Super Smash Bros Wii U & 3DS Thread 4: New Year, Old Arguments

Late Fall/ Early Winter release. I don't see them not releasing towards the holiday season if they can help it.

It's worth noting that Melee was a Holiday-period release in Japan and the US. Brawl was going to be one (December 3rd in the US) until the Sonic-related delay.
 
im exspecting 2015, because i feel like that is realistic. And If i am wrong( in the early way) I will be pleasantly suprised.

Also I am surprised at all you people guessing late spring dates, some guy in Germany related to nintendo already did that and sakurai said no it will be done when its done.

I Would move my dates later if I were you
 
“The game balance of Super Smash Bros. Brawl started six years before its release, and it most likely goes back even further during its time of development, and it’s never been reformed even through the updates afterwards,” says Sakurai.
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this explains so much...
 
FluxWaveZ said:
Sorry if this was posted before:

Sakurai talking about SSB4's balancing in this week's Famitsu via Siliconera.
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What struck me in that article was that none of his comments touched on what I think of as balancing. That is to say, he doesn't mention character tiers, or making sure that every character is competitive. Instead, he just says "Bowser is really strong!" And then the balancing process appears to be if something appears to be too powerful, to add other weaknesses to the character. Certainly you can imply that this is a process of balancing characters against each other, but his guiding star appears to be "good feeling."

Wish I had more context/understanding of this part:
“The game balance of Super Smash Bros. Brawl started six years before its release, and it most likely goes back even further during its time of development, and it’s never been reformed even through the updates afterwards,” says Sakurai. “We’re at a stage where we’d like to release the new title as soon as possible, and offer something more enjoyable than ever.”
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Pociask said:
Wish I had more context/understanding of this part:
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Sounds like it's saying that they never changed the balance through patches, but this time they'd prefer getting the game out faster.

Huge sadness if that means they're considering balance patches/adjustment. Maybe I'm just making too much out of it. Could also just mean that the balance was mostly decided early on.
 
Am I the only one that finds the unbalanced look of the smashbros site kind of irritating? I mean in the way that the blocks for the characters are set up. Right now it's not uniform and it bothres me.
 
Pociask said:
What struck me in that article was that none of his comments touched on what I think of as balancing. That is to say, he doesn't mention character tiers, or making sure that every character is competitive. Instead, he just says "Bowser is really strong!" And then the balancing process appears to be if something appears to be too powerful, to add other weaknesses to the character. Certainly you can imply that this is a process of balancing characters against each other, but his guiding star appears to be "good feeling."
Click to expand...

Part of balancing is to make sure a character has everything set in terms of damage, knockback, trajectory, hitbox sizes, etc. before tackling how they perform against other characters. It sounds to me like he's focusing on making the characters "feel good" to play in general rather than any actual balancing effort -- all the while being conscious of what didn't "feel good" or work in the previous titles (hence why Bowser is being used as an example, I guess).

But the whole "If you hit with the tip of Link's Down Air, it's a meteor! If it seems OP, we'll remove it!" makes me really question their balancing because... a meteor on Link's Dair wouldn't be OP but it also doesn't help the character out at all. But then I look at what he's trying to do with Bowser: increase mobility and decrease startup speed of some attacks, make them still strong, but he's also still a big character and therefore easy to hit/combo (assuming there's hitstun at all in this game).

He's basically trying to take the approach where the characters are strong in one area but have apparent weaknesses -- without taking into consideration the other characters. And that's fine, to a point, but the issue then becomes how much of an effect those weaknesses have on their MUs and I think that's what he's not looking at.
 
Pociask said:
What struck me in that article was that none of his comments touched on what I think of as balancing. That is to say, he doesn't mention character tiers, or making sure that every character is competitive. Instead, he just says "Bowser is really strong!" And then the balancing process appears to be if something appears to be too powerful, to add other weaknesses to the character. Certainly you can imply that this is a process of balancing characters against each other, but his guiding star appears to be "good feeling."

Wish I had more context/understanding of this part:
Click to expand...

I really like how bowser is in project M. His smash attacks and down B are really really good and KO people at like 80%, which makes him a huge threat in 4 player, but 1 v 1 he's really slow, but still good because if you DO land a hit, you win. I really like that in heavy characters. I find that only IKE and sometimes DDD did this well in brawl, but bowser/ganondorf didnt have the extra oomph they needed to make them 'feel' like strong heavy characters. I hope this makes them actually playable in smash 4.
 
Ezalc said:
Am I the only one that finds the unbalanced look of the smashbros site kind of irritating? I mean in the way that the blocks for the characters are set up. Right now it's not uniform and it bothres me.
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It's dynamic and based on your resolution/window, you can make it even:

smashsitet2bik.png
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edit: unless you're talking about newcomers having larger boxes, which I actually think is nice.
 
“We’re at a stage where we’d like to release the new title as soon as possible, and offer something more enjoyable than ever.”
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I feel like that part wouldn't be in there if we weren't at least a little close to release.
 
JStein0222 said:
I feel like that part wouldn't be in there if we weren't at least a little close to release.
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I'm really hoping the lack of subspace means we'll get the game much quicker. Not to mention this literally looks like it's running on the brawl engine, so I doubt they have much engine work to do either. Just character model updates, new character creation, balance, and then hopefully good netcode, rewarding online system (that keeps you coming back for more reasons than just playing smash online), and something interesting to do playing single player (other than trophy/sticker collecting).
 
JStein0222 said:
I feel like that part wouldn't be in there if we weren't at least a little close to release.
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I'd say it's currently a little close to November 2014. At least, I think that's when he plans for it to come out. Reality will have it delayed to January-February 2015.
 
Sakurai also talks about the difficulty in adjusting balances for things such as four player free-for-alls and 1-on-1 fights, as their circumstances are completely different. This can’t be helped at times, he says. For example, some attacks such as Captain Falcon’s “Falcon Punch” might work well when there’s more players, but might not ever hit during a 1-on-1 fight.
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While likely a throw away example might as well chalk this up that Capt. Falcon is not getting cut since some people believe he will be (referring to that character selection screen post a few days back)
 
BGBW said:
While likely a throw away example might as well chalk this up that Capt. Falcon is not getting cut since some people believe he will be (referring to that character selection screen post a few days back)
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Yeah i just noticed sakurai casually brought him up lol. Now to wait for his reveal on the 6th.
 
Ezalc said:
Am I the only one that finds the unbalanced look of the smashbros site kind of irritating? I mean in the way that the blocks for the characters are set up. Right now it's not uniform and it bothres me.
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It's very 'app'-ish.

Looks great on mobile phones.

Also, that Sakurai interview almost sounds like he's making Brawl minus, which would be amazing.
 
Hobobloke said:
I don't know if I'll ever be able to trust Sakurai when it comes to balancing.
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I think it's funny that anybody expects the game to be balanced.
No hate, I love Smash, probably one of my favorite franchises. I will get endless hours of enjoyment out of this game with my friends no matter how unbalanced it is.
 
FluxWaveZ said:
Sorry if this was posted before:

Sakurai talking about SSB4's balancing in this week's Famitsu via Siliconera.
Click to expand...

Sakurai also talks about the difficulty in adjusting balances for things such as four player free-for-alls and 1-on-1 fights, as their circumstances are completely different. This can’t be helped at times, he says. For example, some attacks such as Captain Falcon’s “Falcon Punch” might work well when there’s more players, but might not ever hit during a 1-on-1 fight.
Click to expand...

Captain Falcon confirmed?
He's obviously returning but its nice to hear anyway. Although it sounds like Sakurai may not revise his mooveset.
 
BGBW said:
While likely a throw away example might as well chalk this up that Capt. Falcon is not getting cut since some people believe he will be (referring to that character selection screen post a few days back)
Click to expand...

I remember when I got melee with my gamecube all the way back in 2001, I read the booklet and I remember pointing out tips like "fox is good at one on one fights but not as good with 4 player matches" which I always say bullshit because fox is my main but def sakurai takes the 4 player aspect in mind when designing the characters.
 
Sakurai also talks about the difficulty in adjusting balances for things such as four player free-for-alls and 1-on-1 fights, as their circumstances are completely different. This can’t be helped at times, he says. For example, some attacks such as Captain Falcon’s “Falcon Punch” might work well when there’s more players, but might not ever hit during a 1-on-1 fight.
Click to expand...

Wait... does that mean...

CAPTAIN FALCON CONFIRMED?!?!
 
balladofwindfishes said:
Actually, scratch that, because there were people dead convinced Olimar and Marth were gone too. Wouldn't surprise me if there's a camp of people thinking Falcon is gone.
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There's still a disturbing number of people who think the Ice Climbers aren't returning even after Rosalina and Olimar were announced and shown for 3DS.
 
“Doing things like simply ‘lowering the performance’ can make games lose its fun. Additionally, making a strong attack weaker can take away from the ‘good feeling’. By making adjustments that get rid of all advantages and disadvantages, it can turn a game into a mediocre one without any challenge.”
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Berordn said:
There's still a disturbing number of people who think the Ice Climbers aren't returning even after Rosalina and Olimar were announced and shown for 3DS.
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To be fair, Ice Climbers are fundamentally different in that they can desync and become half AI controlled.

I don't think they're cut though.
 
balladofwindfishes said:
Obviously. Did anyone seriously think he would be cut?

Actually, scratch that, because there were people dead convinced Olimar and Marth were gone too. Wouldn't surprise me if there's a camp of people thinking Falcon is gone.
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Someone posted a predicted roster that excluding Capt. Falcon just the other day. :/
 
Fiktion said:
No one from the original Smash roster is getting cut. Captain Falcon is safe forever.
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I still think Jiggly was a hair away from being cut from Brawl. She was just kind of thrown into the Subspace like the other late additions and she didn't seem very well balanced at all.

Honestly, being in 64 probably saved her. I still think they had a choice of either Mewtwo or Jiggly as a last minute Pokemon, and picked Jiggs, probably because of 64 and being easier to animate and balance (nobody cares if Jiggs is a joke character. They would if Mewtwo was).
 
I'm wondering if they might possibly dump Squirtle and Ivysaur, but keep Charizard as a standalone since he's by far the most popular and iconic, plus he's got a Mega Evolution...two of them.
 
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