whole girl band gimmick reeks of the 1990s, complete with the choreographed dancing.

Girl/boy bands began in the 90s now?

Pop culture goes in cycles, your childhood is about to be dug up, mashed up and spat out - if it hasn't been already.

 

[rodzee]

this thread...just wow

 

[Salazar]

Wow. Do you also think it's normal for celebrities to make next to nothing and live in dorms and sleep in bunk beds?

You're just googling for shots to take at Kpop. I don't think the contracts for idols are legit. I didn't assert otherwise.

I'm going to bail out, seeing as you apparently maintain that rape is an "industry standard" in Kpop.

 

[ChiTownBuffalo]

The gayo business is fucked up, they are manufactured, their songs/moves are derivative.

But people like them, so what?

Just, some people need to dial back the creep factor.

Fuck, I owned more than one New Found Glory album.

 

[Tenck]

/high five

Great avatar!

 

[Salazar]

But people like them, so what?

Yo.

http://www.allkpop.com/2012/01/mc-sniper-to-release-a-new-album

 

[Alex Connolly]

I don't really have anything to add outside of seeing SNSD perform at last year's Kōhaku New Years Eve TV Gala, while slouched with the inlaws and sinking beers. More pizazz than most Japanese girl outfits. Plus I like that Gee song.

A fine performance.

This thread is overly caustic, but I suppose every peanut must have his 2 roubles' worth.