Does his side smash not exist or something? You're not the first person to say that, and I'm still confused. It doesn't function exactly as it does in Wario Land, but it's obviously the same attack. His down throw (hip drop) and crawling animation are also from Wario Land.
Super Smash Bros Wii U and 3DS: Info Collection - Dojo, Mega Man and Trailer! 2014!
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
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Aside from his size fiasco, they REALLY need to incorporate his Wario Land moveset, or move of the moves from those games, I don't see how they passed up perfect candidates to pull combat maneuvers from, instead opting to go with that janky frame skipping Wario Ware style. And please get rid of the fart. I know here a few years ago Wario somehow gained this "toilet humor" personality but him farting is almost an insult to me personally...he's a money grubbing brute! Not some gross, creepy little man...(well he's creepy regardless, but still lol)
If its not picture perfect, it does not count to them
DICKS AHOY
Banned
Because as you said it looks and acts virtually nothing like how it does in Land and given how other characters have elbow smashes could just be a lucky coincidence? His down throw doesn't resemble anything from how he throws in Land/World (in World his down throw is a wrestling-style piledriver, not him sitting on an enemy). Given how there's like, one sticker from World and absolutely nothing else from the Land series, it really does feel like they just decided to ignore half of the character's existence for no reason.
I'll give you him being able to crawl, but that is really lame and reaching when trying to argue they gave Land proper due in his moveset.
I wasn't talking about his Wario World piledriver, I was talking about his Wario Land hip drop attack. It's in Smash Bros. as a throw.
Gotta agree with Astrosanity....Wario's original persona hasn't been repped properly, especially since its PERFECT for a fighting game such as the Smash series. Like stated, hopefully we see some proper representation, especially since after Brawl came out we DID get another Wario Land game in the form of Wii's Wario Land Shake It!! (which I enjoyed quite thorougly, music and art style was amazing)
DICKS AHOY
Banned
You're going to have to explain what you mean by hip drop because I seriously can't think of what his down throw's a reference to. It's just him sitting on top of whoever he's grabbed.
Project M still keeps that 'weird' angle Sakurai wanted for the character while still having him move and fight like he was plucked out of his platformers. Only thing I disliked was getting rid of the wario chopper (know it's competitively viable but I *never* use his chomp attack).
Jump in the air in Wario Land 4 and press down -- Wario will do a butt drop. It's what his Smash Bros. down throw is in reference to.
It's the exact same shoulder tackle pose he has in the Wario Land games. There's nothing coincidental about it. Lots of Smash Bros. attacks work differently from the source material (Samus' charge shot, Mario's cape, lots more), so I don't know why Wario's shoulder tackle keeps getting singled out as some kind of travesty. It's the nature of Smash Bros. Wario Land hasn't been the focus of Nintendo's internal studios since 2001. WarioWare has replaced it, and so it makes sense that the majority of Wario's move set is inspired by those games.
DICKS AHOY
Banned
...
Those look and act nothing remotely similar. By comparison Project M's ground pound looks and works identically to how it does in the land games, right down to having the right button combination.
Besides pointing out he has just about jack pulled from his games whereas those characters usually have almost nothing *but* references to their games in their movesets, those examples you gave are still clear references whereas Wario's isn't. It get's singled out since it's a half arsed attempt at representing a major part of a character's established arsenal. It's not even the same pose but whatever, you've clearly already set your mind on how you feel about how he looks in Brawl as I have.
Poltergust
Member
You're funny.
I could swear that it's the same pose. Can someone post a comparison picture?
RawkHawk2010
Member
Seconded. Next thing you know Smash will draw even more influence form Master of Disguise and Wario's moveset will be changed to include literal shit.
I want some Land music at least. A lot of good themes going to waste because they focus more on Ware.
The Project M team did Wario almost perfect. From changing his running animations to his flex win pose, they hit the nail damn near on the head when they altered him to be closer to his World games. I know i'm beating a dead horse here but if they could have did something about his proportions and height then it would be sublime....sorry guys but its a personal and picky hot button issue for me lol
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
something something rabble about PM being die hard fans etc
Speaking of Project M, has anyone found any interviews or is there any proof that Sakurai knows and acknowledges them? Im asking because hopefully if he isn't some uppity egotistical dude (I don't know if he is or isn't just saying) then maybe he would be humbled enough to incorporate some of the changes the PM team made to some characters that obviously made more sense in terms of character authenticity, style, etc.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Apparently being Warioware is not authentic despite being the more recent appearance. Never understood why these folks had to remove any WW reference when changing Wario to his Land look.
Isn't Project M the mod that strips Falco of his unique animations and turns him back into a Fox clone?
I would love if ZSS was more like her Project M version. A couple others too, Project M is so fun.
Hey I didn't say PM team did a perfect job across the board, but some characters have better moves that fit them from the games they come from, like the pokemon (Charizard, Ivysaur, Squirtle)...while others they attempted to make their presentation, properties and animations a little different (like Sonic posing whenever he scores a clean hit with Homing Attack, I would DEFINITELY expect him to do that since he's cocky lol)
As far as Samus goes, and I know its wishful thinking since we're about to be four games in and still no changes, but I would love to see a more agile Power Suited Samus. I know ZSS is supposed to make up for that but I feel like her sleek look and how she moves in the suit, not to mention her gameplay in the Metroid games...its just a damn shame they made her this floaty heavy thing.
I would have liked to see a beam-switching mechanic with different properties like....
Plasma - Immolates target for a short while (think of the continuous damage of the Flower seedling that spouts on your head when struck by it)
Ice - Freezes characters in their tracks but sends them hurling like Ice Climbers' Ice Block. Slower projectile to compensate for freezing ability
Wave - Pierces the enemy, keeps going for a short distance afterwards. Weak to compensate for piercing ability.
And maybe some other moves we haven't seen like the Speed Booster or Power Bomb
I would have liked to see a beam-switching mechanic with different properties like....
Plasma - Immolates target for a short while (think of the continuous damage of the Flower seedling that spouts on your head when struck by it)
Ice - Freezes characters in their tracks but sends them hurling like Ice Climbers' Ice Block. Slower projectile to compensate for freezing ability
Wave - Pierces the enemy, keeps going for a short distance afterwards. Weak to compensate for piercing ability.
And maybe some other moves we haven't seen like the Speed Booster or Power Bomb
DICKS AHOY
Banned
The Brawl version literally just has him standing there in that one stationary pose, without even any of the exaggeration to his arm that they'd give to somebody like Mario when he throws a punch so it looks all the more plain.
Astrosanity is right. They look NOTHING alike! It's a total coincidence.
In comparison to all other incarnations where it's a horizontal moving attack with a cute run-cycle going on with his legs, there's a pretty big difference in how the two are implemented to the point where again, it's a passing similarity and it could have been integrated far better than how it was.
You're right; it's probably a reference. I (personally, this is all obviously subjective) feel you're wrong that it was a remotely faithful way of referencing it to the point where it may as well of just been something else and nobody would have noticed the difference. When you can only bring up three examples of how they referenced a game, one of which differs visually and functionally to the point where it's only a reference in concept (barge), one of which I think is reaching as all hell (him sitting down?) and him crawling (incredibly minor) whereas most other characters when they have a long-line of action games has at least a dozen proper references to their moveset, I think somethings gone wrong with how a character was implemented. I don't know why you're annoyed other people don't like how something was handled whereas you do.
Ironically despite all this Wario's who I main ed in vanilla-Brawl.
Explain what was taken from Wario Ware beyond his bike move and his final smash; the most I've ever gotten when I've asked this was a vague 'his moveset captures the essence of Wario Ware's wacky style!' response which essentially means squat. While I'm focusing on Land here, there's a general lack of *anything* relevant to his games in Brawl. The character is just off in Brawl compared to what you'd be familiar with him from either series, despite having a fun moveset.
Green Mamba
Member
I think the problem is not really that the shoulder tackle isn't properly represented per se, but rather that his moveset has so few callbacks to anything that his shoulder tackle being a poor representation of his shoulder tackle is just that much worse.
For things like Mario's Cape or Samus's Charge Shot, it's no big loss, there are plenty of other references to their classic titles. For Wario, the shoulder tackle is like the closest thing in his moveset that is a clear reference to his Wario Land moveset, and it's represented pretty poorly. Couple that with the way the Wario Land games are otherwise completely ignored in music, trophy, and even fucking sticker selection and it just leaves a sour taste in the mouth.
For things like Mario's Cape or Samus's Charge Shot, it's no big loss, there are plenty of other references to their classic titles. For Wario, the shoulder tackle is like the closest thing in his moveset that is a clear reference to his Wario Land moveset, and it's represented pretty poorly. Couple that with the way the Wario Land games are otherwise completely ignored in music, trophy, and even fucking sticker selection and it just leaves a sour taste in the mouth.
I don't "like" Wario's implementation, but I think -- after having played some of the WarioWare games -- that he's a faithful representation of the contemporary Wario. The majority of his move set focuses on the goofy, crude direction the character's taken in the last decade. Wario Land references are there if you look for them (shoulder tackle, hip drop, giant swing, crawling), but they take a backseat to his WarioWare stuff. I'd be just as angry as you are if Brawl's Wario is what we got in 1999 or 2001, but the focus of the character has changed. If I tried to distill the essence of the WarioWare games into a playable character, the results wouldn't be far off from what Sakurai attempted with Brawl's Wario.
DICKS AHOY
Banned
I said in my previous post, but I don't feel Wario beyond his FS and bike really makes any sense in relation to Ware either in Brawl. Those games in the few cutscenes that feature him doesn't really depict him as this almost-mime like character with minimal animations and still have a ton of references to his earlier games. Similarly, Wario Land 4 and World are just as 'out there' in terms of the bizarre Japanese humor department. Sakurai just had a different interpretation of Wario than what most others had, and while ultimately I'm cool with that since he's a fun addition in Brawl, I feel I'm allowed to be annoyed at how little he has to do with anything, Ware or Land related (though obviously the former got more attention), that I'd experienced in his own game series. It'd be different if it were like Fox or Falcon where major artistic licences have to be made since their games don't lend themselves too well to moveset ideas. I'm almost wondering if Sakurai was paranoid people would think Wario would be seen before Brawl's release as a cheap-Mario clone and went out of his way to be as out-of-left-field as possible with his design.
I can still hope that Wario gets a few small adjustments like Bowser and Pit have when he shows up in this game.
NeonZ
Member
The Warioman version does make him move though.
Well, you've got mini-games about biting, about raising your arms, lowering your head, etc. Wario generally isn't the character in those games, but I guess what they attempted to make in Brawl was Wario mimicking those movements. Wario's animation style with the sudden moves also was similar to the few frame animations of those mini-games.
There's a lack of Warioland representation, but his costume being from Warioware shows that classic Wario wasn't really the focus.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Honestly the only thing that feels off was his up B and B for not being references to anything (maybe B being his gluttony?). Hell, I thought his running animation being stiff was a callback to the gameboy Wario games.
Now I think about it, how difficult it must have been to make moves for a Wario Ware Wario compared to Land version...stuff like his Down Smash, Bair, its just like.....why? You have a perfectly good series to pull ideas from...instead you have Wario doing like a breakdance spin like move on the ground and his back aerial can only be described as "leaning back" or something....sheesh.....
Neoriceisgood
Member
So, that 3DS version huh!
DICKS AHOY
Banned
don't make me break out the motherfucking eyedropper tool here
His victory theme is from Wario Land Shake It, before the game even came out. But other than that...yeah
So the dude who asked about Pikachu's nose ...
How about DAT NOSE ?
http://kingdomt.deviantart.com/art/Yellow-Electric-Mouse-386903801
How about DAT NOSE ?
IceDoesntHelp
Banned
It's like I'm living in a Cuckoo Clock.
DICKS AHOY
Banned
From having too fat arms to having no arms at all. Looks adorable.
I'M FINISHED!
Um exCUSE me Sakurai but CLEARLY the best choice for Smash Bros would be my fav niche character HOWEVER you are clearly INCOMPETENT and
Getting a shoulder rub from Wario would be super relaxing. I am sure he has a few tricks up his sleeve.
Nice drawing. Though I wouldn't like it as a 3D model.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I wish the XY starters are in the game
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa125/playermode/20121228_180552.jpg
Something I doodled a while back, to replace the fart. Think of it as a jumping headbutt or uppercut. Here's hoping someone from Project M sees it and incorporates it into the next demo release lol
Something I doodled a while back, to replace the fart. Think of it as a jumping headbutt or uppercut. Here's hoping someone from Project M sees it and incorporates it into the next demo release lol
Hopefully.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
That looked more like an Up B.
Also why do people hate the fart attack? It's awesome!
Also why do people hate the fart attack? It's awesome!
I'M FINISHED!
Um exCUSE me Sakurai but CLEARLY the best choice for Smash Bros would be my fav niche character HOWEVER you are clearly INCOMPETENT and
Wario's farts spoil the plot of every Adam Sandler movie.
