FYI, A misdemeanor in the state of Georgia is a life sentence. My story.

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Damn, that's a rough story OP.

I live in the Netherlands and work in a IT organization. There are always IT job openings in my country (http://jobsearch.monsterboard.nl/vacatures/?q=it-support&cy=nl) but the pay is a bit lower than in the US and life is more expensive. On the plus side, nobody gives a damn about some minor offense 7 years ago and health care is cheap.

Thacker said:
Out of curiosity here are my current IT certs. Would this really pull 100k+ there?

[many certs]
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Ok, so you're a Windows IT/Tech support guy? Given your qualifications, those jobs do about 2-3k Euro in the Netherlands, before taxes. Most people (especially in IT) speak English well enough, so language shouldn't be deal breaker, might even be a plus.

Be sure to mention your entrepreneurship. This translates as "willing to work hard".

More general, have you tried to branch out into databases? Some SQL knowledge is valuable. You could also learn to program software. That's a multi-year undertaking, but you're still relatively young. One of the programmers at my job has no real education, little experience (isn't even that good) and still makes ~4k Euro. You have no college education and those certificates are a bit limited and one-note (IMO) so I think it would be wise to diversify a bit. Check out http://www.coursera.org
 
kirby_fox said:
I was thinking the same thing. They see you as a potential liability. Knowingly hire you, you get mad and punch through a wall. Or hurt someone. All a huge risk on their part, and this kind of economy there's so many people looking for a job.

I hope you do get it expunged though. My brother was lucky he wasn't 18. They put a felony on his record for lighting a piece of paper on fire in a school. Some stupid thing a kid does and he admitted his mistake. Expelled him, denied him coming back despite teachers backing him up, and upped his charge to a felony. Talk about people being dumb for something so seemingly small. They act like someone was murdered in some of these cases.
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I just don't see how this is logical thinking at all. Why does an isolated incident 7 years ago reflect on who I am today? I haven't been arrested or in trouble with the law since.


What's the saying? Build 100 bridges and you're a bridge builder... but fuck one goat after and...
 
I saw that you've applied to law firms, state offices. What other kinds of businesses? Any state offices, SEC regulated businesses, etc. have much stricter rules. Have you applied to businesses that wouldn't be bound to the strict guidelines?

I work in IT for a large investment firm, and I know they have to do more thorough FBI checks, etc.
 
I'm in the same situation too. I even don't have a record because I did my probatation and afterwards the charges were taken off my record then years later laws changed and it was retroactively put back on in some strange way that shows up when doing background checks. I am trying to start my own small media company just not sure what else to do, the job in have now pays so little...
 
Zizbuka said:
I saw that you've applied to law firms, state offices. What other kinds of businesses? Any state offices, SEC regulated businesses, etc. have much stricter rules. Have you applied to businesses that wouldn't be bound to the strict guidelines?

I work in IT for a large investment firm, and I know they have to do more thorough FBI checks, etc.
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I mean I've applied everywhere. I just checked my gmail and I've sent out over 120 resumes and applications just since November of last year. Out of those I've probably received 10 phone interviews, 2 of those being multiple but none have went past the application stage where I've listed any sort of arrest or conviction. I know not having a college education hurts me as well. I just would rather that be the only downfall instead knowing that if I get past that, I still have to deal with explaining my past. Something that is just that.. my past. When dealing with recruiters it really crushes me because for instance, the one that denied me the job at King & Spalding (I can't emphasize what an amazing opportunity and how life changing that job would have been) I get blacklisted from sooooo many future opportunities that pass through those firms. IT positions are especially recruiter heavy nowadays and ruining your reputation with one just hurts so much.
 
Also as general advice, if shit happens as it does in the real world and you are indicted for something dumb happening, get a good lawyer. There is no reason to make the job easier on the state. If they want to convict you, make them actually do it.
 
Davis_McGee said:
Your border police might. The chances of getting a low-skilled work visa with a criminal conviction are just about nil in all countries.
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I considered this, but he still has a bunch of certificates and he's a United States citizen. I know we're a lot more lax than Canada and probably the US as well.
 
Buzzati said:
Do you have any job offers for the OP?
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bro1 said:
If he wants to move to Texas, yes.
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Thacker said:
PM please
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bro1 said:
Done
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itQXIH8IaR6OO.gif
 
Guileless said:
Also as general advice, if shit happens as it does in the real world and you are indicted for something dumb happening, get a good lawyer. There is no reason to make the job easier on the state. If they want to convict you, make them actually do it.
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The lawyer I am using now is the same one I had back when I was convicted before. He recommended against fighting it because he said if I lose, the county usually seeks jail time but if I plead no lo, I would get off with just probation and a fine due to a deal with the DA. Whether or not he just didn't want to put in any extra work, I don't know but he seems to be doing his due diligence now. This will be $3,000 total I've paid him since hiring him.
 
Deified Data said:
Glad to hear OP is digging in and getting shit done.
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I'm trying my best now butI won't lie. There was periods of months where I did nothing. Gaming all day and not progressing with my life. I'm ready to get this shit behind me and start a real life... not this depressed bullshit I've suffered through since this happened. I want to see things how I used to see them.
 
Happened to a friend. Was going to college, big pothead. Used to buy weed from two high school girls..long story short he was in the wrong place (high school grounds) at the wrong time and they all got busted hard (went to an affluent school/lived in an affluent neighborhood).

These things take time, dude graduated and had a nice financial job (this is right before the crash). So when it came time to fight, he was afraid of taking too much time off(he was a consultant) and spending all the cash to fight it, etc. So he took a fucked up plea deal...no jail time but he would have to register as a low level sex offender because of their ages (keep in mind no sex was involved) and the fact he was on school grounds. Worst mistake of his life.

So low level sex offenders are people who are 'low risk' to committing the crime again, basically this is the category where a 19 year old dating a 15 year old would fall into. However, who's going to hire anybody when a background check pops up with the words, "sex offender".

Dude eventually got fired from his job when they ran a background check when he tried to switch to official employee, never was re-able to enter the corporate world again, now he fills vending machines.

The way the US treats people after being accused/committed with crimes literally throws lives away. And considering that the prosecution rates tend to be very race and class based is why imho the idea of systematic racism/classism is a very large part of US life...depending on what neighborhood you grew up in there's a chance you might just get swept into getting arrested by being in the wrong place/wrong time (with only an overworked public defender to help you).
 
shuri said:
Good luck! But how did you get into this mess? I mean, what's the whole altercation story? What happened?
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At ex girlfriends apartment spending the night. Wake up in middle of the night and her phone is going off. She answers. Tells me I have to leave immediately that this guy she's been seeing is drunk and is coming over to spend the night (wtf?)

I get jealous, refuse to leave.

Girl gets angry, argument escalates. Girl hits me over head with a portable phone after I said some very mean shit to her. I retaliate.

I leave. Neighbors called police. Police arrive, call me on phone. Spoke with officer after my ex explained what happened to him. He asks if she wants to press charges, she says no, asks me if I want to press charges, I say no.

Three months later, cops show up at my door and arrest me for battery, state/county decided to press charges on me.
 
krazen said:
The way the US treats people after being accused/committed with crimes literally throws lives away. And considering that the prosecution rates tend to be very race and class based is why imho the idea of systematic racism/classism is a very large part of US life...depending on what neighborhood you grew up in there's a chance you might just get swept into getting arrested by being in the wrong place/wrong time (with only an overworked public defender to help you).
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While I agree with you, it's not like there's a huge excess of open job positions. Employers can choose to be picky and there are plenty of candidates out there who haven't made one little mistake, like the OP did. Sucks, I know. Me personally, if I was hiring, I wouldn't let something like that get in the way if I felt the candidate was strong.
 
Thacker said:
At ex girlfriends apartment spending the night. Wake up in middle of the night and her phone is going off. She answers. Tells me I have to leave immediately that this guy she's been seeing is drunk and is coming over to spend the night (wtf?)

I get jealous, refuse to leave.

Girl gets angry, argument escalates. Girl hits me over head with a portable phone after I said some very mean shit to her. I retaliate.

I leave. Neighbors called police. Police arrive, call me on phone. Spoke with officer after my ex explained what happened to him. He asks if she wants to press charges, she says no, asks me if I want to press charges, I say no.

Three months later, cops show up at my door and arrest me for battery, state/county decided to press charges on me.
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What do you mean by, "I retaliate"?
 
To clarify a bit better, the DA informed my lawyer the reason I was charged with a crime was because my "defense" of striking her, in retaliation to her hitting me first with an object(her admittance) was excessive compared to her because she was a woman, and I was a man. If I had just struck her with intent to harm without her initiation the contact it would have been a felony, but since I was hit first but retaliated it was still battery and not self defense. She was never charged (nor did I want her to be).
 
Thacker said:
The lawyer I am using now is the same one I had back when I was convicted before. He recommended against fighting it because he said if I lose, the county usually seeks jail time but if I plead no lo, I would get off with just probation and a fine due to a deal with the DA. Whether or not he just didn't want to put in any extra work, I don't know but he seems to be doing his due diligence now. This will be $3,000 total I've paid him since hiring him.
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Of course sometimes plea deals make sense. What was the maximum sentence you would've faced? Would your ex have actually come to court and testified against you?
 
Thacker said:
To clarify a bit better, the DA informed my lawyer the reason I was charged with a crime was because my "defense" of striking her, in retaliation to her hitting me first with an object(her admittance) was excessive compared to her because she was a woman, and I was a man. If I had just struck her with intent to harm without her initiation the contact it would have been a felony, but since I was hit first but retaliated it was still battery and not self defense. She was never charged (nor did I want her to be).
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Sounds like you're the victim of an overzealous DA. Goddamn, so they just charged you without your ex even wanting to? That's messed up, there's wife beaters that never get charged and they went after you.

Guileless said:
Of course sometimes plea deals make sense. What was the maximum sentence you would've faced? Would your ex have actually come to court and testified against you?
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Odds are she wouldn't have needed to, they have the police statements they both made where he admitted it.

Damn, this whole thing just sounds really messed up. Beyond what I thought when I read the OP.
 
Guileless said:
Of course sometimes plea deals make sense. What was the maximum sentence you would've faced? Would your ex have actually come to court and testified against you?
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I don't know. After I found out she was seeing someone else and after the incident that night I never had contact with her again. Maximum sentencing for a misdemeanor in GA is a jail term of up to a year.
 
B-Dubs said:
Sounds like you're the victim of an overzealous DA. Goddamn, so they just charged you without your ex even wanting to? That's messed up, there's wife beaters that never get charged and they went after you.
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Apparently the only reason charges were brought up was because the DA had reviewed the police report, maybe at the cops request?

The lawyer did advise the plea deal because he said the DA "has a hard on for cases like this".
 
Thacker said:
Apparently the only reason charges were brought up was because the DA had reviewed the police report, maybe at the cops request?

The lawyer did advise the plea deal because he said the DA "has a hard on for cases like this".
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It sounds like maybe the DA seeks out cases like this if your quote is accurate.

This entire thing just sounds really really messed up. How did the DA get the go ahead to prosecute without a victim willing to press charges? Like I said, there are wife beaters (people who literally beat their SO to a pulp) who never see the inside of a courtroom because their spouses don't want to press charges.
 
Police statement is hearsay. The ex would've had to testify and be subject to cross examination by Thacker's lawyer in front of a jury. Granted, 99% of cases like these plea out and its not hard to imagine the DA being pissed at having to take this to trial and asking for the max punishment.
 
Dude, your story sucks. I'm sorry.

And it scares the shit out of me. About a year ago, I was involved in a minor altercation at a bar. It was late, I was drunk and in a terrible frame of mind, he was cheating at pool, and next thing I know I got in his face and we had a minor scuffle. It wasn't a fight, but I totally provoked it.

Totally out of character for me, but ever since then I've been worried that I have a warrant out for my arrest for assault/battery. I don't think he would press charges over something so minor, but you never know.

Anyway, I hope someone on GAF can maybe help you out and get you a job. It's ridiculous that you're still paying for something so minor in the grand scheme of things.
 
As someone with a bit of a temper sometimes stories like these just horrify me like no other. I've been in a few situations where it would have been easy to just fly off the handle and I'm seriously glad that I didn't. I used to think it would be easy to just cop a plea, pay whatever, and be done with it but that's some scary stuff. Hope you get your life back OP. That is some fucked up nonsense.
 
Man, what kind of ass-backwards justice system keeps people down after they've paid their debt to society? What purpose does that serve? Ridiculous.

Best of luck, OP.
 
Georgia sucks. I would never live there as I have been in this situation. I have things in my past that are 20 years old that occasionally pop up. I do applaud the OP for always being honest about it as thats the way to go. As for advice I can say that background checks are usually dictated by the laws of the state in which their home office resides. What this means is that most states and larger companies have a 7 year rule in effect. That is definitely the case for California although some go back up to 10 or 15 should you apply for a job that pays more than 70k annually
 
silkysmooth said:
As someone with a bit of a temper sometimes stories like these just horrify me like no other. I've been in a few situations where it would have been easy to just fly off the handle and I'm seriously glad that I didn't. I used to think it would be easy to just cop a plea, pay whatever, and be done with it but that's some scary stuff. Hope you get your life back OP. That is some fucked up nonsense.
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As someone with temper problems as kid/teen, those days are behind me thankfully, you can get over it.

-Stay away from situations or people that provoke you. Just walk away.
-Avoid hard drinking. I drink but, never to drunkeness. Some people may say that's uptight, but it's kept me away from any altercations. Once I feel a light buzz I stop.
-Cut off all bad influences--relationships, associations.
-Don't let arguments spiral down and learn to end them. Avoid relationships with those who like to look for fights.
-Try seeing a therapist.

I haven't had issues since I was teen and I'm in my thirties now. But the key is to take proactive steps now.

Zelias said:
Man, what kind of ass-backwards justice system keeps people down after they've paid their debt to society? What purpose does that serve? Ridiculous.

Best of luck, OP.
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American culture has roots in Puritanism, which is insanely self righteous and has an obsession with vengeance. It's very deeply rooted. Why do you think tough on crime politicians do well? They only do well because we as a society value vengeance and retribution over rehabilitation and they tickle our ears with those promises. Also see drug war.
 
entrement said:
American culture has roots in Puritanism, which is insanely self righteous and has an obsession with vengeance. It's very deeply rooted. Why do you think tough on crime politicians do well? They only do well because we as a society value vengeance and retribution over rehabilitation and they tickle our ears with those promises. Also see drug war.
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This is definitely true, especially in regards to the death penalty.

There's a high profile case in PA that was just overturned by a philadelphia judge. Apparently it's illegal to Execute the mentally retarded.

Of course, the news that this dude is "only" going to get life in prison as opposed to being killed is somehow a "grave miscarriage of justice" and "the family is devastated" and the vacated ruling "mocks all that is right and fair" that a guy with an IQ in the 70s isn't going to be killed on the spot.

It's very, VERY bizarre logic for me, and just another reason why the DP shouldn't exist.
 
This isn't a justice system problem as much as a technology problem of giant easily searchable databases and a very tight labor market. Domestic violence is a tough problem for the justice system to handle because it often deals with situations like Thacker's. But we don't want to go back to the 50s when women had no recourse.
 
Guileless said:
This isn't a justice system problem as much as a technology problem of giant easily searchable databases and a very tight labor market. Domestic violence is a tough problem for the justice system to handle because it often deals with situations like Thacker's. But we don't want to go back to the 50s when women had no recourse.
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Nah, it's a justice system problem just looking at his story; they both didn't want to press charges.

Regardless I don't think it should be that easy to find/research past low level crimes like misdemeanors because it's ALWAY a mark against you, even in a strong job market. It's crazy how a 40 year old guy can still be haunted by a bar room brawl where nobody really got hurt when he was 18
 
Guileless said:
This isn't a justice system problem as much as a technology problem of giant easily searchable databases and a very tight labor market. Domestic violence is a tough problem for the justice system to handle because it often deals with situations like Thacker's. But we don't want to go back to the 50s when women had no recourse.
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It's also a issue of liability. If a person with a history of domestic violence were hired, and then years later hit an employee, then people would want the company's ass on a platter for not doing a background check and/or hiring a person regardless of criminal history.
 
Sucks man, sorry to hear about your ordeal. While I can't speak for every company, I can tell you that my employer has a zero tolerance policy against any violence (misdemeanor or otherwise). Especially against women - even for entry level positions.

Simply put; they're not going to hire some guy, even in the mail room, who beats up a girl (regardless of the circumstances). I imagine other companies feel the same. Stay positive and best of luck in your search.
 
Carnby said:
It's also a issue of liability. If a person with a history of domestic violence were hired, and then years later hit an employee, then people would want the company's ass on a platter for not doing a background check and/or hiring a person regardless of criminal history.
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I won't turn this into a domestic thread, and I won't cry and say I was the victim here about what happened with me and her, but it wasn't the first time she had laid her hands on me. She was very physical anytime there was an argument and this was the first time I had lashed out in response.One particular case she threw a full water bottle at me one time I was sitting at my computer "ignoring" her and playing battlefield 2. It hit me so hard it gave me a black eye for a few days in which I laid out of work for pure embarrassment. On top of that she ran around on me multiple times with other guys, and yea... well... I'm just glad that part of my life is behind me. Sadly, I still have to think about it on a daily basis thanks to this haunting me.
 
You mentioned being denied simply for listing an arrest. It happens and it's absolutely ridiculous. Employers should never come to conclusions based on arrests, in fact they are advised to do otherwise. They do it anyway though.

An arrest doesn't mean you're guilty of a crime. An arrest means nothing really. You can be arrested for a plethora of reasons, some not even necessarily related to a crime. Innocent until proven guilty. Arrests aren't convictions.
 
saelz8 said:
You mentioned being denied simply for listing an arrest. It happens and it's absolutely ridiculous. Employers should never come to conclusions based on arrests, in fact they are advised to do otherwise. They do it anyway though.

An arrest doesn't mean you're guilty of a crime. An arrest means nothing really. You can be arrested for a plethora of reasons, some not even necessarily related to a crime. Innocent until proven guilty. Arrests aren't convictions.
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This is true. Being arrested is actually quite easy to come by, which is surprising to those it's never happened to.
 
krazen said:
Nah, it's a justice system problem just looking at his story; they both didn't want to press charges.

Regardless I don't think it should be that easy to find/research past low level crimes like misdemeanors because it's ALWAY mark against you, even in a strong job market. It's crazy how a 40 year old guy can still be haunted by a bar room brawl where nobody really got hurt when he was 18
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She said that night she didn't, but she must've changed her mind. But whether she would've been willing to testify and be cross examined about it in court is a different question. Thacker could've also filed a civil suit against her if the DA wouldn't prosecute.
 
Guileless said:
Police statement is hearsay. The ex would've had to testify and be subject to cross examination by Thacker's lawyer in front of a jury. Granted, 99% of cases like these plea out and its not hard to imagine the DA being pissed at having to take this to trial and asking for the max punishment.
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Errr... are you sure? Are you a lawyer? I would think police statements where they documented interviews with suspects are admissible in court. For example, I know police can write accident reports based on interviews with witnesses/examination of tire marks/etc. even when they were not present at the scene of the accident, and those are admissible. What is the point of police questioning/interrogations if they are not admissible? You're saying you can confess a crime to an officer, and then change your mind and plead not guilty in court, and the police testimony is hearsay? I'm lost.
 
bjb said:
Sucks man, sorry to hear about your ordeal. While I can't speak for every company, I can tell you that my employer has a zero tolerance policy against any violence (misdemeanor or otherwise). Especially against women - even for entry level positions.

Simply put; they're not going to hire some guy, even in the mail room, who beats up a girl (regardless of the circumstances). I imagine other companies feel the same. Stay positive and best of luck in your search.
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And that policy doesn't sound discriminatory to you at all?
 
Carnby said:
I think those details are important if your asking for a GAFer to get you a job.
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No, no, and no. The details of what happened on an event 7 years ago if they do not pertain to the type of job I am applying for should not effect nor reflect on my ability to apply, work for, or be hired on by a company at this time. Especially when that crime was a misdemeanor and classified in the same category as traffic ticket by the state. The details of what happen make it seem much, much worse than what it actually was to anyone that wasn't there to witness and be apart of what happened and our society has a very white knight mentality towards this type of thing anyway. I've had multiple long term relationships since, all with girls that would for the most part give me a stellar reference both professionally and personally. I am not a woman beater, nor should I be labeled as one after one incident 7 years ago.

As someone above me said their company doesn't hire anyone who "beats up a woman" no matter the circumstances and that makes me sad, because I'm sure there are hundreds of thousands of men who are true abusers, who don't deserve what they have in life but then there are some like me that are labeled in that same group that while from the outside we look the same, aren't one in the same at all.
 
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