I don't understand the modern day Republican party.

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Deified Data said:
IMO, reliance on corporate money, willingness to pander to the lowest common denominator to win votes, pigheaded foreign policy...basically everything that scares me about the Republicans. I'm not one of those "both parties are the same!" jokers, but they're similar enough to leave observant voters uncomfortable.
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Oh no doubt.

So long as campaigns can be entirely financed by large special interests, both parties are just as guilty of this.

But you're right, both parties are not the same. One party is at least willing to have a centrist debate.
 
Deified Data said:
IMO, reliance on corporate money, willingness to pander to the lowest common denominator to win votes, pigheaded foreign policy...basically everything that scares me about the Republicans. I'm not one of those "both parties are the same!" jokers, but they're similar enough to leave observant voters uncomfortable.
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You do know that is one of the most prevalent criticisms of the Republican Party, right? It's just odd that you would use that, and then remark about 'both parties are the same' jokers.
 
Soler said:
What exactly is it that scares people about republicans?
I understand the religious aspect of it but that's about it
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To me, it is their constant punishing of those that are trying to better themselves to reward those that have already made it. In my state the GOP has cut income taxes heavily while paying for that by cutting funding to the state universities and increasing the sales tax. Tuition has risen 8% just this year. In addition, arts funding that had a federal match was also dropped.

The party of small regulation has also wasted its time mandating doctors give out faulty medical advice and to tell state employes where they can send parts of their paycheck. Our secretary of state spends more time writing other state's voting regulations than working on his tasks at home.

None of these things will help the state overall, and I don't see how my state will able to compete with sub standard and unaffordable higher education even if the taxes are low.
 
Personally, I have no idea why anyone would vote Republican. I have conservative friends, and the Republican party just does not represent them or real conservative ideology. Again, I'm not trying to debate ideological differences. But for those that don't agree with the Democrat party, why not just vote third party? Even if you don't feel it won't make a huge impact, at least you can say morally you voted to the best of your ability. I dunno.

By the way, I really appreciate the mature conversation we are having here. If anything I've said you don't agree with, please call me out on it and explain why I'm wrong. I'm always with an open mind, and willing to reconsider my positions.
 
I think a lot of the modern Republican party and their double downing on extreme views is so that they don't lose their biggest donors (like the Koch Brothers and assorted millionaire old men). Not only that but they have convinced evangelical Christians that their party is 'the party of God.'

What I've noticed from the area I live in is that Republicans use misinformation, distortion and downright lies on Facebook to push their viewpoints.
 
They are provincial, simple minded people who cling to "traditional" values and who believe in the mythology of the ancient Israelites. They're scared of change, they distrust academia and intellectuals because of insecurities about their own intelligence, and this makes them angry and bitter.

They exist in the modern world, but their psychology is that of an early human.

Perhaps it's this juxtaposition that is hard for normal people to comprehend. You have someone living in 2013 who acts like they're living in 1213. And because there are so many of these people, they vote other, provincial, simple-minded morons to represent them in politics, which gives them air time on TV and radio and other media to spew their crap.
 
Deified Data said:
IMO, reliance on corporate money, willingness to pander to the lowest common denominator to win votes, pigheaded foreign policy...basically everything that scares me about the Republicans. I'm not one of those "both parties are the same!" jokers, but they're similar enough to leave observant voters uncomfortable.
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Gerrymandering and the two party system let them get away with it.

We put up with both parties' pandering to lobbyists because "the other guy is worse!"
 
Anyone ever have a conversation about current events or politics with high school/college age kids that vote Republican? That is an uncomfortable insight into a hateful mindset. Maybe it's not their fault, they could have been brainwashed by some institution.
 
I generally agree that the Republicans saying "this doesn't represent me" no longer have reasonable basis for that argument.

As others have said, on any given individual election, I can imagine voting for someone who ends up being different than you expect. You thought you elected a moderate, you instead elected an extreme xenophobe, or something. Accidents happen, and no single elected official can perfectly encapsulate your views.

But when these people are elected en masse and over several election cycles, that explanation loses its plausibility. You essentially have to argue that you just so happen to keep voting for extremists by accident every year across a wide variety of elected positions.

In a very literal sense, the Republican party does represent you if you keep voting for them. You cannot plausibly say, "This isn't who I thought I voted for" when that keeps happening over several cycles all across the country in a variety of elections.
 
Opiate said:
I generally agree that the Republicans saying "this doesn't represent me" no longer have reasonable basis for that argument.

As others have said, on any given individual election, I can imagine voting for someone who ends up being different than you expect. You thought you elected a moderate, you instead elected an extreme xenophobe, or something. Accidents happen, and no single elected official can perfectly encapsulate your views.

But when these people are elected en masse and over several election cycles, that explanation loses its plausibility. You essentially have to argue that you just so happen to keep voting for extremists by accident every year across a wide variety of elected positions.

In a very literal sense, the Republican party does represent you if you keep voting for them. You cannot plausibly say, "This isn't who I thought I voted for" when that keeps happening over several cycles all across the country in a variety of elections.
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I agree with you there. Although I do feel that some people just vote the party line, because it's the team they feel they have to vote for. I posted this a couple pages back, but I really do feel like people view it as: this party is good, this party is bad. And in America people really identify themselves with their political parties.

I personally know people that will vote Republican, even if they can't stand the candidate, just because they feel ideologically they can't support the Democrat opponent. So even if they don't think the candidate running represents them, they will still vote for them. I don't think this is a valid excuse though, and they share the blame for continuing the party in a direction that isn't what they want. The whole team mentality with political voting is just dumb.

Although sadly, I think there are a lot of voters on the right, who do want the batshit crazy things these people are touting. They must exist, or why would they be running on these platforms? So either the majority of the party supports this, or the system is set up in a way that only in the places that matter (ie. the districts where these people keep their jobs), is where these extremists are the ones that voting. I'm not sure that means they are the majority of the party's voters though. But they certainly hold the most power, since they are the ones who decide who keeps their job or not.

EDIT: I do agree with you though. I don't think it's an excuse if you keep voting for them. I guess i just wonder if the majority of the voters in this party support what is being sold, or if it's a loud minority that controls the power based on districting.
 
some people have picked their brand (Coke vs Pepsi) and they are sticking with it for life regardless

these people vote in absolute and there is no hope for these voters and it's best to just move along
 
I agree with OP, but I would personally go further and ask the question about politics in general. There is so much veiled intent by politicians that filters down through more veiled intent by media that there's really nothing to "understand" in my opinion. Layers upon layers of B.S. is all I can see.

I try to focus on the issues that I see as pressing; if there's nothing I can do to change it there's no reason for me to argue with my peers over it.

I might be more inclined to discuss these matters with friends/family more if people weren't so generally one sided about things. As it is, these discussions always result in poo flinging...a bunch of monkeys we are.
 
You'd have to understand decades of history.
Two Santa Clauses or How The Republican Party Has Conned America for Thirty Years

This makes sense to me.

The kids after WWII. "Fuckin' Aaay..." It was happy days.

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=405
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0774473.html
http://economy.money.cnn.com/2013/02/14/minimum-wage-history/
http://mediamatters.org/research/2013/02/15/the-minimum-wage-myths-amp-facts/192692

Some people believe they have a golden stick up their ass as opposed to seeing the elements of happenstance in time and place. They want to keep sink their claws in if not gain more.
Their kids aren't likely to have perspective cause it still was pretty neat to be middle class and white.

Things trickle along, stagnate or get worse.
Scapegoat X, Y and Z.

The simple answers make more sense as you poll up along the age demo.

And keeping it simple stupid works fairly well period across the demo.

30% or there-bouts of the youth vote *<30* went to Romney. I find even that number utterly fucked up.
That is my peer group and being a 90s kid the memories for most are careless kid times with maybe stealth positive enforcement of Democrats with Clinton.
And then you grow up while the biggest fuck up administration in 100 years happens.
A few years later bygones are bygones? Goes back to being ignorant or stupid. That colors everything.
 
my mind was blown when i learned that the Grand OLD Party is actually an offspring of the Democratic Party... and was founded because the Democrats were too conservative.

one can't make that shit up.
 
Wolfgunblood Garopa said:
You do know that is one of the most prevalent criticisms of the Republican Party, right? It's just odd that you would use that, and then remark about 'both parties are the same' jokers.
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Odd? At the end of the day, the only significant difference I see between the two parties are the values voters they choose to pander to - I just happen to agree with one set of values over the other. In every other aspect they're functionally identical. I think I can acknowledge that while still believing that one party is on the right side of social issues.
 
Deified Data said:
Odd? At the end of the day, the only significant difference I see between the two parties are the values voters they choose to pander to - I just happen to agree with one set of values over the other. In every other aspect they're functionally identical. I think I can acknowledge that while still believing that one party is on the right side of social issues.
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If both parties are equally at fault in these observations, then that would mean that it's normal for our politics, since we essentially only have these two parties.

That being said, Republicans are far worse with pandering.
 
ronito said:
Really?
Austerity
Disenfranchisement of the poor
Unfettered Corporate Access to government
No regulations
More tax cuts for the wealthy while cutting social program
More defense spending
Racial profiling
Less education and what education remains will be lower quality
Hawkish approach to foreign policy
Guns everywhere
Medicare vouchers (meaning medicare cuts)
Piss poor health policy
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So
Anacrocapitalism?
 
Catatonic said:
I would stop backing rebels and dictators with the hopes the new government would work with us. It's time to stop playing God around the world and quit funding these awful people that would normally be considered our enemies. Quit trying to upset other countries political environment in the hopes they become our allies.

I would stop being the enforcer for Israel. I would remove ourselves from the Middle East and focus more on defense at home. And I would stop using drone strikes that kill innocent people which ironically leads to a new generation of people that hate America.

America needs to stop trying to force their government onto others and instead should lead by example and focus on being a free democratic society back at home. I believe that will likely make others want to be like us. Not boots on the ground or playing a behind the scenes betting game on conflicts.
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This is the complete antithesis of what the GOP is about
 
Democrats do the same thing. They pander to the extremists because that's where all the passion is. Moderates don't donate enough money, go out to events or host dinner party fundraisers. UNLESS, you have some dream candidate that is incredibly charismatic, good looking and young.
 
I've been Libertarian for the past 20 years, as they're the closest to my beliefs and views. That said though, a politician is a politician is a politician. Doesn't matter if it's Bush/Obama/Whoever....they're all full of shit, and make outlandish promises (lies) that people fall for time and time again.
 
Rookje said:
Democrats do the same thing.
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Objectively false. Demonstrate anything that the democrats do to foster extremism, hate, antintellectualism, xenophobia, corporatism, hostility, etc. The craziest lefty in the democratic party wouldn't even get close to holding office. The republican party is part and parcel of extremism, many crazies are office holders and crazy is the center of the party.
 
Rookje said:
Democrats do the same thing. They pander to the extremists because that's where all the passion is. Moderates don't donate enough money, go out to events or host dinner party fundraisers. UNLESS, you have some dream candidate that is incredibly charismatic, good looking and young.
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Which extremists do you think they've been pandering to lately? I'm honestly curious
 
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