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[skidoo800r]

Hey guys, tweeted Phil Spencer about him mentioning only 3 times more power over X360. He said it was a mistake and he messed up the line. Said something similar to another person who asked. He said in reply to me "Depends exactly what you are doing with the system. For purely local compute functions closer to 10x + Cloud." and "Cloud gives more, cloud really depends on game. Dedicated servers, async compute etc. gives devs more options. 10x is local." And about downclocking rumor, he had this to say to another person. "No downgrading of power, I've seen same rumor, not sure where that comes from. Feeling good about visuals at E3 from press kits."
Take from it what you will but it's nice he answered me and the other guy on those questions.

 

[BobTheFork]

Hey guys, tweeted Phil Spencer about him mentioning only 3 times more power over X360. He said it was a mistake and he messed up the line. Said something similar to another person who asked. He said in reply to me "Depends exactly what you are doing with the system. For purely local compute functions closer to 10x + Cloud." and "Cloud gives more, cloud really depends on game. Dedicated servers, async compute etc. gives devs more options. 10x is local." And about downclocking rumor, he had this to say to another person. "No downgrading of power, I've seen same rumor, not sure where that comes from. Feeling good about visuals at E3 from press kits."
Take from it what you will but it's nice he answered me and the other guy on those questions.

As if we needed more proof that MS fucks their message every single time they talk live. Well, its not like anyone saw it...

The downgrade was always a rumor that's not serious, the issue is the production problems.

 

[Rogue_Ledr]

Everyone knows it was a mistake, just fun to watch it happen

It also just occurred to me, I don't think I've seen a Sony comment on how many times more powerful the PS4 is than the PS3.

People are too focused on how much more powerful it is than the Bone.

 

[Pristine_Condition]

Hey guys, tweeted Phil Spencer about him mentioning only 3 times more power over X360. He said it was a mistake and he messed up the line. Said something similar to another person who asked. He said in reply to me "Depends exactly what you are doing with the system. For purely local compute functions closer to 10x + Cloud." and "Cloud gives more, cloud really depends on game. Dedicated servers, async compute etc. gives devs more options. 10x is local." And about downclocking rumor, he had this to say to another person. "No downgrading of power, I've seen same rumor, not sure where that comes from. Feeling good about visuals at E3 from press kits."
Take from it what you will but it's nice he answered me and the other guy on those questions.

So they'll be releasing the specs soon? Did you ask them why they haven't done that yet?

 

[MCD]

So they'll be releasing the specs soon? Did you ask them why they haven't done that yet?

Why would they release the specs?

 

[smerfy]

So they'll be releasing the specs soon? Did you ask them why they haven't done that yet?

They're waiting for something...

edit: pic was a little big...quoting it to save everyone's eyes

 

[googleplex]

Why would they release the specs?

Why wouldn't they?

 

[DBT85]

Because they have released the true power figure people can infer for themselves that it is pretty beastly.

Oh sure I know, but it just seems to highlight how much Sony has changed once again. They aren't doing a Clarkson and screaming "poweeeeerrrrrrrr" from the rooftops.

The scary thing is just how much we did know before we were officially told anything and how much of what we thought we knew actually was fact. On top of that, all those non believers.

 

[MCD]

Why wouldn't they?

They are not under any obligation to?

 

[Pug]

As if we needed more proof that MS fucks their message every single time they talk live. Well, its not like anyone saw it...

The downgrade was always a rumor that's not serious, the issue is the production problems.

If MS does have production problems, they will never talk about them. Thus it will remain rumour. The downclock was nonsense.

 

[Pug]

Why wouldn't they?

Did they have release the spec of the 360? Did Sony ever officially release the clock of the GPU in PS3?

 

[skidoo800r]

Why wouldn't they?

I hope they do. Weaker than PS4 or not I really want to see the whole thing in detail.

On a side note, I asked him if 10x more than 360 was related to GPU power. Dunno if he could answer that but that big of a leap over 360 GPU wise sounds great to me.

 

[Pug]

I hope they do. Weaker than PS4 or not I really want to see the whole thing in detail.

On a side note, I asked him if 10x more than 360 was related to GPU power. Dunno if he could answer that but that big of a leap over 360 GPU wise sounds great to me.

Skid, vgleaks was on the button for the PS4, I wonder what they are with regards to Xbone?
By way say a console is this time or that times more powerful than previous generations is useless really. Theres multiple variables involved and comparing one generation with another it just pointless.

 

[Kyon]

If MS does have production problems, they will never talk about them. Thus it will remain rumour. The downclock was nonsense.

It's obviously not a rumor if the mods changed the yielding problems to fact because of what CBOAT said. At this point CBOAT has been right about almost everything. I'd believe him over PR guys doing damage control

 

[googleplex]

They are not under any obligation to?

It would be be completely idiotic not to. It looks like they have something to hide. because no matter how hard they try and keep it a secret...

It will leak


And it will be spread across the the internet


And they will look like morons for trying to stop the inevitable.


Much like Nintendo.

 

[Pug]

It's obviously not a rumor if the mods changed the yielding problems to fact because of what CBOAT said. At this point CBOAT has been right about almost everything. I'd believe him over PR guys doing damage control

There's no doubts CBOAT is an insider, I have no problems with that, but he got a few thinks wrong with MS presentation. MS hasn't released an PR with regards to yields so they are not spinning anything, at this point.

 

[Pug]

It would be be completely idiotic not to. It looks like they have something to hide. because no matter how hard they try and keep it a secret...

It will leak


And it will be spread across the the internet


And they will look like morons for trying to stop the inevitable.


Much like Nintendo.

Sony never officially announced the clock of the GPU in the PS3 and don't think MS released a spec sheet of the 360 either.

 

[DBT85]

CBoaT wasn't the only one to mention yields either don't forget.

 

[bobbytkc]

Sony never officially announced the clock of the GPU in the PS3 and don't think MS released a spec sheet of the 360 either.

Sony straight up released the teraflop count. There isno ambiguity there.

 

[googleplex]

Sony never officially announced the clock of the GPU in the PS3 and don't think MS released a spec sheet of the 360 either.

And they looked like morons for trying to hide it, and it all came out anyway.

 

[googleplex]

Sony straight up released the teraflop count. There isno ambiguity there.

To be fair, that teraflop count was pretty much bullshit.

 

[dragonelite]

Sony straight up released the teraflop count. There isno ambiguity there.

Dat release.. 2Tflops machine in a current gen jacket.

But serious everything can change and the specs are set in stone when tech site get their hands on the consoles.

But wouldn't a downclock in GPU also mean a down clock in CPU and Esram bandwidth?

 

[MCD]

It would be be completely idiotic not to. It looks like they have something to hide. because no matter how hard they try and keep it a secret...

It will leak


And it will be spread across the the internet


And they will look like morons for trying to stop the inevitable.


Much like Nintendo.

I hope the poor engineers behind X1 don't read this or they will never sleep well at night.


No seriously, it's pretty silly you think MS or Nintendo think like that.

And here is a thing: the engineers behind X1 have said this already:

We purposefully did not target the highest end graphics

Zero fucks given.

 

[Pug]

And they looked like morons for trying to hide it, and it all came out anyway.

I'm just pointing out there is no precedent from MS is releasing full specs.

 

[Taiser]

To be fair, that teraflop count was pretty much bullshit.

Why are the official 1.84 bullshit?

 

[dragonelite]

Why are the official 1.84 bullshit?

I think he is talking about ps3 2 Tflops announcement.
And i believe microsoft did the same with the 360.

 

[googleplex]

Why are the official 1.84 bullshit?

Sorry, I thought you were talking about the PS3 "flop"numbers Sony released.

 

[LCfiner]

Sorry, I thought you were talking about the PS3 "flop"numbers Sony released.

? But the 1.84 TFLOP number is what Sony released. Did they release something else?

 

[skidoo800r]

Skid, vgleaks was on the button for the PS4, I wonder what they are with regards to Xbone?
By way say a console is this time or that times more powerful than previous generations is useless really. Theres multiple variables involved and comparing one generation with another it just pointless.

Good point. What I will say is that all of us are in for a treat with what is to come during this new gen going off of what both companies have showed graphically for their launch titles.

 

[Pug]

Sony straight up released the teraflop count. There isno ambiguity there.

It's the information released when the 360 and PS3 were launched, not the PS4 Sony never officially released info on the GPU in PS3 becasue the knew it was weaker than 360's. MS however never has released a full spec sheet for any console as far as I'm aware so it's no surprise they haven't for Xbone.

 

[Pug]

? But the 1.84 TFLOP number is what Sony released. Did they release something else?

PS3 was the discussion, not PS4

 

[LCfiner]

PS3 was the discussion, not PS4

yyyeeeaaaah. too early for me.

 

[RetroStu]

Mistake. 360 has 512 MB of Ram and The One Has 8 GB of Much Faster Ram. 16x the RAM of the 360. Not even factoring the GPU and CPU combo.

Yep and thats not taking into account anything else like the cpu and gpu. People can't just look at flops and say the Xbox One has 6 times as many flops so its 6 times more powerful, you have to take into account every bit of hardware like the 16x ram etc.
The console is clearly 8-10x more powerful as a whole package.
I also like the way the Gaf ignores all the quotes from people saying 8x more powerful, 10x more powerful (EA) etc and use this obvious 3x more powerful fumble or mistake as 100% fact now. Ridiculous.

 

[driver116]

Was this posted?

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1748258&postcount=4504



As much as I like CBOAT, he definitely doesn't have a flawless record. Personally, I would trust someone who works on Digital Foundry and someone who works at AMD over CBOAT.

And 7 years of DF face offs show that they are incredibly MS biased. Yes the 360 has more better performing/looking 3rd party games, but whenever a PS3 game turned out better, they downplayed it and worded around it.

 

[kitch9]

Yep and thats not taking into account anything else like the cpu and gpu. People can't just look at flops and say the Xbox One has 6 times as many flops so its 6 times more powerful, you have to take into account every bit of hardware like the 16x ram etc.
The console is clearly 8-10x more powerful as a whole package.
I also like the way the Gaf ignores all the quotes from people saying 8x more powerful, 10x more powerful (EA) etc and use this obvious 3x more powerful fumble or mistake as 100% fact now. Ridiculous.

Can you read?

 

[Woo-Fu]

The console is clearly 8-10x more powerful as a whole package.

Clearly? Tell us more about your extensive benchmarking with production Xbox One hardware where such numbers were clear?

 

[dragonelite]

? But the 1.84 TFLOP number is what Sony released. Did they release something else?

Numbers aren't fixed until the consoles are launched.
Its even on the spec sheets.
And historically seen down clocks are the norm with both consoles.
Haven't heard about up clocks but then again im only really following console gaming this gen. If the X1 overheating rumors are also true i would be more
worried about next gen Rrod and Ylod.

Clearly? Tell us more about your extensive benchmarking with production Xbox One hardware where such numbers were clear?

It also has 3 times the bandwidth compared to the 360 if im not mistaken.
21 vs 65(?) GB/s the Edram only supplied high bandwidth(200+) to the rops if im not mistaken.

 

[dr. apocalipsis]

Yes, it scales linearly with clock speed.

Nope. Clock speed is just part of the equation.

(However, 1.8 GHz is impossible to reach with that architecture)

Lol, no. +200mhz is an easy achievable clock for that chip. 1'6Ghz is just the sweet spot between TDP/Performance of this architecture at current node.

It reaches it without the CPU.

A weak CPU can bottleneck a strong GPU and prevent it to perform at its fullest.

 

[lightchris]

Nope. Clock speed is just part of the equation.

Right, and it goes linearly into the equation. Total FLOP/s = floating point operations per cycle per core * number of cores * clock speed. Double the clock speed, double the FLOP/s.

Lol, no. +200mhz is an easy achievable clock for that chip. 1'6Ghz is just the sweet spot between TDP/Performance of this architecture at current node.

I was talking about the GPU's clock speed which should be 800 MHz. He might have thought the clocks of CPU and GPU are linked which I didn't notice.

A weak CPU can bottleneck a strong GPU and prevent it to perform at its fullest.

Has nothing to do with peak performance of a GPU.

 

[RetroStu]

Clearly? Tell us more about your extensive benchmarking with production Xbox One hardware where such numbers were clear?

Why do you have to act like a dick?, anyway i'll believe developers like EA who said the Xbox One was roughly 10x more powerful, besides this guy already said that it was a mistake what he said. You also don't need to be a hardware expert to know that its rumoured specs mean a machine far more powerful that 3x ffs.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

Lol, no. +200mhz is an easy achievable clock for that chip. 1'6Ghz is just the sweet spot between TDP/Performance of this architecture at current node.

I wouldn't call it "easy", because not all chips are useful for higher clocks, but it is possible.

A weak CPU can bottleneck a strong GPU and prevent it to perform at its fullest.

That's not really true. This depends on how the software is designed, and CPU power isn't that important when you can put many computational tasks on the GPU. Games can be tailored for a specific console so that bottlenecks won't be a big problem.

 

[dr. apocalipsis]

Right, and it goes linearly into the equation. Total FLOP/s = floating point operations per cycle per core * number of cores * clock speed. Double the clock speed, double the FLOP/s.

Real world doesn't approve that.

Cinebench r11.5
A10-6800k @ 4.1Ghz = 3.59
A10-6800k @ 5.05Ghz (+23.17%) =4.16 (+15.88%)

3DMark '06
A10-6800k @ 4.1Ghz = 18,462
A10-6800k @ 5.05Ghz (+23.17%) =21,011 (+13,81%)

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru...nd-review-a10-6800k-a10-6700-benchmarked.html

And those are the best case scenarios.

Has nothing to do with peak performance of a GPU.

Weak CPU, slow RAM, anemic system BUSes or even poorly coded drivers can prevent a GPU to work at 100%. Peak performance is either a theoretical number or an all ideal case scenario not achievable at real world workloads on real worl systems.

 

[Durante]

And those are the best case scenarios.

Why are you quoting benchmarks in a discussion that has been about peak FLOPS from the start? They are irrelevant.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

Real world doesn't approve that.

Cinebench r11.5
A10-6800k @ 4.1Ghz = 3.59
A10-6800k @ 5.05Ghz (+23.17%) =4.16 (+15.88%)

3DMark '06
A10-6800k @ 4.1Ghz = 18,462
A10-6800k @ 5.05Ghz (+23.17%) =21,011 (+13,81%)

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru...nd-review-a10-6800k-a10-6700-benchmarked.html

And those are the best case scenarios.

But aren't those only CPU clock frequencies? What about the GPU clock frequencies?

 

[dr. apocalipsis]

But aren't those only CPU clock frequencies? What about the GPU clock frequencies?

Cinebench R11.5 is a CPU only benchmark, but we can do this more painful if you want.

A10-6800k 4.1Ghz CPU/844mhz GPU (stock)
A10-6800k 4.6Ghz CPU/1100mhz GPU (OC) CPU +12.2%/GPU +30.33% (Really nice OC!)

Metro 2033

Stock: 53fps
OC: 53fps (+0.0%)

Dirt 3

Stock: 119fps
OC: 122fps (+2.52%)

3DMark11

Performance

Stock: 7632
OC: 8023 (+5.12%)

Extreme

Stock: 1788
OC: 1811 (+1.27%)

IGP alone

Entry

Stock: 3238
OC: 3514 (+8.52%)

I guess you get the idea. More here.

 

[lightchris]

Still completly irrelevant to a discussion which was about peak theoretical performance. Don't know what you're trying to prove. Nobody was saying anything about application performance with other limiting factors.

 

[Durante]

Cinebench R11.5 is a CPU only benchmark, but we can do this more painful if you want.

The only "painful" thing here is an argument about peak FLOPS using random benchmarks.

 

[Ushae]

No one wants, need or will use their controllers as a games main audio output. So 5.1 sounds through controllers is a useless bullet point.

What really? I think that's an amazing feature. I always use headphones for privacy and gaming at night (have baby and wife).

 

[coldfoot]

Why did you think I was joking? There's a market for them. Why else would the X1 support 5.1 for 4 controllers?

What is the source for X1 supporting 5.1 for 4 controllers and PS4 not supporting it?
all "5.1 audio through headphones" is just software mixing 5.1 over stereo, you know this right? The actual cable and hardware inside the controller is stereo.

 

[Melchiah]

Did they have release the spec of the 360? Did Sony ever officially release the clock of the GPU in PS3?

They did, and Sony didn't reveal the specs of RSX because it was weaker than the competitor's GPU, which is probably why the XB1 (and Wii U) specs aren't officially released.