Ninja Scooter
Member
No it still seems crazy. It's not 1982 anymore.
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Bloomberg: Nintendo to announce 18.7 Billion Yen loss for the fiscal year
- Thread starter Mihael Mello Keehl
- Start date
No it still seems crazy. It's not 1982 anymore.
They are actually losing a lot less money than they were before.
Given any "rational" estimate, and using observed trends, when the Wii U games start to release back to back and the sales of the console pick up as a result, they will be back to straight profit.
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
Not necessarily.
Original Nintendo projections for FY 2013:
820,000 million JPY ($8.256 billion) profit in net sales
35,000 million JPY ($352.38 million) PROFIT in operating income
35,000 million JPY ($352.38 million) profit in ordinary income
20,000 million JPY ($201.36 million) profit in net income
Current Nintendo projections for FY 2013:
670,000 million JPY ($6.746 billion) profit in net sales
20,000 million JPY ($201.36 million) LOSS in operating income
20,000 million JPY ($201.36 million) profit in ordinary income
14,000 million JPY ($140.952 million) profit in net income
So Nintendo's projections went from:
820,000 -> 670,000 in net sales
35,000 -> (-20,000) in operating income
35,000 -> 20,000 in ordinary income
20,000 -> 14,000 in net income
Bloomberg's prediction:
(-18,700) in operating income
-----MISS original projection (35,000)
-----MEET revised projection (-20,000)
14,000 in net income likely
-----MISS original projection (20,000)
-----MEET revised projection (14,000)
Bloomberg's general sentiment: Nintendo will meet revised profit projections.
HOWEVER, Nintendo will fail to meet original profit projections.
So the overall environment is lukewarm. Meeting projections is one thing, but meeting heavily-revised projections is another thing.
And as someone who owns Nintendo stocks, you really should read their quarterly reports.
Amazing post. So it seems Nintendo over estimates which does not bode well for their 2014 forecast. How much of it would you say depends on how well the WiiU does?
Steve Youngblood
Member
Some of the criticism against Nintendo can of course be interpreted as premature and/or hyperbolic depending on what specifically is said and what one's own subjective take is on the situation, but I think for every post that is putting the cart before the horse and getting carried away with a desire to tar and feather any and all figureheads we feel have wronged us, there's also somebody who is ignoring the present warning signs in favor of unwavering optimism that Nintendo always had and always will be capable of steering a ship back on course.
And perhaps that's true. However, I personally believe that there is some naivete in the outlook that -- despite the bad start -- the Wii U is a couple of Mario games away from soaring.
Fourth Storm
Member
StreetsAhead
Member
With the weakening yen a price cut, at least in the West, may be possible, even if they just bring down the price of the Premium set. A price cut won't work on its own though, there needs to be games people want.
_ _ _
As I said a few pages ago, they have a new 1,500 dev-holding ~$208 million dollar building under construction, they've hired 700 people WW in 3.5 years, they opened Kyoto Monolith and are rebuilding (seemingly) NST, got rid of the inefficient Brownie Brown and restructured them into something that may be useful and they have an insane number of games announced. It might be too little, too late, but I don't think the fat lady has sung just yet.
I don't know exactly how it affects Nintendo but comparisons to Sony like this don't make much sense. Nintendo is a much smaller company, games are like 5% of Sony. PS3 pushing blurays helped Sony sells HDTVs which were a bigger focus for the company, arguably the $3billion the Earth Worm Jim developer thought Sony sunk on the PS3 five years ago was worth it to them. I know their tvs aren't doing so well now but who's to say how bad they would have done without them. The PS3 has also sold a considerable amount now.
Nintendo are doing better than last year so it's not that worrying.
Petrae
Member
How is Iwata a thorn in any competitor's side when his follow-up to the Wii can't be given away and when his follow-up to the DS is about to lose the distinction of being ahead of the DS in terms of units sold LTD at this period? At least his screw-up with the 3DS is being rectified, though it cost him-- and his employer-- a pretty penny to fix. The Wii U disasterbacle is practically daring the competition to blow right on by... and I'm not talking about new-gen competition. I'm talking about platforms that are seven and eight years old, leaving the Wii U behind like it doesn't exist. Microsoft and Sony don't have to worry about Wii U (at least, not for awhile) because Nintendo is tripping over itself out of the gate.
MS and Sony are probably hoping that Iwata stays in place. He's doing more damage to Nintendo than they could do.
This is one of the most disingenuous posts I've read in the entire forum.
Take a seat. Have a glass of water. I'm sure you're exhausted after erecting all those strawmen.
PS360 don't have the Mario appeal do they? Mario isn't there right now but he will be. I know what you mean though, for a lot of people including budget families, ps360 is a much better choice from a wii than a wiiU at the moment.
StreetsAhead
Member
I think my brain just melted a little reading this.
...on the Wii U obviously
Mario 3D and Mario Kart. So far it's just system-companion NSMB.StreetsAhead
Member
...on the Wii U obviously
Oh you meant all three. I thought you were trying to say there was no Mario game on the system.
Petrae
Member
Even when Mario (not NSMB) shows up, will it be enough? Wii is several years removed from the height of its popularity, and X360 and PS3 have stepped in to fill the console void left when Nintendo marooned Wii in order to bet the house on its successor.
Why are families going to instantly dump $350 on a new Wii? That Mario game has got to be pretty freaking amazing for that kind of spend. The GamePad? Still only one at a time-- otherwise, it's the same thing as what kids were playing 4 years ago with Wiimotes and nunchuks. Off-screen play? Okay... but what about that tablet that they already own that has Angry Birds, Cut The Rope, and others on it? Is Mario really worth $350?
And then you've got this holiday season, which will still have an ample software library for last-gen systems. GTA V. Madden 25. FIFA 14. Assassin's Creed IV. Plus there will likely be more stuff announced in a few weeks. Not a slam dunk to "upgrade" to a Wii U-- or maybe any new-gen hardware just yet.
Maybe Nintendo finally delivers on Wii U games. Even so, given the price point as an obstacle given that the experience really isn't that much different than what families already have or can buy for less than Nintendo is charging, there's no guarantee that families will bite later this year. Last-gen hardware is cheaper, has a larger and less-expensive library, and will still be getting support for at least the near-term.
metalslimer
Member
Where is that indication? Chances are a major priecut happens which will wipe out any profits they could make.
Yeah, particularly as Sony's gaming division was losing that much pretty much every 6-8 weeks for years after the PS3 came out. I guess the difference is, it's not considered normal for Nintendo to lose money.
It's like people here fail to realise that turning stuff around actually takes time. It's not an instant thing and anyone with a shred of business sense knows this.
If true, this is half their loss of last year, indicating they're on track.
Last quarter, they posted a profit, indicating they're on track. Analysts predicted a loss.
Iwata's goal for FY2013/14 is the 100billion yen, which based on the 3DS lineup is actually quite likely.
Seriously, I don't get why people assume that this means Iwata is out when he has specified to investors his two year plan. If that plan fails, then he may leave, but until then...no. Stop it.
If true, this is half their loss of last year, indicating they're on track.
Last quarter, they posted a profit, indicating they're on track. Analysts predicted a loss.
Iwata's goal for FY2013/14 is the 100billion yen, which based on the 3DS lineup is actually quite likely.
Seriously, I don't get why people assume that this means Iwata is out when he has specified to investors his two year plan. If that plan fails, then he may leave, but until then...no. Stop it.
CoffeeGames
Member
I would like to see the breakdown of each region's finances/performance.
How is NCL (Japan) doing compared to NOA and NOE? What divisions are underperforming consistently, and not meeting internal goals?
Aquamarine
Member
Ever stop and realize that some of us may actually be Nintendo shareholders + fans like me?
Wii U performance is obviously a large factor in future Nintendo profitability. However, the 3DS needs a large overall boost in sales to complement--and possibly even help prop up--the Wii U as well.
Nintendo is obviously going to backload the second half of 2013 with bombastic Wii U releases to gain momentum, timing it with megatons like Pokemon X/Y for the 3DS and Link to the Past 2 to extract the maximum amount of profitability during the next FY.
StreetsAhead
Member
I'll give you a hint. America and to a lesser extent Europe are under performing on 3DS, all are terrible on Wii U.
3DS Social, $200, more ram, better camera, Miiverse/account system.
shinra-bansho
Member
Fixed. Edit: actually Nintendo's habit of reporting their numbers as six and nine month blocks may have mis-communicated this, they may have operated at a profit for the last quarter.
Precisely. Even with a large price cut of $100 (which would essentially ensure a third year of losses for Nintendo I imagine), there's no guarantee their value proposition to a given family becomes more appealing than a potential $200 Kinect Family Fun Pack or the eventual 32GB PS3 at $169 etc.
Yes, there may have been external reasons for a profit, but even then the operating loss was significantly reduced from previous quarters which proves that things are turning around.
It's a gradual process, it's seldom an overnight change and it boggles the mind that people here think it needs to be, especially considering the gaming industry in general is continually at a loss at the moment
Aquamarine
Member
Wut.
Nope, we're back to 100 to 1. Nintendo, Honda, Nissan, Toyota, Sony, etc are all making 33% more from US purchases than they were 2 years ago when we were around 75 yen per dollar.
Canis lupus
Member
Weren't they forecasting a profit?
Aquamarine
Member
A net profit yes, but reduced operating loss from FY 2012.
Continued operating loss partially demonstrates the consequences of Wii U's lack of momentum, especially since Nintendo's initial predictions soured as time went on.
evilromero
Member
His personal commitment rings hollow when nothing released on the Wii U for months.
You dont know whats coming, Iwata does. Its better to prepare a killer holiday now than to please the few that currently own a Wii U.
Just posting an operating profit the next fiscal year doesn't qualify as turning it around. Nintendo has the name and money to become the real leader in this industry again within a decade, provided they have the proper vision from the CEO.
It really comes down to maneuverability. Sony and Microsoft are sluggish companies that have to integrate their gaming divisions into their larger corporate visions which includes all of their other businesses like Sony's electronics or Microsoft's PC software. It makes them slower and less able to adapt, to switch gears. Nintendo is far more nimble. If they wanted to, they could make 2 or 3 key acquisitions, change the types of games they internally produce, make machines with the power and organic capabilities that are up to date and demanded by gamers, and launch hardware with an emphasis on what their third party partners wanted to see to fulfill their visions.
I view Nintendo as a company that is vastly under performing their potential. They have carved out a comfort zone where they've largely insulated themselves from having to compete with other companies but it holds them back immensely from being the video game company that other video game companies want to be. They used to be that, and I wish I could see them be that again one day.
It really comes down to maneuverability. Sony and Microsoft are sluggish companies that have to integrate their gaming divisions into their larger corporate visions which includes all of their other businesses like Sony's electronics or Microsoft's PC software. It makes them slower and less able to adapt, to switch gears. Nintendo is far more nimble. If they wanted to, they could make 2 or 3 key acquisitions, change the types of games they internally produce, make machines with the power and organic capabilities that are up to date and demanded by gamers, and launch hardware with an emphasis on what their third party partners wanted to see to fulfill their visions.
I view Nintendo as a company that is vastly under performing their potential. They have carved out a comfort zone where they've largely insulated themselves from having to compete with other companies but it holds them back immensely from being the video game company that other video game companies want to be. They used to be that, and I wish I could see them be that again one day.
Last quarter they forecasted an operating loss but a net income for the fiscal year.
Uncle Rupee
Banned
Wow, didn't realize GAF hated Iwata so much.
I don't think he can wave a wand and magically make games appear any faster, do you?
I don't think he can wave a wand and magically make games appear any faster, do you?
...of course not.
But he's kind of the reason why they're not here now in the first place.
Yeah. Nothing to do with the industry in decline or anything like that...not like almost every other company related to gaming is reporting losses etc.
StreetsAhead
Member
The games, Joe.
Gamer @ Heart
Member
Silly. You guys have no idea what he is or isnt responsible for. Also, the board doesnt choose the president of a subsidiary
...he's the CEO, right?
Aquamarine
Member
No...he's President and COO of Nintendo of America, an NCL subsidiary.
You mean the games that have consistently been top quality and reviewed highly in the last 7 years?
Yep, Nintendo have lost it
StreetsAhead
Member
You mean the games that have consistently been top quality and reviewed highly in the last 7 years?
Yep, Nintendo have lost it
Yes, but he was talking about them being delayed.
Nintendo was too confident when they released WiiU and now the bad marketing bites them in the ass. Also the lack of 1st party games - since that's all the system has. Kinda sad to hear. Fortunately the 3DS seems to be doing really well and that's the system where my interest is focused as well.
As much as I like Nintendo, I think this is good. They need a major shake up to get them rolling. They have become complacent due to the success of the Wii and it's about time their ego took a hit. Bring out the big guns for the Wii U and amaze us like you have always done, Nintendo.
You haven't been keeping up. The stock sank back to its regular pricing before the overvaluation due to the Wii boom and leveled off, with the lowest turn being during the aforementioned weakening of the entire Nikkei exchange due to the yen strengthening.
But Nintendo was one of the largest gainers in trading on the Nikkei on news of a weakening yen increasing returns on consumer exports again.
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/03/nintendos_stock_price_jumps_higher_than_mario
Looks like the "fire sale" was just a sign of people bailing out of multinationals on the Nikkei entirely until exports regained their value.