JStein0222
Member
I agree about the villain thing and I'm predicting that to be a big part of this Smash. Heck we already focused on Bowser.
Tom Nook
Super Smash Bros Wii U and 3DS: Info Collection - Dojo, Mega Man and Trailer! 2014!
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
- Start date
This is my thinking as well, Black Shadow is one of the very few F-Zero character's I'd rather not see in the game, everyone immediately wants him to be a Ganon clone. I have no doubts Sakurai would make him interesting anyway, but there are dozens of far more interesting choices in the F-Zero games.
Ignis Fatuus
Banned
The fancy jacket and armor is worn on top of her original plain FE7 robe thing, which makes sense since she went from being a wild nomad to running her own country. The design offers continuity with added panache. Perfection.
Black Shadow is big, menacing, and would suit Ganondorf's current moveset well (so they could give Ganondorf his own unique one).
I'd rather have a new Ganon that incorporates elements of Melee/Brawl Ganondorf alongside a new F-Zero rep with an original moveset.
Nocturnowl
Member
Also because he occupies the same delicious level of campiness that Falcon himself thrives upon.
I mean F Zero GX Samurai Goroh comes close backflipping into his Fire Stingray which he totally can't lose in but Black Shadow takes it, I mean look at that costume!
Well, I'm not saying he's a bad character. Just not "one of the best in the game" by a very long shot. I mean, I'm pretty sure you can go ask the PT mains directly at Smashboards and you won't find a ton of people agreeing with you. My post wasn't supposed to be condescending, but funny, relax
I apologize for real life people who use the online names of George93 or xXxNarutoRocksxXxHey, xXxNarutoRocksxXx is a close personal friend of mine.
NeonZ
Member
Well, he's the main villain of the series, outside of the original F-Zero and GX. And even in GX he's still the fake main villain who's the main antagonist during most of the story until the twist. He'd also be a super villain to keep the super hero theme that C.Falcon has going, while Samurai Goro would need to go for some different approach.
But, really most people just mention him hoping that he'd take Ganondorf's moveset and Ganondorf got something original. Still, personally, I'd take a completely original Black Shadow over a completely original Samurai Goroh if we were going to get a second F-Zero representative with a completely original moveset. I just like the super villain motif to contrast with Captain Falcon's super hero.
Metroid Killer
Member
I agree with you that Samurai Goroh is the most likely character we will get from F-Zero, but X and GX has pretty clearly cemented Black Shadow as the series' villain.
It would be nice, preferable even, but I can't really imagine it happening personally. Ideally there would be no more clones, but I think they're here to stay.
Well to be fair pretty much all F-Zero characters are like this.
Well, I'm not saying he's a bad character. Just not "one of the best in the game" by a very long shot. I mean, I'm pretty sure you can go ask the PT mains directly at Smashboards and you won't find a ton of people agreeing with you. My post wasn't supposed to be condescending, but funny, relax
I guess, poor choice of words on my part, sorry.
ShockingAlberto
Member
Fucking BAWS looking Lyn from Awakening would be a dream come true.
DO IT SAKURAI. You know you want that red hot character design in there.
It'd be impossible, I'm afraid.
Sakurai said there'd be no tripping and she looks like she can barely stand.
Have you people discussed move decay? I for one I'm hoping it gets removed. It's one of the absolute worst aspects of Brawl - characters without a lot of KO moves become a pain to use. Peach needs her f-air during fights, and it also happens to be her most reliable KO move, it's not uncommon to fight Snake and not being able to kill him until nearly 200% because of this. Jigglypuff is in the exact same situation, with the added crap-factor that her sour-spots are as strong as a regular jab, but still make the move go stale. It's just an incredibly awful idea.
Nocturnowl
Member
This is true.
Since the game is a treasure trove of campy characters I suggest we have the F-Zero stage take place in the bar from the chapter 3 cutscene of GX, a background full of brawling F-Zero characters complete with that one song from the cutscene itself blaring out "F-ZEEEEEROOOO" over and over.
SenorArdilla
Member
Ignis Fatuus
Banned
Good read, though I think you're under selling Ike a bit much here. Ike is definitely one of the most popular FE lords, and his inclusion in Brawl definitely helped with that. Also, I think the Fire Emblem development team really likes Ike (he even has his own
descendant
I actually really liked how Ike played in Brawl, though I'll admit that he should be alot more faithful to his games. If Ike does come back (and I really hope he does), he should have stuff like using Ragnell to fire sword beams and stuff.
Doesn't explain the noodle legs.
Professor Beef
Banned
The extra sword is from her cane-sword (not shown).
Lets fund it.
Nocturnowl
Member
Considering I frequently fought people in melee who literally did nothing but Captain Falcon's aerial knee attack as their entire offence I am all for move decay.
The real solution here is to ensure that each character has access to a few reliable kill moves even if they're on the weaker end of the spectrum.
Green Mamba
Member
Yeah, Brawl was just full of shitty gameplay mechanics. Hopefully this nonsense is gone, just ends up widening the gap between the versatile and less versatile characters to even more absurd lengths.
It's the kind of mechanic that the average person might think about for a second and say "Hey, that sounds like a good idea!" but completely falls apart in actual testing. Just garbage.
Ultimately, if you keep hitting an opponent with the same move over and over, I'm sorry, but it's their fault, not your's. Why should you be punished for succeeding?
The top is all you need, let the smash development team deal with the rest when doing the in game model. If lyn did make it in I wonder if they would let her dual wield like in this picture or just use FE7 lyn design.
I don't think Ganondorf needs a huge overhaul, honestly. This is what I would change:
Standard Special Move - Electric Orb
Side Special Move - Flame Choke (same as Brawl)
Up Special Move - Ground Pound
Down Special Move - Deflect
The Warlock Punch could be his new side smash. I don't think he needs to use a sword. Despite his Wind Waker and Twilight Princess boss fights, I more associate Ganon with magic.
Standard Special Move - Electric Orb
Side Special Move - Flame Choke (same as Brawl)
Up Special Move - Ground Pound
Down Special Move - Deflect
The Warlock Punch could be his new side smash. I don't think he needs to use a sword. Despite his Wind Waker and Twilight Princess boss fights, I more associate Ganon with magic.
This is better. But Captain Falcon's aerial knee hardly made him OP or anything, and if you're facing someone who does nothing but spam one single move you really shouldn't be losing in the first place
Ignis Fatuus
Banned
I believe she is dual wielding the Mani Katti and Sol Katti, which is all kinds of awesome and should be in Smash. We've already got swordsmen but none of them are dual wielders.
Thanks and I suppose that Ike's moves kind of reflect his "unrefined" person seeing as he was never royalty. But even with Ragnell being the beast that it is, the change was a really odd one. I love Ike and I would enjoy seeing him back again, but I just feel like there is a chance he could be cut or replaced. He would also be a good candidate to have alt costumes of many of the other FE lords that can't make it like Hector who after his promotion can use swords as well as axes. As for SNES lords I really do think it sucks that that part of the series gets little love when the arguably most popular lord of the franchise hails from that particular time period as well as having some really important effects on the series as a whole with the creation of the weapons triangle and I think magic trinity. I wish we would get Seliph or Sigurd playable but sadly it's a long shot.
Interesting that your first FE was Thracia, honestly I never finished the game but I really do want to go back to it and complete it one day. I didn't know that Leaf had such potential in FE4 since I stopped playing the game around the second gen since I messed up in the first in regards to the children. That whole stealing thing could be argued to be the Villager's "gimmick" though. Also, I think Leaf could make a fun assist trophy but due to his popularity and importance not much aside from that. But it's always fun to see another old school FE fan.
Sooo, the reason why so many characters in Fire Emblem have blue hair is because they're related?Now I want to play FE more.
No that's not why hahaha. The designers just seem to have a thing for blue haired protagonists. There are a few in the series who are related as stated before. The hair is just coincidental. That shouldn't stop you from checking out the rest of the games though
.Fucking BAWS looking Lyn from Awakening would be a dream come true.
DO IT SAKURAI. You know you want that red hot character design in there.
I would love for Lyn to become playable, not only would does she have a good possible moveset potential given that not only is she faster than Marth, she can also equip bows after her promotion and she'd help the female half of the roster. She was also an assist trophy so it'd be fun to see her back playable.
Nocturnowl
Member
This is better. But Captain Falcon's aerial knee hardly made him OP or anything, and if you're facing someone who does nothing but spam one single move you really shouldn't be losing in the first place
Who said anything about losing? it's more that they bored me to tears, especially when you had three of them flying around the screen knee first for 3 minutes.
I did however often lose to my main smash rival who loved Zelda's lightning kicks just a little too much so guilty as charged on that one.
Green Mamba
Member
I had a similar idea and a similar moveset all written out. I personally would rather not see him with a sword; Ganondorf's fighting style changes in every Zelda game so I think it's better he's represented with some of his more original abilities, not saddled with this one sword he used one time.
He also used swords in Wind Waker.
Too OoT focused in my opinion. While the energy projectile is good, Ganon needs a teleport. Classically, Ganon has used a combination of magical blasts while teleporting around the battlefield. Invisibility is also one of his classic tricks. I wouldn't mind the trident, either.
But then you'll always face people who do nothing but spam one single move, it happens in Brawl too.
Green Mamba
Member
Swords plural, yes. Not a single sword. He's used a single sword as often as he has dual wielded two swords (once each). Why should one be chosen over the other? Because it's more recent? That's a way to pretty much instantly date the character.
Nocturnowl
Member
And the the decay will punish them for their transgressions, they will be forced to learn...okay they wont but it's nice to believe, point being I don't mind the feature, remember that the moves don't stay weakened if you continue mixing them up, it just discourages overly frequent use of one move in succession.
Ahh yes... The time and effort it takes peach to kill snake around 150+% while he has his basic combo, u tilt, side tilt combo, down a, explosives. N air, and just about every thing else can easily ok her at lease by 90% was ridiculous lol.
Green Mamba
Member
The mechanic punishes the purposefully less versatile characters. Jigglypuff was designed to have a crappy ground moveset in comparison to her aerial moveset--that's the whole point of Jigglypuff. Yet despite having intentionally roughly half the viable moves of most characters she gets hit with stale move degradation at the same rate. The slow characters have a much harder time landing singular hits than the fast ones, but they have just as much degradation as the fast characters.
You could make those moves better, sure, make everyone have an equally viable moveset, but that's just homogenizing the characters in their totality and that's no good.
The mechanic should be dropped. It's just poor game design, a quick and dirty band-aid to something that isn't even a real problem.
Technically Ganon used dual-swords twice: once as the final boss of Wind Waker and once as the final boss of Ocarina of Time. OoT and MM both establish that dual sword fighting is popular among the Garudo, so Ganon has wielded dual swords in the games where is most strongly associated with the Gerudo.
He still has used the Trident in the most number of Zelda games where he appears. Even Phantom Ganon in OoT used the trident.
A lot of people do.
Its been "Bros." since Melee.
Green Mamba
Member
There is a very clear delineation between the abilities of Ganondorf the man and Ganon the beast and they basically never, ever cross over.
Nocturnowl
Member
Fine, fine, drop it or whatever then, I don't feel that strongly in favour of it, I just thought it was a decent idea that encouraged people to work with more moves overall.
They should go with this, no other main character would be dual wielding. She's a lord and she was good enough for assist trophy status when they could have used hector or elliwood. Its a long shot but you never know with sakurai anymore.