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[Jest Chillin]

A lot of people get offended by a lot of different things, and their levels of tolerance to such things varies depending on the person. Where is the limit to which one person can or can't do any thing because of the chances it could offend someone?

Good taste and context should determine the limit. There's a history rooted in Blackface itself that makes painting your skin black questionable. It's not dissimilar to using eyeliner or squinting to portray an Asian character. If you feel that those things are absolutely necessary, then you're better off choosing a character to portray that wouldn't require you to do such questionable things to be so completely (or excessively imo) accurate.

 

[OrangeGrayBlue]

Being a prisoner is her character, being black isn't.

The physical identity of an actor is tied to the characters they portray, which is why it makes no sense for Johnny Depp to play the character he does in The Lone Ranger. It's also why Denzel Washington portrayed Malcolm X in a movie instead of, say, Kevin Costner. To say that an actor just happens to be the race they are and so they should have free reign to portray whatever ethnicity they feel is part of the mindset that allowed real blackface in the first place.


That said, Julianne probably shouldn't have done this because, while not offensive, you're obviously going to get blackface comparisons even if portraying a specific character. Should've just used a different character from the show.

 

[The Adder]

You can dress up as black people without the need for blackface. Why is that hard for you to understand?

No you can't! You have to paint yourself black or you're not going to be recognized as the character! Hair color, eye color, the correct skin tone, proper portrayal of the character, none of that matters though. But you HAVE to slather on that coat of some shade of brown paint.

 

[dbztrk]

This is the kind of things I don't get about the US culture. How can it be offensive to anyone?

Because the US has a history of white people donning blackface to demean black people. So some American's are sensitive to it. If I wanted to dress as an East Asian person/character, would it be ok if I taped my eyes to make them slanted? Or should I walk around with my index fingers lifting up the sides of my eyes so that I look East Asian. Would that offend some East Asians? I dunno. I'm not East Asian. So I can't speak for them.

 

[KHarvey16]

I really think people are missing the point regarding why blackface acts are offensive. It's not because a white person colored their skin black. A blackface act is 100% as offensive without the makeup.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

It's weird that she thought it necessary to paint her skin to better portray her character, but didn't bother to put on colored contacts or dyeing her hair black.

Pretty damn good point. If she'd spent the money on brown make-up on hair-dye and colored contact lenses instead, it would have probably come off a lot better. Just look really intensely at everyone, dark hair, pulled into that style - people would have figured it out.

Fuck, at that point, she might as well have gotten some glasses and gone as Laura Prepon's character.

 

[Coffee Dog]

I really think people are missing the point regarding why blackface acts are offensive. It's not because a white person colored their skin black. A blackface act is 100% as offensive without the makeup.

I don't think people arr missing that, they just don't care much. A lot of this debate depends on how much you value context towards the action itself

 

[BocoDragon]

Good taste and context should determine the limit. There's a history rooted in Blackface itself that makes painting your skin black questionable. It's not dissimilar to using eyeliner or squinting to portray an Asian character. If you feel that those things are absolutely necessary, then you're better off choosing a character to portray that wouldn't require you to do such questionable things to be so completely (or excessively imo) accurate.

Did ya see Cloud Atlas?

 

[Uncle]

Fuck, at that point, she might as well have gotten some glasses and gone as Laura Prepon's character.

Isn't the woman in the background dressed as her?

 

[Divvy]

Pretty damn good point. If she'd spent the money on brown make-up on hair-dye and colored contact lenses instead, it would have probably come off a lot better. Just look really intensely at everyone, dark hair, pulled into that style - people would have figured it out.

Fuck, at that point, she might as well have gotten some glasses and gone as Laura Prepon's character.

Isn't she blonde? It looks like she did dye her hair, though maybe it's the flash or maybe she didn't darken it enough.

 

[Live Free or Die]

people are upset about this? I m really...really...REALLY people?

 

[MorisUkunRasik]

Everyone defending her can go have sex with themselves.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

Isn't the woman in the background dressed as her?

They shoulda ro-sham-beau'd for it.

 

[justjohn]

people are upset about this? I m really...really...REALLY people?

Yes people are. How dare they.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

people are upset about this? I m really...really...REALLY people?

Why is it so astounding to think that would be the case?

I mean, I understand if you disagree - like I said, the last time anyone started a thread about this, it was me, and I saw plenty of people who disagreed - but most people didn't seem that surprised by the mere IDEA that someone would & could have a problem with it.

I don't think there's anything at all surprising about the idea that people would be a little taken aback by seeing this attending their Halloween party.

 

[Alligatorjandro]

So what qualifies as blackface?

 

[nateeasy]

Looks like snooki tbf

 

[The Atticus]

In this instance, I have little problem with her actions.

 

[ReturnOfTheRAT]

 

[f0lken]

Pretty damn good point. If she'd spent the money on brown make-up on hair-dye and colored contact lenses instead, it would have probably come off a lot better. Just look really intensely at everyone, dark hair, pulled into that style - people would have figured it out.

Fuck, at that point, she might as well have gotten some glasses and gone as Laura Prepon's character.

There is already a Prepon, look behind Piper

Good taste and context should determine the limit. There's a history rooted in Blackface itself that makes painting your skin black questionable. It's not dissimilar to using eyeliner or squinting to portray an Asian character. If you feel that those things are absolutely necessary, then you're better off choosing a character to portray that wouldn't require you to do such questionable things to be so completely (or excessively imo) accurate.

In this case I agree is in bad taste, but the context sure is there, the character is not defined by her color but she is still black, if anything as someone said she should also painted her hair.

And I get what you are saying about the roots of the blackface, I am mexican myself and our bronze race had to endure all the pain, suffering, humilliation and slavery your has, such were the consequences of the clash of different cultures in the new world. But I think that if we react negativelly at the first person shouting "fire in the theatre" we wil never outgrow all our fears and insecurities, by now we all should be able to judge things according to the reasons behind it, even by going by the dictionaire this is not blackface, one of the main characteristics of blackface is being accompanied by a performance stereotyping them as buffoons which is complete absent here, all the traits were taken exclusively from the character itself and not as a generalization of black people

 

[Korey]

I think a lot of you are missing that the core problem here is that:

When people think of characters like Ned Stark, Kevin Spacey in House of Cards, Jack Bauer, Walter White, Jesse Pinkman, Agent Coulson, etc -- they're not thought of as "white characters" because in our society being white is a default and so we just think of them as "characters".

On the other hand, characters who happen to be black are considered "black characters" with them being black a defining characteristic of that character for some reason.

Instead of being instantly reverse-outraged (or whatever), pause and consider that for a moment why that is.

 

[dskillzhtown]

Discrimination and treating black people like second-class citizens was legal not too long ago. I am aware this country likes to pretend none of that ever happened, but it did. When you do anything resembling that moment in history, it is wrong. Blackface, equating black people with monkeys, etc. are all off-limits. Use some common sense.

The thing that REALLY gets me is the number of black people who don't know the racial history of this country. I wouldn't be surprised to see a black person burning a cross to keep warm in the near future.

The people defending the use of blackface reminds me of an argument I got into at a bar with a white guy complaining about Historically Black Colleges. He thought they were racist. Not knowing the history of them and why it is a shame that they had to be created in the first place. People just don't know history, and generally don't care.

 

[Lambda Pie]

haha, she looks awesome.

 

[Van Owen]

She could have gone without the paint yeah, but the costume would have been shittier for it.

Sort of like when you see a fat chick in a princess lea outfit. Kinda takes our outta it.

 

[Grinchy]

They didnt need whiteface to pull it off, but we all know what charcters they are dressed ass

Step it up senpai

They should have, actually. And no one would have been offended if they did.

 

[THRILLH0]

She defined a character by the color of her skin. It's insulting.

No. She wanted to imitate the physical appearance of someone who's skin is black. This is not difficult.

 

[EulaCapra]

I'm offended... that people blew this out of proportion. Good for her. She didn't need to apologize on Twitter saying that she was wrong to do this. A white woman cosplaying for the love of a black female character. Seems more like progress.

 

[Onemic]

They should have, actually. And no one would have been offended if they did.

And I guess white people who cosplay as Asian characters should put makeup on to make their eyes look slanted. Or just do what the Spanish basketball team did.

 

[Randy Monk]

I don't see no costume, all I see is a damn fool!

 

[THRILLH0]

I think a lot of you are missing that the core problem here is that:

When people think of characters like Ned Stark, Kevin Spacey in House of Cards, Jack Bauer, Walter White, Jesse Pinkman, Agent Coulson, etc -- they're not thought of as "white characters" because in our society being white is a default and so we just think of them as "characters".

On the other hand, characters who happen to be black are considered "black characters" with them being black a defining characteristic of that character for some reason.

Instead of being instantly reverse-outraged (or whatever), pause and consider that for a moment why that is.

This is a good post.

However, when you consider the fact that not a single person would be upset if a black man shaved his head and painted his face white to look like Walter, you can see why people struggle to see the big deal with this.

Is a white person painting their face black insensitive considering the history of capital B Blackface? Perhaps. Is it offensive or racist? I don't think so.

 

[The Adder]

No. She wanted to imitate the physical appearance of someone who's skin is black. This is not difficult.

And yet didn't bother to match the hair or eye color. Or even the skin tone.

However, when you consider the fact that not a single person would be upset if a black man shaved his head and painted his face white to look like Walter, you can see why people struggle to see the big deal with this.

Because it almost never happens and isn't a symptom of a massive problem with society as a whole.

 

[The Adder]

Double Posted instead of Edited, sorry.

 

[THRILLH0]

And yet didn't bother to match the hair or eye color. Or even the skin tone.

If she did would you have been ok with it?

 

[Thorakai]

This is a good post.

However, when you consider the fact that not a single person would be upset if a black man shaved his head and painted his face white to look like Walter, you can see why people struggle to see the big deal with this.

Is a white person painting their face black insensitive considering the history of capital B Blackface? Perhaps. Is it offensive or racist? I don't think so.

Has this actually happened?

 

[The Adder]

If she did would you have been ok with it?

Nope, see above. The fact that she didn't, however, puts the lie to your statment.

 

[Servbot24]

This is the kind of things I don't get about the US culture. How can it be offensive to anyone?

People think think that maybe they're supposed to be offended, and get offended just to be on the safe side.

 

[The Adder]

People think think that maybe they're supposed to be offended, and get offended just to be on the safe side.

Maybe you should try reading instead of shooting your mouth off. Then you'd actually be able to answer the question you're responding to.

 

[justjohn]

I see the retards have finally arrived. I'm off.

 

[The Adder]

I see the retards have finally arrived. I'm off.

Poor choice of words only serves to demonstrate your own shortcomings.

 

[Uncle]

Has this actually happened?

I remember reading about some black athlete whitening his skin for some halloween (I think) costume. Can't remember if people were offended or not.

 

[Van Owen]

And yet didn't bother to match the hair or eye color. Or even the skin tone.

It was for a dumb Holloween party. It's not that hard to rub some paint on your face so you look like a close approximation of the character.

I don't know why anyone would expect her to be 100% accurate like she's DDL or something.

 

[Coins]

I'll be back

I misread that as "I'll be black"

 

[xbhaskarx]

I dont think bronzer counts as blackface. Im not an expert though.

Would it be offensive if someone put on tanning crap to dress up as a Jersey guido for Halloween?

 

[The Adder]

It was for a dumb Holloween party. It's not that hard to rub some paint on your face so you look like a close approximation of the character.

I don't know why anyone would expect her to be 100% accurate like she's DDL or something.

In what universe do you live wherein painting your skin is easier than buying a wig/applying cosmetic contacts?

 

[BrokenEchelon]

It's Halloween. She's dressing up for Halloween.

It's fucking Halloween.

Also, I thought she was going as Miley Cyrus, three years from now after she's in jail for crack peddling/murder and experimental surgery.

 

[SouSouRocket]

This is a good post.

However, when you consider the fact that not a single person would be upset if a black man shaved his head and painted his face white to look like Walter, you can see why people struggle to see the big deal with this.

Is a white person painting their face black insensitive considering the history of capital B Blackface? Perhaps. Is it offensive or racist? I don't think so.

White people are privileged enough to inhabit a space where it's a lot more difficult to do things that are racially offensive because they've been and continue to be the dominant culture. It doesn't matter if YOU don't think it's offensive or racist for a white person to paint their face black, it is insensitive at the least considering the history of race relations in this country and even worldwide. Did she mean to be racist? I'm sure she didn't. But that's how it comes across. A lack of ill-will doesn't excuse it. The best way you could spin it is that it's displaying extreme ignorance and insensitivity.

Race isn't part of a costume. You know why you recognize a black guy cosplaying as superman? Because he's wearing the outfit. If you truly can't separate the race of the character from the costume, then maybe you should consider only dressing up as someone that wouldn't force you to do something like blackface.

For the record, I think it would look similarly idiotic for a non-white person to cover themselves in light foundation to look like a character.

 

[Valtýr]

And yet didn't bother to match the hair or eye color. Or even the skin tone..

This is ridiculous. It's a Halloween costume for christ's sake. What do you think her intention was? To make fun of black people? To bring back the decades old ritual of blackface because she's a deep seeded racist?

This is all ridiculous. She dressed up in a quick costume of a character she was a fan of. There's no secret hidden agenda going on here or message being pushed on others. Not getting every single detail in the costume correct means nothing.

 

[The Adder]

It's Halloween. She's dressing up for Halloween.

It's fucking Halloween.

Halloweens where I've dressed up as a non-black human character: 13

Halloweens where I've painted myself the skin color of that character: 0

This is ridiculous. It's a Halloween costume for christ's sake. What do you think her intention was? To make fun of black people? To bring back the decades old ritual of blackface because she's a deep seeded racist?

This is all ridiculous. She dressed up in a quick costume of a character she was a fan of. There's no secret hidden agenda going on here or message being pushed on others. Not getting every single detail in the costume correct means nothing.

Ahem:

In what universe do you live wherein painting your skin is easier than buying a wig/applying cosmetic contacts?

And to answer your question about intention

The thing is that this isn't, as far as I see it at least, about blackface. It's about people distilling characters, people, and entire cultures down to a superficial feature or two.

Jules chose his occupation. He created his speech pattern. He picked his weapon of choice. And he decide on his facial hair and gerry curl.

Jules didn't choose his skin color.

The problem with this whole thing is that it values skin color over anything else as an indicator. It devalues tge person, people, or peoples you are portraying.

Someone with a note perfect Jules costume who had the portrayal down pat? That impresses me. Someone painted brown in a suit does not.

Replaces "Jules" with "Suzanne" and change appropriate traits.

I swear no one in this topic actually reads.

 

[BrokenEchelon]

White people are privileged enough to inhabit a space where it's a lot more difficult to do things that are racially offensive because they've been and continue to be the dominant culture. It doesn't matter if YOU don't think it's offensive or racist for a white person to paint their face black, it is insensitive at the least considering the history of race relations in this country and even worldwide. Did she mean to be racist? I'm sure she didn't. But that's how it comes across. A lack of ill-will doesn't excuse it. The best way you could spin it is that it's displaying extreme ignorance and insensitivity.

Race isn't part of a costume. You know why you recognize a black guy cosplaying as superman? Because he's wearing the outfit. If you truly can't separate the race of the character from the costume, then maybe you should consider only dressing up as someone that wouldn't force you to do something like blackface.

For the record, I think it would look similarly idiotic for a non-white person to cover themselves in light foundation to look like a character.

Opinions are a fun thing to base facts on.

Halloweens where I've dressed up as a non-black human character: 13

Halloweens where I've painted myself the skin color of that character: 0

I'm making myself more white to portray Commander Data this very evening. I must be like Privileged^2.

 

[Stinkles]

This is the kind of things I don't get about the US culture. How can it be offensive to anyone?

because our country is racist as fuck and in many states, institutionally racist.