New Obamacare Regulations Outrage Catholic Groups

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It's ridiculous how the Catholic church gets all indignant over something like this, but when children are being mistreated for decades at the hands of their clergy all they do is try to cover it up and down play the incidents.

This is the very reason why I don't go to ANY church. They're always centuries behind modern culture.
 
xavi42 said:
I have never brought up non-Catholics. My point was that if I walked around telling everyone I was Catholic, and I was having affairs outside of marriage, then I would only be a Catholic in name.
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What constitutes being a Catholic is being a member of the Roman Catholic Church, and nothing more. It's not some idealised "moral" follower of the Catechism. It's not even just someone who is beyond Church dogma and is a pure moral being. That's absolute bull shit. It's also a no-true-Scottsman fallacy.
 
How can religions exist when they are so against women's rights? I don't know who is dumber, religious leaders, or religious women.

But it is true that 98% of catholic women use contraception. So I guess they're not dumb, just hypocrites. Golly gee thanks religion.
 
genjiZERO said:
What constitutes being a Catholic is being a member of the Roman Catholic Church, and nothing more. It's not some idealised "moral" follower of the Catechism. It's not even just someone who is beyond Church dogma and is a pure moral being. That's absolute bull shit. It's also a no-true-Scottsman fallacy.
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Cafeteria Catholics are what we call the ones who like to attach the label to themselves but do everything in opposition to what it actually means to be Catholic
 
Kusagari said:
So, I'm guessing you consider the majority of Catholics to be as such?
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Probably a fair assessment.
At some point you stop being a Catholic and become nothing more than Catholic in name only if you take every position that runs counter to teachings.

Disagreements can certainly exist but there are plenty who are very happy to claim the Catholic title and then have little to do with it or totally disagree with everything.
 
Matt said:
Umm, why not? It costs a hell of a lot less to cover birth control then it does to cover an actual birth.
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1. Many/most employers aren't required to pay 100% of costs of childbirth
2. An employer that pays for BC will still pay for childbirth when a woman chooses to do so. Then they will turn around and pay for the BC again until menopause.
3. It is a borderline myth that the only reason people don't have BC now is because the employer doesn't pay for them. A person getting pregnant is doing so regardless of the existence of this benefit.
Zoe said:
That seems prone to abuse though unless they lay down limits. Otherwise everyone's going to be going for the premium brand names.
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I'm sure there is something that indicates the employer only has to lowest amount or a generic equivalent like there is now. However, if it covers more than pills, then the costs could still get a bit high.
 
antonz said:
Probably a fair assessment.
At some point you stop being a Catholic and become nothing more than Catholic in name only if you take every position that runs counter to teachings.

Disagreements can certainly exist but there are plenty who are very happy to claim the Catholic title and then have little to do with it or totally disagree with everything.
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And Cafeteria Catholic is also what right-wing Catholics like to call liberal Catholics, even if they themselves don't follow all of the teachings.

It's bullshit.
 
"....require employers who offer health-care coverage to their employees to include coverage for contraception."

Good news. About time they started requiring this. I hope the Catholic church doesn't screw this up somehow.
 
I'd still like an answer to my question. Why is the catholic church against contraception? what's the rational. Is there anything in the bible forbidding it?
 
Raist said:
I'd still like an answer to my question. Why is the catholic church against contraception? what's the rational. Is there anything in the bible forbidding it?
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No, there's no specific part of the Bible against contraception it's more of the moral issue of "killing a baby," like abortion.
 
Raist said:
I'd still like an answer to my question. Why is the catholic church against contraception? what's the rational. Is there anything in the bible forbidding it?
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This. I don't get it either. It just doesn't make sense to refuse contraception from logical point of view. It's ridiculous to expect people not to have sex in this day and age and to prevent any kind of disease or unwanted pregnancies, contraception is required. But then again I'm saying this as a lapse Catholic.
 
AnathemicOne said:
No, there's no specific part of the Bible against contraception it's more of the moral issue of "killing a baby," like abortion.
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That doesn't even make sense. But I do know crazy/fundamentalist catholics are basically opposed to anything that interferes with the baby making process.
 
Raist said:
Contraception and abortion are two completely different things. You're not killing anything with contraception.
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Except the whole reason behind Catholicism's anti-contraception stance is the verse "thou shalt not spill your seed upon the ground" or whatever, which is entirely due to the idea they had back then that semen contained everything that made a baby and the woman was just an incubator, i.e. an extension of the view that life begins at conception. Now that we know this is false the Catholic church should update its views. 'Course if any religion ever did that they'd have to throw out everything.
 
Jackpot said:
Except the whole reason behind Catholicism's anti-contraception stance is the verse "thou shalt not spill your seed upon the ground" or whatever, which is entirely due to the idea they had back then that semen contained everything that made a baby and the woman was just an incubator, i.e. an extension of the view that life begins at conception. Now that we know this is false the Catholic church should update its views. 'Course if any religion ever did that they'd have to throw out everything.
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The Catholics are actually pretty good at updating their views, they are slow at it, but they at least acknolwedge evolution, and eventually realised Copernicus and Galileo were right. I guess 'good' may be a reach, but certainly they are one of the better ones. Most religions that are modern are that way becuase they are modern creations.
 
Dead Man said:
The Catholics are actually pretty good at updating their views, they are slow at it, but they at least acknolwedge evolution, and eventually realised Copernicus and Galileo were right. I guess 'good' may be a reach, but certainly they are one of the better ones. Most religions that are modern are that way becuase they are modern creations.
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Thankfully, they have stopped persecuting and burning people at the stake, although it did take a few centuries.
 
Dead Man said:
The Catholics are actually pretty good at updating their views, they are slow at it, but they at least acknolwedge evolution, and eventually realised Copernicus and Galileo were right. I guess 'good' may be a reach, but certainly they are one of the better ones. Most religions that are modern are that way becuase they are modern creations.
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Yeah, the Catholic church occupies a weird spot for me. I respect that they actually work to incorporate science into their doctrine and beliefs, but their staunch refusal to update their views about birth control is ridiculous
 
While this is really a minor example ... it just adds another piece of straw to my back.

Pretty sure I'm slowly moving from being an atheist to a new atheist.
 
WowBaby said:
Thankfully, they have stopped persecuting and burning people at the stake, although it did take a few centuries.
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See? They can learn! ;)
The_Technomancer said:
Yeah, the Catholic church occupies a weird spot for me. I respect that they actually work to incorporate science into their doctrine and beliefs, but their staunch refusal to update their views about birth control is ridiculous
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Yeah, it does seem a baffling oversight since they have been able to incorporate science into so much of the rest of their doctrine. If they could get over that it would help the world a lot, their propaganda against condoms in Africa especially has been criminal.
 
GhaleonQ said:
Oh, man, Uhuru Kenyatta went to a Catholic day school before Amherst. Surely, his subsequent actions are directly caused by Catholic theological teaching, as are all of Africa's problems! Close those schools, Catholics!
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You have no right to make joke comments dismissing harmful Catholic teachings when the fucking pope has publicly told the world, including Africa, that condoms will make the AIDS epidemic worse, sabotaging the effort to combat HIV in Africa. This is a simple fact: You religious organization has done more harm in the fight against AIDS than good.
 
Ignatz Mouse said:
And Cafeteria Catholic is also what right-wing Catholics like to call liberal Catholics, even if they themselves don't follow all of the teachings.

It's bullshit.
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I absolutely despise that cafeteria catholic label. So terrible.

...

Apparently most Catholics support including contraception coverage in health plans.

BC-Employers-Religion1-e1328631576475.png
 
Agent Icebeezy said:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46310316/ns/health-womens_health/
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It may or may not be true, but they notoriously don't prove it. I believe in 2006 and 2007 it went up, and they blamed negligible increases in abstinence-only education. 2008 had more abstinence-only education (itself an umbrella term) than any other time, and it dropped. Mysteriously, the effects disappeared, according to them!

Again, I don't doubt their numbers, but their explanations are silly to me.
 
So...how come the Church and others were not complaining for the last decade:

http://motherjones.com/politics/2012/02/controversial-obama-birth-control-rule-already-law


As recently as last year, the EEOC was moderating a dispute between the administrators of Belmont Abbey, a Catholic institution in North Carolina, and several of its employees who had their birth control coverage withdrawn after administrators realized it was being offered. The Weekly Standard opined on the issue in 2009—more proof that religious employers were being asked to cover contraception far before the Obama administration issued its new rule on January 20 of this year.
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Not even religious employers were exempt.....Although Title VII allows religious institutions to discriminate on religious grounds, it doesn't allow them to discriminate on the basis of sex—
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WowBaby said:
So...how come the Church and others were not complaining for the last decade:
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Because Republican party leaders are bags of stupid who have chosen to pander hard to social conservatives. It's tearing their party apart and they don't really seem to care.
 
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