[Eurogamer\DF] Orbis Unmasked: what to expect from the next-gen PlayStation.

thuway said:
For those of you who want backwards compatibility, have you looked at this:

Backwards Compatibility Adaptor - an add-on that enables BC.

http://www.complex.com/video-games/...and-backwards-compatibility-add-on-discovered

I assume it is a Cell processor with some other doohickeys to emulate RSX. Your thoughts?
Click to expand...


The perfect solution for not just Sony but consumers as well, if i could play my PS1, PS2 and PS3 games with this add-on i would be it in a instant as long as its not too pricey.

The masses wont care about old PS2 games, but i think the enthusiast gamer will very much care for this.
 
DBT85 said:
You are not going to get digital content from your PS3 working on your PS4 unless they manage to get ALL PS3 games running.

They are the same games, just distributed differently.
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This.

We are not talking about different phisical support (like digital PSP games on Vita), since Orbis will have Blu-ray drive.
PSN games are no different than retail ones. Sure, loading via HDD/SSD may be faster, but that's it.

Forget about BC unless Sony goes for a superior SKU with PS3 components in it (Cell, RSX) or makes a dongle like the one thuway posted.
 
i-Lo said:
It'll be no different this gen. The devs will learn to utilize resources better (with new things like tessellation) and come up with the ultimate rendition of what's possible on the next gen during its twilight years. If you have reason to doubt this, then you're welcome to wait and watch.
Click to expand...

Not doubting, just skeptical. I do hope you're right though, it will mean better games for all of us.
 
What would a PS360 simply with the amounts of ram being hypothesized here be capable of?? just sheer curiosity here.

For the average dude bro gamer what do these predicted consoles mean for games like COD and BF? Assuming support of more players and larger maps...basically PC play.

I also want to go on record that I predict the orbis will look like the S5100 bluray player.
 
GodofWine said:
What would a PS360 simply with the amounts of ram being hypothesized here be capable of?? just sheer curiosity here.

For the average dude bro gamer what do these predicted consoles mean for games like COD and BF? Assuming support of more players and larger maps...basically PC play.

I also want to go on record that I predict the orbis will look like the S5100 bluray player.
Click to expand...
That is sexy as fuck, I'll take it!
 
Damn!

This thread is becoming littered with crazy comments!

These are all rumors until Sony or Microsoft announce something.

Doesn't matter how much you guys fight over which processor or how much ram they'll have, you don't know anything until they announce solid info.
 
NinjaFusion said:
more than £299 in the current UK economy is going to be a tough sell.... it guess they could try and keep current gen at the £249+bundle level to justify a £349 price range, but personally i think over 300 for the base hardware would be a mistake.
Click to expand...

Considering the PS3 super slim 500gb is £250 and still selling, don't expect the PS4 to be in the £300 price bracket.

Oblivion said:
Okay, so Orbis will have 1 gig less RAM for gaming than Durango, but Orbis has a way better type of RAM than Durango.

So...which ones wins on the memory front?
Click to expand...

Speaking purely on that comparison, without doubt Orbis. You're talking ram that has 2-3 times more bandwidth, something that is ever more important as graphical features get more intensive and demanding.

Having said that, it's not a fair comparison because Durango is expected to have Esram to compensate for the slower DDR3 ram, so we'll have to wait and see.
 
DBT85 said:
We win.
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Pretty much this.

Just like this generation, the difference between graphics on these two systems will be negligible. They'll both be fantastic. The bigger question I have is if the market is big enough to successfully sustain another generation with two systems of equal power.

Proelite said:
Graphics whores are in for a treat the start of next generation.

That's all I will say.
Click to expand...

Exactly.
 
DBT85 said:
We win.
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Pretty much. Both consoles seem close enough in specs that we'll never see games horribly gimped on one platform vs the other like we did with this gen. No more Bayonetta situations. I am so happy for that, it means everyone wins.
 
nib95 said:
Considering the PS3 super slim 500gb is £250 and still selling, don't expect the PS4 to be in the £300 price bracket.
Click to expand...

I thought it was around £230 most places? ShopTo are doing it for £200 plus a game for instance.

I can't see PS4 costing more than £299, there is nothing revolutionary going into it really.
 
nib95 said:
Considering the PS3 super slim 500gb is £250 and still selling, don't expect the PS4 to be in the £300 price bracket.
Click to expand...

The 500gb is down to £230, and if we assume PS4 will launch around October - December kind of time they could drop that down to £175 and bring the PS4 in at £330-£350. Nothing we have heard of so far is particularly expensive in the PS4 but they would need to keep some distance between both in order for the PS4 to sell. I doubt that £425 is going to happen again this time out.

I think Microsfot and Sony could both have dropped the price of their current offerings further if they wanted, but by this point they are both probably making a nice sum on the hardware and both are trying to claw back as much as possible from the start of the generation.
 
DBT85 said:
He said $400 not £250. You can't just do a direct currency exchange because that never ever works out to be the case.

If the consoles are $400 then the'll also be €400 and then about £330-350. Direct currency conversions from the dollar would make it £252 and €300 which we know nobody adheres to.

That iPad you are talking about is £400 in the UK, but only $500 in the US, not the $634 a direct currency conversion would suggest.


Also your post seems to suggest (apologies if I'm misreading) that they start at a high price just so that they can reduce the price later on to keep it fresh. They start at a high price because it costs them a high price to design, manufacture and ship the product only to then sell it typically at launch at a loss. They reduce the price yes to keep it ticking over, but only because the price of manufacturing has dropped in the first place.

Compared again to your iPad which is sold for a handy profit for everyone involved.


My thoughts on the subject are that it'll be $€400/£330-350 for the lowest SKU with a more expensive one with some pack ins and a larger HDD.

What I do NOT want to see is the lowest SKU being a gimped version of the console. No HDD is fine (on the logical assumption I can put my own in), but no less ports or anything like we saw with the PS3 launch.
Click to expand...
You are right they don't do a direct currency, hence why the PS3 was £425 here €499 in EU and $599 in the US
Wait that was direct currency, sorry only Nintendo & MS have the balls to charge $300 in the US and charge people in the UK £300
 
kharma45 said:
I thought it was around £230 most places? ShopTo are doing it for £200 plus a game for instance.

I can't see PS4 costing more than £299, there is nothing revolutionary going into it really.
Click to expand...

I thought rrp was still £250?

Anyway, no way in hell the PS4 is £299. Quote my post later and mock me of the impossible happens, but I just can't see it being the case. People are saying nothing in this is particularly expensive, but if you were to buy parts closest to these for a gaming pc, just think how much it would cost. Obviously they barely make any profit on these, sometimes even a loss, but my guess is still £350-£400. Guess we'll have to wait and see.


The economy is struggling at the moment, especially gaming side, so it'd certainly be hugely beneficial for them to keep the price lower. £425 like the PS3 would be suicide. I think past £350 they're cutting away a huge portion of their buyers, even past £300 really. But due to early adopters and new tech, I don't see £299 being realistic.
 
DBT85 said:
The 500gb is down to £230, and if we assume PS4 will launch around October - December kind of time they could drop that down to £175 and bring the PS4 in at £330-£350. Nothing we have heard of so far is particularly expensive in the PS4 but they would need to keep some distance between both in order for the PS4 to sell. I doubt that £425 is going to happen again this time out.

I think Microsfot and Sony could both have dropped the price of their current offerings further if they wanted, but by this point they are both probably making a nice sum on the hardware and both are trying to claw back as much as possible from the start of the generation.
Click to expand...


UK price will be based on the euro price, the euro price will be based on the dollar price

So my guess would be a base sku at $399/€399/£339 (euro to pound rate is bad at the moment, and maybe a higher end sku at $499/£€499/£429
 
Proelite said:
Graphics whores are in for a treat the start of next generation.

That's all I will say.
Click to expand...

We are listening.

3525859742_bd86e015c22.jpg
 
nib95 said:
I thought rrp was still £250?

Anyway, no way in hell the PS4 is £299. Quote my post later and mock me of the impossible happens, but I just can't see it being the case. People are saying nothing in this is particularly expensive, but if you were to buy parts closest to these for a gaming pc, just think how much it would cost. Obviously they barely make any profit on these, sometimes even a loss, but my guess is still £350-£400. Guess we'll have to wait and see.
Click to expand...

It may not be as crazy as you think. It may have launched at £425 but Sony scrambled and got the revision out in 6 months flat with a £299 price....

Though I am leaning toward £350 myself.
 
Have any GAF insiders put their necks on the line with 'quote me on release day' statements regarding Orbis/Durango specs? Or is everyone still guessing?
 
Oblivion said:
Wasn't trying to start a fight. Was actually legitimately curious on the tech front. I know both will clearly be absolute graphical monsters, that goes without saying.
Click to expand...

Monsters?
Anyway, Orbis wins unless Durango has an entire sleeve out of sight.
On the memory front at least I'd say Orbis is the outright winner. Sounds far better and really good balance. Durango sounds like a tradeoff for more RAM over faster RAM because of the size of the OS.

Will probably start to affect stuff mid gen onwards.
 
thuway said:
Why are people so fixated on the CPU? It wasn't a bottleneck this generation, and it won't be a bottleneck next gen either. Developers have designed engines that are pretty indicative of which hardware pieces offer the most substantial performance increase.
Click to expand...

No, apparently the bottleneck is the fucking speed of RAM...

Fanboys will be fanboys...
 
As far as BC goes I personally dont care about it, Id rather they focus all their hardware efforts/costs on new tech for PS4 games. However some have suggested that putting in an inexpensive updated cell chip could give the system ps3/ps2/ps1 hardware BC while at the same time boosting overall performance (including ps4 games). If that's the case then it's no brainer.

I'm pretty ignorant tech wise so I have absolutely no idea how plausible this is.
 
grimshawish said:
Monsters?
Anyway, Orbis wins unless Durango has an entire sleeve out of sight.
On the memory front at least I'd say Orbis is the outright winner. Sounds far better and really good balance. Durango sounds like a tradeoff for more RAM over faster RAM because of the size of the OS.

Will probably start to affect stuff mid gen onwards.
Click to expand...

I'm certain Sony first party will want to show off the benefits of that GDDR5 even early on. Unless Microsoft has a good amount of Esram or something else in the works, the ram bandwidth advantage will be a big trump card for Sony. Only with the more competent devs mind.
 
TGO said:
You are right they don't do a direct currency, hence why the PS3 was £425 here €499 in EU and $599 in the US

Wait that was direct currency, sorry only Nintendo & MS have the balls to charge $300 in the US and charge people in the UK £300
Click to expand...

Erm,

Apple charge $499 for an iPad that costs £400 (£314) in the UK
Sony charged $€249 for the WiFi Vita that cost £230 (£157) in the UK
PS3 500GB w/Ass Creed is $299 but a 500GB PS3 with no game is £230 (£188) in the UK

The prices in brackets are direct currency conversions from $ to £ which you claim only Microsoft and Nintendo have the balls to do.


In addition, the PS3 console we got in the EU launch has hardware missing from the US version, so it wasn't even the same equipment for comparison, and was released 6 months later so costs should have come down. Despite that we got charged £425 which is (at the exchange rate at the time of about 1.95:1) $820!

Every time shit launches people bitch that the UK price is more than it should be, and that is down to the fact that it is never a direct currency conversion from dollar to pound.

mrklaw said:
UK price will be based on the euro price, the euro price will be based on the dollar price

So my guess would be a base sku at $399/€399/£339 (euro to pound rate is bad at the moment, and maybe a higher end sku at $499/£€499/£429
Click to expand...

I agree entirely. Maybe the higher SKU will only be a larger HDD so might only be an extra $50 though.

Oblivion said:
Wasn't trying to start a fight. Was actually legitimately curious on the tech front. I know both will clearly be absolute graphical monsters, that goes without saying.
Click to expand...

I know, it's just impossible to conclusively say until we get come concrete numbers. Enough people on here are scratching their heads as to why MS want 3GB for the OS, we don;t know the final answer on ESRAM etc.

At this stage the only thing we can conclusively say is that we will in.
 
Mr.Green said:
No, apparently the bottleneck is the fucking speed of RAM...

Fanboys will be fanboys...
Click to expand...

In previous generation CPU speed wasn't bottleneck because both consoles provided leaps and beyond better CPUs than PC market had at that time. Hell even today both proccesors aren't that bad.

And Ram was bottleneck of x360 and ps3 same as bath-wind. With use of better GFX and bigger ram pool you NEED better bandwidth

That has hardly to with fanboyism
 
Perkel said:
In previous generation CPU speed wasn't bottleneck because both consoles provided leaps and beyond better CPUs than PC market had at that time. Hell even today both proccesors aren't that bad.

And Ram was bottleneck of x360 and ps3 same as bath-wind. With use of better GFX and bigger ram pool you NEED better bath-wind.

That has hardly to with fanboyism
Click to expand...
What will we do without quality bath wind?
 
shinobi602 said:
Pretty much.
Click to expand...

Well it depends. I was expecting to get at least a solid 70fps from the GTX680 i bought running with an overclocked i7 2600K with everything turned to max at 1080p on unigine heaven 3.0 - yes i understand it's just one benchmark and not a closed system, still it's far more powerful hardware than what's going into these consoles. All i got was 47 fps meaning potentially no (minmum 30fps) 3D at 1080p with everything maxed out in graphically intensive games in the near future.

Where does this fit in? Well it comes to the point of being impressed. I'm rather tired of being impressed in spite of the hardware i.e. thinking "it's amazing what they've done with this hardware". No, i want to be impressed off the bat by the hardware itself and that's what would have been accomplished had the GTX680, in my example, fulfilled my expectation.

So i really don't believe that i will be impressed by the games being developed on these consoles but the great thing for me is i can't be disappointed since my expectations are more realistic.

The one thing that has impressed me recently has been raytracing but that's evidently not coming to these consoles
 
GodofWine said:
What would a PS360 simply with the amounts of ram being hypothesized here be capable of?? just sheer curiosity here.

For the average dude bro gamer what do these predicted consoles mean for games like COD and BF? Assuming support of more players and larger maps...basically PC play.

I also want to go on record that I predict the orbis will look like the S5100 bluray player.
Click to expand...

sony-s5100-blue-ray-player-1.jpg


Ok, WOW.

Probably the best design ever.
 
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