The show actually exists within the Troll 2 universe.
House of Cards - S1 on Netflix - Spacey & Fincher - *UNMARKED SPOILERS FOR ALL OF S1*
- Thread starter Cornballer
- Start date
- Status
The show actually exists within the Troll 2 universe.
EightBitNate
Member
These have to be the longest credits ever.
fallengorn
Bitches love smiley faces
Ooh, I can't wait until a representative from Nillbog comes to Washington.
I Big JG I
Banned
11 in and loving it
Fantastical
Death Prophet
Yeah that's really annoying.
The show is really interesting. Just when Spacey does something i like they manage to pull off some seriously low shit and then win the battle.
The tv interview
where he messes up was brilliant. Felt good. The meeting following made me hate him so much.
Has anyone watched both the American and the British version of this show? If so how similar are they? I watched the British one ages ago and loved it, and am anticipating this show. I hope that this version builds on the original and doesn't just go over the same themes without adding anything.
He's a fantastic character. Both him and his wife are fascinating.
I think Spacey is just playing the character he was in 'Midnight in The Garden of Good and Evil'. I think he was some asshole southern lawyer in that movie.
But yes he is amazing.
From what I've read from someone earlier in this thread was that the first episodes were similar to the British version however it becomes its own entity after the first few episodes.
also:
didn't she have a giant bruise on her face the first time around? Or am I just imagining that?
Unlikely. Underwood will have Walker resign/impeached by the end of the next season. If they plan to end it he'll fall as Urquhardt did in the book, or he will kill off Zoe and the series will go on to how he governs.
I like Homeland but I agree. I just can't believe the quality of this show coming from Netflix. If this is a sign of things to come, it's a pretty amazing future for episodic content.
Last ep
I found it funny how much of a figurehead he is. He was totally oblivious to all that was happening with frank getting the nom
Yeah, though fantastic episode otherwise. Hopefully this keeps up, past couple of episodes had been somewhat a drag.
cartoon_soldier
Member
I haven't watched the BBC version so I'm not aware of what happened but yeah, I suppose 2016 would be quite the time jump. I'm very interested in how Francis governs and considering he will be under media scrutiny 24/7 it will be difficult for him to carry out his plans secretly such as sneak out and murder someone.
Yeah it's fascinating just how out of the loop the president is. I do wonder however if he is as oblivious as we think, he might have an incline of some of the things Francis may be up to due to his billionaire friend
I wouldn't underestimate mad men.
Slurpy2k20
Member
Just finished ep 7. What a good fucking show. Didnt expect him to be the type to go down on a chick. Also, while on the phone with her dad? Amazing. Also, I have a feeling he's building up Russo just so he can fuck him over royally afterwards. I feel sorry for the guy already. Spacey is just Godly in this role. I didn't expect much from a Netflix exclusive, but this has shot up to be one of my favorite shows.
I love Madmen, but it would have to be twice as good as last season.
Nobody should beat Kevin Spacey though. Nobody.
Just saw the first episode. (not really sure if these are even spoilers but I'll put them in tags anyway)
Ep 1:
This is going to be great I can feel it.
Ep 1:
Very interesting style with the guy talking straight to the audience. My first impression during the first couple of minutes wasn't very good though, it sort of felt like Damages which I didn't really like (didn't even finish the first season). But it got better and better and by the end I was hooked. Not like Damages which has a nice build up but doesn't deliver.
Very tense, very gripping. A nice and familiar cast too. If I didn't have to get up in a couple of hours I would continue watching it.
Very tense, very gripping. A nice and familiar cast too. If I didn't have to get up in a couple of hours I would continue watching it.
This is going to be great I can feel it.
Fantastical
Death Prophet
I'm really excited to dig into this. Unfortunately, I don't have a lot of time to dedicate to full episodes, but these glowing reviews are very encouraging.
I thought it was pretty obvious Walker was nothing more than a puppet that looked good with a great smile. In the pilot Frank pretty much said how capable he was at politics, but that isnt why he won. He didnt have a ton of experience, but you find out later early in Walkers career Tusk gained his absolute trust/loyalty and vice versa, so he will follow whatever advice Tusk gives him. Doubtful Tusk is going to tell him everything, just like he wont tell Frank everything. Tusk knows now how ruthless Frank is and his ability to get his agenda passed.
I question now if it is all an act and Tusk is going to punish Frank for his past actions now that he has a higher profile. Tusk is a powerful enough man to squash Skorsky story should he find out, but it is also a way to keep Frank in line. Frank wants Walker out, but unless Tusk gains absolute trust he wont let Walker fall. Now I could see something happen and Walker decide to step aside in the next election, so Frank can take the seat only if Frank produces more results on Tusks needs to gain a bigger legacy.
If Frank gets the VP seat and gets Tusk the relation he needs with the Chinese, he will be untouchable by any news report, unless they have proof Frank killed Russo. People are going to end up taking the fall for Frank, but its hard to imagine he would have put Frank into the VP seat without having a plan to shield him from any past action. He has the power and resources to know exactly what all Frank has been up to especially with Remy and a mole on Franks staff. Walker can get the bills signed, but Frank has the power to get it through congress unlike Walker.
If Zoe, Skorsky or Lucas get in the way, they will get run over and possibly killed. If he doesnt go after them directly, he will go after every source they come up with and either buy them off or make them disappear, so their story is seen as a crazy conspiracy theory. I think Tusk is well aware of the story they are working on and I would be shocked if he doesnt have a plan in place to save Frank or kill his career in another plan.
Frank has warned Zoe from the beginning, he was going to hurt her and discard her as well as told her if the boat tips over he can only save one of them. No way does Tusk let Frank go down if he is producing results with the Chinese. Frank is smart enough to give him some results, but not give him everything at once. Given Frank has his person as the head of the State department as well as the DNC behind him, the black caucus and the few independents who now feel they owe him, he can get it done, if he chooses.
If Skorsky, Zoe and Lucas find Frank scary, they have no idea how ruthless and what lengths Tusk will do to keep his people in power. Depending on how many seasons they have planned, Frank will play ball with Tusk in return for the same kind of favors. How long that will last is anyone's guess, but Franks goal has been to take out the whale and doubtful he is going to stop until he is above Walker. In a way he already is, but Frank wants the most power and VP wont be enough. Walker is a face, but Frank produces and as long as he produces for the right people, he is protected.
Given how much money he spent on stopping Frank by investing in Sancorp, he could buy out slugline through another company and end everyone's career there. The owner has already said she would sell out, and given a 150 million dollar check, I could see her selling quickly. So many possibilities for next season. I know a lot of things are more dramatic and over the top, but it is clear that lobbyist and the richest people in the world control the governments around the world. In many ways I want to hate Frank, but its seem he want the best for the country overall and when someone is hurt by his actions, he tries to repay them and get them back on their feet. If people thought Frank was ruthless, I cant imagine how intense Tusk can get with his mentality and enough money to buy anything or anyone he wants.
I question now if it is all an act and Tusk is going to punish Frank for his past actions now that he has a higher profile. Tusk is a powerful enough man to squash Skorsky story should he find out, but it is also a way to keep Frank in line. Frank wants Walker out, but unless Tusk gains absolute trust he wont let Walker fall. Now I could see something happen and Walker decide to step aside in the next election, so Frank can take the seat only if Frank produces more results on Tusks needs to gain a bigger legacy.
If Frank gets the VP seat and gets Tusk the relation he needs with the Chinese, he will be untouchable by any news report, unless they have proof Frank killed Russo. People are going to end up taking the fall for Frank, but its hard to imagine he would have put Frank into the VP seat without having a plan to shield him from any past action. He has the power and resources to know exactly what all Frank has been up to especially with Remy and a mole on Franks staff. Walker can get the bills signed, but Frank has the power to get it through congress unlike Walker.
If Zoe, Skorsky or Lucas get in the way, they will get run over and possibly killed. If he doesnt go after them directly, he will go after every source they come up with and either buy them off or make them disappear, so their story is seen as a crazy conspiracy theory. I think Tusk is well aware of the story they are working on and I would be shocked if he doesnt have a plan in place to save Frank or kill his career in another plan.
Frank has warned Zoe from the beginning, he was going to hurt her and discard her as well as told her if the boat tips over he can only save one of them. No way does Tusk let Frank go down if he is producing results with the Chinese. Frank is smart enough to give him some results, but not give him everything at once. Given Frank has his person as the head of the State department as well as the DNC behind him, the black caucus and the few independents who now feel they owe him, he can get it done, if he chooses.
If Skorsky, Zoe and Lucas find Frank scary, they have no idea how ruthless and what lengths Tusk will do to keep his people in power. Depending on how many seasons they have planned, Frank will play ball with Tusk in return for the same kind of favors. How long that will last is anyone's guess, but Franks goal has been to take out the whale and doubtful he is going to stop until he is above Walker. In a way he already is, but Frank wants the most power and VP wont be enough. Walker is a face, but Frank produces and as long as he produces for the right people, he is protected.
Given how much money he spent on stopping Frank by investing in Sancorp, he could buy out slugline through another company and end everyone's career there. The owner has already said she would sell out, and given a 150 million dollar check, I could see her selling quickly. So many possibilities for next season. I know a lot of things are more dramatic and over the top, but it is clear that lobbyist and the richest people in the world control the governments around the world. In many ways I want to hate Frank, but its seem he want the best for the country overall and when someone is hurt by his actions, he tries to repay them and get them back on their feet. If people thought Frank was ruthless, I cant imagine how intense Tusk can get with his mentality and enough money to buy anything or anyone he wants.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Episode 5, Union stuff:
(I highly doubt the average viewer is going to care about that, of course)
I think the portrayal of the teamsters as borderline animals, basically like rabid paid homeless people, was pretty problematic. I think the ethnic dimension was a problem, but I think the political dimension was even more of one--the issues being debated in the education bill are substantive ones, and real educators would be concerned with them, and I think real union members would be concerned with them in solidarity, in particular the provisions concerning collective bargaining. I think portraying the picketers as a rowdy mob, commanded by a lobbyist, rather than as literate and articulate individuals, is pretty gross. The framing of the issue dimensions had been pretty vibrant and nuanced up until now, but this seemed very base and obvious. Too bad.
(I highly doubt the average viewer is going to care about that, of course)
I won't lie. A lot of that went over my head. But:
weren't the picketers mostly just people off the street, not actual union members?
Pretty sure they said just grab anybody that looks smart so you dont know for sure who they were.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
[Episode 7]
WTF @ Claire giving a handjob to the dying bodyguard at the hospital! O__O
JeTmAn81
Member
That's what I actually thought she'd do so I guess that means the character work is consistent.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
I mean, that's what I thought would happen too, but it was still a WTF moment.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
(episode 5 continued)
As of the end of episode 5, the coolest filmed shot I've seen is when
I love the show's logo. The US flag flown upside down is only to be done in situations of extreme distress, dire peril. And there are no stars. No stars means no states. Very cool image.
I also like the use of news footage in the show. They use real networks, not fake ones, and the fonts and banner sizes are less fake looking than most shows (still not real, perhaps because if they dumped all the real garbage news networks put on screen, the viewers would be visually confused).
The initial dialogue inside the union office might lead you to believe it, but listen closely. He first says "Get me 200 teachers", and then when the aide reacts as though that's a tough order, he says "fine, then, just get me 200 bodies"--he then follows-up with a remark about the Teamsters, and there's a throwaway line like "Tell 'em to dress smart and we'll give 'em glasses if we need to".
The implication is that as a union organizer, he's calling in members of other unions. He's also involved with getting the hotel staff to disallow the event, as well, right?
And then when the party decides to give the food to the protest, Spacey says directly to the viewer, something along the lines of "Nothing can come between Teamsters and food." -- which is actually a pretty hilarious joke given the stories I've heard about Hollywood filming craft services tables.
Up until this point, the show characterizes the union reps as smart people fighting for their own interests, which is fine. But at this point, suddenly they're kind of portrayed as almost animalistic, it's pretty gross. The protestor who is in focus in the shot in particular is visually disgusting to look at, practically foaming at the mouth, clearly physically dirty. As a critique of a union protest, that's pretty crummy politics.
But if it's not a union protest, then you can read the shot as primarily racial. A group full of wealthy whites delivering food to an angry pack of largely non-white people, portrayed in a kind of animal fashion.
I only mention it because this is a very meticulous show in terms of its visual composition. There are many, many, many shots that I've paused and said "wow, I totally get what they're going for here", so I'm fairly confident I'm not reading something into nothing when I notice something
The implication is that as a union organizer, he's calling in members of other unions. He's also involved with getting the hotel staff to disallow the event, as well, right?
And then when the party decides to give the food to the protest, Spacey says directly to the viewer, something along the lines of "Nothing can come between Teamsters and food." -- which is actually a pretty hilarious joke given the stories I've heard about Hollywood filming craft services tables.
Up until this point, the show characterizes the union reps as smart people fighting for their own interests, which is fine. But at this point, suddenly they're kind of portrayed as almost animalistic, it's pretty gross. The protestor who is in focus in the shot in particular is visually disgusting to look at, practically foaming at the mouth, clearly physically dirty. As a critique of a union protest, that's pretty crummy politics.
But if it's not a union protest, then you can read the shot as primarily racial. A group full of wealthy whites delivering food to an angry pack of largely non-white people, portrayed in a kind of animal fashion.
I only mention it because this is a very meticulous show in terms of its visual composition. There are many, many, many shots that I've paused and said "wow, I totally get what they're going for here", so I'm fairly confident I'm not reading something into nothing when I notice something
As of the end of episode 5, the coolest filmed shot I've seen is when
Spacey is intimidating the cokehead congressman into compliance. When he delivers his "I need your absolute loyalty" line, he's hunched over, leaning into the congressman's personal space. What it actually reminded me of was another famous Southern Democrat... Lyndon Johnson, who was well known for making use of his height in political negotiations. Spacey doesn't have half Johnson's height, so the shot is framed with the other congressman sitting down so the effect still holds.
I love the show's logo. The US flag flown upside down is only to be done in situations of extreme distress, dire peril. And there are no stars. No stars means no states. Very cool image.
I also like the use of news footage in the show. They use real networks, not fake ones, and the fonts and banner sizes are less fake looking than most shows (still not real, perhaps because if they dumped all the real garbage news networks put on screen, the viewers would be visually confused).
As interesting and fascinating Kevin Spacey's character is in this show, Don Draper is still a much more better character in general imo. I'm still in shock that Jon Hamm hasn't won any of the Best Lead Actors at the Emmys (well when went up against Bryan Cranston it was understandable but last year he should of won)
I agree that Draper is an incredible character, but we've known him for 5 seasons at this point. I think you compare where Don was at the end of S1 to where Frank is at the end of S1 and you have similar character depths.
However, Homeland's complete implosion in season 2 should ensure that the best drama, best actor, and best actress prizes are all up for grabs. Lewis and Danes put in some great performances this season (okay, really just Q&A... but that was a damn good episode), but it was just so over the top. It'd be a shame for it to win over this or Breaking Bad.
Macmanus
Member
That was my thought - except slightly less gay.
bearythebear
Member
Just finished it and
god, every single main character in this show is so fucking detestable. I just hope some horrible shit happens to them. Especially Zoe/Frank.
Fantastical
Death Prophet
Just watched the first episode. REALLY good start, the main theme alone is amazing. I wasn't sure if I was going to like the fourth wall breaking, but I'm happy to say that the moments where Spacey just looks at the camera with that knowing "Are you kidding me?" look is great.
fallengorn
Bitches love smiley faces
Finished the entire season and loved it. Kevin Spacey and Robin Wright do a fantastic job.
Their characters marriage is fascinating to watch. They love each other but it's so... clinical.
This always freaks me out. Not that these networks are bastions of impartiality but news anchors playing themselves hurts their network's integrity as well as their own. It's like they're publically admitting that it's all just theater. Cynical. Gotta keep the revenue coming in, I guess.
Unless the price of a month's subscription is a lot higher than it is in America, it's absolutely worth it.
itwasTuesday
He wasn't alone.
Not really a spoiler but I'll tag it anyway. Goes with the difference in direction between directors.
Overall good series, sad that I didn't realize it is not a complete story. I think the UK version is on instant now too, might have to watch that.
Was not ecstatic how they went from the pop up text notifications of the first few episodes (which I thought was pretty slick) to just doing a close up on the phone getting a text message on latter episodes. Also falling into frame and really controlling the the depth of field is kinda what Fincher does, and I felt it was missed in later episodes. But part of me thinks if each episode didn't say who was the director, maybe I wouldn't notice as much.
Overall good series, sad that I didn't realize it is not a complete story. I think the UK version is on instant now too, might have to watch that.
I think these are very interesting comments coming from someone who is more familiar with the labor union system in North America than I am, and provides a good perspective into what might be troubling about the portrayal here. I appreciate that. I largely agree with your analysis on the visual level, and I think that's clearly what was intended, but I do have a slightly different reading of the implications of the scenes described. This might be either because being unfamiliar with American union politics I am more ignorant/naive about the situation, or that I am more disconnected from the issue personally. I'm not sure which.
But here's how I read into it:
I felt that for the most part leading up to the point Marty decided to make it a personal battle against Underwood, he was representing the teachers' unions well and it was rather professional. The people from the unions brought together for the discussion on the bill were not savages, they were not dumb, and certainly not racial in any way. This all changes when it becomes a personal vendetta, with the threat of a strike only being part of a larger picture. The fact that he decided to pull strings to screw with the charity event shows that it wasn't just about trying to make the unions look good anymore - he was just using them to attack Frank.
Now, for the protest itself - I really question as to whether they were indeed Teamsters from other unions gathered together. He does say "call the Teamsters, maybe they'll help us", but he didn't suggest that it was the only or main way to get "200 bodies" at the protest he was staging. I doubt given the short time frame and the sort of message he was trying to make that he managed to get many rational or self-respecting person to this protest (look at the first sign he holds up, it says "F Underwood!" lol).
Now with that in mind, I would say this protest represents exactly what is portrayed in the show itself - these are a bunch of riffraff picked up from the streets and some -may- be union members who simply agreed to the favor in exchange for some incentive, but generally the bottom of the barrel in terms of protester quality. They're just a mob told to be angry, they don't even seem to know what they're there for - which is why Marty had to do all the talking to the media, and why they succumbed to food so easily.
Frank's comment to the audience at the end of it just seems to be his arrogance talking. He assumes (or he doesn't care either way) that this mob are Teamsters put together by Marty to oppose him, and as the superior manipulator here he has once again shown that he is smarter than all these insignificant pawns. He is condescending, but he is that way to everyone anyway.
As for the racial tones. I think that "rich white folk handing food to poor possibly-non-white hungry dirty protesters" is the exact image which was delivered at the end. That is what hurts their cause, and it is why a poorly planned attack on Frank Underwood has consequences of backfire. Now, as to whether it is fair or realistic that the sort of people Marty could have put together at Washington in the last minute would be minorities who are hungry and dirty looking - I'm not so sure. But it didn't feel out of place to me.
I feel that there is a great contrast between the make-shift protest in ep5 and the actual news footage of the teachers strike at the start of ep6. The signs are more to the point, they seem more organized, there isn't a feeling of these people being dumb savages. I think that too was deliberate. This arc shows that while there are real union concerns about the Education Bill, the personal battle between Marty and Frank had gotten to the point where Marty was descending to Frank's level even though he was initially a better person.
Now, for the protest itself - I really question as to whether they were indeed Teamsters from other unions gathered together. He does say "call the Teamsters, maybe they'll help us", but he didn't suggest that it was the only or main way to get "200 bodies" at the protest he was staging. I doubt given the short time frame and the sort of message he was trying to make that he managed to get many rational or self-respecting person to this protest (look at the first sign he holds up, it says "F Underwood!" lol).
Now with that in mind, I would say this protest represents exactly what is portrayed in the show itself - these are a bunch of riffraff picked up from the streets and some -may- be union members who simply agreed to the favor in exchange for some incentive, but generally the bottom of the barrel in terms of protester quality. They're just a mob told to be angry, they don't even seem to know what they're there for - which is why Marty had to do all the talking to the media, and why they succumbed to food so easily.
Frank's comment to the audience at the end of it just seems to be his arrogance talking. He assumes (or he doesn't care either way) that this mob are Teamsters put together by Marty to oppose him, and as the superior manipulator here he has once again shown that he is smarter than all these insignificant pawns. He is condescending, but he is that way to everyone anyway.
As for the racial tones. I think that "rich white folk handing food to poor possibly-non-white hungry dirty protesters" is the exact image which was delivered at the end. That is what hurts their cause, and it is why a poorly planned attack on Frank Underwood has consequences of backfire. Now, as to whether it is fair or realistic that the sort of people Marty could have put together at Washington in the last minute would be minorities who are hungry and dirty looking - I'm not so sure. But it didn't feel out of place to me.
I feel that there is a great contrast between the make-shift protest in ep5 and the actual news footage of the teachers strike at the start of ep6. The signs are more to the point, they seem more organized, there isn't a feeling of these people being dumb savages. I think that too was deliberate. This arc shows that while there are real union concerns about the Education Bill, the personal battle between Marty and Frank had gotten to the point where Marty was descending to Frank's level even though he was initially a better person.
- Status