Super Smash Bros Wii U and 3DS Thread 2: Where Pilotwings is apparently Minecraft
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
- Start date
What could they possibly add? Randomly chucking in mechanics like that sounds like change for the sake of change.
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
Who said randomly chucking? We can't possibly have exhausted the coffers of video game mechanics. I don't want it new just to be new, but... well, maybe I do want that. I liked focus attacks in Street Fighter 4 because it was a new way to fight. Makes you rethink techniques, changes the flow of battles. If I wanted the exact same mechanics I'd just keep playing Brawl. So gimme something that makes me play it differently. Parries, counters, air-grabs, any number of things. Things I can't think of, preferably!
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
Ooh, that'd be fun. Guilty-gear style. Definitely put more focus on the mid-air game.
How about tripping?
That's kind of my point. Why fix what isn't broken? We can get a lot of new variety in quirky stages and characters with new playstyles. Why muck with the physics and mechanics if it's good as it is?
I'm not saying that they shouldn't come up with new ideas or use them if they work, but adding stuff for the sake of being different is a quick way to break a good game.
SenorArdilla
Member
Sudden lightheadedness when jumping.
Muscle cramps when swimming.
And if you don't move for a while, parts of your body may fall asleep.
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
I don't think anyone in their right mind is saying "throw in bad mechanics to be different." I want them to evaluate their fighting engine and figure out how to improve it or add additional depth. It's what I expect from a sequel. I absolutely don't subscribe to "why fix what isn't broken." There's so much more that a game can be beyond "not broken."
But why do there need to be mechanics changes to add more depth? Why can't that be fulfilled with unique ideas for characters or stages?
Part of Smash's appeal is its simplicity, that there's two attack buttons and no more. Melee added side attacks which was a logical addition, shield power because of the analog triggers, and air dodging to allow defense in midair.
Where do we have to go from there? How do you add some game altering mechanic that doesn't go against the one function per button rule of Smash?
this would be awesome
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
One function per button? R is used for grab, roll, sidestep, and air dodge (and arguably air-catch-thrown-item).
I don't consider "more characters" to be depth, because it partitions the depth. I want to pick up an old character and find something new there. I want my regular to be somewhat unfamiliar. I want to be encouraged to try new things, encouraged to break out of my traditional play style.
I think air dashes were a good idea. Utilizes existing paradigms. Air grabs would be the same kind of thing, maybe you air-dodge a guy and press A while he's passing over you. Risky cause it'll cancel your dodge if he's attacking, but can grab him if he's not attacking. Footstool jumps were a similar new thing, but are generally useless.
Insert sanctioned wavedashing! The ability to buffer an attack during a slide! Move cancels! There are a billion things we could do here to add nuance to the system. We don't have to pack in everything but the kitchen sink, I'm just listing options here, but the point is that there are a ton of directions to go in that in no way betray the spirit of SSB and its mechanics.
Actually, don't the "muscle cramps when swimming" already happen in Brawl? Unless I'm remembering incorrectly, can't you only stay in water for a limited amount of time until your character starts flipping out and then drowns?
All of these are "defense," with the exception of grabbing (which I forget you can actually do since I usually leave it to its own button).
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
Sure, I figured you meant that, but grabbing kind of negates the notion. Especially when if you're boiling it down to something like that, "B" moves can be all sorts of different things. Attack, defense, locomotion, etc. "Special" is a pretty vague thing.
None of my suggestions break the button-per-function rule you're suggesting anyway though.
[Edit] We can charge smash attacks, what if we could charge jumps
[Edit Edit] I probably want L-canceling back more than anything. I still do it unconsciously when I play Brawl. It just feels so good to do, to keep up that momentum.
I always wondered why they never expanded on this mechanic, since it would just stand to give everybody at least one more move/move extension to add to their repertoire.
Red Rudolph
Member
Unless you're WFT, obv.
It would make a lot of people happy as well. Imagine tilt side b with Bowser being the slam, but the smash version is koopa claw from melee.
You can essentially fuze melee and brawl movesets while also giving others new moves
I'm not against any of the suggestions I've read so far, even though I've got trouble envisioning some of them. I just don't understand why more of the same is bad for sequels lately.
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
Because more of the same is an edition, not a sequel. I don't want Super Smash Bros 3 Third Strike, I want SSB4.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
oh just skip my post D:
Yeah I've always wanted this as well. B-smashes only make sense.
So what was Brawl then, being that the only new move addition was basically an item? The changes were minimal in my eyes, and while I have no issue calling it a sequel I don't think something like the Footstool Jump or Tether Recover targeting is enough to set it apart with the criteria you've given.
Brawl added Final Smashes, swimming, ladder climbing, and... I think crawling was Brawl? I don't remember if it was on Melee.
Ah, but then there's the case of Sakurai visiting Platinum Games way back in May of last year. A year and three months is plenty of time to be working on a character from TW101 to get them implemented.
Crawling wasn't in Melee so that's new too. They also added gliding but I guess that doesn't count since it's for certain characters.
This isn't to say I agree with you that it'll be just another Brawl (I think SSB4 is gonna be more than that), but I just felt the need to provide accurate info.
I think this game can keep the same amount of move sets as is while still being a fresh game. Besides, I don't think Sakurai is the type of person to make something that's just feels like an expansion pack. I'm sure this game will have plenty of new content and new types of things such as customization.
I guess my issue then is that these are such minor things in my eyes that had they not touched the engine at all but shipped with the same content in Brawl, I wouldn't have seen an issue in it.
A fighter "edition" to me has always been the same game with minor tweaks to content, whereas a Smash sequel has so far always added so much in terms of stages and characters that I wouldn't compare the two.
Troubled Bat
Member
I still think Mario should use his cape to glide.
I agree. What a wasted opportunity...
Troubled Bat
Member
It really is. He could also have his own unique attack, like when he flys straight down and causes the ground to shake around him from the impact.
I say people should start a Miiverse campaign.
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
People have listed some things, but honestly, I wasn't too happy with how little Brawl brought to the table. I think the main things that altered how I played were the changes to air dodges and the loss of L-canceling. Air dodges were pretty big, actually, being able to do them without losing the rest of your jumps, and not being able to evade directionally. And with that the implicit death of wavedashing. But I wanted more.
I don't really expect SSBU/3DS to actually be a larger update than Brawl was, unfortunately. If anything, I expect it to be smaller. I'll probably be pretty disappointed by that. But I can hope.
Hot Coldman
Banned
Are you sure?
The name of bow in Uprising is Palutena Bow.
Huh. I never, ever got that thing. I assume it's OP as fuck?
Choppasmith
Member
Surprisngly, no, it's actually pretty average. I think having strong side dash shots is its highlighted feature.
Red Rudolph
Member
The fifth post in that thread is really creeping me out.
Green Mamba
Member
Pit's Palutena Bow is on the box art for Kid Icarus Uprising, and a giant one attacks you at the end of the flying section of the second to last level (the one with Dyntos).
EDIT: It had its name "Palutena Bow" since Brawl. It is, according to the Brawl trophy, not his bow from the original Kid Icarus, but something Palutena made to give to Pit between the old Kid Icarus and Uprising. But then Uprising says all of the weapons Pit uses are things Dyntos made, supposedly, or something. I don't know.
EDIT: It had its name "Palutena Bow" since Brawl. It is, according to the Brawl trophy, not his bow from the original Kid Icarus, but something Palutena made to give to Pit between the old Kid Icarus and Uprising. But then Uprising says all of the weapons Pit uses are things Dyntos made, supposedly, or something. I don't know.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
I'M FINISHED!
Um exCUSE me Sakurai but CLEARLY the best choice for Smash Bros would be my fav niche character HOWEVER you are clearly INCOMPETENT and
If Final Smashes are more balanced this time around I wouldn't mind seeing a FS gage. I am not saying it should be standard, just an extra feature that can be turned on and off.
I want these. I've also always been on the "Final Smash should be an EX move mechanic" train. Imagine like A+B does a neutral ex, tilt+A+B does another and Smash+A+B does the most powerful of the three? They wouldn't be guaranteed instakill type things but would be balanced around Smash Bros. specific meters (visible or "invisible") and be used for better knockback, different move properties or more damage.
Freezie KO
Banned
I don't mind the Smash Ball for Final Smashes... if they can keep it balanced. I like that Smash is doing its own thing instead of a gauge. But I don't like that the person winning the match can hit the ball 18 times and it takes 2 hits from the person losing.
They need to treat the Smash Ball just as a part of the game, not as a Mario Kart blue shell. And only one per match would be nice. It gets ridiculous having 3+ every fight.
They need to treat the Smash Ball just as a part of the game, not as a Mario Kart blue shell. And only one per match would be nice. It gets ridiculous having 3+ every fight.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
*shaking magic eight ball*
Will I see Ridley tomorrow morning?
*turned the ball over and see the answer*
Will I see Ridley tomorrow morning?
*turned the ball over and see the answer*
*shaking magic eight ball*
Will Ridley be a vomit-inducing abortion inspired by Other M's rendition, which in turn was inexplicably inspired by that one Nightmare Before Christmas character, which in turn was inspired by Dr. Frankenstein?
*eight ball says, "Keep a bag handy"*
Will Ridley be a vomit-inducing abortion inspired by Other M's rendition, which in turn was inexplicably inspired by that one Nightmare Before Christmas character, which in turn was inspired by Dr. Frankenstein?
*eight ball says, "Keep a bag handy"*
...full of party equipment due to it being the best Ridley and not aboma-Ridley.
starwarsfan541
Banned
Diddy Kong
Banned
Wonder Red would be pretty bad ass. Fingers rossed 
RomanceDawn
Member
Did someone calculate a character reveal again with tomorrow being it? Its Ridley without a doubt! I mean its inevitable right? 
starwarsfan541
Banned
Did someone calculate a character reveal again with tomorrow being it? Its Ridley without a doubt! I mean its inevitable right?
This, did someone say there was one?
0_0 that accuracy