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[Jackpot]

Agreed. The vitriol some have about this subject is completely unnecessary.

So wanting someone banned for promising to murder people in the event of their guns being taken = vitriolic.

Promising to murder people in the event of their guns being taken = no problem.

 

[Messypandas]

Honest question : Would playing iPad games instead of PC/console games not hold the same thrill for people?

So whats so inherently thrilling about firing live ammunition at a target range? Some kind of dick extension i'm not getting? Still puts holes through the targets i'm guessing.

 

[Kurdel]

I am sure those recently freed slaves did not have semi-automatic weapons or assault rifles.

That being said, I am all for the right to bear arms from the 19th century that take forever to reload, but can garanty your safety by scaring invaders or assaulters.

 

[TacticalFox88]

"Hey guys....we need to buy more Assault rifles!!!!!"

"...Why?"

"They're soon going to be outlawed by the Obama Administration! Quick, we need to hurry before it's too late!"

"....YEAH!"

"....Wait...if we buy weapons now that will soon be outlawed....won't we be in possession of illegal products and go to prison...?"

"....."

"....."

"...Fuck."

 

[Kurdel]

I think they are more in the vein of Charleston Heston : "from my cold dead hands".

 

[Dead Man]

"Hey guys....we need to buy more Assault rifles!!!!!"

"...Why?"

"They're soon going to be outlawed by the Obama Administration! Quick, we need to hurry before it's too late!"

"....YEAH!"

"....Wait...if we buy weapons now that will soon be outlawed....won't we be in possession of illegal products and go to prison...?"

"....."

"....."

"...Fuck."

Historically existing weapons have been grandfathered in. Hence the rush to buy more than you need so you can then sell once the value goes up. All of this assumes an AWB type peice of legislation is put in place. I would hope they would come up with something better than that.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

.

Weapons purchased before a ban typically get grandfathered in. If they didn't, then there would be an amnesty period where you are allowed to turn them in.

 

[Messypandas]

Wouldn't gun owners just see that kind of legislation of as the much fabled tyrannical government knocking down their door they've been dreading anyway? Thats why they're stockpiling up in the first place.

 

[stevematic]

"Hey guys....we need to buy more Assault rifles!!!!!"

"...Why?"

"They're soon going to be outlawed by the Obama Administration! Quick, we need to hurry before it's too late!"

"....YEAH!"

"....Wait...if we buy weapons now that will soon be outlawed....won't we be in possession of illegal products and go to prison...?"

"....."

"....."

"...Fuck."

I doubt any of these people are buying assault rifles.

 

[stevematic]

So whats so inherently thrilling about firing live ammunition at a target range? Some kind of dick extension i'm not getting? Still puts holes through the targets i'm guessing.

Why don't you go try it? (serious)

 

[cajunator]

So whats so inherently thrilling about firing live ammunition at a target range? Some kind of dick extension i'm not getting? Still puts holes through the targets i'm guessing.

Rubber bullets dont have the consistency or accuracy of quality ammunition. when you are target shooting, it is about consistent groupings of 4 or 5 shots, and being able to group 5 shots within a quarter inch of a spot on a target takes considerable practice and body control. Its a challenge, managing heat mirage, wind carry, and long distance viewing and patience. Something people can practice for years before they get it right. Its a challenge to do and a damned fun one.

 

[fastford58]

Child murderers waiting to happen.

Hate speech happening.

 

[Angelus Errare]

All I'm saying is this, guns get alot more slack than swords, crossbows and bows. In my state I can't carry any of them in public

 

[cajunator]

I just googled AR-15. Wow! Who that fuck would need such a thing either for personal protection or hunting?

Looks like the stuff Arnold and his men had in the first Predator.

uhhh...no.
Not even close.
Ar-15 is just like any other rifle.

 

[RoadHazard]

Damn, some people in this thread (and elsewhere)... Sometimes I'm just so fucking happy I don't live in the US, with your insane gun culture.

 

[fastford58]

In a situation where it's citizens versus the government, and we're assuming the military has sided with tyrant mcpresident

the US military has full armor, video cameras, drones, mines, grenades, SAWs, tanks, apcs, control over the supply of materiel, and can cripple any city by simply blowing up bridges and putting craters in airport runways. They wouldn't even need to shoot anybody, they could just take the infrastructure and bleed a resistance out in a matter of a week.

Guns are pretty worthless without ammo. Sure, you can forge your own, but the military would control the sources for it, and you wouldn't have enough to melt down nor the ability to melt it down.


You are honestly better off heading to Mexico or Canada or surrendering as a POW and waiting for NATO to liberate you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wn-l0Ahzgoc

 

[cajunator]

Damn, some people in this thread (and elsewhere)... Sometimes I'm just so fucking happy I don't live in the US, with your insane gun culture.

Actually, I'd be much more afraid to live in a place without guns.

 

[FyreWulff]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wn-l0Ahzgoc

I know how to make bullets.

I think you missed where I mentioned that your material to make bullets will be in scarce supply.

 

[Pandaman]

Actually, I'd be much more afraid to live in a place without guns.

that says more about you then the places without guns.

 

[spandexmonkey]

Actually, I'd be much more afraid to live in a place without guns.

Why is that?

 

[RoadHazard]

Actually, I'd be much more afraid to live in a place without guns.

Because you're part of the gun culture I'm talking about. You're raised to feel like you need a gun and to be afraid without one. I'm not.

 

[Dude Abides]

This isn't surprising. Fools and their money are soon parted.

 

[Curufinwe]

Actually, I'd be much more afraid to live in a place without guns.

Then you would be irrational because countries like NZ, Ireland and Australia that have less guns and tighter gun laws are much safer.

 

[ElectricBlue187]

Sometimes I'm just so fucking happy I don't live in the US, with your insane gun culture.

Hyperbole. I live in a red state and have gone my whole life without seeing a gun unless I went to a shooting range for fun. I don't own a gun nor will I probably but I can appreciate that some people do so responsibly.

 

[stevematic]

Then you would be irrational because countries like NZ, Ireland and Australia have less guns and tighter gun laws are much safer.

NZ laws aren't that tight (edit: in comparison to Australia).

Australia isn't safer because of our gun control.

 

[cajunator]

Why is that?

Would prefer to be able to legally arm myself for protection of life/property if I wanted to.
I don't have a concealed carry license personally at the moment but its nice to know I could.
a place that bans guns just means that when someone does have a gun, you are a sitting duck. Right now I have roommates with guns so its not as much of an issue, but when Im in my own place, I will probably buy a small handgun and get the license.
For most people, owning a gun is deterrent enough for an attacker to think twice.
Its really not a huge deal.
And yes, I have grown up all my life in an area that is very lax on guns and it feels as safe here as anywhere else.

 

[RoadHazard]

Hyperbole. I live in a red state and have gone my whole life without seeing a gun unless I went to a shooting range for fun. I don't own a gun nor will I probably but I can appreciate that some people do so responsibly.

"Insane gun culture" isn't really that much of a hyperbole when comparing the US to most of the rest of the civilized world. And sure, you can live your life without a gun in the US too, but the overall mentality is very, very different compared to where I am.

 

[VistraNorrez]

It's ultimately a culture thig isn't it? There is the fantasy in America that started from the fact that we defended ourselves from tyranny. We've turned it into such legend and mythology, through all forms of storytelling, that we truly believe we are the light cleansing the world of its darkness. And not only will we cleanse the world but it will be down in a picture perfect way. Only the bad guys will be hurt, and those bad guys are 100% evil so they deserve to die. There will be no negative psychological effects from our actions because they are 100% in the right. And we get to be Heroes. Forever celebrated as the epitome of what a human is supposed to be. And thanks to a trusty weapon we can remain secure in the knowledge of remaining heroes, allowing us to be the best heroes we can be.

Of course the people that bring the darkness feel almost exactly the same way. They come from same culture after all. When you glorify the heroes, and don't take the time to understand what people are really like, you glorify actions that can be interpreted the wrong way. The fascination slips to the villains and, as even less analysis is done on them, the good and bad start looking the same to those who feel rejected by the culture in some way.

I don't know the answer for lessening gun violence, or any violence, but it seems to me the pro-gun ad anti-gun people come from the same place: the mistrust of other people. I think getting rid of guns and making sure everyone has access to guns are natural reactions to that feeling. Maybe there is a middle ground (I'd have to think about it much longer with other people to come up with a reasonable idea). No one seems to want to consider that or especially that it is a culture thing and that objects can be a problem, too.

 

[cajunator]

Because you're part of the gun culture I'm talking about. You're raised to feel like you need a gun and to be afraid without one. I'm not.

Do you know why I personally feel the need to have a gun? Because my grandparents and aunt were murdered with one at their house, and if they had a gun in the house to deter my Uncle, they might be alive today. Perhaps they still might not, but we will never know. I would prefer to never face this situation, but being armed beats the hell out of not. But by all means, feel free to judge all of us and our reasons.

 

[Zeppu]

n/m. I'm late as fuck.

 

[ZimbAdam]

Do you know why I personally feel the need to have a gun? Because my grandparents and aunt were murdered with one at their house, and if they had a gun in the house to deter my Uncle, they might be alive today. Perhaps they still might not, but we will never know. I would prefer to never face this situation, but being armed beats the hell out of not. But by all means, feel free to judge all of us and our reasons.

Not to be a dick, but dude... Where did he get the gun from?

If the answer is from a gun store or from someone who got it at a gun store then your argument is ridiculous.

Sure, there are some guns in countries where guns are illegal, but there are so few that the chances of someone uninvolved in gang violence getting shot are beyond miniscule.

 

[NathanMcMahon]

you think 4.5 million high spenders is a number to ignore?
it's a culture. do not deny it.
guess those Deer aren't going to kill themselves also(along with wolves, bobcats, coyotes, cougars, elk, bears, etc etc etc)

Won't someone think of the crops from overpopulous animals!

 

[okdakor]

keep pointing fingers at each other and destroy yourselves while mental illness issues and bad parenting goes unchecked, and will continue to wreck havoc.

From the rest of the world to some US citizens : if you're a gun nut, needing "more" than a hunting rifle, then yes, you're probably mentally ill and also probably a bad parent... you are the one to keep in check

 

[RoadHazard]

Do you know why I personally feel the need to have a gun? Because my grandparents and aunt were murdered with one at their house, and if they had a gun in the house to deter my Uncle, they might be alive today. Perhaps they still might not, but we will never know. I would prefer to never face this situation, but being armed beats the hell out of not. But by all means, feel free to judge all of us and our reasons.

I'm very sorry that happened to you, but do you really think that would have been even close to as likely to happen in the first place had the US had stricter gun laws?

The US has a much higher firearm-related homicide rate than the rest of the western world, and there's a reason for that.

 

[Deadbeat]

Then you would be irrational because countries like NZ, Ireland and Australia that have less guns and tighter gun laws are much safer.

NZ allows people to own silencers. Theres no restrictions on them.

This is the problem when talking about gun laws. Every country has a different list of what you can and cant own where it doesnt make any sense when you compare them to one another. The one thing that is consistent is a firearms license. This is what we need to discuss. Not the type of guns you can own but the gate you must pass through to own them.

 

[cajunator]

Not to be a dick, but dude... Where did he get the gun from?

If the answer is from a gun store or from someone who got it at a gun store then your argument is ridiculous.

Sure, there are some guns in countries where guns are illegal, but there are so few that the chances of someone uninvolved in gang violence getting shot are beyond miniscule.

There are guns here from multiple generations. Its not like all the guns that have been here would just go away.
Also, my Uncle was abusive and unstable. He would have found some way to murder my aunt. Thats why he's currently in Angola and never getting out. This has not changed my view on guns in general though, nor has it changed my family's.
In any case I have said what Im gonna say about this so Ill leave you guys to it.

 

[stevematic]

I'm very sorry that happened to you, but do you really think that would have been even close to as likely to happen in the first place had the US had stricter gun laws?

The US has a much higher firearm-related homicide rate than the rest of the western world, and there's a reason for that.

It's also decreased by 44% in the past twenty years despite gun ownership increasing.

 

[_machine]

It's also decreased by 44% in the past twenty years despite gun ownership increasing.

Guess what happened in '94?

And it's on the rise now whilst numerous other death causes are dropping.

 

[Deadbeat]

edit: post below covers it.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

Guess what happened in '94?

And it's on the rise now whilst numerous other death causes are dropping.

Ah yes the chart using linear projection on something clearly not linear and including suicides to pad the numbers.

 

[stevematic]

Guess what happened in '94?

And it's on the rise now whilst numerous other death causes are dropping.

Hmm, a ban on assault weapons which make up for the least amount of gun crime. Shouldn't it have stopped the Columbine shooting?

EDIT: Also like the above says, it's including suicide.

 

[Scuderia]

It seems that guns aren't the real problem, it's the mentality of the people who own them.

 

[Onion_Relish]

It seems that guns aren't the real problem, it's the mentality of the people who own them.

It's both. Look at any other civilised country and try to deny this. In china gun related fatalities are next to 0. Wanna know why? No fucking guns. Even in places like Canada where there are actually lots of guns, shootings are still incredibly small in number and relegated almost solely to gang violence, not homicidal maniacs who shoot people for complaining about their pizza taking too long to cook.

The American gun culture is perverse, the sheer amount of hardware is insane, and the will to use it is too strong. Perhaps Americans find it hard to look at their own culture, but us on the outside can see it pretty clearly.

 

[Deadbeat]

It's both. Look at any other civilised country and try to deny this. In china gun related fatalities are next to 0. Wanna know why? No fucking guns. Even in places like Canada where there are actually lots of guns, shootings are still incredibly small in number and relegated almost solely to gang violence, not homicidal maniacs who shoot people for complaining about their pizza taking too long to cook.

You just contradicted your point. First you are saying countries with few guns have low gun crime then you say canada with lots of guns has low gun crime.

So what is it? Whats the solution?

 

[qwerty2k]

I do find the american gun mentality utterly baffling and their 'reasons' for owning guns are imo flimsy.

 

[Scuderia]

It's both. Look at any other civilised country and try to deny this. In china gun related fatalities are next to 0. Wanna know why? No fucking guns. Even in places like Canada where there are actually lots of guns, shootings are still incredibly small in number and relegated almost solely to gang violence, not homicidal maniacs who shoot people for complaining about their pizza taking too long to cook.

The American gun culture is perverse, the sheer amount of hardware is insane, and the will to use it is too strong. Perhaps Americans find it hard to look at their own culture, but us on the outside can see it pretty clearly.

This further validates what i was saying though, other countries with lots of guns aren't complete nutters about it.

 

[stevematic]

I do find the american gun mentality utterly baffling and their 'reasons' for owning guns are imo flimsy.

Why are they "flimsy"?

 

[Onion_Relish]

You just contradicted your point. First you are saying countries with few guns have low gun crime then you say canada with lots of guns has low gun crime.

So what is it? Whats the solution?

I didn't contradict my own point. In reality, canada has a lot of guns in comparison to most countries howber it pales in comparison to the united states. As I clearly point out, the American gun culture itself is to be blamed, that is the first thing that needs to be fixed. Secondly, the sheer amount of guns cannot be divorced from their nature. Canada has a lot of guns because we have a lot of hunters. Canada also does not have ready access to smg/ar style weaponry. My family owns four guns even though they are only owned by my stepdad who hunts game and birds during the winter/summer months. We have two rifles and two shotguns, one of which is a .22. None of these guns are in any way shape or form suitable for shooting rampages. Also, GASP, they are trigger locked. This is the difference. The meaning and utility of these guns is clearly demarcated for one thing, hunting, not killing.

As I said in the beginning. its both.

 

[_machine]

Why are they "flimsy"?

Guns for "protection" doesn't simply add up in the statistics, whilst the amount of guns has a definite link to the amount of firearm related deaths. You can use guns for recreational purposes like at ranges or hunting where private owning is mostly banned. Not to mention the whole "we need guns for freedom and to protect from becoming a police state".

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/research/hicrc/firearms-research/guns-and-death/index.html

 

[Deadbeat]

Canada has a lot of guns because we have a lot of hunters. Canada also does not have ready access to smg/ar style weaponry..

Wrong.

http://www.tacticalimports.ca/nonrestricted-firearms-c-1.html

http://www.tacticalimports.ca/restricted-firearms-c-44.html

Anyone here play Max Payne 3? You want a Famae SAF? Here you go.

Semi auto .50 cal bmg rifle right here.

Canada's only commercially available semi-automatic bullpup .50 BMG. Brought to you exclusively by Tactical Imports Corp.

Heres what Wolverine Supplies has available.

8.5 inch pump action shotgun. Non Restricted.