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[Dahbomb]

because I like Heavenly Sword and Nariko.

Pretty irrelevant huh?

Not only did Ninja Theory made Heavenly Sword but DmC is a much better game than Heavenly Sword.

because the burden of proof is not on me. I am not the one making the claim. Even if it took me one second of googling to credit/discredit the post I wouldn't do it because the poster should have included a source in his post.

It wasn't even a claim, it was a statement of fact. It's pretty much common knowledge at this point that DmC is under performing compared to DMC4. So we should be giving citations every time someone posts a fact?

I mean I am not going to post a link every time I make the "claim" that Tameem doesn't care about the fans.

 

[Hot Coldman]

I get we're your coming from. If I rocked an Avatar it would be of X, but I still wouldn't support a Legends 3 from Capcom. You can love a product and be not supportive of a developers future works.

Not a great comparison, sporting Heavenly Sword is way more likely to lead to assumptions that one is pretty cool with Ninja Theory whilst a Mega Man avatar probably implies the user likely hates Capcom nowadays

 

[HalfBakedProphet]

Ill be there once it hits 20 bucks.

I bought DMC 2, 3, 3SE and 4 on day one. Ninja Theory didn't need to reinvent the damn wheel. They released a product that didn't excite consumers like previous titles did. Don't except us to apologize or feel bad about it.

 

[Goon Boon]

All you need to do is look at a YouTube or Facebook comments section to know that people who play Mgs are not happy about MGR.

High bars and credible sources, I know. However the sentiment does exist.

You can't please everybody.

Well the bright side for MGS fans is they'll get more of the main game so their favorite series isn't dependent on a some mysterious "Test", while they deliver something new for Metal Gear with MGR.

 

[fvng]

It could go wrong though, and there is definitely a difference between both developers communication with militant fan bases. On one side, Ninja Theory and DMC had some initial communicational missteps reacting to fans complaints, Platinum Games were pretty much silent (at least that I know of) when some vocal fans of MGS complained about a non-canon MGS game in genre and protagonist. Keep under the radar, let the publisher deal with the communication, deliver a good game and hope that fans old and new understand the value of your game without the background noise of polemic.

This is a great post. Side note: MGR is non-canon? From what I understood, even though it's not a mainline MGS entry, the story is still canon.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

Not only did Ninja Theory made Heavenly Sword but DmC is a much better game than Heavenly Sword.

He already said he thought DmC was good, he just wasn't going to play it because of how Ninja Theory acted with it...so I guess there's not really any reasoning that can be done.

 

[Beth Cyra]

Not only did Ninja Theory made Heavenly Sword but DmC is a much better game than Heavenly Sword.

I don't see the hang up with the mans avatar.

He dug Heavenly Sword, choose it as a base for his avatar because of that like.

Ninja Theory acts like a tool, so he doesn't support DmC. How does the second that happened afterword replace or make the first event not count?

 

[Corto]

All you need to do is look at a YouTube or Facebook comments section to know that people who play Mgs are not happy about MGR.

High bars and credible sources, I know. However the sentiment does exist.

You can't please everybody.

I know, I know. But Platinum Games never said a thing addressing those complaints. At least to my knowledge.

 

[Qwell]

I wonder how much of this is simply the market adjusting to the increased value / time ratio people have with entertainment. I know a lot of my friends now simply don't buy games at full price anymore. I am also a pretty rabid gamer and myself reserve the $60 price to a very select few games a year. The fact is I have a massive backlog, along with the other things I like to do with my time (movies, tv, motorcycle etc.) so it is much harder to convince me to give up $60 for a game.

I'll pick up DmC for PC when its about $20 or less, because I'm not the biggest fan I'll honestly probably wait for sub 15. It's just the way it is, even Far Cry 3 which I'm really looking forward to playing, I can wait until its about $25. I'm honestly kicking myself that I didn't bite the bullet when I could have gotten it for $28 on Amazon, but oh well, I still have another 80+ games that I really want to get through (finally finished FF13 over the weekend, which I picked up for $14 over a year ago).

Too much competition for gamers attention that you have to be the best of the best to really get that $60 grab....

 

[Zephyrus]

It hurts my brain just looking at the post. The av was the capper.

It hurted mine seeing you wiggling your tail about DmC's and NT latest insult to people who liked the previous games.

I know Heavenly Sword was made by Ninja Theory.
It was also released in 2007, 3 years prior to Tameem's diva personality insulting me and anyone who was a fan of the older devil may cry games.

Yet, I still like Heavenly sword.

I still like Nariko's character, one which I consider to be the best female character this gen.

I still want a Heavenly Sword 2.

Yet I want to see Ninja Theory fail.

 

[antitrop]

Don't worry guys, I don't think you're fuckwits. <3

 

[Beth Cyra]

Not a great comparison, sporting Heavenly Sword is way more likely to lead to assumptions that one is pretty cool with Ninja Theory whilst a Mega Man avatar probably implies the user likely hates Capcom nowadays

Haha I guess I don't really see it that way. I would think he/she likes HS, hell maybe even PSAS, and I just happen to like X.

 

[CambriaRising]

I know, I know. But Platinum Games never said a thing addressing those complaints. At least to my knowledge.

I don't think they have ever aknowlaged it publicly, no.

 

[abadguy]

It could go wrong though, and there is definitely a difference between both developers communication with militant fan bases. On one side, Ninja Theory and DMC had some initial communicational missteps reacting to fans complaints, Platinum Games were pretty much silent (at least that I know of) when some vocal fans of MGS complained about a non-canon MGS game in genre and protagonist. Keep under the radar, let the publisher deal with the communication, deliver a good game and hope that fans old and new understand the value of your game without the background noise of polemic.

It also helps a great deal that MGS fans still have Ground Zeroes to look forward to for a more traditional Metal Gear game, DMC fans aren't so lucky.

 

[FoxSpirit]

I think what really went wrong is how they wanted to make it Dark, but forgot to make it cool. I love dark, but not when it's "dark, serious, drama that will actually touch on your very essence." That simply does not work for a game where your main mode is beating up increasingly giant monsters.

I just imagined Insanely Twisted Shadow Planet by those guys: a ton of cutscenes detailing the dramatic and brutal devoural of life, complete with a killed baby and bodies ripped apart while screaming in agony. I imagine a part where you simply are too depressed and must wander around to find the "light of hope" to continue on your adventure. But then the angel of madness descends driving everybody but you mad. As a light drains from your eyes you swear vengeance, because it's the only emotion left to you.

The credits feature you, staring emotionless into the empty that devours you.

The End.

 

[Dahbomb]

Damn even people who like NT games hate NT.

Then again that is the case with a lot of Capcom IPs.

 

[Grief.exe]

Ninja Theory games under perform financially, that is what they do.

It should come as no surprise that their latest endeavour followed this pattern.

Don't they also under perform critically as well?

I don't know too much about NT and have never played one of their games since I don't own a console.

But I remember Heavenly Sword being fairly underwhelming.

 

[Alchemy]

This is what happens when you rebrand something. Fans of the original are no longer part of your demographic because you've changed it. Not fucking rocket science.

 

[BadWolf]

All you need to do is look at a YouTube or Facebook comments section to know that people who play Mgs are not happy about MGR.

High bars and credible sources, I know. However the sentiment does exist.

You can't please everybody.

Irrelevant because those people are getting an entry in the main series, which has already been announced and showcased.

They aren't getting any junk about a reboot and a possible death/hibernation of the series.

 

[Endo Punk]

Well the bright side for MGS fans is they'll get more of the main game so their favorite series isn't dependent on a some mysterious "Test", while they deliver something new for Metal Gear with MGR.

If fans are pissed with MGR they only have themselves to blame. Like you said MGS is still alive and this game is another entry in the Metal Gear franchise not the Solid franchise. As a hardcore MGS fan I couldn't be more happier with Rising.

 

[Glass Rebel]

Well the bright side for MGS fans is they'll get more of the main game so their favorite series isn't dependent on a some mysterious "Test", while they deliver something new for Metal Gear with MGR.

It's been said over and over again. This is basically where DmC and MGR differ. Konami has handled the PR for that game exceptionally well, assuring people that it won't eat up significant resources at KojiPro and that the main-line will continue with Ground Zeroes coming up. Capcom on the other hand has been constantly emptying its colon unto its bed since the announcement trailer.

 

[Fistwell]

fair enough. I have this habit of including links backing up my statement whenever I make a claim.

Oh you do, don't you?

The grey market for video games in China currently meets the demand for video games over there. Lifting the console ban will do nothing

Oh wait...

I guess it's silly of me to expect the same of others.

Na, you just have higher standards for others than you have for yourself, that's fine, carry on.

 

[demidar]

It hurted mine seeing you wiggling your tail about DmC's and NT latest insult to people who liked the previous games.

I know Heavenly Sword was made by Ninja Theory.
It was also released in 2007, 3 years prior to Tameem's diva personality insulting me and anyone who was a fan of the older devil may cry games.

Yet, I still like Heavenly sword.

I still like Nariko's character, one which I consider to be the best female character this gen.

I still want a Heavenly Sword 2.

Yet I want to see Ninja Theory fail.

Personally I like to resolve my cognitive dissonances but if you think you can take it then more power to you.

 

[joe2187]

The future of Lost Planet doesnt bode well

 

[Beth Cyra]

Don't they also under perform critically as well?

I don't know too much about NT and have never played one of their games since I don't own a console.

But I remember Heavenly Sword being fairly underwhelming.

They've done alright to good. It's just usually what follows the reviews that make them look bad.

E.g. Sony needing to fly in Santa Monica to finish Heavenly Sword because NT are fuck ups and even SM couldn't fix he shitty combat or shortness of the game.

 

[neorej]

Wasn't it common knowledge that Capcom and gamers are two entities that exist on two separate planes of existence?

 

[Glass Rebel]

The future of Lost Planet doesnt bode well

Capcom already killed anything resembling a fanbase with Lost Planet 2. LP3 can't go that much lower... maybe?

 

[Hot Coldman]

Haha I guess I don't really see it that way. I would think he/she likes HS, hell maybe even PSAS, and I just happen to like X.

I figure if you're going to sport a HS avatar, it should be Andy Serkis's character anyway :x

 

[Endo Punk]

It hurted mine seeing you wiggling your tail about DmC's and NT latest insult to people who liked the previous games.

I know Heavenly Sword was made by Ninja Theory.
It was also released in 2007, 3 years prior to Tameem's diva personality insulting me and anyone who was a fan of the older devil may cry games.

Yet, I still like Heavenly sword.

I still like Nariko's character, one which I consider to be the best female character this gen.

I still want a Heavenly Sword 2.

Yet I want to see Ninja Theory fail.

You're coming through clearly man but don't hold your hopes for HS2. Sony will never do it and I prefer their premier devs never touch the thing.

 

[BadWolf]

If fans are pissed with MGR they only have themselves to blame. Like you said MGS is still alive and this game is another entry in the Metal Gear franchise not the Solid franchise. As a hardcore MGS fan I couldn't be more happier with Rising.

It's been said over and over again. This is basically where DmC and MGR differ. Konami has handled the PR for that game exceptionally well, assuring people that it won't eat up significant resources at KojiPro and that the main-line will continue with Ground Zeroes coming up. Capcom on the other hand has been constantly emptying its colon unto its bed since the announcement trailer.

Agreed, Konami handled things very well with Metal Gear.

Here's Metal Gear Rising, a new take on the series made by Platinum Games and assisted by KojiPro. If you like the game and it sells then we have no problem turning it into its own series.

Oh and in case you were wondering here's Ground Zeroes, a new entry in MGS. Then they go as far as to discuss possibilities and scenarios for further sequels.

 

[Deleted member 13876]

Played the demo, thought it was okay. But okay is not something I spend 60 euros on. May get it at 20.

 

[CambriaRising]

Irrelevant because those people are getting an entry in the main series, which has already been announced and showcased.

They aren't getting any junk about a reboot and a possible death/hibernation of the series.

Well before ground zeroes there were only little hush hush rumors about another MGS being made outside of MGR. I don't think it is irrelevant at all actually. It is not that different of a situation in terms of switching developers and such.

 

[JABEE]

Haven't we established already that MCV is not really gaming journalism but something heavily PR influenced directed to retailers? Not that it excuses them for this, but let's not lump them in the "gaming journalism" catch-all net. This of course if I'm remembering correctly from the whole doritosgate ramifications in UK.

Doesn't mean we can't criticize them if they write like this in the guise of an independent media outlet.

 

[Hot Coldman]

Don't worry guys, I don't think you're fuckwits. <3

*looks at tag*

YOU'RE JUST DESTROYING THE MEDAL OF HONOR SERIES OUT OF SPITE

 

[Frankenstrat]

Guess I'm a terrible person for choosing MGR over DmC. Oh well.

 

[The Crimson Kid]

This guy's responses to DMC fanboys (and the "GAF hivemind") are just as embarassing as the legion of DMC fanboys that insist that the reboot is a horrible game and are actively celebrating the game's apparent "failure" at retail. You would expect a bit more maturity from a journalist than from Internet fanboys. But hey, this is games journalism, so I guess I shouldn't expect much.

Again this is a prime reason why I want Ninja Theory to make DmC2. This whole saga is just too funny.

Also I hope that Capcom releases the HD Collection games individually on PSN so I can pick up DMC3 and not have to pay more for two games that don't hold up at all by today's standards and that I have zero interest in playing.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

Agreed, Konami handled things very well with Metal Gear.

Here's Metal Gear Rising, a new take on the series made by Platinum Games and assisted by KojiPro. If you like the game and it sells then we have no problem turning it into its own series.

Oh and in case you were wondering here's Ground Zeroes, a new entry in MGS. Then they go as far as to discuss possibilities and scenarios for further sequels.

It also helps that Rising looks and plays really solid.

If Capcom really wanted mass market sales I'm seriously wondering why they didn't try to spin DMC off into a shooter. That makes more sense to me than sticking an underperforming dev on a reboot that's still stuck in the same niche genre, and they wouldn't have to abandon the main series.

 

[BadWolf]

Well before ground zeroes there were only little hush hush rumors about another MGS being made outside of MGR. I don't think it is irrelevant at all actually. It is not that different of a situation in terms of switching developers and such.

No one thought Rising was being made to replace Solid, everyone knew it was doing its own thing from pretty much day one.

 

[Endo Punk]

They've done alright to good. It's just usually what follows the reviews that make them look bad.

E.g. Sony needing to fly in Santa Monica to finish Heavenly Sword because NT are fuck ups and even SM couldn't fix he shitty combat or shortness of the game.

It was actually Sony Cambridge who helped finish Heavenly Sword. The game probably would of ended up way worse if they didn't step in just like Capcom with DmC.

 

[djplaeskool]

The future of Lost Planet doesnt bode well

...but EX Troopers is really damn good

 

[Glass Rebel]

Well before ground zeroes there were only little hush hush rumors about another MGS being made outside of MGR. I don't think it is irrelevant at all actually. It is not that different of a situation in terms of switching developers and such.

Metal Gear Rising was never presented as a replacement of the Metal Gear Solid franchise though. It's not really comparable.

 

[Fistwell]

Doesn't mean we can't criticize them if they write like this in the guise of an independent media outlet.

Yeah, absolutely.

 

[unbias]

Not only did Ninja Theory made Heavenly Sword but DmC is a much better game than Heavenly Sword.

Too bad the story, protagonist, and antagonist, are all so embarrassingly bad, in DmC.

 

[Endo Punk]

Well before ground zeroes there were only little hush hush rumors about another MGS being made outside of MGR. I don't think it is irrelevant at all actually. It is not that different of a situation in terms of switching developers and such.

Nah there is a world of a difference. You're just not acknowledging it.

 

[FoxSpirit]

This guy's responses to DMC fanboys (and the "GAF hivemind") are just as embarassing as the legion of DMC fanboys that insist that the reboot is a horrible game and are actively celebrating the game's apparent "failure" at retail. You would expect a bit more maturity from a journalist than from Internet fanboys. But hey, this is games journalism, so I guess I shouldn't expect much.

Again this is a prime reason why I want Ninja Theory to make DmC2. This whole saga is just too funny.

Also I hope that Capcom releases the HD Collection games individually on PSN so I can pick up DMC3 and not have to pay more for two games that don't hold up at all by today's standards and that I have zero interest in playing.

You can pick it up for PC but be ready for low res pre-rendered inengine cutscenes.

 

[Beth Cyra]

This guy's responses to DMC fanboys (and the "GAF hivemind") are just as embarassing as the legion of DMC fanboys that insist that the reboot is a horrible game and are actively celebrating the game's apparent "failure" at retail. You would expect a bit more maturity from a journalist than from Internet fanboys. But hey, this is games journalism, so I guess I shouldn't expect much.

Again this is a prime reason why I want Ninja Theory to make DmC2. This whole saga is just too funny.

Also I hope that Capcom releases the HD Collection games individually on PSN so I can pick up DMC3 and not have to pay more for two games that don't hold up at all by today's standards and that I have zero interest in playing.

What the hell? DMC ones combat doesn't hold up as well but everything else is top notch and its combat is still better then 90% of the genre.

 

[demidar]

...but EX Troopers is really damn good

And also remains untranslated so no sizable western fanbase. Because there's no sizable fanbase there's no demand. Because there's no demand, Capcom's gonna put the series on ice.

 

[Pie and Beans]

It was actually Sony Cambridge who helped finish Heavenly Sword. The game probably would of ended up way worse if they didn't step in just like Capcom with DmC.

Since the biggest disasters are all mostly behind the scenes, I don't think people appreciate what a house of unending incompetence Ninja Theory is. Capcom probably had to get a hell of a lot more hands on with this title than they would have liked, essentially scrubbing much of the "outsourcing to lower our load" point.

 

[x3sphere]

I have no idea what Capcom was expecting with this game, I could tell from day one it would not appeal to a mainstream audience despite the changes made. Personally I didn't buy it because I'm tired of the formula.

 

[Beth Cyra]

It was actually Sony Cambridge who helped finish Heavenly Sword. The game probably would of ended up way worse if they didn't step in just like Capcom with DmC.

Ah thank you. I did get the dev studio mixed up, the point still stands however that needing this to be done didn't look good for NT.