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Gay and Bisexual thread |OT2|Bears and Twinks and Otters. Oh My!

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The opposite is also true for me. When I say something more meaningful then for example, "hey, you a top or bottom" and actually try to hold a decent conversation and the guy is just not able to have such a conversation with me, that works like an extreme turn-off.

Whenever someone asks "top or bottom?", I can't help but roll my eyes because to me it somehow relates to the whole question of masculinity vs. femininity. I realize that if you're hooking up it's a valid question and it doesn't necessarily imply anything beyond "will I be able to hook up with you and enjoy myself?" but bear with me.

In the recent years, I have grown annoyed at traditional gender roles and sentences such as "women are so complicated", "men are all horn dogs". I admire and applaud individuals who defy these traditional gender roles and who do not fit in the general consensus of how should men/women act. For example, like many gays, I love strong women and I cringe every time such a women manifest a typical "girly" characteristic. I also cringe whenever I see guys doing stereotypical "manly" things.

This is exacerbated by (more often than not) right-wing religious pundit claiming that various atrocities about fem boys/tomboys and how being gay is because of an absence of a dad, yaddy yadda.

It's come to the point where I have HUGE preconceptions about people which almost prevent me from interacting with them in a neutral way. I used to pride myself in being open-minded and non-judgmental but after I got into a heated discussion with my boyfriend about "white straight male" vs. minorities, I realize that the way I was seeing the world was totally biased and that I needed to tone down my irrational dislike traditional gender roles and their place in society.

What do you guys think? Do you tend to think that traditional gender roles are true because of inherent biological dispositions or is it a direct result of a long standing patriarchal society?
 
Thanks. I think...?

tumblr_m67zx4B0CQ1rn8xgxo2_250.gif
 
What do you guys think? Do you tend to think that traditional gender roles are true because of inherent biological dispositions or is it a direct result of a long standing patriarchal society?

you know i am still so confused about what i think so i will wait and read what everyone else says
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I'm also kind of weird because I can look at a girl and be like "I would fuck the shit out of her" but generally I'm not like that with guys?

I haven't really had any experience with guys in terms of relationships, so I find once I start some sort of relationship (friendship or whatever) I find myself thinking about them.

Like my roommate was good friends with me and he'd walk around half naked and he was fit and I'd get hard thinking about me doing things to him or him to me. But those feelings didn't develop until I knew he didn't dislike me.
 
I don't really know what I like in guys or girls. I mean, I could start writing about physical preferences, but I don't think that's relevant. Considering the people I've been involved with, there's been a wide range of personalities. The only common thing is that somehow we clicked. The last time I had this connection with someone, and it happened years ago, she had a boyfriend and he was super jealous so I had to step aside. Every time I see her facebook updates I feel bad because she's always posting lyrics of my favorite band.
We had so much in common :'(

The only deal breaker I can think of is not liking movies or art museums.


What do you guys think? Do you tend to think that traditional gender roles are true because of inherent biological dispositions or is it a direct result of a long standing patriarchal society?

I hate gender roles so fucking much. I can't even have a reasonable discussion about this because I always end up losing my mind. It's the only topic I can't really talk about, but I think it's a combination of both, biological dispositions and society and media shaping us.
 
Another reunion? Weren't they supposed to reunite years ago?
I don't really like the spice girls... >.>

Yeah, they did a big world tour. They're performing at the closing ceremony for the Olympics, so I suppose that's a rehearsal for that.
 
I'm also kind of weird because I can look at a girl and be like "I would fuck the shit out of her" but generally I'm not like that with guys?

I haven't really had any experience with guys in terms of relationships, so I find once I start some sort of relationship (friendship or whatever) I find myself thinking about them.

Like my roommate was good friends with me and he'd walk around half naked and he was fit and I'd get hard thinking about me doing things to him or him to me. But those feelings didn't develop until I knew he didn't dislike me.

It's just a confidence thing methinks. I think I size up about 60% of the people I meet now vs when I was still un-confident about my body and sexuality.
 
lol, why?

Because fuck you why not, that's why.

Victormartin said:
WHY AREN'T WE DISCUSSING THE IMMINENT SPICE GIRLS REUNION???

BAD GAYS!!!

I only remember Victoria Beckham/Posh Spice's "Sunday drivers... it's only Saturday" line in the Spice Girls movie.

Oh and Tell me what you want what you really really want. >_>
 
Another reunion? Weren't they supposed to reunite years ago?
I don't really like the spice girls... >.>

Yeah, they did a big world tour. They're performing at the closing ceremony for the Olympics, so I suppose that's a rehearsal for that.
ONE REUNION IS NOT ENOUGH!!!!! I'm still pissed because they didn't film the reunion tour (even though I went to 3 dates). That was back in 2007/2008, TOO LONG AGO!!!!

And yes, this is a one-off kind of thing for the Olympics. They were rumored to perform for years! I never really thought it would happen, they always denied it and said they hadn't been approached.

I'm a HUGE spice girls / Melanie C (AKA Sporty Spice) fan. I've been lucky enough to have met her a couple of times and she's really nice :)

London 2010 after seeing her perform on "Blood Brothers" on two different days.

London, earlier this year, backstage at one of her concerts (I won a competition).

/spice
 
For you bi guys: Sphinx bought up interesting thought, where he seemed to pursue men because they were more direct and easier to get sex (less complicated than women). But I wonder, when you think about a long term relationship, when you think about settling down and making a life together with a partner, when (and if) you have fallen in love, is it with a man or a woman.

Also, my apologies in advance if I misinterpreted Sphinxs' post.

As I said many years ago, I'm down with either or, which is where I settle the definition of Bisexual with myself. Are you actually willing to be in a relationship with the other sex and same sex.

Of course I actually need to become more social-able and get rid of this self-loathing attitude first.
 
Actually, I really like roleplay like that as long as it stays in the bedroom. I think it can be very hot even.

yes I am a bottom :)

I sometimes think it's hot but I have real issues with it; it really really gets me down. I have dated older guys before and the stigma/sly remarks/subconsciously rude insults from literally all my friends really upset me (I was 22, he was 37). Friends from home, gay friends, uni friends, everyone - was depressing. It still bothers me now to a degree because since him I've been much more consciously aware of dating people my age - and whilst I liked them, found them attractive, cared about them; I kind of fetishized them as 'twinks' as apposed to just.. people.. Likewise, combined with anxiety towards growing up I have become more of a 'twink' and thus I feel I'm losing track of who I am. I find myself actively buying clothes that make me look 'cute' instead of things I actually want to wear. I need to.. I need to get a grip. Hard and fast decisions about friends and exterior issues will just make me feel even more depressed though; I think I need to take little steps towards being happy with myself before looking for things in other people.
 
Just got finished watching Eating Out 5.

It's not a good movie. But nevertheless it was enjoyable in a cheezy, turn your brain off, look at the hot man flesh kind of way.

I hope they make a six.
 
I'm not even joking when I say I've thought about buying a Pikachu onesie/babygrow. Seriously. Wear that to Popstarz (gay indie night in London) and you will not go home empty handed!

EDIT: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/261069720612 Those are some pretty Asian boys. Gosh! :3

Gosh is right. I need to fly to Seoul.

BTW I wasn't commenting on looking cute like a pikachu way but just wearing fitted clothing that looks good. Being fat I don't get to enjoy wearing clothes.
 
Whenever someone asks "top or bottom?", I can't help but roll my eyes because to me it somehow relates to the whole question of masculinity vs. femininity. I realize that if you're hooking up it's a valid question and it doesn't necessarily imply anything beyond "will I be able to hook up with you and enjoy myself?" but bear with me.

In the recent years, I have grown annoyed at traditional gender roles and sentences such as "women are so complicated", "men are all horn dogs". I admire and applaud individuals who defy these traditional gender roles and who do not fit in the general consensus of how should men/women act. For example, like many gays, I love strong women and I cringe every time such a women manifest a typical "girly" characteristic. I also cringe whenever I see guys doing stereotypical "manly" things.

This is exacerbated by (more often than not) right-wing religious pundit claiming that various atrocities about fem boys/tomboys and how being gay is because of an absence of a dad, yaddy yadda.

It's come to the point where I have HUGE preconceptions about people which almost prevent me from interacting with them in a neutral way. I used to pride myself in being open-minded and non-judgmental but after I got into a heated discussion with my boyfriend about "white straight male" vs. minorities, I realize that the way I was seeing the world was totally biased and that I needed to tone down my irrational dislike traditional gender roles and their place in society.

What do you guys think? Do you tend to think that traditional gender roles are true because of inherent biological dispositions or is it a direct result of a long standing patriarchal society?

I think is more complicated than just people living by prescripted, traditional gender roles.

For instance, I think the gay community is not immune to social labels. With this I mean that ever since being gay was more or less o.k in western cultures (around year 2000, will & grace, etc..), gays have been playing the same moronic game of building an exclusive community which sets them apart from everything else in an attempt to get acknowledge and accepted. The thing is that most of the straight people in 2012 won't give a damn about any guy or girl being gay, so all we are is a group of people behaving like gay society has taught us to do.

conclusion, we all like to fit somewhere and we will take measures to make sure we belong somewhere and by doing that, we will have to live our lives following traditional social roles ("I am gay, I must do this, like that, go to pride festivals and do whatever shit every gay guy does" ). In that sense we are as guilty as the typical straight girl who is extra needy and feels incomplete without a man and thinks a man must "earn" her. As guilty as the straight guy who thinks he must court thousands of girls and write 40 Okcupid messages per day because it's his role in society to "catch the prey".

but speaking only about sex, I think that many people are too busy trying to fit into a model that makes them feel comfortable and accepted and then sometimes a big part of their subjectivity goes into a dormant state and you settled down with some kind of behaviour.

for example, me, when I was 17 I really liked a female friend of mine, brunette, good looking, smart, a good pianist, also student from the music school. I asked her if she'd be my girlfriend and she rejected me. At the time I was very confused because I was already having fantasies with men. After the rejection, I had the chance to start something with a man and I did so, I felt loved and appreciated. After that, other friends came out being gay and all of a sudden I was in a gay enviroment, one in which I was and still am very happy. Because I felt that gay world had been kind to me, I didn't need to "look around" or "think about options" and since last march when I broke with my now ex-BF and started to have bad dates, I started to think about what was going on with me and I realized I had been a victim of my own life's prescription. I realized I was obsessively seeking that which gave me joy in the past (looking for tall guys, older, "I am incomplete, I need a man by my side" bullshit, blablabla) and that was completely wrong. Since I've realized that, I've been having an open mind an paying more attention to everything and everyone, every guy, every girl, short, tall, younger, older, etc. and I think, I am getting more from life that way.

I am definitely not over but it's such a long rant... I'll leave it there. thanks for reading! :D
 
I think I'm depressed. I basically sat at home all day doing nothing. Couldn't bring myself to watch anything or play a game even.

Just sat thinking what I could watch or play or do and ended up doing nothing.

No human contact today either. Like I'm invisible today or something.
 
I think I'm depressed. I basically sat at home all day doing nothing. Couldn't bring myself to watch anything or play a game even.

Just sat thinking what I could watch or play or do and ended up doing nothing.

No human contact today either. Like I'm invisible today or something.

You think you're depressed? You're probably not depressed then. Either way feel better I guess. Read a book or something. I recommend the Bone series by Jeff Smith. It's a bit of a happy story with fun adventure.
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I think I'm depressed. I basically sat at home all day doing nothing. Couldn't bring myself to watch anything or play a game even.

Just sat thinking what I could watch or play or do and ended up doing nothing.

No human contact today either. Like I'm invisible today or something.

There's a depression thread which you can find here or you can join depression GAF's skype chat if you want. (though it's just getting started)
 
I think I'm depressed. I basically sat at home all day doing nothing. Couldn't bring myself to watch anything or play a game even.

Just sat thinking what I could watch or play or do and ended up doing nothing.

No human contact today either. Like I'm invisible today or something.

Well this is me as well, aside from having to go out to eat (And GAF of course) I had no human interaction either. I actually woke up at 2:00 pm, and have done absolutely nothing since.

I'm a bit scared to be falling into depression, being jobless is not helping, and I've had my history with depression, but I hope it will just go away soon. The sooner I get a job the better, but I feel zero energy to actually go out and look for one. I'm also eating really bad, I really need to get out of this, all those are just not good signs.

You should definitely do something about it if it continues though, you get blues once in a while and thats ok but when it becomes a constant is time to get worried.
 
I think is more complicated than just people living by prescripted, traditional gender roles.

For instance, I think the gay community is not immune to social labels. With this I mean that ever since being gay was more or less o.k in western cultures (around year 2000, will & grace, etc..), gays have been playing the same moronic game of building an exclusive community which sets them apart from everything else in an attempt to get acknowledge and accepted. The thing is that most of the straight people in 2012 won't give a damn about any guy or girl being gay, so all we are is a group of people behaving like gay society has taught us to do.

conclusion, we all like to fit somewhere and we will take measures to make sure we belong somewhere and by doing that, we will have to live our lives following traditional social roles ("I am gay, I must do this, like that, go to pride festivals and do whatever shit every gay guy does" ). In that sense we are as guilty as the typical straight girl who is extra needy and feels incomplete without a man and thinks a man must "earn" her. As guilty as the straight guy who thinks he must court thousands of girls and write 40 Okcupid messages per day because it's his role in society to "catch the prey".

but speaking only about sex, I think that many people are too busy trying to fit into a model that makes them feel comfortable and accepted and then sometimes a big part of their subjectivity goes into a dormant state and you settled down with some kind of behaviour.

for example, me, when I was 17 I really liked a female friend of mine, brunette, good looking, smart, a good pianist, also student from the music school. I asked her if she'd be my girlfriend and she rejected me. At the time I was very confused because I was already having fantasies with men. After the rejection, I had the chance to start something with a man and I did so, I felt loved and appreciated. After that, other friends came out being gay and all of a sudden I was in a gay enviroment, one in which I was and still am very happy. Because I felt that gay world had been kind to me, I didn't need to "look around" or "think about options" and since last march when I broke with my now ex-BF and started to have bad dates, I started to think about what was going on with me and I realized I had been a victim of my own life's prescription. I realized I was obsessively seeking that which gave me joy in the past (looking for tall guys, older, "I am incomplete, I need a man by my side" bullshit, blablabla) and that was completely wrong. Since I've realized that, I've been having an open mind an paying more attention to everything and everyone, every guy, every girl, short, tall, younger, older, etc. and I think, I am getting more from life that way.

I am definitely not over but it's such a long rant... I'll leave it there. thanks for reading! :D

I am trying to follow this mantra. It's what I had when I was 18/19. I would look at the person, not the type. Avoid being jaded and be open about people.
 
I think is more complicated than just people living by prescripted, traditional gender roles.

For instance, I think the gay community is not immune to social labels. With this I mean that ever since being gay was more or less o.k in western cultures (around year 2000, will & grace, etc..), gays have been playing the same moronic game of building an exclusive community which sets them apart from everything else in an attempt to get acknowledge and accepted. The thing is that most of the straight people in 2012 won't give a damn about any guy or girl being gay, so all we are is a group of people behaving like gay society has taught us to do.

I think your perspective is somewhat skewed. While acceptance in some capacity is certainly an important issue for many people, i don't think gays are truly building _exclusive_ communities for the _purpose_ of getting acknowledged and accepted. especially not the former.

The ones I've seen most of my life aren't really exclusive at all. They're groups of friends like any other group. They often just tend to include more queers in the same way lots of groups often tend to associate with like-minded people -- social support. You'll nearly always see this with minorities and even majorities to a point. They have a lot of things in common and so being friends is somewhat more congruent.

I know many gay people who don't associate much with lots of other gays. Even then, there are lots of pretty large sub-groups of gays that tend not to associate with one another. Again, not so much out of exclusivity, but more out of interests. It's pretty aligned with every other group in society.

In reference to Alcoori's thing, the gender role's thing has been rubbing me the wrong way a lot more recently. There are so many silly expectations people have about this stuff and how it relates to the relationships and all. I especially like some of the reactions lesbians get that have their basis in these. it's sad and funny.
 
I got busy working with Dead or Alive 5 OT. I'm happy with the work so far and pretty much done for most of the part (waiting for some renders of remaining cast and minor tweaks) so the thread is pretty much done already. I need to make the Google docs for the PSN ID and XBL gamertags. (Gonna be my first at making OT and Google docs wish me luck)

On the job hunt everything is still shit with not even a single call from any of the places I applied to. I'm used now to this but is still depressing since I do want to help my parents with the bills and have my own money to spend on whatever I want.

On the love side everything smooth with my BF we still talk pretty much the whole day everyday without getting bored and watch good and shitty (yet funny) movies and enjoy them no matter what happens. Today I introduced him to Showgirls. (We were laughing our asses off most of the movie) Also we started watching recently Batman Brave and the Bold series and we might continue watching Ranma 1/2 and Ah! My Goddess. I love him a lot and hopefully it all keep going as smoothly as it has been since January.

For most of the part everything seems to be alright :)
 
So who used to like dolls and dresses? because I did, it must be really weird growing up with parents that support non gender specific behavior, I can't even imagine how it would be like.

My cousin had Ariel and Belle dolls and I remember I didn't understand why. He's straight now. I never used dolls or dresses, my toy collection consisted of batman figures.
 
So who used to like dolls and dresses? because I did, it must be really weird growing up with parents that support non gender specific behavior, I can't even imagine how it would be like.

I played with my mum's old Barbies when I was really young and was always interested in whatever new stuff my sister got but I was primarily into my Ninja Turtles and Power Rangers. I also loved Sailor Moon and had a Sailor Venus doll. Though on the Power Rangers front...

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Fascinating article.

So who used to like dolls and dresses? because I did, it must be really weird growing up with parents that support non gender specific behavior, I can't even imagine how it would be like.

I have a sister (two years older) and thus I played a lot with her and her dolls.
Nowadays I enjoy playing Sims, which is basically a virtual doll house ;)
 
Fascinating article.

So who used to like dolls and dresses? because I did, it must be really weird growing up with parents that support non gender specific behavior, I can't even imagine how it would be like.

I had all kind of toys growing up, mostly non gender-specific stuff as I didn't like dolls, action figures save it for a Saint Seiya and a TMNT I still remember, or cars. I could spend hours with Playmobil, Lego and K'nex though. Or just playing with other kids at the street or riding my bike.
 
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