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The Dark Knight Rises |OT2| The Legend... Continues

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Guzim said:
No need for spoilers.

1. Yep, Bruce was freeing the other prisoners.

2. Bruce fixed the auto pilot. That was Bruce's way of telling Lucius that he was alive, and Alfred really did see Bruce.

3. I'll let this be answered by someone on the IMDB FAQ about the film.
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With the response you posted with three, I thought I'd point out that an option for disabling the device was drowning it with water. Probably going to guess that it wouldn't cause any fallout based on that.

Also drowning a fusion device with water reminds me of Spider-man 2. Anyone else?
 
Ah I see.

This is poetry.

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He was talking about that movie the whole time.

That's one big pile of poetry.

Yeah.
 
I haven't seen The Hobbit yet, but it would have to shit the bed something fierce to be more disappointing than TDKR. It would have to pull a Prometheus-level mud pie.
 
To build a cohesive narrative with a plot that, on the surface, sounds completely ridiculous and make it come off even semi-believable and realistic like Nolan was able to do is a monumental achievement in and of itself.
 
Heavy said:
To build a cohesive narrative with a plot that, on the surface, sounds completely ridiculous and make it come off even semi-believable and realistic like Nolan was able to do is a monumental achievement in and of itself.
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Yes, The Prestige is a huge achievement.
 
Scullibundo said:
Replicating plot beats/interactions and then shuffling them into different places. You don't want to get me started on TDKR using BB as a crutch.
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Go ahead.

TDKR references Begins a few times for obvious reasons, but I feel that all the best parts of the movie are scenes that were different from anything that happened in Begins. Bane's introduction, Batman's return, escaping the pit, both Bane fights, etc.
 
LeBrick James said:
Go ahead.

TDKR references Begins a few times for obvious reasons, but I feel that all the best parts of the movie are scenes that were different from anything that happened in Begins. Bane's introduction, Batman's return, escaping the pit, both Bane fights, etc.
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And I agree. The parts where we get unnecessary Begins flashbacks as an attempt to imbue scenes with some sort of import and poignancy are completely ruined by how lazily/clumsily those scenes come across. When Nolan relies on nostalgia to do all the work it ends up ringing hollow.

Then outside of the intelligence-insulting flashbacks, you have shit like Blake re-enacting Bruce's ascendance into the Batman that not only uses that nostalgia as a crutch, but ends up undermining the original scene.

TDKR is the most disappointing because I never thought Nolan could be so sloppy/lazy.
 
Scullibundo said:
And I agree. The parts where we get unnecessary Begins flashbacks as an attempt to imbue scenes with some sort of import and poignancy are completely ruined by how lazily/clumsily those scenes come across. When Nolan relies on nostalgia to do all the work it ends up ringing hollow.

Then outside of the intelligence-insulting flashbacks, you have shit like Blake re-enacting Bruce's ascendance into the Batman that not only uses that nostalgia as a crutch, but ends up undermining the original scene.

TDKR is the most disappointing because I never thought Nolan could be so sloppy/lazy.
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I thought the only part that Nolan relied on nostalgia was when Ra's haunted Bruce as he was passed out from the pain. A very necessary and cool scene i'd add. Not only because it was good to see Ra's again, but also because they used the opportunity to play with the idea that he's immortal, which was good fanservice.

I forgot to mention that Blake's ascendance into the Batman is another one of my favorite parts of the movie, easily the best ending in the series. I thought it made sense because Blake/Robin has a lot in common with Bruce, both in the comics/shows and especially in TDKR. They share a lot of the same pain. There will obviously come a time when Batman is needed again, and who better to take the challenge than the guy that understands Bruce to the point that he figured out who he was? It all makes sense when you just think of Blake as Robin.

For those reasons, it didn't undermine Bruce's arc at all imo. Since the beginning he thought the Batman could be everlasting, and there you have it.
 
It undermined what that scene meant to Bruce as a character. Bruce was finally confronting and embracing his fear, becoming it.

What the fuck do bats have to do with JGL? It's a cheap bit of nostalgic repetition that let's audiences know that JGL is going to be the next Batman, but doesn't make a lick of goddamn sense for that character outside of that. My point is that these nostalgic callbacks to Begins are lazy and cheap and thus feel forced, not that they don't make sense.
 
Scullibundo said:
It undermined what that scene meant to Bruce as a character. Bruce was finally confronting and embracing his fear, becoming it.

What the fuck do bats have to do with JGL? It's a cheap bit of nostalgic repetition that let's audiences know that JGL is going to be the next Batman, but doesn't make a lick of goddamn sense for that character outside of that. My point is that these nostalgic callbacks to Begins are lazy and cheap and thus feel forced, not that they don't make sense.
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I can agree with you here
 
Scullibundo said:
It undermined what that scene meant to Bruce as a character. Bruce was finally confronting and embracing his fear, becoming it.

What the fuck do bats have to do with JGL? It's a cheap bit of nostalgic repetition that let's audiences know that JGL is going to be the next Batman, but doesn't make a lick of goddamn sense for that character outside of that.
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I don't see how it cheapens what happened to Bruce at all. Why does it need to make sense for the character? They wanted to show he was going to become the next batman and what better way to do that than showing him going through the batcave and the same thing happening. It doesn't mean that he is overcoming his fear in the same way that Bruce does. The bats coming out had different meaning for each character.

TDKR had some problems but that scene and frankly the whole end to the movie were pretty much perfect to me.
 
AdventureRacing said:
I don't see how it cheapens what happened to Bruce at all. Why does it need to make sense for the character? They wanted to show he was going to become the next batman and what better way to do that than showing him going through the batcave and the same thing happening. It doesn't mean that he is overcoming his fear in the same way that Bruce does. The bats coming out had different meaning for each character.

TDKR had some problems but that scene and frankly the whole end to the movie were pretty much perfect to me.
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So I don't feel like it's forced as opposed to an organic scene.
 
Scullibundo said:
It undermined what that scene meant to Bruce as a character. Bruce was finally confronting and embracing his fear, becoming it.

What the fuck do bats have to do with JGL? It's a cheap bit of nostalgic repetition that let's audiences know that JGL is going to be the next Batman, but doesn't make a lick of goddamn sense for that character outside of that. My point is that these nostalgic callbacks to Begins are lazy and cheap and thus feel forced, not that they don't make sense.
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Obviously the bats would be explained through Bruce, inspiring him to make the bat his symbol. For his successor to also be heavily linked to bats would be way too coincidental. His potential, will, and similar reasons for fighting crime should be enough for him to be worthy of carrying on the symbol.
 
LeBrick James said:
Obviously the bats would be explained through Bruce, inspiring him to make the bat his symbol. For his successor to also be heavily linked to bats would be way too coincidental. His potential, will, and similar reasons for fighting crime should be enough for him to be worthy of carrying on the symbol.
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So you agree the bat scene that mirrors Bruce's was unnecessary?
 
Every single flashback in the movie was unnecessary. It showed absolutely no faith in the audience and felt shoehorned in to lazily give context to what was happening. Make no mistake, I'm not saying I have a problem with callbacks to Begins. I'm saying I have a problem with how sloppily Nolan handled those callbacks to the point of them feeling unnatural and breaking my engagement with what was going on in the film.
 
Scullibundo said:
Every single flashback in the movie was unnecessary. It showed absolutely no faith in the audience and felt shoehorned in to lazily give context to what was happening. Make no mistake, I'm not saying I have a problem with callbacks to Begins. I'm saying I have a problem with how sloppily Nolan handled those callbacks to the point of them feeling unnatural and breaking my engagement with what was going on in the film.
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He didn't even try to be subtle, that's one of my issues with the callbacks. Too forced.
 
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