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[MYeager]

This would all be cleared up real quick if someone just asked about it on that Xbox forum.

Except they only share that info with the account holder. They've cracked way down on posting information related to bans publicly, probably for legal reasons.

I don't believe the original poster is guilty, but I also will not assume Microsoft was wrong either (I've read way too many posts on the support forum about how someone was innocent when it was obvious that they tampered with their HDD). Since there will never be enough information revealed it's really hard to make any kind of judgement call.

Sucks the guy got banned though. Trying to navigate their customer service for anything is kind of a pain in the ass. At least it was years ago, I don't know i that's changed at all over time.

 

[elementalsin]

I love how the console ban message is 'we won't tell you why you're banned and there is no recourse.'

The very definition of arbitrary. Just imagine, we almost had a whole console subject to this.

Jesus, sensationalist much?

And if you want to get right down to it... nothing has changed that prevents them from being able to ban you for anything they want. So.... yeah?

 

[yami4ct]

This might be my most favorite GAF response ever. Well said and you presented your argument maturely.

Aw. Thanks. I try to keep a calm head in terms of internet discussions. Just because I don't know a person, can't see them, and don't agree with them doesn't mean they don't have something of value to bring to the discussion.

Also, a well reasoned argument is the best way to make your point. If the only reason you have for your thoughts is that you have them, then there really isn't much to talk about.

 

[hirokazu]

Jesus, sensationalist much?

And if you want to get right down to it... nothing has changed that prevents them from being able to ban you for anything they want. So.... yeah?

I'm not sure how that's sensationalist. If the Xbox One backflip never occurred and you get permabanned, all of your retail games would become unplayable because you need to sign in authenticate them.

If you get permabanned now, at least you can still play the retail games that you bought.

 

[JaseC]

I'm not familiar with Sony, Nintendo, Valve history. So does Sony, Nintendo, Valve banned as well for similar actions which gamers exploit through their loopholes?

Valve stopped outright banning accounts about 18 months ago now and instead just restricts functionality, so even if you transgress in the most severest of ways (like filing a chargeback and refusing to resubmit the funds, for example), you can still access what you've purchased. That said, there have been no situations on Steam analogous to creating an XBL account in a different region to score a free game that is a paid title elsewhere -- the closest comparison would be taking advantage of obvious price mistakes, which Valve always honours.

Well, that's true, but something being against the ToS depends on what ToS actually say. Valve, for one, outright prohibits accessing other region's stores. It's enforced by an IP block and an account ban if you use a proxy to circumvent it. This is stated explicitly in the Subscriber Agreement:

That's actually incorrect, funnily enough -- if Valve catches you bypassing regional restrictions, the worst that will befall your account is the complete removal of the ability to purchase and (presumably) trade (see here, for example). The pertinent bit:

Our records indicate that you are using this account to purposely bypass regional content restrictions or regional pricing.

In the future, do not resell games to users in regions that do not match the price of the region in which you reside or are purchasing from. Additionally, do not use proxy or VPN software to falsify your purchasing region.

Note that the reselling of games is not supported by Steam Support. If you choose not to follow these instructions, your current and future reselling accounts will be permanently blocked from purchasing on Steam.

 

[Big-ass Ramp]

I can't imagine exploiting something like the Oman thing knowing I had that much online content I paid for. Way too risky.

 

[RukusProvider]

Avoid exploits, avoid bans.

Risk vs reward. You got stung this time.

 

[ilMikhail]

I can't imagine exploiting something like the Oman thing knowing I had that much online content I paid for. Way too risky.

this , its your fault man , deal with it

 

[PaulloDEC]

It sucks for the OP that they got nabbed, but the fact is that nowadays the console manufacturers have us all at a disadvantage. The rules are the rules, and they don't have to be fair. If we do something that isn't technically against the rules, there's not much stopping them from making a new rule to cover it.

The moral of the story is that we all ought to play nice, and play fair. Or else.

 

[Ocaso]

this , its your fault man , deal with it

I think too many people are missing that this was almost certainly NOT for the Oman thing, or the time games were free on Chinese accounts, or on Costa Rican accounts, or any of the myriad of times MS made a pricing error.

 

[BadAss2961]

Valve stopped outright banning accounts about 18 months ago now and instead just restricts functionality, so even if you transgress in the most severest of ways (like filing a chargeback and refusing to resubmit the funds, for example), you can still access what you've purchased. That said, there have been no situations on Steam analogous to creating an XBL account in a different region to score a free game that is a paid title elsewhere -- the closest comparison would be taking advantage of obvious price mistakes, which Valve always honours.



That's actually incorrect, funnily enough -- if Valve catches you bypassing regional restrictions, the worst that will befall your account is the complete removal of the ability to purchase (see here, for example). The pertinent bit:

The worst thing about it on Microsoft's part is that you're paying them annually for their service, only for them to walk away with your money and games if you slip up . Steam's ban is less severe, and their service is free.

 

[toythatkills]

It wouldn't surprise me if this was due to the Oman thing, MS have screwed up and given away free games in other regions by mistake before, but this was like thirty games or something, and everyone knew full well going in that it was a mistake and that they were not entitled to those games.

Saying that, there's plenty of other things it could be. I imagine most of us have received messages from weirdos on Xbox LIVE asking us to do "license transfers" to swap downloaded games with them, and maybe the OP just went with it. Having read the xbox.com banning forum now and then for entertainment, you realise that Microsoft very rarely make mistakes with bannings, if the OP was banned then it was very likely deserved, however massively shit they are at advising why it happened.

EDIT: I don't know why people are talking about how he's lost his game collection. The Xbox will be perfectly usable offline so all the games are fine (save for multiplayer, obviously) unless they're all Xbox LIVE Indie Games.

 

[Korosenai]

Man...that "thank you" at the end of the email italicized is just so sinister sounding.


Thank you.

It's like that one guy's tag on here that says "straight" then changes when you hover over it.

When you hover over the Thank You it changes to "fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you".

 

[Magwik]

I am still wondering why Zune Social is still in the code of conduct email.

 

[sangreal]

It's pretty hard to get your account banned

The worst thing about it on Microsoft's part is that you're paying them annually for their service, only for them to walk away with your money and games if you slip up . Steam's ban is less severe, and their service is free.

XBLG has nothing to do with the marketplace. MS originally said getting banned wouldn't cost you your existing games on XB1 but I wonder if that changed post-180

 

[yami4ct]

EDIT: I don't know why people are talking about how he's lost his game collection. The Xbox will be perfectly usable offline so all the games are fine (save for multiplayer, obviously) unless they're all Xbox LIVE Indie Games.

Any games he's bought, but aren't on his HDD, are as good as gone. You can use the ones you already have on your hard drive, but you can never go online to grab the stuff you've deleted. I don't argue with Microsoft bans, as they get it right a vast majority of the time, but that aspect certainly gives me pause.

 

[Sakujou]

You guys are certainly nasty.

the exploit of the oman thing should result into banning that one account and not the main account.

whats wrong with switching the account? it is dedicated to people in oman, on the other hand, as a german you get constantly fucked over just because we have such tight controls of violent games.

for myself, i think this sucks super hard. why not just get out the games, and ban the oman account which was used???

It wouldn't surprise me if this was due to the Oman thing, MS have screwed up and given away free games in other regions by mistake before, but this was like thirty games or something, and everyone knew full well going in that it was a mistake and that they were not entitled to those games.

Saying that, there's plenty of other things it could be. I imagine most of us have received messages from weirdos on Xbox LIVE asking us to do "license transfers" to swap downloaded games with them, and maybe the OP just went with it. Having read the xbox.com banning forum now and then for entertainment, you realise that Microsoft very rarely make mistakes with bannings, if the OP was banned then it was very likely deserved, however massively shit they are at advising why it happened.

EDIT: I don't know why people are talking about how he's lost his game collection. The Xbox will be perfectly usable offline so all the games are fine (save for multiplayer, obviously) unless they're all Xbox LIVE Indie Games.

you cant use shit on your xbox, if its offline.

tried your games on demand or your indie games? well for me, it shows that most games i have to be online or i should download them again.

 

[Ocaso]

for myself, i think this sucks super hard. why not just get out the games, and ban the oman account which was used???

You're right, banning the Oman account would make more sense, which is why this was almost certainly not for the Oman thing. That thread was filled with people admitting to downloading games, and only one GAFer gets banned? Seems unlikely. This is probably about another issue.

 

[FiveMinuteHero]

Funny banning users for lying about their country.

When I emailed nintendo Europe asking them if they are going to add a store for my country, their cool reply was to make a fake UK account and use that store. It eve accepts my credit card.

 

[AcceptableGhost]

Not letting users access games they purchased should not happen under any circumstances, it is inexcusable.

 

[93xfan]

So you take away his whole account? All the games you've ever bought? I understand taking away the games he downloaded from Oman but everything hes ever bought and done on your platform?

Incredibly excessive.

some people here are merciless

 

[Miles Quaritch]

I bet it's for another reason or else there would have been mass bannings by now

Yep. Hundreds took advantage of the free games glitch and yet only a couple of people have been banned?

Yeah, we're not getting the full story..

 

[Orca]

Funny banning users for lying about their country.

When I emailed nintendo Europe asking them if they are going to add a store for my country, their cool reply was to make a fake UK account and use that store. It eve accepts my credit card.

A mod is going to have to edit the thread title because people are too lazy to read even a few replies. It seems obvious that it's not related to the Oman thing.

 

[Zumblakladla]

I'm greedy and stupid. That's why I got banned. I got 350 games on steam, over 100 games for xbox360 (overall) over 100 games for PS3, 30+ vita, 20 ds-3ds, shitload for wii, i have a lot of triple copies (pc, x360 and ps3 versions of the same game) and i wanted 10 funcking games that i wont even play it!!!

Fucking greedy idiot!!!! Cant fucking belive it i flushed over 500€ of content! Fucking idiotic, without any reason.

 

[sangreal]

Yep. Hundreds took advantage of the free games glitch and yet only a couple of people have been banned?

Yeah, we're not getting the full story..

Even actual piracy doesn't get your account banned

 

[Defect]

Sucks dude. I know how it feels to lose a console and two main accounts with a third one on the line (If the Oman thing will get it banned.).

I don't think you're telling the whole story though. Apparently you let other people use your Oman account to download the free games? That has to be why.

 

[BootlegSnackz]

Not letting users access games they purchased should not happen under any circumstances, it is inexcusable.

This is what scares me about digital purchases. Unless it becomes as easy as mp3's We don't really have any control. MS could just take it all away with the push of a button.

 

[JaseC]

Even actual piracy doesn't get your account banned

Microsoft is very good at cracking down on presumed piracy, though.

 

[AcceptableGhost]

It doesn't matter if he pirated games, committed 20 chargebacks, punched a microsoft employee in the face or anything really. Cripple his account to not allow online play and or new purchases and let him continue to play stuff he purchased. There is zero reason to remove access to things someone purchased.

 

[SparkTR]

This is what scares me about digital purchases. Unless it becomes as easy as mp3's We don't really have any control. MS could just take it all away with the push of a button.

Steam has system where they only ban you from the storefront/community sections, but all your games are still downloadable/playable forever. Do Sony/Microsoft have a system like that? It seems insane to me that these guys are pushing digital so hard but have paid so little attention to the PC services in that regard (Hell, even Origin does bans like that).

 

[Zumblakladla]

Sucks dude. I know how it feels to lose a console and two main accounts with a third one on the line (If the Oman thing will get it banned.).

I don't think you're telling the whole story though. Apparently you let other people use your Oman account to download the free games? That has to be why.

No i have not :/

I would really like to see that activation system on MS website like sony has, so i can prove that too...

 

[Madness]

The Oman thing had you create an account tied to Oman country, which had free games. Not theft per se, but it is against the ToS so i can see why they are banning for it.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=677769

Uh what? You create an outlook email that is tied to Oman and just download the profile to your console and legally download. If I had a friend from Oman and did it, it's the same thing. If I moved to Oman and downloaded the profile, it's the same thing.

No copyright protection was breached, no laws broken, no terms of use broken. Until they make downloading profiles illegal, you are good. You were banned for something else OP, not because of the Oman thing.

 

[Zumblakladla]

I wouldn't make topic here if i made some other stupid things... I'm not that retarded.

People getting axed because of someone else for such a long time, i really want to see what's the reason why i got banned.

Damn why don't they try and look at my login logs, my purchase history and all other shit, its like banning without thinking who's loyal customer and who's not. Ok i took advantage of exploit but i gave them shitload of money untill that moment... What the...

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

I wouldn't make topic here if i made some other stupid things... I'm not that retarded.

People getting axed because of someone else for such a long time, i really want to see what's the reason why i got banned.

Damn why don't they try and look at my login logs, my purchase history and all other shit, its like banning without thinking who's loyal customer and who's not. Ok i took advantage of exploit but i gave them shitload of money untill that moment... What the...

Go to the xbox forums on xbox.com I promise they will tell you the exact reason why you were banned. Go do that then report back to us.

 

[DarkCloud]

They've reversed bans with complete proof of purchase.

Correct. The reason Skilleton never got his account back is because he didn't have a receipt dated from the day he bought it. He did an under the table deal with the store clerk...was going to pay for it but not ring it up till release date so the store wouldn't get flagged. Then when he got banned refused info at first (name of store) to save the clerk's job. All this on top of not having a receipt showing he bought the game.

He didn't just walk into the store and pick up a copy of Halo 4 not knowing it wasn't supposed to be out yet. He went in with full knowledge that it was breaking street date and was actually trying to get an early copy despite this. The huge orange do not sell sticker on all copies of halo 4 is kind of a giveaway there as well. MS overreacted but his own actions were what prevented him from getting the issue resolved.

As far as Microsoft was concerned that copy of Halo 4 was stolen...and as no proof of any transaction was available I don't blame them for thinking that.

 

[Madness]

I wouldn't make topic here if i made some other stupid things... I'm not that retarded.

People getting axed because of someone else for such a long time, i really want to see what's the reason why i got banned.

Damn why don't they try and look at my login logs, my purchase history and all other shit, its like banning without thinking who's loyal customer and who's not. Ok i took advantage of exploit but i gave them shitload of money untill that moment... What the...

My friend, I am almost certain it has nothing to do with the Oman thing and it's something else. You really should try contacting customer or Xbox live support. You deserve answers. It's not just GAF that took advantage of the Oman thing. It was on every site from cheap ass gamer, slickdeals etc. Why weren't there hundreds or even thousands of bannings?

 

[sakipon]

OP, have you asked the customer service about the reason you got banned? They are giving out explanations, there's a whole forum for such questions and answers.

Everyone always claims they're innocent. Maybe you are, but we'd need some evidence to back it up, like a statement from the MS customer service.

 

[Zumblakladla]

Go to the xbox forums on xbox.com I promise they will tell you the exact reason why you were banned. Go do that then report back to us.

I made 2 threads over there. None of them are approved. I need to sleep now, havent slept whole night, 9am here...

Thanks for everyone for support and of course criticism... Hopefully I will find out more about this tomorrow (later).

OP, have you asked the customer service about the reason you got banned? They are giving out explanations, there's a whole forum for such questions and answers.

Everyone always claims they're innocent. Maybe you are, but we'd need some evidence to back it up, like a statement from the MS customer service.

Customer service couldnt help me. They told me to contact enforcment team and to see with them about transfering my funds, gold subscription and licences of the game to other account or a chance for unban. I contacted them they are ignoring me, for like 5 hours. Maybe more.

Also i asked to get me to Tier 2 support as someone told me, and they apparently couldnt do it, as they said to me, becaue even tier 2 team support cant help me. I can only settle this with a people who reviewed my account and banned me.

 

[cpp_is_king]

Uh what? You create an outlook email that is tied to Oman and just download the profile to your console and legally download. If I had a friend from Oman and did it, it's the same thing. If I moved to Oman and downloaded the profile, it's the same thing.

No copyright protection was breached, no laws broken, no terms of use broken. Until they make downloading profiles illegal, you are good. You were banned for something else OP, not because of the Oman thing.

Taking advantage of a region-exclusive deal, while not physically present in the region in question, is most definitely against the ToS

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

OP, have you asked the customer service about the reason you got banned? They are giving out explanations, there's a whole forum for such questions and answers.

Everyone always claims they're innocent. Maybe you are, but we'd need some evidence to back it up, like a statement from the MS customer service.

Yup. I have browsed those forums many times reading all of the "why was I banned!??" threads. All of them sound so innocent until one of thos xblpets tell them the exact reason why..

"Why was I banned?"
You modded the console and made your avatar a color yoi cannot choose from

"My son was banned from xbl and I pay every year for subscription why was he banned?"
Your son was nude on camera in a game of uno

etc..

 

[Truespeed]

edit: OP already answered that he posted his question on the Xbox Live Suspended forum.

 

[Madness]

Taking advantage of a region-exclusive deal, while not physically present in the region in question, is most definitely against the ToS

OP's account never did that. Nor did his console. It was a legally created account for Oman, and recovered on OP's profile. There was nothing that was done illegally, nor was anything against the ToS. You can't seem to separate everything was legally done through a loophole.

And even at the most, if the Oman account was deemed to not be fundamentally sound, they should only ban that and not the OP's main account on the console.

 

[Fess]

It doesn't matter if he pirated games, was found to be stealing credit cards, committed 20 chargebacks, punched a microsoft employee in the face or anything really. Cripple his account to not allow online play and or new purchases and let him continue to play stuff he purchased. There is zero reason to remove access to things someone purchased.

I kind of agree with you, it's the risk of losing the access to everything that makes me fear the digital future. I nearly lost everything I had bought digitally on the 360 just by forgetting my password, and having an old emailadress registered at an ISP that I didn't use anymore, I simply couldn't do the password recovery.
Simple human mistake - huge consequences. But I got it all back just a few days ago thanks to my brother so it's all good now, I'm still not a digital purchase supporter though. I know I won't ever lose my physical games, unless someone steals them, but losing digital purchases seems to be way too easy.

 

[Triggerhappytel]

Marketplace Theft, almost certainly the Oman thing.

You took advantage of an exploit to get a game you were not entitled to, the punishment is expected and just IMO.

There's gonna be a lot of similarly upset people over this, but they all knew what they were doing.

Oh, bullshit. They made a bunch of games free, presumably by mistake, and a lot of people took advantage of it. It's not theft; it's exploiting an error. Is there anything in their TOS which specifically states that users cannot create accounts in other regions? Or that there will be recourse if they take advantage of MS's mistakes?

I'm not familiar with Sony, Nintendo, Valve history. So does Sony, Nintendo, Valve banned as well for similar actions which gamers exploit through their loopholes?

I know it's happened with Sony before, and to my knowledge they just admit their mistake and apologise. For instance, GTAV was, I recall, accidentally available to download and play last week. They soon changed it, but I've not heard of any bans to consumers as a result.


Edit @ OP: I reckon you should Tweet Phil Spencer or Major Nelson or someone like that in the public senior team, and ask why consumers get banned for something which is clearly not "theft". Say you've bought dozens of games on Live and been a customer for X years, and that if your account is not restored they've made the decision for you to buy a PS4 in a couple of months.

 

[Visualante2]

It's weird how the group thinking on GAF regarding fraud is so morally ambiguous.

 

[Drkirby]

Mate, its their fuck up, not mine, half of the world was using this...

Im from Serbia, kind of third world country... You really think they give a fuck about me?

Well, since there is nothing useful I think any of us can contribute at this point, I feel I can at least give you a history lesson.

Now, the whole "First/Second/Third" world thing stems back to the Cold War, and refers to the type of economy and allegiances at the time. First World Nations were those aligned with the United State, and had developed Free Market Economies. Second World is nations aligned with the Soviet Union, and had planned economies. And Third world are nations that allied with nether, and lacked a strong global economic impact. Serbia is second world nation, not third.

 

[cpp_is_king]

OP's account never did that. Nor did his console. It was a legally created account for Oman, and recovered on OP's profile. There was nothing that was done illegally, nor was anything against the ToS. You can't seem to separate everything was legally done through a loophole.

And even at the most, if the Oman account was deemed to not be fundamentally sound, they should only ban that and not the OP's main account on the console.

Was the OP's console physically located in Oman when the download occured? No. Therefore it was against the ToS. I'm sorry you don't agree with this, but that's how it works.

It is for this same reason that if you download certain music from iTunes or Google Play, or certain movies from Amazon Instant Video, and take your device across a border, the content will be unavailable / removed from your device.

 

[ridethepiggy]

It's weird how the group thinking on GAF regarding fraud is so morally ambiguous.

Group thinking eh

 

[Truespeed]

It's weird how the group thinking on GAF regarding fraud is so morally ambiguous.

Equally weird is how the riotous are able to demarcate the morality of downloading music and videos from games.

 

[Birathen]

Glorious the all digital future will be! We will be at the mercy of corporations like MS and EA. Hehe.