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[Brawndo Addict]

You may want to read the indoctrination theory before resorting to bleach.

Okay, I've read up on this theory but I feel stupid because I don't get it. The prothean VI could sense indoctrination and Shepard is clean right before the battle for Earth. Saren/Benezia were literally inside a Reaper for ME 1 and it still took a while for him to become fully indoctrinated. Seems like a stretch to say, oh you got magically turned in a few hours.

More importantly, what would be the point of doing it (this is also an issue with TIM). Wouldn't they just have Shepard kill himself or do nothing at all allowing themselves to win the battle and go about the cycle. If the Crucible was really a threat to the Reapers, why would they give Shepard visions of activating it or have the TIM work on a method for controlling them?

And if it wasn't indoctrination, why in the world did the child-AI bring Shepard up there in the first place if some of the options went directly against his plans and agendas? If it just wanted Shepard to choose the option it already wanted, what was stopping it from doing that itself during any one of the previous cycles.

EDIT

Along those same lines, am I the only one who sees blowing up the Mass Relays as dooming all space-faring civilizations to a slow death through starvation. It would be like having the concept of money or engines vanish from our planet, we're utterly dependent on both to allow our society to exist.

The biggest one has been pointed out to death but what the hell was with the Normandy? Where was it going during the battle? How did my crew get back on board? Why do they trust the air is breathable? Should we pity them for them being stranded on a planet with no long-term sources of food or water?

 

[SpectreFire]

Wait. Hold on. Bioware has confirmed that Mass Effect 3 would be the end of Shepard's story, but they never said that it would be the end of the Mass Effect universe.

What if the Indoctrination Theory was right, but instead of of the real ending coming out as DLC, it comes out in a whole new game featuring another character? In Mass Effect 4, you would start where Shepard left off, in London, figuring out to get to the Citadel.

 

[Zomba13]

The indoctrination theory is dumb.

Not that it has no basis, and not that Bioware won't eventually use it, but it's just something fans came up with to make the ending hurt less.

It is the video game fan equivalent of "No, my significant other wasn't seeing someone else, she legitimately broke up with me because of physical distance, it wasn't something wrong with either of us!"

What we saw is what we got. Even if Bioware adds on or changes or whatever, this is forever the canon ending of ME3.

And doesn't that just show how bad the ending we got was? So many people (myself included) want to believe this kinda insane theory because we are so disappointed with the ending we were given. We're pretty much willing to believe the last 10 minutes never happened and was all a dream just so there is a glimmer of hope that it can be changed.

 

[pakkit]

Finally finished the game (how the fuck did you guys play this so quickly?) so I'll simply say that the fact that Bioware has drummed up this much conversation about the ending is a sign of success. I'm not entirely happy with how it went out, especially since the biggest appeal regarding the Mass Effect series occurred in the social aspect and not the macro-philosophies. Still, this is better than non-provoking Hollywood bullshit, and the ending seems more planned than, say, Enslaved, or Castlevania: LoS, or even Deus Ex: HR. It's obvious Bioware wants you to dig around a bit, which I can appreciate.

 

[Dresden]

Wait. Hold on. Bioware has confirmed that Mass Effect 3 would be the end of Shepard's story, but they never said that it would be the end of the Mass Effect universe.

What if the Indoctrination Theory was right, but instead of of the real ending coming out as DLC, it comes out in a whole new game featuring another character? In Mass Effect 4, you would start where Shepard left off, in London, figuring out to get to the Citadel.

That'd be terrible. I'm sick of Urf.

At this point I'd take a millenium-long time jump and hit up a ME universe that's considerably different from the one we know.

 

[syoaran]

What we saw is what we got. Even if Bioware adds on or changes or whatever, this is forever the canon ending of ME3.

Just make it stop....

 

[SpectreFire]

Finally finished the game (how the fuck did you guys play this so quickly?) so I'll simply say that the fact that Bioware has drummed up this much conversation about the ending is a sign of success. I'm not entirely happy with how it went out, especially since the biggest appeal regarding the Mass Effect series occurred in the social aspect and not the macro-philosophies. Still, this is better than non-provoking Hollywood bullshit, and the ending seems more planned than, say, Enslaved, or Castlevania: LoS, or even Deus Ex: HR. It's obvious Bioware wants you to dig around a bit, which I can appreciate.

Twilight drummed out intense amounts of discussion about how shitty it was and I'd still hardly call it a success.

There's thoughtful provoking of discussion, and then there's "let's make the shittiest ending we could come up with and have fandom rave over it" provoking of discussion.

That'd be terrible. I'm sick of Urf.

At this point I'd take a millenium-long time jump and hit up a ME universe that's considerably different from the one we know.

But I'm sure Bioware and EA aren't sick of money!

 

[lastplayed]

I really do have to get around to reading that series.

It's amazing. Do it.

 

[Zomba13]

Okay, I've read up on this theory but I feel stupid because I don't get it. The prothean VI could sense indoctrination and Shepard is clean right before the battle for Earth. Saren/Benezia were literally inside a Reaper for ME 1 and it still took a while for him to become fully indoctrinated. Seems like a stretch to say, oh you got magically turned in a few hours.

More importantly, what would be the point of doing it (this is also an issue with TIM). Wouldn't they just have Shepard kill himself or do nothing at all allowing themselves to win the battle and go about the cycle. If the Crucible was really a threat to the Reapers, why would they give Shepard visions of activating it or have the TIM work on a method for controlling them?

And if it wasn't indoctrination, why in the world did the child-AI bring Shepard up there in the first place if some of the options went directly against his plans and agendas? If it just wanted Shepard to choose the option it already wanted, what was stopping it from doing that itself during any one of the previous cycles.

EDIT

Along those same lines, am I the only one who sees blowing up the Mass Relays as dooming all space-faring civilizations to a slow death through starvation. It would be like having the concept of money or engines vanish from our planet, we're utterly dependent on both to allow our society to exist.

The biggest one has been pointed out to death but what the hell was with the Normandy? Where was it going during the battle? How did my crew get back on board? Why do they trust the air is breathable? Should we pity them for them being stranded on a planet with no long-term sources of food or water?

Prothean VI probably had it's protection protocol switched off by Cerberus and TIM becuase otherwise they wouldn't be able to look into it.

Indoctrinating Shepard would give you a HUGE advantage. He pretty much commands the united galaxy and has massive pull so could be used for all kinds of devious Reaper thingies. You could just as well ask why indoctrinate anyone?

God know this one. Real reason is the AI is there to present you the three different ending colours because BioWAre couldn't think of a way to present that to you otherwise.

Yup. Galaxtic civilisation is royally fucked up.

Space magic. There is no answer for this that doesn't make your team out to be wildly out of character and incorporates teleportation.


EDIT: How I'd have done the ending: Shep dies after getting hit with the beam. No choices, Nothing after that. Just straight cut to black, 2 second beat, then credits.
People would rant and rave and talk about it for like, ever. Would it be good? Hell no. Would people talk? Hell yes. Ending successful. I R genuis. All deep and what nots.

 

[Alrix]

Finally finished the game (how the fuck did you guys play this so quickly?) so I'll simply say that the fact that Bioware has drummed up this much conversation about the ending is a sign of success. I'm not entirely happy with how it went out, especially since the biggest appeal regarding the Mass Effect series occurred in the social aspect and not the macro-philosophies. Still, this is better than non-provoking Hollywood bullshit, and the ending seems more planned than, say, Enslaved, or Castlevania: LoS, or even Deus Ex: HR. It's obvious Bioware wants you to dig around a bit, which I can appreciate.

I didn't even start the game until Saturday or Sunday and just finished it early this morning. I can't remember the last time I got sucked into anything non-WoW like I did with the mass effect games, minutes literally turned into hours. Even Zelda didn't do that to me. Not that I didn't marathon Zelda like I did with ME3, but I was so much more absorbed into Mass effect.

but yeah I agree totally. kinda makes me a little excited again thinking about the possibilities for DLC/expansions.

 

[hateradio]

Here's a collection of images from this thread aka the support group.

https://minus.com/mbxm0TCIq#1g

Wait. Hold on. Bioware has confirmed that Mass Effect 3 would be the end of Shepard's story, but they never said that it would be the end of the Mass Effect universe.

What if the Indoctrination Theory was right, but instead of of the real ending coming out as DLC, it comes out in a whole new game featuring another character? In Mass Effect 4, you would start where Shepard left off, in London, figuring out to get to the Citadel.

Why does indoctrination have to be right? If Shepard is gone people still have to continue on.

 

[Digoman]

Others have said it, but they're got good writers and it's not a bad game. The problem is that they seem to spend all their energy on the side-plots and the over-arching narrative really suffers, a similar problem with ME 2.

I don't think it's a matter of wasting energy in side-plots, it's just that the "higher ups" had a vision where they wanted to go and forced it down. There's no way one of the "secondary" writers (that did a very good job in the individual quests/scenarios) comes up with the endings out of nowhere in a meeting and it's accepted.

The tragic thing - well, one of them - is that if they had gone with the traditional Ewoks and fireworks ending, the resulting post-war galaxy would have been _perfect_ material for new stories. Billions or trillions dead, rebuilding planets and cities, chaos, drama, hope, space opera, fun; all thrown out the window because of new-age Adam and EDI bullshit. Right now I don't even feel like replaying the story with my other characters because nothing matters. I'd have to hit the brain bleach to erase the last five minutes from my mind first.

Some people on this thread, including me, think this is Bioware way of reseting the universe to avoid dealing with all decisions up until now. I actually wouldn't mind this scenario, and even understand the need for it if they're sticking with the "your choices matter" instead of picking a cannon plot, but it was so badly done.

At "best" destroying the Mass relays create enormous repercussions, but Shepard doesn't say anything (and at worst in completely wipes out a lot of systems). And even in the galaxy-changing scenario, they could have answered a few questions and set up possibilities for the future.

What I can't really understand is the business side of all of this. At this point it appears that while is "making people talk", it has damage the brand somewhat. A conventional ending (or a couple of endings going for cliche happy to "you fucked up and the reapers won) would be uninspired but given the rest of the game, would leave most people with a very good impression of the whole trilogy, and ready to buy what comes next.

 

[duckroll]

The indoctrination theory is dumb.

Not that it has no basis, and not that Bioware won't eventually use it, but it's just something fans came up with to make the ending hurt less.

It is the video game fan equivalent of "No, my significant other wasn't seeing someone else, she legitimately broke up with me because of physical distance, it wasn't something wrong with either of us!"

What we saw is what we got. Even if Bioware adds on or changes or whatever, this is forever the canon ending of ME3.

Tell that to Fallout 3 fans. Lol.

 

[rollingstart]

The indoctrination theory is dumb.

Not that it has no basis, and not that Bioware won't eventually use it, but it's just something fans came up with to make the ending hurt less.

It is the video game fan equivalent of "No, my significant other wasn't seeing someone else, she legitimately broke up with me because of physical distance, it wasn't something wrong with either of us!"

What we saw is what we got. Even if Bioware adds on or changes or whatever, this is forever the canon ending of ME3.

It may be the canon ending, but fans can accept or reject whatever they want. All that Star Wars expanded universe media (novels, comics, the like) isn't canon but fans still acknowledge it. Likewise, there are people that refuse to acknowledge the very canon prequel trilogy.

Besides, the entire idea of canon is flimsy. Didn't the original writer(s) have dark energy as the conclusion? but ME3's whole singularity thing was in the final game, even if it wasn't the original intention from the people who created the universe. So it's canon because it's in the final product, even if it's from different minds. Or something.

also, Highlander.

 

[milesdm]

Apart from that kid, the ending(s) had such a tangible ridiculousness to it that I couldn't help but love it.

Writing was still shitty -- but not in terms of "I didn't get what I want", but bullshit like Effective Military Force factoring into tiny different outcomes when it's completely redundant. Blah, blah, Bioware made a weird Evangelion ending.

(Am I alone on this?)

 

[GroundCombo]

The indoctrination theory is dumb.

Not that it has no basis, and not that Bioware won't eventually use it, but it's just something fans came up with to make the ending hurt less.

It is the video game fan equivalent of "No, my significant other wasn't seeing someone else, she legitimately broke up with me because of physical distance, it wasn't something wrong with either of us!"

What we saw is what we got. Even if Bioware adds on or changes or whatever, this is forever the canon ending of ME3.

Yeah, pretty much this. They'd have to pull off a major storytelling miracle to continue the story from here in a satisfactory manner.

It wasn't only the reset button BS that pissed me off; the execution and pacing of the whole thing was in stark contrast with everything that has happened before. The ME2 ending sequence had some problems, but it still took into account just about everything I did and addressed every character, and for that I have to tip my hat to the team. Nothing like that here. DLC isn't going to help anymore.

Thinking about the space magic, the problems already started with Javik. The ME universe has been pretty believable (work with me here...) if you accept eezo and the basic mass field technology that drives everything. The Prothean beacons were in the magic territory, but I could still accept them as a minor fantasy element. The foundations cracked badly, however, when Javik did his read-the-whole-history-of-ME2-off-the-floor-of-Normandy bit... and when the ending hit, my immersion was so badly broken that it needed a cast.

 

[hateradio]

Blah, blah, Bioware made a weird Evangelion ending.

They wish.

Spoiler

At least Evangelion tried to explore topics about the human psyche and the universe.

 

[Brawndo Addict]

Prothean VI probably had it's protection protocol switched off by Cerberus and TIM becuase otherwise they wouldn't be able to look into it.

Indoctrinating Shepard would give you a HUGE advantage. He pretty much commands the united galaxy and has massive pull so could be used for all kinds of devious Reaper thingies. You could just as well ask why indoctrinate anyone?

Okay I get the VI thing now. Don't know why I didn't make that connection before. I think my point still stands for the purpose of indoctrination though. There's not really a point to indoctrinating Shepard now since the Reapers are fully in the annihilation phase of the cycle, whereas they indoctrinated Saren to start the cycle again. They'd get just as much mileage out of blowing him up. And if they did indoctrinate him, wouldn't they just turn him into a husk or collector general type role to inspire fear?

My bigger point is if Shepard is indoctrinated, why did the reapers give him these weird ass visions/dreams of using the Crucible? What purpose does that serve?

 

[LAUGHTREY]

Here's a collection of images from this thread aka the support group.

https://minus.com/mbxm0TCIq#1g


Why does indoctrination have to be right? If Shepard is gone people still have to continue on.

What's with the shot of EDIs robo-camel-toe?

Her alternate outfits are really walking the outrageous sex appeal line, tiny waist with giant hips ass and bust put Miranda to shame. The weird thing is her default "naked" isn't even that bad.

My bigger point is if Shepard is indoctrinated, why did the reapers give him these weird ass visions/dreams of using the Crucible? What purpose does that serve?

Nothing. Because he wasn't indoctrinated. All the evidence toward indoctrination is opinion and conjecture with circumstantial evidence based on game-play elements and plot devices. The things that are actually shown and told to us invalidate it all.

I still don't get why this is being talked about. The ending isn't better if it's a metaphor for being indoctrinated, it's somehow worse because then we didn't get an ending and will probably have to buy more DLC to see it.

They wish.

Spoiler

At least Evangelion tried to explore topics about the human psyche and the universe.

The last 5 minutes of the game being bad don't affect the rest of the game being marvelous. Trying to figure out if Geth deserve life, what is a soul, what is sentience, sacrifice for your loved ones, if it's alright to give the Krogan another chance. The story of the game was amazing save for a tiny minuscule part of the ending, in the overall scheme of things, .005% of the entire trilogy was a let down. Not that big of a deal.

 

[LiK]

What's with the shot of EDIs robo-camel-toe?

Her alternate outfits are really walking the outrageous sex appeal line, tiny waist with giant hips ass and bust put Miranda to shame. The weird thing is her default "naked" isn't even that bad.

If you got it, flaunt it.

 

[Zomba13]

Okay I get the VI thing now. Don't know why I didn't make that connection before. I think my point still stands for the purpose of indoctrination though. There's not really a point to indoctrinating Shepard now since the Reapers are fully in the annihilation phase of the cycle, whereas they indoctrinated Saren to start the cycle again. They'd get just as much mileage out of blowing him up. And if they did indoctrinate him, wouldn't they just turn him into a husk or collector general type role to inspire fear?

My bigger point is if Shepard is indoctrinated, why did the reapers give him these weird ass visions/dreams of using the Crucible? What purpose does that serve?

I'd say the point was so they could infiltrate and snuff out any possible resistance. They did it to the Preotheans (happened to Javik).
And the vision of the Crucible is the test (a crucible). The reaper makes it seem as if Blue ending or green ending are what you want (as they don't end up killing the Geth and EDI) and in choosing those you become indoctrinated. They even paint TIM's way as Paragon (even though he is clearly a renegade) and Anderson's as renegade (even though he could be described as a paragon). By picking destroy you resist the indoctrination and thus wake up back in London. The whole point is to make Shepard feel as if he has a choice in the matter when he's actually letting his guard down.

 

[LAUGHTREY]

I'd say the point was so they could infiltrate and snuff out any possible resistance. They did it to the Preotheans (happened to Javik).
And the vision of the Crucible is the test (a crucible). The reaper makes it seem as if Blue ending or green ending are what you want (as they don't end up killing the Geth and EDI) and in choosing those you become indoctrinated. They even paint TIM's way as Paragon (even though he is clearly a renegade) and Anderson's as renegade (even though he could be described as a paragon). By picking destroy you resist the indoctrination and thus wake up back in London. The whole point is to make Shepard feel as if he has a choice in the matter when he's actually letting his guard down.

Or he wakes up in London because it's the only ending where his body isn't combined with the Reapers, just assumed he would die because of the synthetic stuff Cerberus used to revive him, not coincidentally shown to remind players of that at the end of the game with his glowing scars on his face.

He just got blown clear somehow and his cybernetics weren't shut off, that's all.

 

[mxgt]

I love how there's 10 extra pages to read through in this thread every time I wake up

 

[Zomba13]

Or he wakes up in London because it's the only ending where his body isn't combined with the Reapers, just assumed he would die because of the synthetic stuff Cerberus used to revive him, not coincidentally shown to remind players of that at the end of the game with his glowing scars on his face.

He just got blown clear somehow and his cybernetics weren't shut off, that's all.

Well. Yeah. The indoctrination thing isn't true. I'd love it to be true and this was all a clever (but badly executed) experiment but it isn't. The body being in London at the end doesn't even make sense because it'd have to fall from space and Shep didn't survive re-entry before when he had a full suit and helmet and probably functioning shields.


ANYWAY, I've been thinking of some possible motivations for the reapers I think would make more sense than the 'we come to kill you because you'll make robots that'll kill you and we need to stop that...'.

The reapers wait for civilisation to advance so they can come in, kill everyone, harvest them to make new reapers and use the tech they have developed to add to their own. They are ancient sentient AI constructs that have grown to think of themselves as the rulers of the galaxy. Everything we make belongs to them, whatever we've done in our lives has only served to further their kind, to create more of them.

The reapers kill every cycle just to harvest life to 'reproduce'. They believe that the meaning of life is to survive and reproduce as organics do and are emulating that in the only way they can. They leave the lesser races to grow as they will forget about the reapers and have time to evolve and populate the galaxy making it easier for reaper babies.

The reapers kill every cycle to prevent the galaxy from getting advanced enough it can travel through dark space and to other galaxies. This is because there is seriously fucked up shit there and they are doing us a favour killing us before we get there. 50,000 years is the safe maximum amount of time they can allow us to live because usually at this point a race is on the verge of dark space travel or something.

The reapers kill because of a wizard did it.

The reapers kill because the reapers kill.

 

[RoboPlato]

What is the indoctrination theory? I keep seeing people mention it but no description of it. Is it just that Shepard got indoctrinated at the end and everything was a hallucination? If so, that's a WAY worse ending than the one we got.

 

[SpectreFire]

What is the indoctrination theory? I keep seeing people mention it but no description of it. Is it just that Shepard got indoctrinated at the end and everything was a hallucination? If so, that's a WAY worse ending than the one we got.

The indoctrination theory isn't an ending though, it's opening that allows for a continuation of the series either through DLC or Mass Effect 4, hopefully leading to a REAL ending.

 

[hateradio]

Well. Yeah. The indoctrination thing isn't true.

I'm glad you admit it.

The last 5 minutes of the game being bad don't affect the rest of the game being marvelous. Trying to figure out if Geth deserve life, what is a soul, what is sentience, sacrifice for your loved ones, if it's alright to give the Krogan another chance. The story of the game was amazing save for a tiny minuscule part of the ending, in the overall scheme of things, .005% of the entire trilogy was a let down. Not that big of a deal.

I just meant that the ending is nothing like Evangelion at all, maybe the TV ending but not.

 

[LiK]

What is the indoctrination theory? I keep seeing people mention it but no description of it. Is it just that Shepard got indoctrinated at the end and everything was a hallucination? If so, that's a WAY worse ending than the one we got.

Indoctrination process began before ME3

 

[hateradio]

Indoctrination process began before ME3

There's nothing that proves that at all.

 

[Last Hearth]

What is the indoctrination theory? I keep seeing people mention it but no description of it. Is it just that Shepard got indoctrinated at the end and everything was a hallucination? If so, that's a WAY worse ending than the one we got.

Read up on Indoctrination.

http://w11.zetaboards.com/Theorycraftng_HUB/topic/7688087/1/

 

[RoboPlato]

The indoctrination theory isn't an ending though, it's opening that allows for a continuation of the series either through DLC or Mass Effect 4, hopefully leading to a REAL ending.

Wow, something like that turned out to be true I would be so mad. I'm tired of games leaving stuff open for sequels or DLC. I'm glad this is actually wrapped up.

That theory also makes everything you did in all the games completely irrelevant. People say that about the real ending but you do end up actually saving the galaxy from the Reaper cycle, just not in the way most expected.

 

[Zomba13]

What is the indoctrination theory? I keep seeing people mention it but no description of it. Is it just that Shepard got indoctrinated at the end and everything was a hallucination? If so, that's a WAY worse ending than the one we got.

Pretty much when Shep was hit with Harby's beam and knocked out that is when the indoctrination is happening. When he wakes up he's getting indoctrinated. The 'pick your favourite colour' is the crucible (test or trial) that decides if Shepard 'gives in' or fights the indoctrination. The 'destroy' ending, the one where shep breaths back in London (meaning he broke the indoctrination attempt) is painted as being the worst option (killing Geth, EDI and yourself, cycle will repeat) while the other two are painted as what is best for everyone. There is a bunch of evidence that supports this, from things that include Biowares asset re-usual to things such as not being able to argue with the AI.

There's nothing that proves that at all.

There are hints in Arrival. The whole Rho thing (I think it's Rho?) Isn't that a reaper thing and the woman there is indoctrinated and you're locked up there for a pretty long time. Could easily have had the seeds of indoctrination planted there.

Again, of course this isn't true as it'd mean BioWare put thought into ending the franchise and are monsters for the whole 'lol dlc ending' thing.

 

[LiK]

There's nothing that proves that at all.

Who cares, most arguments here are baseless anyways.

 

[DSix]

My only conclusion is that we need a Blade Runner-style retcon.

People will remember there was a slight bump in the road, but in the long run everybody will get over it and enjoy the new and final canon, and praise the game as it would deserve.

 

[LAUGHTREY]

Well. Yeah. The indoctrination thing isn't true. I'd love it to be true and this was all a clever (but badly executed) experiment but it isn't. The body being in London at the end doesn't even make sense because it'd have to fall from space and Shep didn't survive re-entry before when he had a full suit and helmet and probably functioning shields.

It didn't make sense for Joker and the Normandy to be in the middle of a mass relay jump with crew members that were right behind you as well, doesn't mean diddly. He could've been blown into a portal he came in on, or the starchild put him there somehow. Assuming he fell from space is just as likely as assuming he got blasted into the beam of light.

It's just a little easter egg for that particular ending. The paragon gets one too, like Big Ben exploding or not. It's not committing to him being alive, like Jeremy Jahns said.

 

[LiK]

My only conclusion is that we need a Blade Runner-style retcon.

People will remember there was a slight bump in the road, but in the long run everybody will get over it and enjoy the new and final canon, and praise the game as it would deserve.

Just have Shepard narrate the ending.

 

[Zomba13]

Wow, something like that turned out to be true I would be so mad. I'm tired of games leaving stuff open for sequels or DLC. I'm glad this is actually wrapped up.

That theory also makes everything you did in all the games completely irrelevant. People say that about the real ending but you do end up actually saving the galaxy from the Reaper cycle, just not in the way most expected.

But you doom the galaxy. And it doesn't provide any closure to your squad and friends. They either live on the jungle world and start a new civilisation there (with the aliens dying off) or they die in the starvation and post war shittyness caused by no relays (if they retcon the mass relays blowing up killing everyone. which is mentioned in this game...)

 

[hateradio]

^That may be depressing, but it's what we have.

It's just a little easter egg for that particular ending. The paragon gets one too, like Big Ben exploding or not. It's not committing to him being alive, like Jeremy Jahns said.

That's all based on your EMS, not respect.

 

[Brawndo Addict]

And the vision of the Crucible is the test (a crucible). The reaper makes it seem as if Blue ending or green ending are what you want and in choosing those you become indoctrinated. By picking destroy you resist the indoctrination and thus wake up back in London. The whole point is to make Shepard feel as if he has a choice in the matter when he's actually letting his guard down.

Except every other indoctrinated person we know 'escapes' indoctrination by killing themselves (TIM, Saren). You don't just 'shake it off' and free yourself. I'd argue there's more evidence that indoctrination is a slow unstoppable process as opposed to a vision-quest test where you hand control of your mind over to them.

And it misses the bigger picture of why bother indoctrinating anyone at the Battle of Earth. If the Crucible really is a threat to the reapers, they would have every reason to destroy every single thing there to ensure nothing could possibly harm them. It would be one thing to indoctrinate Shepard while he was gathering allies to sabotage his efforts, but to try an apparently resistible method on the galaxy's most fervent anti-reaper foe 20 feet away from the teleporter which could lead directly to their destruction?

That's getting into other problems of the end like why the Reapers left that portal on at all, or why they only left 1 reaper guarding it, why there were no forces inside the Crucible (assuming it was real). For being the only possible way the Reapers could be stopped they seemed more than happy to leave it essentially wide open and undefended.

 

[Zomba13]

^That may be depressing, but it's what we have.

True. And I guess it does close off the universe.

I think I'd be more ok with the ending if we were told explicitly that the galaxy was fucked. I mean, from what we know of the universe there is next to no way (unless more space magic) the galaxy comes out ahead in all this. It's just we're shown a 'happy' ending (I know, not happy happy but we're shown soldiers cheering that should make us feel like everything will be ok) but we know it's not. And by we I mean people who know/care enough about the games to know that they'd be fucked and why.

Except every other indoctrinated person we know 'escapes' indoctrination by killing themselves (TIM, Saren). You don't just 'shake it off' and free yourself. I'd argue there's more evidence that indoctrination is a slow unstoppable process as opposed to a vision-quest test where you hand control of your mind over to them.

And it misses the bigger picture of why bother indoctrinating anyone at the Battle of Earth. If the Crucible really is a threat to the reapers, they would have every reason to destroy every single thing there to ensure nothing could possibly harm them. It would be one thing to indoctrinate Shepard while he was gathering allies to sabotage his efforts, but to try an apparently resistible method on the galaxy's most fervent anti-reaper foe 20 feet away from the teleporter which could lead directly to their destruction?

That's getting into other problems of the end like why the Reapers left that portal on at all, or why they only left 1 reaper guarding it, why there were no forces inside the Crucible (assuming it was real). For being the only possible way the Reapers could be stopped they seemed more than happy to leave it essentially wide open and undefended.

Or why Harbinger didn't make sure everyone was dead. I doubt it'd have been much effort to fire another few reaper death beams making sure everyone was nice and dead, or at least stay there to make sure none of them get up and run to it.

 

[Sojgat]

If the ending is not indoctrination I don't understand what it even is. It just seems like a slap in the face to fans. Why would anybody do that to their fanbase. no intelligent person could think any of these color coded varient endings would be satisfying.

 

[LAUGHTREY]

That's all based on your EMS, not respect.

Uh, yeah? Paragons ending is different based on how much EMS you have, same with Renegade. One is Big Ben not blowing up, the other is the shot of Shepard taking a breath. Just little weird things for no reason.

 

[Zomba13]

Uh, yeah? Paragons ending is different based on how much EMS you have, same with Renegade. One is Big Ben not blowing up, the other is the shot of Shepard taking a breath. Just little weird things for no reason.

Sums up the whole ending.

 

[hateradio]

That's getting into other problems of the end like why the Reapers left that portal on at all, or why they only left 1 reaper guarding it, why there were no forces inside the Crucible (assuming it was real). For being the only possible way the Reapers could be stopped they seemed more than happy to leave it essentially wide open and undefended.

The beam was used to transport bodies to the Citadel, where they would later be blended into a new reaper.

Uh, yeah? Paragons ending is different based on how much EMS you have, same with Renegade. One is Big Ben not blowing up, the other is the shot of Shepard taking a breath. Just little weird things for no reason.

Only Destroy has the clip of Shep breathing. The other two do not.

There's a good/bad (or vaporized) version of each ending most endings, where Big Ben does blow up or doesn't. Some clips just bypass it, and don't show anything.

Edit, here are the available options.

I like how they just title them by the color.

 

[LiK]

Uh, yeah? Paragons ending is different based on how much EMS you have, same with Renegade. One is Big Ben not blowing up, the other is the shot of Shepard taking a breath. Just little weird things for no reason.

Cheaper to do than make all new FMVs :/

 

[Brawndo Addict]

Just little weird things for no reason.

Sums up the whole ending.

Ouch. It's funny because it's true.

The beam was used to transport bodies to the Citadel, where they would later be blended into a new reaper.

No I know what the beam was for, I'm just stating how idiotic it is that the Reapers would keep it on while they were being attacked.

 

[LAUGHTREY]

Only Destroy has the clip of Shep breathing. The other two do not.

Because the other two involve Shep being vaporized on screen, having a N7 dog tag and a sharp breath wouldn't make any sense.

So they put something to "reward" people who had a high EMS in both endings, and for not choosing the green ending. How is this a complicated idea you can't grasp? It's just an easter egg, not confirmation of indoctrination.

 

[hateradio]

So they put something to "reward" people who had a high EMS in both endings, and for not choosing the green ending. How is this a complicated idea you can't grasp? It's just an easter egg, not confirmation of indoctrination.

I'm aware. I'm just reiterating. I'm not indoctrinated theorist.

 

[LiK]

Ending was fantastic.

 

[Zomba13]

Ending was fantastic.

Oh you.