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Bloomberg: Nintendo to announce 18.7 Billion Yen loss for the fiscal year
- Thread starter Mihael Mello Keehl
- Start date
They use different teams for their handheld and console development, there is no reason this should be true and wasn't true during the DS/Wii years.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
Why is that a correlation? 2011-2012 Wii output wasn't because they were focusing on a system that was out at the same time, it's because the system had been out 4 years and the Wii U was incoming. And a big Zelda title still came out.
You look at the history of the DS and the Wii and there's many, many instances where the DS and the Wii both got excellent titles. You're comparisons lack founding and therefore make very little sense.
3DS 2014 we know we're getting Yoshi's Island and possibly Smash 3D already. More titles will be announced throughout this year too.
No, it really didn't.
From 2007 onwards;
Pokemon Diamond/Pearl
Zelda: Phantom Hourglass
Kirby Superstar Ultra
Advance Wars: Day of Ruin
Diddy Kong Racing
Brain Training
Mario Party DS
Picross DS
Rhythm Heaven
Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story
Legend of Zelda: Spirit Track
The Legendary Starfy
So you are seeing what you want to see (and to be honest, plain ignoring things)
BlockheadBrown
Member
There is an on-going crazy argument that Nintendo is always doomed and are going to go out of business. It's really turning me off to this placeand it's really sad
Take it with a grain of salt. These are just people in a forum posting their opinions and views. Don't take it to heart. Don't take someone else's opinion as fact. Microsoft's foray into the console business has been "doomed" from the get-go, as has been Sony's.
What matters is what you spend your money on and how you feel about it.
This thread is specifically about the anticipated loss that's supposed to be coming. Expect doom, gloom and naysayers to have a field day with this. Then, move on to the rumors and anticipation threads or general discussion threads for games. GAF has its good sides as well as bad - just like everywhere else.
I don't really see how these things are related. 3DS is a goldmine for Nintendo in JP and Reggie was all in the news last week talking about how it is outperforming the DS in the same time frame in NA. So, my prediction is that the 3DS will continue to be the best platform on the market while Nintendo turn the Wii U from a colossal failure into a sort of GameCube-esque mini-failure that maintains their devoted fan base but doesn't necessarily make huge waves.
By paper I assume you mean money. Didn't Mario Kart Wii make more profit on its own than the whole of the iOS market in a year or something like that?
StreetsAhead
Member
EAD is currently only working one 1 known retail game (LttP2). I'd say they've mostly moved on, for now. Their other teams and partnerships carried a lot of DS software and will probably carry a lot of 3DS.
DragonSworne
Banned
It would.
Do people honestly believe Iwata and co are running the most efficient development cycle?
There are numerous reports of how Nintendo struggles to develop games on time. I wouldn't be surprised if quality and budget are also suffering because of their development process.
Yeah, what is your point? The Wii-U is no Wii, that much is terribly obvious. Look for Mario Kart U to have attach rates around whatever Double Dash and Mario Kart 64 did. It will sell well, but it ain't saving shit single-handed. Smash has a better chance at that IMHO.
That's nowhere close "Wii 2011-2012 levels."
what are you talking about?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_products_published_by_Nintendo#Nintendo_DS
Look at all those games after 2006.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
No, it really didn't.
From 2007 onwards;
Pokemon Diamond/Pearl
Zelda: Phantom Hourglass
Kirby Superstar Ultra
Advance Wars: Day of Ruin
Diddy Kong Racing
Brain Training
Mario Party DS
Picross DS
Rhythm Heaven
Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story
Legend of Zelda: Spirit Track
The Legendary Starfy
And that goes without mentioning third party titles like World Ends With You, GTA Chinatown Wars, Dementium, Scribblenauts, and Professor Layton. So you are seeing what you want to see (and to be honest, plain ignoring things)
You forget I don't think the DS has ever had as packed a year as the 3DS is having right now;
Luigi's Mansion 2
Fire Emblem: Awakening
Donkey Kong Country Returns 3D
Animal Crossing: New Leaf
Mario & Luigi: Dream Team
Mario Golf 3D
Mario Party 3D
Pokemon X/Y
The Legend of Zelda: Link to the Past II
Aquamarine
Member
Nintendo spends a lot of time prototyping and testing with a very small planning team to get their execution and vision down just right during actual development.
I wouldn't really chalk that under "struggles to develop games on time," especially when we've seen countless times that Nintendo is more than capable to deliver under a very tight development schedule (cf. Mario Kart 7).
DragonSworne
Banned
Where do you base this on?
Personally, I believe that even a GC-level of success is very unlikely for Wii U.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
Release date Original model:
NA November 19, 2006
JP December 2, 2006
Unless you mean before 2006, but that's even more a ridiculous claim.
metalslimer
Member
There is an on-going crazy argument that Nintendo is always doomed and are going to go out of business. It's really turning me off to this place
Where did someone say they were going out of business? i suggest you and many other people in this thread grow some thicker skin if talking about video game financials upsets people.
Posts like this are just sad to read
GiantBreadbug
Member
No, it wouldn't. Iwata doesn't walk into these studios and make the development slow down. His decisions may have some negative impacts, but he isn't wholly responsible for the speeds at which these developers work.
The struggles Nintendo is having with HD development is due to the company-wide development philosophy. It's not all Iwata, and replacing him isn't going to bring any drastic changes.
Fake Edit: I'm not saying I think it's a bad thing, this development philosophy they have. It's frustrating as a consumer, but that's about all. I know the goods are coming. Personally this doesn't really effect me, but it's unfortunate for those who are really frothing for Wii U games.
DragonSworne
Banned
peanutbutterlatte
Member
We were talking about the 3DS. You're making no sense, at all, it's sort of frustrating. Little snarky comments don't make any sort of point that nobody hasn't made before, nevermind the fact you ignored my point entirely.
Father_Brain
Banned
Yeah, there ought to be a complete or near-complete change of high-level management. It's clear that there are problems with NCL's corporate culture that go much deeper than the very top.
DragonSworne
Banned
The CEO does not control companywide operations and planning at Nintendo?
Nintendo has bigger problems then I thought.
CentralScrutinizer
Banned
This bad news is good news. Panic mode Nintendo is the best Nintendo. The 3ds had a slow start and it is now a beast. Wii U failing initially is the best thing for us, we will get core games down the line that make the Wii U an essential system.
Would you rather have a Wii situation where Nintendo makes gangbusters off Wii sports and spends the rest of the generation catering to casual gamers, or a situation where Nintendo struggles early and then caters greatly to its core audience with amazing games after amazing games a couple years in to the system (3ds)?
Would you rather have a Wii situation where Nintendo makes gangbusters off Wii sports and spends the rest of the generation catering to casual gamers, or a situation where Nintendo struggles early and then caters greatly to its core audience with amazing games after amazing games a couple years in to the system (3ds)?
As of now Nintendo gave us "No Quantity" :-D
Both N64 and GC suffered from being too late to fend off the momentum generated by the main competitor (with the former having much more hype behind it than the latter).
I believe there is still an opportunity window for WiiU.
Let's see what Nintendo does.
Unfortunately [for Nintendo] that's true.
Don't be so drastic.
EDIT:
My personal belief.
WiiU momentum is fading amid lack of exciting software (especially Nintendo games) and of course the momentum of the yet to be revealed/released platforms is always consistent for the nature of not be tangible.
The thing that WiiU has compared to GC or N64 is time though.
The Nintendo one was Iwata expectation for GC (and implicitly for Wii)
Father_Brain
Banned
If I had a dollar for every time someone repeated this incredibly vapid meme without offering any plausible suggestions for how "panic mode" might be implemented...
They can't make first-party software materialize overnight, their leverage over third parties seems to be all but nonexistent, and a price cut will accomplish little more than a short-term bump until/unless Nintendo can get something resembling a steady stream of major releases going, which looks like it won't currently be possible until at least late summer.
Aquamarine
Member
Corporate Nintendo has been essentially stagnant.
For example, Iwata has maintained the same core representative directors on the board ever since he got appointed as President way back in FY 2003.
Unfortunately, that can foster bureaucracy, arrogance, and unwillingness to sufficiently innovate.
GiantBreadbug
Member
Company-wide operations and planning =/= Actual game development
You can't just will games to be finished. You can encourage your developers to work faster and harder, but ultimately your output will only come as quickly as your developers can work.
Of course, there's something to be said for the planning that you mentioned, and Iwata has had some slip ups there. No doubt. But not catastrophic meltdown fire-worthy slip ups. Nintendo is a huge company with several studios, so the current Wii U drought is confusing. But I'm willing to chalk it up to tough transitions between consoles (moreso than usual).
What kind of question is this? I don't own Nintendo stock so obviously the latter. But there's no reason to blindly hope for things to change. I do not hate Nintendo, I love their handhelds and end up buying their consoles for some reason or another (RE4,PSO:1&2, Smash). Things look bleak to me because all the signs point to it. I have nothing to gain from Nintendo not releasing good solid content. I really don't care if the thing sells like shit, I care WHY though.
At the end of the day we only benefit from me being wrong, I don't think I'm wrong though.
metalslimer
Member
Yep, panic mode on the 3ds never existed outside possibly rushing mk7 and the pricedrop. The 3ds already had big 3rd party support. Panic mode wiiu will be cancelling any experimental game and focusing more on mario than usual
SniperHunter
Banned
So they launched a new console with 6 year old tech and it's still losing money? wow!
CentralScrutinizer
Banned
That's why I said "in a couple of years"
3ds didn't magically turn in to an amazing system the moment the price was dropped. It took some time, about two years into the systems life, and it wasn't until recently people realized "the heck?! 3ds is actually a beast"
I wouldn't call that "materializing overnight."
Quite an obvious point. If they made iOS games they'd be sharing that market that apparently only brought in what one of their games did. Of course Mario Kart Wii is one of their bigger games, but if just one of their games can make that much why would they need to make iOS games? Also take into account that people would be satisfied with just having MK on their iPhone, thus hindering the potential sales of MKU.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
Didn't the Wii/DS prove that this sort of logic doesn't fly on its own? It's more due to the complete lack of desirable titles and the poor managing of marketing, amongst other things. Third parties not getting involved due to lack of power was always going to be a thing, but it's not the sole, most important reason Nintendo's fucking up so bad right now.
The Abominable Snowman
Member
Could this loss be because usually during console launches Nintendo has had a handheld that was doing amazing at the time in the volume of software sales and profitable hardware sales to negate any loss on new console hardware? And this time they don't?
The 3DS is doing well but it's no GBA or DS yet worldwide or in any one major territory. The GBA carried Nintendo to profitability through the GC's lifetime, and the DSLite through the Wii's launch.
IIRC the 3DS is doing quite a bit less in comparison to the DS/GBA and Nintendo doesnt make as big a profit on each hardware sold as thiey did before.
The 3DS is doing well but it's no GBA or DS yet worldwide or in any one major territory. The GBA carried Nintendo to profitability through the GC's lifetime, and the DSLite through the Wii's launch.
IIRC the 3DS is doing quite a bit less in comparison to the DS/GBA and Nintendo doesnt make as big a profit on each hardware sold as thiey did before.
As news goes, I'm not sure why this is a surprise or "bad." When Nintendo cut their Wii U forecast from 5.5 million consoles to 4 million back in January, they themselves predicted an operating loss of 20 billion yen for the fiscal year. So wouldn't an 18.7 billion loss fall in line with those revised expectations?
"OMG 18.7 billion yen loss according to Bloomberg!" Gee whiz! Except Nintendo said to expect the same exact thing 4 months ago.
Wii U's gamepad and streaming abilities are not 6 year old tech. Apparently they're just not the tech you want so you dismiss it.
"OMG 18.7 billion yen loss according to Bloomberg!" Gee whiz! Except Nintendo said to expect the same exact thing 4 months ago.
Wii U's gamepad and streaming abilities are not 6 year old tech. Apparently they're just not the tech you want so you dismiss it.
DragonSworne
Banned
Honestly, I believe a CEO has tremendous influence in the quality and speed developers can produce titles.
Depending on their methodology, their could be unneeded documentation, reviews cycles, meetings, and plan old slacking off due to low moral that all impacts development. All these things can be out in place or removed by the CEO.
Developers rarely spend all day coding.
Has to he direct planning that warrants him getting fired, I think the Wii U and 3ds concept, design, and launches are all good enough reasons.
MK Wii is an anomaly. Mario Kart U shouldn't even be able to do half of what that game did. I don't care about Wii software sales bloated by that massive install base.
That's all pointless going forward.
Father_Brain
Banned
Well, I at least agree that the first-party software we know is coming will significantly boost hardware sales, if only relative to their current abysmal level.
The problem is, it'll take a lot more than the known upcoming software lineup to get Wii U much past GC sales levels (if even that), and I see very little reason for optimism on that front.
Aquamarine
Member
Four words: Lack. of. Forward. Momentum.
Please this.
I have yet to see any numbers to back up the idea that making iOS games would benefit Nintendo. It's more of a case that people just want Nintendo games on their iOS devices. Nintendo is basically banking on that want turning into impatience and they buy their system for their fill of Nintendo games. Stick it on iOS and that incentive to buy Nintendo systems disappears.
Father_Brain
Banned
Agreed. As I said in a thread last week: It's fair to say that most, if perhaps not all, of the seeds of Wii U's failure - rampant Japan-centrism, deteriorating relationships with third parties, "not invented here" approach to online, overreliance on the Mario IP, penny-pinching on software development as well as tech - were planted before Wii even launched. Nintendo caught lightning in a bottle with motion control and that bought them a reprieve for most of a generation, but make enough big mistakes and they'll inevitably catch up with you sooner or later.
Four words: Announced. Four. Months. Ago. A quick google search confirms this, so no investor should be at all surprised by this bad news.
How pray tell would it not? Mobile devices are already cannibalizing the market in the west, double dipping would be brilliant if Nintendo wants to make some money. Think of the consumers who had no incentive to buy a dedicated handheld ever. You have to think beyond yourself. There will always be a dedicated handheld market for the hardcore enthusiast, but it's shrinking.
Nintendo is quite literally sitting on a gold mind.
Don't confuse trolls with facts.
robertsan21
Member
well it´s obvious that Nintendo needs to step up their games. I have completely stopped playing their games since Wii. I cant stand playing games that looks like they where made on a PS2.
Hopefully Nintendos next console will be just as powerful as the PS4.
Hopefully Nintendos next console will be just as powerful as the PS4.
GiantBreadbug
Member
Well, considering Iwata is a developer himself, I would think that he has created a good atmosphere for Nintendo's developers. I can't claim to know exactly what's going on, but the guy has experience making games.
And I hardly think that the 3DS is grounds for his firing. I think it's indicative of Iwata being capable of learning (with the steady stream of content we're getting now). Unfortunately, it doesn't seem that's working out for the Wii U just yet. I think it's definitely worth taking a "wait and see" approach to the Wii U's slow start. If it's this time next year, and the situation is similar or worse, then it'd be appropriate to suggest he be fired.
But I guess that's just me, I dunno.
What a happy coincidence that the only person in the entire world qualified to run Nintendo was already working there when they needed a CEO.
Of everything that's said about Iwata the one thing that I cannot understand is the software droughts. The guy keeps identifying it as a problem but then every Nintendo platform experiences the same situation again. Why can't Nintendo put out a steady stream of software? Or at least a somewhat regular schedule of tentpole releases? Say what you will about Nintendo's strategy, marketing, or tactics, they need to be putting out software for whatever direction they head in.
Maybe Iwata was a good developer but has no idea how to manage developers? There's something very wrong here.