I was always under the impression jobs move off shore because people don't want the manufacturing jobs, call center jobs etc. Americans by and large feel they need more pay and are worth more despite not having qualifications and or training. In my experience anyway. I'm generalizing a little with this statement but why work for $10 an hour when you can sit at home getting unemployment and food stamps? I think the US is a bit lazy, again my opinion on personal experience.
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Obama Offers to Cut Corporate Tax Rate as Part of Jobs Deal
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I was always under the impression jobs move off shore because people don't want the manufacturing jobs, call center jobs etc. Americans by and large feel they need more pay and are worth more despite not having qualifications and or training. In my experience anyway. I'm generalizing a little with this statement but why work for $10 an hour when you can sit at home getting unemployment and food stamps? I think the US is a bit lazy, again my opinion on personal experience.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Almost never, but he can't do anything else. He's a lame duck second term president, already. It's hard to see anything passing in the next 3 years.
you think it's a effort he knows isn't going to work?
Tylahedras
Banned
For large companies international profit needs to have a much lower tax rate to encourage repatriation of money for investment in the US.
For small companies laws and regulations need to be streamlined to make it easier to start, operate and be successful.
Corporate tax rates going down is pointless and will do very little to spur additional hiring or investment. Lowering it to 25% to try to encourage manufacturing inside the US is a flat out joke.
For small companies laws and regulations need to be streamlined to make it easier to start, operate and be successful.
Corporate tax rates going down is pointless and will do very little to spur additional hiring or investment. Lowering it to 25% to try to encourage manufacturing inside the US is a flat out joke.
CharlieDigital
Banned
Can you expand on this?
Incorporating in the US -- effectively starting a business -- is dead simple. You can fill out some forms online, submit a small fee, and you're good to go.
Deified Data
Banned
Republicans are far-right, Democrats are center-right. Any compromise that occurs is going to occur somewhere in that spectrum. It's not hard to imagine why people are put off by the prospect of "compromise" at this point. Some might just call it capitulation for the sake of looking busy.
I don't understand.
Yup this is 100% true it takes little time.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Yes. I think that's the case with a lot of stuff he's tried this year. First there was the gun control fight, which he had to know was doomed in the House. Then he pivoted to Pre-K funding which went nowhere, as everyone knew it would. Now immigration is slowly dying in the House, and the economy is stalling (again).
I'd imagine he still believes immigration can pass, but most of his 2013 actions seem like PR moves to reinforce what is obvious: the House is insane.
there are americans willing to work. jobs leave because they can get a car made without considering the health insurance, or retirement for children. and sell the product for more.
there's a standard of eating and shelter costs in cities with manufacturing. America's employers have to factor in these costs. others don't, as the re government pays or they have human rights violations.
Obama honestly does share the blame for being in the position he is. His ceaseless effort to appear like the great *~post-partisan uniter~* led to Republicans getting to frame every single debate, and forced his party to take on their rhetoric. He gave Republicans all the legitimacy they needed when both parties started pretending like austerity-fetishim was warranted. "im serious about the deficit!!!!"
How about we start at him not authorizing raids of (legal) marijuana dispensaries at an unprecedented scale and not ramping up the same Bush policies of hawkishness and erosion of civil liberties on a global scale?
Your impression is incorrect. Offshoring is driven by being able to hire more cheaply elsewhere, rather than by low demand for jobs here.
Corporations mostly shelter international profit earned overseas, domestic tax avoidance is just the avoidance of state taxes by locating in Delaware, Texas, Nevada, etc. They largely cannot escape corporate taxes on domestic earnings.
PhoenixDark
Banned
I'd rather just cut manufacturing and small business tax rates, but I'm fine with this proposal.
I wish he would hold a press conference and declare every day that things are specifically this way due to the following reasons, and have data. then open its up for the gop to respond. live on television or the net. people are getting sick of games from both sides.
I know what your saying that is true for many companies, Subaru has a US plant that seems to do very well and a lot of the US car companies have state side factories though. I'm in no way an economist you guys are probably more knowledgeable than I. Just working for large companies and being a manager who hired employees it is hard to find people to do simple tasks. Bad attitudes, tattoos, work ethic, customer service are all hard to find (or not find) especially in one person. If you do find those things they want a lot more money, I guess it's a double edged sword some of those traits are worth the money but convincing higher ups of that is impossible sometimes.
The home owner tax break would be a disastrous thing to eliminate (politically) for either party and would actually have a significant chilling effect on the economy and recovering housing markets. Maybe one day, but certainly not now.
Mammoth Jones
Member
diffusionx
Gold Member
This is crazy ignorant.
It's not 1976 anymore, welfare in this country has been gutted many times over, and most of it is tied to employment. Unemployment is limited. Food stamps come out to around $5-$8 a day in benefits, enough to keep you from dying on the street but hardly living large.
There are lots of people, tens of millions in fact, who work for less than $10 an hour right now. We have a situation where there are like, 5 unemployed workers for every available position and you think Americans are lazy? Wow. The jobs were moved offshore and replaced with nothing.
Karsticles
Member
I can't take his offers seriously without offering self-impeachment, personally.
Owch yeah local governments would crumble! Most of the State and City are still working on small budgets this wouldn't help at all right now.
diffusionx
Gold Member
You pay crap, you get crap. This is well understood in every single part of the economy save the labor market. Companies want to pay crap and get gold and the problem is the workers.
It's not ignorant again I said it's based on my experience from hiring and working in large corporations. I know people who literally did just what I explained and don't give a shit while doing it. I don't know where you live or your work experience so maybe it's better where you are. I've worked with hundreds of independent contractors in the construction/trade business and they all have the same problem. For the last 10 years I've been doing this I heard it DAILY. So don't tell me your opinion and call it fact.
timetokill
Banned
at people thinking this is a serious proposal. He's legislatively giving them a rope to hang them themselves with.
This strategy doesn't work when your opponent is into autoerotic asphyxiation.
Yep, pretty much how I see it. At least we won't see more conservative supreme court justices appointed.
at people thinking this is a serious proposal. He's legislatively giving them a rope to hang them themselves with.
Republican will happily do as they will with whatever rope Obama gives them. Meanwhile, this is all at the expense of the well being of the entire country. People on the left are pissed off at Obama, Republicans; corporations; and the wealthy get more of what they want and still trash Obama.... all in an attempt to make the Repugs "look bad".
Obama looks bad, Republicans look worse, and America goes to shit....... I"m having trouble seeing the justification here. It seems to me in the very end all this does is set up Democrats who are also willing to bend to corporate money look a little less despicable than the Republicans. It's empty marketing. "Vote Democrat. We look better, but we'll still fuck you over."
Metaphoreus
This is semantics, and nothing more
I'd like to clarify what you say here: there are two levels of law involved in the federal taxation of business entities. First, there is the state law under which the entity is formed: a business's typical choices for state-law entities are the corporation, the partnership, and the limited liability company. Second, there is the Internal Revenue Code, which provides three basic forms of taxation: "C corporations" (taxed under subchapter C) pay their own taxes, separate and apart from the shareholders; when dividends are distributed to the shareholders, the shareholders then pay tax on those. "S corporations" (taxed under subchapter S) do not pay their own taxes. Instead, each shareholder pays taxes (at the individual rate) on his or her share of the net income. Distributions to the shareholders are not taxed, since the shareholders already paid tax on the income as it was earned. Finally, partnerships (taxed under subchapter K) likewise do not pay their own taxes, but the shareholders pay taxes (at the individual rate) on the partnership's net income. There are important distinctions between S corporations and partnerships, but they aren't relevant to this brief overview.
The Internal Revenue Code provides each type of state entity with choices as to how it will be taxed for federal income tax purposes:
A corporation will be taxed for federal purposes as a C corporation by default. If it meets certain requirements, the shareholders can elect for the corporation to be taxed as an S corporation.
A partnership formed under state law will be taxed as a partnership by default, but can elect to be taxed as a C corporation or (if it meets certain requirements) as an S corporation.
An LLC with only one member is disregarded by default (meaning that the income and deductions are all reported on a Schedule C to Form 1040, as though the business were operated as a sole proprietorship), and an LLC with more than one member is taxed as a partnership by default. In either event, the member(s) may elect to have the LLC taxed as a C corporation or (if it meets certain requirements) as an S corporation.
I wanted to clarify because (1) it makes me look smart, and (2) I have this pet peeve about people referring to S corporations and LLCs as though they are alternative structures; they aren't. They come from completely different levels of law. I understood what you meant (a multi-member LLC does default to partnership tax treatment for federal purposes, which is an alternative to S corporation treatment), but I prefer that things be stated clearly.
EDIT: A corporate tax rate cut would only affect (directly) entities taxed as C corporations, since, like I said, entities taxed as S corporations or partnerships don't have a tax rate.
which is why none of this is Fucking funny.
people are still keeping track of their teams agenda, while the economy is a disaster.
it's ignorant because you're insinuating it's an American issue. it's a shit wage issue. which is the same anywhere. and your original offensive post was about jobs leaving because people are lazy and welfare.
after explaining to you why companies left, you're still here saying that you knew a guy once that did something. great, but manufacturing leaves because of profit and the ability to pay people less.you manage an industry that paid people wages that they can't survive on. minimum wage isn't a livable wage. working for nothing, as far as effort, time, and social standing. it produces negativity. being the working poor.
no one would disagree with you saying that unviable wages create bad work ethic.
I guess, in a very narrow sense of the pure political game of it, this is a brilliant political move; but political games have looooooooong ago fallen out of synch with what this country needs for long term stability and promoting higher quality of living.
nothing is funny about a bloated infinite military budget, Detroit filling for bankruptcy, 4/5 adult americans being poor, americans dying y younger than all first world nations, etc. it's passed the point of cheerleading the political game.
no one is getting the help or aid they need in this country. we cant standardize tests because the states that wanted to participate, can't afford the testing system that goes along with it. people are taking furloughs.
playing political games, and promoting the premise is exactly what aided in getting us here.a bunch of games, where the merging poor and middle class are the only losers.
there was a time, but that shit is over. americans need to start getting a sense of what they need to do to get government working for its population.
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PhoenixDark
Banned
How is it brilliant? He's done this before you know, and republicans have refused to play ball. It doesn't work...and Americans then blame both parties.
That`s the reality, Mr. Obama is a good speaker, nothing else. Obama is no socialist, he is a neoliberal, a black Romney. I ask me when the U.S. are finally insolvent.
It amazes me that people still think the President of the United States is a dictator that can do whatever he wants.
He was to work with congress. If he doesn't, nothing is going to get done. The problem is that he has a congress that wants to gum up everything so that in 2016 they can point and say that Obama did nothing during his second term, and passed socialized healthcare in his first.
If you want the president to start passing more left-wing stuff, support Democratic candidates running for congress next year.
He was to work with congress. If he doesn't, nothing is going to get done. The problem is that he has a congress that wants to gum up everything so that in 2016 they can point and say that Obama did nothing during his second term, and passed socialized healthcare in his first.
If you want the president to start passing more left-wing stuff, support Democratic candidates running for congress next year.
I've actually argued with other liberals in real life, who basically say that what we currently do with predator drones is essential -- if not to "keep us safe" -- for Obama and the whole Democratic party's image. They make their argument casually and with a mocking smirk on their face... It's not a fucking joke/game, and it makes me sick to my stomach seeing people so bought into it. People are dying, but they feel quite proud and secure thinking that I'm the whiny wimpy Obama hater; and they're the good players on team Democrat.
Tylahedras
Banned
Here are the separate steps generally speaking:
1) Register your business name with your state government.
2) Learn which tax identification number you'll need to obtain from the IRS and your state revenue agency then register for it.
3) Get a list of federal, state and local licenses and permits required for your business and apply for those.
Each state of course has it's own permits and licences depending on the type of business. And these relate to the government side of things, they don't for example include trademarking your companies name or doing any number of things you will need to do on your end from a legal standpoint. And once all that is done you still need a firm grasp of state, local and federal law relating to your industry and your employees. Failure to follow any one these will likely result in a lawsuit that ends your business.
Much of this mind you has nothing to do with Obama and he doesn't have control over it, a lot of it is crap that the states and local governments have piled on, often to raise money. I'm also not claiming America is the worst country in this regard, we are probably in the top ten, but that doesn't mean we do it well or that it's as easy as it should or could be.
I implore you to read my sentence again. Good politics in this country has long since fallen out of line with good policies. See what I'm saying?
BTW: I used italics in "brilliant" to imply a sarcastic tone.
Pretty much.
It's not a joke. What will get done is that the economy and everyone's livelihoods goes in the shiter, but you're happy with anything getting passed?
CornBurrito
Member
I had a History/US Gov teacher in high school who said that this was what American politics should be. Apparently not everyone sees compromise as a good thing.
empty vessel
Member
It's a procession.
Compromise for the sake of compromise is idiotic.
When one side is totally wrong (as is the case with Republicans and conservatism in general, keeping it real.) compromising ends up with watered down legislation that's not as effective as it would've been had it passed without the dumbshit added to it for the sake of one side feeling they "got something".
chaostrophy
Member
Many Northern/Western European countries which are much more equitable than the US and have higher income taxes on their rich than the US have a lower corporate tax rate than the US. So I don't see this news as terrible. IMO it makes more sense to heavily tax the individuals that extract huge sums of wealth from businesses for their personal fortunes than to tax the businesses themselves.
Dude doesn't have to get re-elected.
Cutting the corporate tax rate will have a negligible effect on jobs. Corporations aren't hurting for cash. No analyst is going to say that. In fact most economists use the word "hoarding" when they talk about corporate cash nowadays.
It's a dumb move.
Cutting the corporate tax rate will have a negligible effect on jobs. Corporations aren't hurting for cash. No analyst is going to say that. In fact most economists use the word "hoarding" when they talk about corporate cash nowadays.
It's a dumb move.
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