Super Smash Bros Wii U and 3DS Thread 3: Ridley's Believe It or Not!

That sounds terrible. Ganondorf doesn't just suddenly transform into Demise in any of the Zelda games.

Not yet, anyway. I don't think we've seen the last of him. I guess it would be weird for that to happen in Smash though haha, but I was using it as a point to argue that Sheik's one-off-ness likely isn't the reason she got in and then got excited about controlling Demise

Are you really challenging Pac-Man's legacy? Sure his newer outings may not be that popular, but does that matter? We've still got Star Fox who hasn't seen a new entry since Command. And it is highly unlikely Captain Falcon is getting cut, and there hasn't been a new F-Zero game since GX.

No, I'm not challenging his legacy. But are those the best arguements for Pac-man now, legacy and Namco's involvement? There's some good arguements here for how a moveset for him could work, and Sakurai's comments about him are what they are. So I'm probably shouting at the wind since I personally dislike Pac so much =p To me, Pacman's inclusion would be the line where there's a feeling of brand dilution, sort of like Big Daddy's and Isaac Clarke's inclusion into Playstation All-Stars. As for who else would be a better Namco rep, I'll shut up about it since I realize they would bring an even bigger sense of Nintendo dilution, but I was thinking along the lines of Soul Calibur (which has a long history too, though not Pac-man length) and possibly an outside brand that Namco has made games for for a long time like DBZ.
 
Shiek is also a one-off character, so I think as long as the character is added while they're relevant then they have a good shot of making it.
While true. Sheik was part of Zelda. Sheik was also a very well received character in a pivotal game in the series. Its for those same reasons why I wouldnt be surprised if Rosalina was added to the roster.

The only characters that I think were so well received as Sheik in the LoZ series were Midna and Tetra. Vaati, Ghirahim, Zant, etc. dont have quite that same level of popularity or stature in the series. That's why I suggested having the other two triforce holders have transformations as well. Ganon is another iconic form of Ganondorf that could be used as another character as well as alleviate complaints of him being a Captain Falcon clone. Wolf Link would also be interesting and be a means to allow Midna on the roster.
 
Oh, and if Pac-Man is in the game -- and I would be surprised if he's not -- then he will be a playable character. Sakurai isn't going to relegate a videogame legend to Assist Trophy status. Again, Pac-Man is by far and away one of the most recognizable videogame characters in the world. He's one of the incredibly few characters you could add to the roster who everyone and their grandma could point to and say, "Hey, I know that character!"
 
Bored. So let's list initial reactions to the playable characters when they first got announced into a Smash game!

Mario, Link, Fox, Pikachu, Yoshi, Donkey Kong - Not taken aback seeing these characters fighting each other because I just assumed this happened all the time with video game characters when I was little.
Samus, Kirby - I started video games late so I had vague inklings of who they were but never real figured them out. Also, Samus was a girl the whole time and not a robot?
--
Luigi - Not surprised
Jigglypuff - Not surprised. Made sense at the anime time. Also, too adorable.
Ness, Captain Falcon - Who? What's wrong with Ness' jump???
--
Peach, Zelda/Sheik - OMG, they added girls! Yay! Also, Zelda transforms into some ninja guy. Since when?
Bowser - OMG, a villain!
Ice Climbers - OMG, there's two of them! Also, who?
--
Young Link - next!
Mewtwo - Oh cool!
Pichu - Neat!.... wait, it damages itself?! Next!
Marth, Roy - Oh cool! I didn't know Nintendo made sword guys.
Mr. Game & Watch - What the hell? He's so flat!
Falco - Sure
Dr. Mario - Oh neat!
Ganondorf - Cool! Another great villain!... lol @ clone moveset
--
Meta Knight - Oh cool, it's that Kirby villain thing.
Pit - ZOMG, even though playing Kid Icarus was torture, IT'S THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST!!!
Zero Suit Samus - OMG! What does this mean?!
Wario - Expected
Diddy Kong - Expected. Can't wait for Dixie's reveal!
Ike - Neat/Expected
Olimar - Expected
Lucas - What does this mean for Ness?!
King DeDeDe - Oh cool, it's the real Kirby villain thing.
Pokemon Trainer - OMG! Game-Changer! I bet there's a Pokemon Coordinator!
--
Lucario - Oh, guess Mewtwo is getting cut after seeing the similarities.
Snake - OMFG! Game-Changer! Also... get out. You barely make a Nintendo presence at all.
Sonic - OMG! Everyone expected it, but it's happened! I bet Mega Man's next!
R.O.B. - Um, cool I guess. Where's Dixie Kong, Tom Nook, Custom-Robo, Isaac and Ridley though?
Wolf - Are you fucking kidding me? They didn't even try to make a new-looking moveset?
Toon Link - Are you kidding me? He's barely a Toon in this game! He and Wolf got in while Ridley and Dixie Kong didn't? No new females at all? Like for real?
--
Villager - Oh cool. I bet you can customize him and her.
Mega Man - OMG! It happened!
Wii Fit Trainer - No effing way! Best twist ever! But she better not be the only female added this time, Sakurai!
 
Masks Link would be the best Zelda addition.

It'd allow them to rep Young Link again (outside of Toon Link, I mean), and by allowing him to transform into his Deku, Goron and Zora forms, you'd represent three prominent races in the Zelda universe. It'd work like Pokémon Trainer and add a great deal of color and variety to the roster. Plus... His Final Smash would be Fierce Deity Link! Would also be nice foresight on their part, if they plan to release Majora's Mask 3D at some point.

Regarding Pac-Man... I believe he's in the game.

Tkg0sMs.jpg


Shortly before E3, someone posted here on GAF a prediction that Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, Mega Man, Little Mac, Mii and Pac-Man are in the game. As you know, Villager was confirmed, despite Sakurai having previously ruled him out, and not many people guessing him. And nobody guessed Wii Fit Trainer. The post was not edited, either. The time stamp shows it was made before E3, and not tweaked since.

In addition... When one media outlet interviewed Sakurai at E3, they asked about Pac-Man, and Sakurai coyly replied with a question of his own: "How would YOU implement Pac-Man?" And the interviewer -- maybe it was Richard George, with IGN at the time -- said he'd go the classic route with the black eyes, and for his Final Smash he'd power up and chase the others around the screen like classic Pac-Man. Sakurai agreed it was a good idea. The implication, it was said at the time, was Sakurai was already thinking along these lines.

The thing about Pac-Man is he's one of the most well-known videogame characters of all time. He's an ICON. The legacy factor alone justifies him. Aside from being one of the great-granddaddies of the arcade scene, right up there with Donkey Kong, Pac-Man has some quality offerings in the here and now -- the Championship Editions are excellent, and for Nintendo's part, he continues to star in the arcade Mario Karts, and previously headlined Pac-Man Vs., the darling of Miyamoto's eyes and the Nintendo game that would serve as a prototype for the WiiU's defining feature (asymmetric play).

Consider also that Pac-Man is the mascot of Namco, which is lending an unprecedented level of support to the development of this game. The stars are all in Pac-Man's favor.

What about his move-set potential? He can launch himself forward like a human cannonball. He can dribble himself like a basketball. He can chomp and chew enemies before spitting them back up. He can spit out pellets like watermelon seeds, or belch up ghosts. Best of all, he could tuck in his arms and legs and "wakka wakka wakka" through the air, moving like classic arcade Pac-Man. You could even alter his flight path by 90 degrees, making him go up, down, left and right -- altering his path mid-flight to pursue fleeing enemies.

There is PLENTY that could be done with Pac-Man. Trust me, if Sakurai could figure out a full move-set for Wii Fit Trainer (and he has), then he can easily devise a compelling move-set for one of gaming's most well-known and best-beloved mascots.

Great post. Would love to see Pacman in Smash.
 
I remember some grainy-ass footage leaking of Melee, back in the days before YouTube, and seeing Roy's fully charged special attack OHKO Pichu on the Great Fox level. My reactions were, "Oh, that's not Roy from Super Mario World," and "HOLY FUCKING SHIT."
 
Masks Link would be the best Zelda addition.

It'd allow them to rep Young Link again (outside of Toon Link, I mean), and by allowing him to transform into his Deku, Goron and Zora forms, you'd represent three prominent races in the Zelda universe. It'd work like Pokémon Trainer and add a great deal of color and variety to the roster. Plus... His Final Smash would be Fierce Deity Link! Would also be nice foresight on their part, if they plan to release Majora's Mask 3D at some point.

Regarding Pac-Man... I believe he's in the game.

Tkg0sMs.jpg


Shortly before E3, someone posted here on GAF a prediction that Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, Mega Man, Little Mac, Mii and Pac-Man are in the game. As you know, Villager was confirmed, despite Sakurai having previously ruled him out, and not many people guessing him. And nobody guessed Wii Fit Trainer. The post was not edited, either. The time stamp shows it was made before E3, and not tweaked since.

In addition... When one media outlet interviewed Sakurai at E3, they asked about Pac-Man, and Sakurai coyly replied with a question of his own: "How would YOU implement Pac-Man?" And the interviewer -- maybe it was Richard George, with IGN at the time -- said he'd go the classic route with the black eyes, and for his Final Smash he'd power up and chase the others around the screen like classic Pac-Man. Sakurai agreed it was a good idea. The implication, it was said at the time, was Sakurai was already thinking along these lines.

The thing about Pac-Man is he's one of the most well-known videogame characters of all time. He's an ICON. The legacy factor alone justifies him. Aside from being one of the great-granddaddies of the arcade scene, right up there with Donkey Kong, Pac-Man has some quality offerings in the here and now -- the Championship Editions are excellent, and for Nintendo's part, he continues to star in the arcade Mario Karts, and previously headlined Pac-Man Vs., the darling of Miyamoto's eyes and the Nintendo game that would serve as a prototype for the WiiU's defining feature (asymmetric play).

Consider also that Pac-Man is the mascot of Namco, which is lending an unprecedented level of support to the development of this game. The stars are all in Pac-Man's favor.

What about his move-set potential? He can launch himself forward like a human cannonball. He can dribble himself like a basketball. He can chomp and chew enemies before spitting them back up. He can spit out pellets like watermelon seeds, or belch up ghosts. Best of all, he could tuck in his arms and legs and "wakka wakka wakka" through the air, moving like classic arcade Pac-Man. You could even alter his flight path by 90 degrees, making him go up, down, left and right -- altering his path mid-flight to pursue fleeing enemies.

There is PLENTY that could be done with Pac-Man. Trust me, if Sakurai could figure out a full move-set for Wii Fit Trainer (and he has), then he can easily devise a compelling move-set for one of gaming's most well-known and best-beloved mascots.

Then barring a character design miracle, I'm going to have to institute a personal rule of "pac-man dies first" when I play multiplayer, for I strongly dislike every 3d pacman design I've ever seen.
 
Neiteio justifying why Pac-Man should be in the game is awesome. I remember I've wanted the ultimate gaming's icons battle since Sonic was announced in Brawl: Mario vs Sonic vs Megaman vs Pac-Man. Looks like this time it's almost coming true! Just need Pac to be confirmed.
 
Then barring a character design miracle, I'm going to have to institute a personal rule of "pac-man dies first" when I play multiplayer, for I strongly dislike every 3d pacman design I've ever seen.
In all likelihood, given Sakurai's agreement with Richard George (I believe it was him in the E3 interview) that arcade Pac-Man is best Pac-Man, any "limbed" form of Pac-Man would probably be the one in my post you quoted.

...and that would look fine in 3D. Especially since he would be playing in 2D, and so most of the time you'll be seeing him at a slight angle from the side. Not unlike Mega Man, who's a polygonal recreation of his sprite, right down to the way he stands and runs.
 
Funnily enough, I was reading your "conservative predictions" post.. VERY useful
That's called a joke, and was also a nice opportunity for people to geek out about what they want in our favorite hobby.

And at any rate, no one gets anything out of complaining about something being "like weekend SmashGAF" -- especially when interesting character debate is going on.
 
Sakurai will reveal Pac-Man when Pac-Man VS. II hits the Wii U in 2014.
 
Pac-Man is in the game and you will love him and main him.

Your hearts of ice will melt at the first screens of arcade grand-daddies DK, Pac-Man and Mario a.k.a. Jumpman leaping around Pac-Man's neon maze stage... or of Mario, Sonic, Mega Man and Pac-Man -- four of the greatest legends in videogame history -- all sharing the same stage in a glorious clash of the titans.

You will come around, and you will learn the meaning of love.
 
Pac-Man is in the game and you will love him and main him.

Your hearts of ice will melt at the first screens of arcade grand-daddies DK, Pac-Man and Mario a.k.a. Jumpman leaping around Pac-Man's neon maze stage... or of Mario, Sonic, Mega Man and Pac-Man -- four of the greatest legends in videogame history -- all sharing the same stage in a glorious clash of the titans.

You will come around, and you will learn the meaning of love.

Neit, you make a good arguement for Pac, and you're probably going to right in the end about his inclusion(I had a hard time arguing it above in an edit I made above), but you're dead wrong about Pac-love. Only thing I'll enjoy about Pac being in the game is smashing that burned-out face in or just completely ignoring that fallen idol altogether =p

Still finding his inclusion in Mario Kart Arcade GP so... uuggghhh ><
 
Neit, you make a good arguement for Pac, and you're probably going to right in the end about his inclusion(I had a hard time arguing it above in an edit I made above), but you're dead wrong about Pac-love. Only thing I'll enjoy about Pac being in the game is smashing that burned-out face in or just completely ignoring that fallen idol altogether =p

Still finding his inclusion his inclusion in Mario Kart Arcade GP so... uuggghhh ><

oh so Nintendo DID find a platform deader than Wii U!
 
Still think that Bomberman would be a bajillion times better than Pac-Man. On basically every metric.
Bomberman is what I would personally prefer (any excuse to include Bomberman 64 music is a good excuse!), but Pac-Man is more deserving from a star power standpoint. I bet you any number of avatar changes (lol) that far more people off the streets would recognize Pac-Man before they'd recognize Bomberman. And then there's the matter of the previously established relevance to Nintendo, in particular, from Pac-Man Vs. to Mario Kart Grand Prix. But the shared arcade lineage is the main reason. And like I said, he has tremendous move-set potential.

I really think Sakurai's take on Pac-Man would have some of the haters revising their opinions. As gamers, we all owe Pac-Man some measure of respect. He's like one of the Founding Fathers of our favorite pastime. :)
 
Pac-Man is in the game and you will love him and main him.

Your hearts of ice will melt at the first screens of arcade grand-daddies DK, Pac-Man and Mario a.k.a. Jumpman leaping around Pac-Man's neon maze stage... or of Mario, Sonic, Mega Man and Pac-Man -- four of the greatest legends in videogame history -- all sharing the same stage in a glorious clash of the titans.

You will come around, and you will learn the meaning of love.

I'm looking forward for Pac-Man for long time ever since the rumor "leaked." However, you should stick around here more often but I know hype isn't healthy for you. What a shame. :(
 
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