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[Alexios]

I have been over the 8 bit look.

Feels like a cheap way out of actually doing any kind of art for your game. It was novel years ago but now this stuff is just bloated in the indie scene.

Didn't know art is acknowledged on its resolution.

What about 16bit, how do you feel about that?

Note to certain people: again, not defending Anodyne, this is a way wider argument than this one game. I can find it ugly (but I don't, it looks solid and distinct to me) and still ponder over the same issue, you know? In the end, all games played right now are judged equally. Some are 3D high res some 2D low res, or anything in-between. Some are old, some are new. I still find some 8 bit games beautiful and some 16 bit games beautiful, etc. If those classics still can look beautiful I see nothing wrong with drawing with the same limitations for new games. Some will get it right, some wrong, just like they get it right or wrong (where wrong isn't necessarily wrong, just not appealing to the person talking) when they don't use those. It's art.

 

[JBuccCP]

I think it looks ugly because it's too dense. Every surface is the same pattern repeated with nothing breaking it up and no empty space. It reminds me of one of those posters you stare at until something appears.

 

[TommyT]

Bugs me that in one of the pictures when the character turns around, their face is the same color as the cave/dirt.

If it's like Zelda though, I'll give it a shot.

 

[Drakken]

There is a demo, for those interested in actually trying it rather than pre-judging.

Still haven't gotten to start it yet; hopefully will find some time over the weekend.

 

[RM8]

For some reason Zelda-likes appeal to me more than the real deal. Stuff like Neutopia and 3D Dot Game Heroes. Actually, 3D Dot Game Heroes might be my favorite Zelda game, haha.

Also don't get the hate for retro-ish visuals. These guys probably don't have the budget for something that looks like Rayman Origins, and low-res pixel art can be really good looking if done right.

 

[Burt]

Yeah, I dunno, I like those kind of SNES era visuals. I'll probably check this game out at some point.

 

[Marlowe89]

But yeah, I'm totally defensive because I called out your irrational knee jerk reactions. I haven't even commented on the game's quality yet, or how those elements are handled. Because, much like you, I don't really know. Except I act like it.

I take that back. You're not just unreasonably defensive, you're childishly defensive.

What part of "I'm not really commenting on the quality of the whole product as a game" do you not seem to understand? I'm referring to a thematic concept; how that concept is handled is irrelevant, my point is it's there and I'm getting rather sick of it. At this point you might as well question the philosophical semantics of why anyone finds anything exhausting. You're practically yelling at a wall.

 

[Fine Ham Abounds]

I understand people being sick of being bombarded with pixel art indies, but there's nothing inherently lazy about pixel art.

It's a tradeoff really, you spend more time trying to make something look good with less, but the result is something impressionistic that lets you simply suggest detail to the viewer and engage more of their imagination.

Maybe I'm less annoyed by it because I generally don't play many indies

 

[Alexios]

I take that back. You're not just unreasonably defensive, you're childishly defensive.

What part of "I'm not really commenting on the quality of the whole product as a game" do you not seem to understand? I'm referring to a thematic concept; how that concept is handled is irrelevant, my point is it's there and I'm getting rather sick of it. At this point you might as well question the philosophical semantics of why anyone finds anything exhausting. You're practically yelling at a wall.

Circle jerking much? Again, nowhere did I say you judged the game's quality, so get off that straw man already.

Using such as an excuse to call people names probably has the opposite of the intended effect. Just trying to help here.

Every "thematic concept" has been done to death a million times before in all media, all that remains is how it's handled.

So yes, I found it peculiar that you called a game out for using one such broad thematic concept when another would be just as tired and yes, more so you did it before seeing how it's handled. Dream/mind worlds don't always try to be artsy about it, sometimes it's just a dream/mind world, an excuse for the wonders within.

I don't know if that's the case for this game, which I've yet to praise and thus in your words defend, neither do you.

So yeah, that's like, just my opinion and all, try and not take things personally enough to just start insulting others for disagreeing with, or rather investigating, an issue enough to challenge a proposed argument.

 

[RM8]

there's nothing inherently lazy about pixel art.

Can't be said enough. I used to do some sprite art ages ago. It's TOUGH working with limitations such as color and resolution, it's part of why I give so much credit to beautiful sprite art over generic real-life high quality assets, personally.

 

[Angelus Errare]

ITT: People saying the artists should take a color theory class are the ones who need to take a color theory class.

 

[Lissar]

I have been over the 8 bit look.

Feels like a cheap way out of actually doing any kind of art for your game. It was novel years ago but now this stuff is just bloated in the indie scene.

As someone who is a painter who also has done quite a bit of pixel art, both of them take quite a lot of effort and have their up and downsides. Pixel art has to be both pixel perfect (no room for error like you have with a painting) and represent an object with not much space. This is much harder than it looks. You can't just place some pixels down and say "good enough". Using pixel art is a very deliberate stylistic choice, like any other style you might use.

Personally I love pixel art and games that have that style. I'd love to see more of them.

 

[Marlowe89]

Circle jerking much? Again, nowhere did I say you judged the game as a whole, so get off that straw man already.

Ironically this itself is a strawman, because I never actually said you made that accusation. The reason I continue making this remark is because you seem entirely ignorant of it when you tell me I shouldn't play games I find less appealing, or how I don't really know how the quality of a game is handled.

Every "thematic concept" has been done to death a million times before in all media, all that remains is how it's handled.

You're either intentionally oversimplifying the argument here or you really do have piss-poor reading comprehension, but I definitely wouldn't put it past you if it was the latter. I was referring to something specific that's commonly overused in a particular genre. Within the industry in its entirety, the "dream/mind world" idea is occasional at best.

Are other thematic elements used in excess in other genres? Sure, but we're not even discussing that.

 

[atomic moth]

It seemed like the "Where's my new top-down Zelda" thread was much more positive and upbeat. Where are those people? Here's your Zelda game.

I look forward to playing this eventually.

 

[Crub]

A low-budget indie game with minimalistic graphics from an unproven developer?

I think they should have went with a lower price.

 

[Alexios]

Ironically this itself is a strawman, because I never actually said you made that accusation.

You claim I don't understand you judge its quality as a catch-all argument against my posts that never implied you do so. That's more than enough for anyone to make the connection that you claim I say or imply you judge that. Logic, you know?

The reason I continue making this remark is because you seem entirely ignorant of it when you tell me I shouldn't play games I find less appealing, or how I don't really know how the quality of a game is handled.

The former is sound advice when what you find unappealing makes you by your own words sick. I think you should avoid getting sick regardless of the game's quality, which I've yet to comment on. Feel free to disagree. The latter I did not do.

You're either intentionally oversimplifying the argument here or you really do have piss-poor reading comprehension, but I definitely wouldn't put it past you if it was the latter. I was referring to something specific that's commonly overused in a particular genre. Within the industry in its entirety, the "dream/mind world" idea is occasional at best.

Oh look more insults, you sure do seem smarter now than you did before. It's funny you accuse me of oversimplification when your whole argument is such, putting a whole host of potentially completely different things under the "try-hard artsy shit" label while implying this game is one of those (otherwise you had no reason to post that in this thread) based on pretty much nothing other than knowing it's a dream or mind world that is explored in the game. Not to mention that, yes, you need to know how it's handled in the particular case we're discussing in order to know if it's "try-hard" and "shit", possibly even "artsy". Shit, you might be right, I've merely pointed out at this point you don't know that. What a dumb crime!

Also, indie isn't a genre, it's a development/publishing model. For example, this game would probably be an action adventure, another indie game could be a platform game, another a CRPG, etc. Those would be their genres. Just saying.

 

[zoukka]

I have been over the 8 bit look.

Feels like a cheap way out of actually doing any kind of art for your game. It was novel years ago but now this stuff is just bloated in the indie scene.

It's a way to create decent visuals by people who don't have a strong grasp in game visuals. Don't be a hater.

 

[Eric C]

In Anodyne, you explore and fight your way through nature, urban and abstract themed areas in the human Young's subconscious, evoked by a 16-bit-era visual style and a moody, dream-like soundtrack.

I see lot's of indie games say this, but to me a lot of the indie games that say this seem more 8-bit inspired than 16-bit inspired, or at best something in-between 8-bit and 16-bit.

This game with it's sprite size, and the aspect ratio/screen size seems to remind me more of the GameBoy Color than say the SNES. But if some of it's inspiration is Link's Awakening I guess that's understandable.

 

[Alexios]

Well it certainly doesn't look as advanced as some 16bit stuff yeah.

But also not as primitive as some other 8bit stuff (ie the first Zelda).

It's a toss up I guess. Could the 8bit systems handle that many colors on screen?

 

[PsySal]

[deleted]

 

[Fine Ham Abounds]

Yeah, the NES had I think 64 colors and the SNES had 32k and change.

 

[elohel]

I have been over the 8 bit look.

Feels like a cheap way out of actually doing any kind of art for your game. It was novel years ago but now this stuff is just bloated in the indie scene.

over used you mean

and I think people do it because its a nice middle ground for effort and production

what's with the color theory complaints?

 

[Marlowe89]

It's funny you accuse me of oversimplification when your whole argument is such, putting a whole host of potentially completely different things under the "try-hard artsy shit" label while implying this game is one of those (otherwise you had no reason to post that in this thread) based on pretty much nothing other than knowing it's a dream or mind world that is explored in the game.

When I was asked to clarify why I feel that way, I was going by specific key descriptions from the official synopsis of the game and various reviews. Hardly an oversimplification on my part. I was going to respond to the other points in your post, but frankly I'm not as enthusiastic as you are about the semantics of how literally the word "sick" should be interpreted in that context or why you think it's only natural you'd jump to conclusions about me supposedly using strawmen in an argument. Seriously, no.

For what it's worth, I do think the environments look pretty. I'd be more than willing to actually try the game out if I didn't think it was overpriced for an indie title created by some nobody development duo.

 

[BlueSteel]

I mean, they do have a demo, so you guys can decide whether or not it's worth your money. I am obviously biased, but it's 3 dollars more than the "sweet" price point of $5 that everyone likes, which isn't all that much.

Also, regarding the story, it's not like story is even a huge part of the game. Sean might not agree with me, but I found the environment and ambience more important. The game puzzles are clever, and the writing isn't like "THIS IS A DREAM. STORY ABOUT DREAM." It more just allows them to fit the different environments together.

Anyways, I put up two desura keys Sean gave me. First two people can play the whole thing gratis. Quote to reveal.

 

[Persona86]

Reminds me more of Pokemon.

 

[Alexios]

Anyways, I put up two desura keys Sean gave me. First two people can play the whole thing gratis. Quote to reveal.

Thanks, got the second.

First game I get via Desura. Goot to see I don't need to install the client and can get the game in a zip instead!

Edit: it's an AIR installer after all, still great.

 

[Brazil]

I mean, they do have a demo, so you guys can decide whether or not it's worth your money. I am obviously biased, but it's 3 dollars more than the "sweet" price point of $5 that everyone likes, which isn't all that much.

Also, regarding the story, it's not like story is even a huge part of the game. Sean might not agree with me, but I found the environment and ambience more important. The game puzzles are clever, and the writing isn't like "THIS IS A DREAM. STORY ABOUT DREAM." It more just allows them to fit the different environments together.

Anyways, I put up two desura keys Sean gave me. First two people can play the whole thing gratis. Quote to reveal.

Got the first key. Thanks!

 

[Alexios]

Obsolete.

 

[smr00]

It's a way to create decent visuals by people who don't have a strong grasp in game visuals. Don't be a hater.

I am going to hate because the style is bloated.

People are using it to try to sell on "nostalgia" and using it as a cheap way to develop, if you want to do that fine, whatever. I just really have 0 interest in buying anymore of these games right now just like i have 0 interest any of the 9000 minecraft clones. Making your game a copy of a retro game and using retro style does not appeal to me anymore.

If you are going with the retro look at least do something NEW and refreshing.

 

[Alexios]

This doesn't really have copycat art though. Sure, 8-16bit, but its own distinct new style as well. Hence all the colors comments.

And again, bad art is bad art, whether it's high def 3D or low fi 2D. And good art is good art. This one's not exceptional I guess so far but it's solid. The style and limitations chosen don't make it inherently worse. The craft of the team assembled was pixel art, not 3D modeling, that's all there is to it, a choice like any other, that happens to be more viable for small teams.

Minecraft clones are one thing since they all are trying to provide the same experience. Randomly generated worlds, cubic voxels, completely interactive, building, crafting, basic combat, multiplayer, etc. In the end they mostly differ in the prefabs, mobs, etc, but they might as well be Minecraft mods. The games that change the concept like for example Terraria, do get a different audience as they provide a different enough experience despite the similarities.

Action adventures like this are a whole different thing, linear experiences, a preset journey, and each is its own, however similar concepts they may use. Each is distinct. You don't solve the same puzzles or fight in the same way the same bosses, generally you don't take the same journey. Like Okami vs Wind Waker. 3D, cel shaded, different experiences. This is a similar situation, but for 2D Zelda games. And there aren't that many Zelda style games to begin with.

 

[ntropy]

Zelda is video game's shadow of Buddha.

 

[outunderthestars]

I think the game looks great. I just tried the demo and will probably be picking up the full game this weekend. Digging the soundtrack as well.

I have been over the 8 bit look.

Feels like a cheap way out of actually doing any kind of art for your game. It was novel years ago but now this stuff is just bloated in the indie scene.

funny, I feel the exact same way................... about Unreal Engine

 

[PsySal]

[deleted]

 

[fart town usa]

I'm game if it actually plays like a 16-bit game.

I hate how so many "retro" games usually feature a shoehorned spin to the gameplay. i understand people want to think outside the box but eh, not me. I just want to play 16-bit games as if they were actually 16-bit games.

Maybe it's just me though.

 

[Alexios]

This is relatively minor but I think this needs a control fix.

In Zeldas, if I remember right, if you move UP or DOWN then add LEFT or RIGHT you'll move diagonally looking UP or DOWN.

While if you move LEFT or RIGHT then add UP or DOWN you'll move diagonally while looking LEFT or RIGHT.

In this, when moving diagonally you always look UP or DOWN regardless which means you need to stop the diagonal movement if you want to look LEFT or RIGHT (and thus fight an enemy in that direction or whatever you need).

It would also be nice if it saved your display settings, I want it windowed with 2x or 3x on boot, but it's always fullscreen.

Oh, and controller support built-in so I don't have to mess with xpadder.

 

[Lord Phol]

I think the game looks great. I just tried the demo and will probably be picking up the full game this weekend. Digging the soundtrack as well.



funny, I feel the exact same way................... about Unreal Engine

Amen, don't get how people can complain about pixel art when you got this generation of every shooter looks the same thing going on.

 

[flowsnake]

It would also be nice if it saved your display settings, I want it windowed with 2x or 3x on boot, but it's always fullscreen.

Yep. I have the game but I won't be playing it until that's fixed.

 

[outunderthestars]

Played this last night before bed and absolutely love it.

 

[PsionBolt]

I literally cannot think of any stylistic visual choice I dislike more than using "lighting effects" on pixel art. Good lord, it looks horrible. And it's not even neccessary! In those castle and forest gifs, the lighting doesn't even move, it's just planted directly in the centre of each screen. In the case of the castle, there's not even a discernable light source in the first room. It just laughs in the face of good pixel art, where actual shading is one of the most complex parts. Gah.

Also, the character sprites look pretty bad, as do the grass tiles. At least I don't really mind the color schemes that much though!

I'll probably check it out at some point regardless because I love 2D Zelda gameplay, but I think most of the visual complaints in here are justified.

 

[Noogy]

what's with the color theory complaints?

Apparently a lot of people who don't actually know what 'color theory' means were turned off by the warm palette.

I think this looks cool. A bit busy with some of the ground elements, but it's not like Nintendo is giving me another 2D Zelda. People just like to complain.

 

[Alexios]

I have one Desura copy of this to gift, if you want it quote me then message me with your e-mail (it doesn't give me a code to post here). Quote me so others can see that it's been taken by the first person to do this so they don't message me too...

Edit: taken.

 

[Burt]

I have one Desura copy of this to gift, if you want it quote me then message me with your e-mail (it doesn't give me a code to post here). Quote me so others can see that it's been taken by the first person to do this so they don't message me too...

I'd like to try it

 

[Alexios]

Sent.

 

[Burt]

Sent.

Appreciate it! I'll let everyone know what I think as I work through it.

 

[Tizoc]

Gamersgate has it for $8 if anyone's interested:
http://www.gamersgate.com/DD-ANODYNE/anodyne

 

[Drakken]

A couple major reviews went up yesterday:

Edge - 8
Gamespot - 7

 

[Joonytoon]

Pay what you want promotion going on now. Minimum of $1.

 

[outunderthestars]

Pay what you want promotion going on now. Minimum of $1.

Quality game, well worth a dollar.

Also, the soundtrack is awesome and "pay what you want"

 

[Zia]

They use Humble Store so, I might be wrong, but I assume you'll get a Steam key when and if it's listed.

 

[kuroshiki]

Shitty looking. $8 is too high for this.