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[StreetsofBeige]

This level of boomer logic makes me physically sick. I can just hear the clicking of wingtips on a marble floor.

HAHAHAHA! I'm no boomer, I'm Gen X, which IMO is the best generation because we are the best mix of traditional values and being smart enough to know modern tech, while laughing at Millenneals entitled attitudes.

Good timing. I was at my brother's new house and he does have marble floors and Dacor and Wolf kitchen appliances.. Giant house with 6 or 7 bathrooms. His daughter's bedroom is bigger than my master bedroom in my modest house. He laughed that the huge finished basement he'll never even use it. My sis in law laughed too that the home as gone up half a million dollars since they bought it late last year due to people scrambling to buy.

Hey, they deserve it. They worked hard their life and would work to 7 pm regularly. Now, they are done and loving it retiring in their 50s.

Work hard, earn hard, retire early.

I'm happy for him. We all are. Sounds like you'd be sore and spit in his face. And that's why you'll never achieve anything.

 

[Lukaku's First Touch]

HAHAHAHA! I'm no boomer, I'm Gen X, which IMO is the best generation because we are the best mix of traditional values and being smart enough to know modern tech, while laughing at Millenneals entitled attitudes.

Good timing. I was at my brother's new house and he does have marble floors and Dacor and Wolf kitchen appliances.. Giant house with 6 or 7 bathrooms. His daughter's bedroom is bigger than my master bedroom in my modest house. He laughed that the huge finished basement he'll never even use it. My sis in law laughed too that the home as gone up half a million dollars since they bought it late last year due to people scrambling to buy.

Hey, they deserve it. They worked hard their life and would work to 7 pm regularly. Now, they are done and loving it retiring in their 50s.

Work hard, earn hard, retire early.

I'm happy for him. We all are. Sounds like you'd be sore and spit in his face. And that's why you'll never achieve anything.

Dayum. Pure truth.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Looks like more drama over there. The new subreddit that they set up to migrate from /r/antiwork has already been compromised by more communist agenda pushers, causing another fracture and more drama.

Links from this image can be found here and here

How fucking deep does the agenda pushing on reddit go exactly? Holy shit.

Power mods are destroying Reddit.

I’m a longtime user and the rising of power mods has coincided with dramatic changes in the site culture fueled by this small group projecting their agendas over the entire site.

And if you resist, they’ll use AHS to organize a brigade…

At this point the company refuses to replace power mods by paid staff to save on costs so it’s super fucked.

 

[InfiniteCombo]

This level of boomer logic makes me physically sick.

What is it with extreme left types that makes them have hyperbolic, melodramatic reactions to things?

"I'm literally shaking right now"

"Makes me physically sick"

You guys are starting to become a parody of yourselves. If you want to be taken seriously in a debate, stop with the melodramatic nonsense and focus on the facts.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

What is it with extreme left types that makes them have hyperbolic, melodramatic reactions to things?

"I'm literally shaking right now"

"Makes me physically sick"

You guys are starting to become a parody of yourselves. If you want to be taken seriously in a debate, stop with the melodramatic nonsense and focus on the facts.

That's modern day social media drama queens.

On one hand, they don't like people calling out their need for attention.

But then show up to the office wearing no socks, sandals(!) and nose rings even in traditional office dress policies where there can be important meetings with external visitors. And they still do it even though there can be a company wide memo saying on a certain day the CEO from the US, or VPs from customers are visiting so in a nutshell "don't look or act like an asshole that day". It's amazing that grown adults have to be babysat with HR memos, but they do it because there's always rebels.

And then they dont like it when HR or their boss calls them out to dress better.

Figure that one out.

 

[GymWolf]

You can clearly discern realistic people from idealistic people who live in fairy land in this topic...

 

[AJUMP23]

What is it with extreme left types that makes them have hyperbolic, melodramatic reactions to things?

"I'm literally shaking right now"

"Makes me physically sick"

You guys are starting to become a parody of yourselves. If you want to be taken seriously in a debate, stop with the melodramatic nonsense and focus on the facts.

People who were never able to face failure, or learn how to deal with disappointment. It is part of the everyone gets a trophy generation. Part of the issue is with parents that they want to protect their children from any sense of failure. As a parent of 2 kids I am tempted too to protect my kids from dealing with their failures. But as a parent I know it is more important for them to be able to come back from disappointment than to never face it.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

People who were never able to face failure, or learn how to deal with disappointment. It is part of the everyone gets a trophy generation. Part of the issue is with parents that they want to protect their children from any sense of failure. As a parent of 2 kids I am tempted too to protect my kids from dealing with their failures. But as a parent I know it is more important for them to be able to come back from disappointment than to never face it.

Agreed.

The thing is you dont have to excel in a career or be in the best family ever to be a good person and accept your way.

One of my cousins (in their 40s) has never had a great job. One of those people who floats around every few years with another temp job one after another. She makes shit money. I would be surprised if she has ever made more than $40k per year. And even thats a stretch as many of her jobs dont cover a full time year of employment. And her family is single parent with only a mom because dad bolted like 30 years ago. And her mom didn't work a great job either raising her. Her fam is possibly (probably) the worst off in our fam tree out of everyone I can think of.

But that's ok. She and her mom are still good family with good hearts. Zero entitlement attitude, when on paper youd think this fam would be at the top of the list complaining.

 

[AJUMP23]

What you earn has no bearing on your character or value as a person.

clarity provided below for some of the abstract ideas left up for interpretation.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

 

[Unknown Soldier]

What you earn has no bearing on your character or value as a person.

In a capitalist society, it kinda does...

 

[Meicyn]

In a capitalist society, it kinda does...

If you view life in transactional terms, sure.

 

[Halo is Back]

What you earn has no bearing on your character or value as a person.

This is not true at all

 

[Unk Adams]

You can clearly discern realistic people from idealistic people who live in fairy land in this topic...

I can see the point on both sides. Some jobs do absolutely treat their employees like shit (less so over the past year because of job shortages because they're afraid of losing employees) and are run by narcissistic assholes and cunts who abuse their power. On the other hand the type of lazy, entitled people you find on Reddit would have a problem with even the best bosses and easiest jobs. One guy on Reddit was having a meltdown because he works at a retail store and was whining about customers paying with cash and not wanting to handle actual physical money. Another guy was whining and says he goes off on customers for asking "dumb questions" (you're literally there to provide customer service, dumbass). The type of people on Reddit literally can't handle anything in the real world, so even if you gave them a nice boss, easy job, and high pay they would still find any minor thing to nitpick and bitch about. They literally want to sit around, browse (and complain) on Reddit all day, whine and have other people pay for them to exist while contributing nothing.

So there are actual legitimate problems in the employment market to complain about. You just won't find any mature, intelligent conversation about it on the Antiwork subreddit.

 

[evolvaer]

HAHAHAHA! I'm no boomer, I'm Gen X, which IMO is the best generation because we are the best mix of traditional values and being smart enough to know modern tech, while laughing at Millenneals entitled attitudes.

Good timing. I was at my brother's new house and he does have marble floors and Dacor and Wolf kitchen appliances.. Giant house with 6 or 7 bathrooms. His daughter's bedroom is bigger than my master bedroom in my modest house. He laughed that the huge finished basement he'll never even use it. My sis in law laughed too that the home as gone up half a million dollars since they bought it late last year due to people scrambling to buy.

Hey, they deserve it. They worked hard their life and would work to 7 pm regularly. Now, they are done and loving it retiring in their 50s.

Work hard, earn hard, retire early.

I'm happy for him. We all are. Sounds like you'd be sore and spit in his face. And that's why you'll never achieve anything.

Content in ignorance. This guy made it at the curb end of golden age where you couldn't throw a stick without hitting success, and laughs at people who weren't born into a good economy.
Just platitudes about working hard gets you success.

Ignorance truly is bliss.

 

[AJUMP23]

This is not true at all

I should make it more clear. character can be had by rich or poor, being wealthy doesn’t give one more or less character. Value as an individual can fluctuate to society, but value as a human being is intrinsic as all people have value within reason but certainly a wealthy person creating jobs has more market value than a person working in a factory.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Content in ignorance. This guy made it at the curb end of golden age where you couldn't throw a stick without hitting success, and laughs at people who weren't born into a good economy.
Just platitudes about working hard gets you success.

Ignorance truly is bliss.

If it was that easy, everyone would be in that situation. Most people dont even know someone whose done that well as a family.

The economies have been fine the past 20 years. You just got to know which careers make money and know how to be good parents so the kids don't grow up idiots. This goes for any generation.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

If you view life in transactional terms, sure.

If you don't, then you'll stay poor forever.

 

[Meicyn]

If you don't, then you'll stay poor forever.

Not really. I don’t have to look down on the janitor and view them as lesser in order to not be poorly paid myself. I value the EMTs who save lives day by day, despite being paid beans for the service they provide society.

 

[Tazzu]

What you earn has no bearing on your character or value as a person.

clarity provided below for some of the abstract ideas left up for interpretation.

Some people find this out way too late their lives.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Not really. I don’t have to look down on the janitor and view them as lesser in order to not be poorly paid myself. I value the EMTs who save lives day by day, despite being paid beans for the service they provide society.

Agreed.

It comes down to attitude. And it's up to every person out there in their situation to either accept who they are and what they do, or complain.

At work, I'm pretty sure the warehouse crew doesn't get paid a ton, and our company uses a lot of temp workers during the holidays who probably get paid even worse and they have zero job security. When the Xmas rush is over those temp workers disappear. There's also various facility workers who do odd jobs too around the building.

But I've never seen or heard any of them in the cafeteria complain about wages or people treating them like shit or anything like that. And why would anyone grill them? They do a good job (especially during covid) and have never sabotaged the business with silly tactics or flooded the building with political rhetoric.

Now if they were all kicking and screaming being entitled and pissing people off that would be a different story.

 

[Unk Adams]

Not really. I don’t have to look down on the janitor and view them as lesser in order to not be poorly paid myself. I value the EMTs who save lives day by day, despite being paid beans for the service they provide society.

There are women who sell their dirty socks online to weirdo men with disturbing fetishes and make more than people who actually work their ass off to keep society running every day. Many of the highest paid management positions in companies are actually some of the most worthless people who run the companies into the ground over time. You could easily get rid of their jobs and the companies would be better off and more productive as a result. Your payment doesn't really define who you are, especially in the modern, dysfunctional society where some of the shittiest people are some of the most successful and are artificially placed in positions they don't deserve and didn't work for through nepotism, popularity, good looks or whatever else.

I don't agree in the whole lazy antiwork Reddit thing but I also don't agree with the boomer fantasies about how work and society are, either.

 

[evolvaer]

There are women who sell their dirty socks online to weirdo men with disturbing fetishes and make more than people who actually work their ass off to keep society running every day. Many of the highest paid management positions in companies are actually some of the most worthless people who run the companies into the ground over time. You could easily get rid of their jobs and the companies would be better off and more productive as a result. Your payment doesn't really define who you are, especially in the modern, dysfunctional society where some of the shittiest people are some of the most successful and are artificially placed in positions they don't deserve and didn't work for through nepotism, popularity, good looks or whatever else.

I don't agree in the whole lazy antiwork Reddit thing but I also don't agree with the boomer fantasies about how work and society are, either.

This is the best take i've read on this forum. It's not entitled and out of touch like some gen x and boomers, and it isn't a caricature of how gen z and millenials are portrayed in their frustration of facing odds previous generations never faced, but also talked down to.

This silly notion that hard work equals success, therefore any success is a reflection of your ethics and value as a person is ridiculous. We do the best with the hand we are dealt, but as an elder millenial it is especially annoying when self righteous older generations like streets of beige come in and so self assuredly pat themselves on the back for the good fortune of being born into an era where success was easier to have, and to dismiss the struggles of younger generations as a mere "stop whining and work hard like me, even though any mediocre person in my generation achieved relative success".

 

[StreetsofBeige]

This is the best take i've read on this forum. It's not entitled and out of touch like some gen x and boomers, and it isn't a caricature of how gen z and millenials are portrayed in their frustration of facing odds previous generations never faced, but also talked down to.

This silly notion that hard work equals success, therefore any success is a reflection of your ethics and value as a person is ridiculous. We do the best with the hand we are dealt, but as an elder millenial it is especially annoying when self righteous older generations like streets of beige come in and so self assuredly pat themselves on the back for the good fortune of being born into an era where success was easier to have, and to dismiss the struggles of younger generations as a mere "stop whining and work hard like me, even though any mediocre person in my generation achieved relative success".

I knew this view would come from a millennial.

Its never been easier to get a decent job that pays well. Excluding summer students which come and go and make $20/hr at my work, everyone else makes I'd say about $60,000 cdn. And that's the lowest job on the ladder. We're talking coordinators, green analysts and assistants. I wouldnt be surprised if they were paid more. And once you get promoted to a higher level, just about everyone is making $75-100k and were talking middle rank analysts and low level marketing managers.

Half these people above arent great as they are all relatively young and new to their jobs.

If they can a score a job like that anyone can. You don't need an ivy league degree or accounting designation to get a decent paying job. And same goes for blue collar work. You don't need to be a 15 year vet in a union to make decent money.

There's good money everywhere now (especially if anyone goes the tech career path the past 20 years).

If some people cant cut it too bad. Leave the entitlement at the door and earn your way to what you want. Dont complain. Dont think your millennial generation is the only generation that has issues. The generations before me (boomers and older) had shit loads of people whose families could had got annihilated in fire bombs where cities got leveled to dirt. And back then there was a lot more blue collar work and high school grad kinds of people. So you didn't exactly have smartest people who could immediately get back up.

They figured out how to prosper. If they can, so can you in your cozy bedroom with iPhone and unlimited internet, all paid for by your parents.

Stop complaining and get off your ass and get a decent job. I'm not the smartest guy in the world. I've stared at spreadsheets doing analysis for almost my entire career. As long as someone is decent at math, can analyze numbers and can use MS Excel, you got half the job done for you (I didn't even start using Excel till my first job and barely used LOTUS 123 in school as I went to university when people were hand crunching numbers and charts and then you type it into a Wordperfect file). Then you answer emails and come up with answers and solutions to bad numbers. That's the job. Pays great and isnt hard.

You dont like numbers and dollars jobs? Too bad. You just cut out a big portion of careers that pay well.

 

[Scotty W]

Bump

 

[Hero of Spielberg]

That’s one weird sub. I saw a thread from it pop up in my feed that was basically a chain comment of ‘the only good Nazi is a dead Nazi’ for about 2k comments. Do these people just sit around in their pj’s all day imagining they’re Brad Pitt from Inglorious Basterds or something?

I thought it was about not wanting to work in an office or getting paid more or something …

 

[MomsNewBoyfriend]

I knew this view would come from a millennial.

Its never been easier to get a decent job that pays well. Excluding summer students which come and go and make $20/hr at my work, everyone else makes I'd say about $60,000 cdn. And that's the lowest job on the ladder. We're talking coordinators, green analysts and assistants. I wouldnt be surprised if they were paid more. And once you get promoted to a higher level, just about everyone is making $75-100k and were talking middle rank analysts and low level marketing managers.

Half these people above arent great as they are all relatively young and new to their jobs.

If they can a score a job like that anyone can. You don't need an ivy league degree or accounting designation to get a decent paying job. And same goes for blue collar work. You don't need to be a 15 year vet in a union to make decent money.

There's good money everywhere now (especially if anyone goes the tech career path the past 20 years).

If some people cant cut it too bad. Leave the entitlement at the door and earn your way to what you want. Dont complain. Dont think your millennial generation is the only generation that has issues. The generations before me (boomers and older) had shit loads of people whose families could had got annihilated in fire bombs where cities got leveled to dirt. And back then there was a lot more blue collar work and high school grad kinds of people. So you didn't exactly have smartest people who could immediately get back up.

They figured out how to prosper. If they can, so can you in your cozy bedroom with iPhone and unlimited internet, all paid for by your parents.

Stop complaining and get off your ass and get a decent job. I'm not the smartest guy in the world. I've stared at spreadsheets doing analysis for almost my entire career. As long as someone is decent at math, can analyze numbers and can use MS Excel, you got half the job done for you (I didn't even start using Excel till my first job and barely used LOTUS 123 in school as I went to university when people were hand crunching numbers and charts and then you type it into a Wordperfect file). Then you answer emails and come up with answers and solutions to bad numbers. That's the job. Pays great and isnt hard.

You dont like numbers and dollars jobs? Too bad. You just cut out a big portion of careers that pay well.

This reeks of copium. Job pay well, life good!

 

[Ragnarok]

Jesus Christ, it’s not society’s or anyone else’s job to fix your existential crisis. Society is providing a way for you to be more comfortable than any other generation in history. It’s up to you to find meaning after that. Go have a kid, enjoy real responsibility and stop being a fucking twat.

 

[Later Alligator]

Jesus Christ, it’s not society’s or anyone else’s job to fix your existential crisis. Society is providing a way for you to be more comfortable than any other generation in history. It’s up to you to find meaning after that. Go have a kid, enjoy real responsibility and stop being a fucking twat.

i've followed antiwork for a while, and a lot of it is a bunch of lazy retards crying about never wanting to work in their life or that embarrassing mod completely disconnected with reality. but there are some legitimate concerns being raised as well. the gulf between income and cost of living has never been larger than it is right now for low paying jobs. and at a certain point, if you cannot cover your basic needs as a human being by working a full time job - why even go to work?

no one working in fast food or retail should be driving around in a lambo. but, you should to be able to afford the following:
rent
food
medical expenses
savings/rainy day/entertainment

or why even go to work? if you're going to be in poverty anyways, why not be in poverty with more free time on your hands?

"if you want all of those things go get a better job!". if everyone does that, who will do the shitty jobs that no one else wants to do? cooking burgers, making coffee, etc.. are not glamorous jobs but they are essential, someone needs to do that shit and it ain't gonna be me. we should at least ensure that they are fairly compensated for their efforts

i think we are starting to see a turn around, a lot of places are starting to up their pay to 15/hour minimum which is a start

 

[RoboFu]

Plenty of kids from well off households go on to make poor decisions and plenty of kids from struggling homes succeed. Just throwing up your hands and saying "it's ALL luck" is lazy defeatism and is probably why those people struggle no matter what their circumstances.

Yes there is “ luck “ involved but that’s mainly for opportunities. You still have to put in the effort to be able to take advantage of a lucky opportunity. These people want you to believe that you just sit around and wait for someone to ask to work for them as well as train you to do so.

 

[poppabk]

You can clearly discern realistic people from idealistic people who live in fairy land in this topic...

Can you? I am seeing two extremes both believing in a different fairy tale
- one where companies should be ran for the benefit of employees
- and one where achievement is strongly correlated with work ethic and the American Dream is alive and well

 

[StreetsofBeige]

This reeks of copium. Job pay well, life good!

Don't forget, it's not hard getting a decent paying job too! lol.

Out of university way back my first job was $40,000 and all I knew was what I learned in textbooks and doing shitty presentations in front of the class. See? Not hard.

i've followed antiwork for a while, and a lot of it is a bunch of lazy retards crying about never wanting to work in their life or that embarrassing mod completely disconnected with reality. but there are some legitimate concerns being raised as well. the gulf between income and cost of living has never been larger than it is right now for low paying jobs. and at a certain point, if you cannot cover your basic needs as a human being by working a full time job - why even go to work?

no one working in fast food or retail should be driving around in a lambo. but, you should to be able to afford the following:
rent
food
medical expenses
savings/rainy day/entertainment

or why even go to work? if you're going to be in poverty anyways, why not be in poverty with more free time on your hands?

"if you want all of those things go get a better job!". if everyone does that, who will do the shitty jobs that no one else wants to do? cooking burgers, making coffee, etc.. are not glamorous jobs but they are essential, someone needs to do that shit and it ain't gonna be me. we should at least ensure that they are fairly compensated for their efforts

i think we are starting to see a turn around, a lot of places are starting to up their pay to 15/hour minimum which is a start

Even if you work the crappiest job out there, you'll probably still make more than sitting around collecting welfare. Also, if you don't work how is anyone going to work their way up to betters jobs or promotions if they are sitting on the couch all day? And then nobody will hire you when you want to work because now you got a 2 year gap in your resume history from sitting at home you got to explain.

Not too many people out there start out with a great paying or middle manager kind of job when they are 25. Maybe if they are lucky enough their uncle works at head office and scores them a fast tracked job right away, but most people start from a low level job.

The McJobs out there arent meant to support someone who is 40 and has a family. Those are ultra low skilled transient jobs meant for kids or people looking for PT money while their spouse works a normal job. I did these shitty jobs in high school and university making anywhere from min wage (which was about $6/hr at the time, to "hitting the jackpot" so I thought making $10/hr). It's pocket money to goof around with and add to your bank account during university.

Nobody ever claimed in history a fry cook should make $50,000 ($25/hr) which is the average wage of the country (which is around $52,000 per person). Right now the fry cook gets anywhere from $8-15/hr in the US (depending on state min wage), and in Canada all jobs pay a minimum of I think $13/hr. And let's not pretend every one of these jobs pays the bare minimum.

So while making these bad wages won't get anyone anywhere in life, that's their problem. Most jobs arent even min wage kinds of jobs, so it cant be that hard to get a low level office or blue collar job that pays a tier up the ladder at $20/hr. But if somehow nobody wants to hire them, that's on them to figure out. Everyone else has.

The vast majority of low level jobs are food service, shopping mall sales, and things like that. IMO, there's too much of that anyway, so you could get rid of many business and the world will still turn. Everyone got by fine during covid and some cities were on shut down. All people did was cook more at home and order more stuff from Amazon. Problem solved and life goes on.

Low pay jobs is something every country faces. And it's kind of the same in every place. Make bad money at a bad job and you'll barely stay afloat. No different than 50 years ago.

So that tells me a few things about boosting people up:

1. Government and companies barely do anything about it (if any).

2. Since #1 holds true, If you want better paying jobs, got to go get it yourself

3. Or dont do anything and wish one day every company and government boosts min wage to $25/hr

Your choice what to do in life. Or just accept things as they are.

 

[FunkMiller]

Every single modern generation thinks they have it worse than the one before.

Spoiler: it’s never true.

 

[Taxexemption]

Every single modern generation thinks they have it worse than the one before.

Spoiler: it’s never true.

Or maybe you are experiencing normalcy bias. Theoretically however bad things are you would get used to it as being normal

If you fished for a living, and your father before you did, and his father before him did, you could develop a culture around that occupation. You could develop a really good pitch for it, you could intimately study it, you could ultimately find pretty much the perfect way to do it with minimal effort. Nothing is like that today. There are only a handful of occupations where a person could make the kind of living where they could reasonably afford to have children, and depending on what you do there is a decent chance it will be automated and you'll be looking for something new before you are an old man, or your employer will find a way to outsource your job.

Even if things are not that bad now, people deal with struggles unique to our time, and because our time is not like any other that has existed before there are no well thought out answers. Things were mostly the same through history, and so there were more concrete answers as to how you should approach things. We are living with technology and ideas that fundamentally change every aspect of life, and it's going to keep changing. You can't get comfortable, you can't relax, you can't think you know anything concrete about the world, because before you are an old man it will all change at least once if not several times.

 

[funkygunther]

Every single modern generation thinks they have it worse than the one before.

Spoiler: it’s never true.

it can be

Millennial life: How young adulthood today compares with prior generations

Now that the youngest Millennials are adults, how do they compare with those who were their age in the generations that came before them?

www.pewresearch.org

Millennials with a bachelor’s degree or more and a full-time job had median annual earnings valued at $56,000 in 2018, roughly equal to those of college-educated Generation X workers in 2001. But for Millennials with some college or less, annual earnings were lower than their counterparts in prior generations. For example, Millennial workers with some college education reported making $36,000, lower than the $38,900 early Baby Boomer workers made at the same age in 1982. The pattern is similar for those young adults who never attended college.

even having a “roughly equal” income to those 20 years ago isn't great…

 

[StreetsofBeige]

it can be

Millennial life: How young adulthood today compares with prior generations

Now that the youngest Millennials are adults, how do they compare with those who were their age in the generations that came before them?

www.pewresearch.org

even having a “roughly equal” income to those 20 years ago isn't great…

Sounds close enough to me.

One big boost millenneals have is rock bottom interest and loan rates. So while things cost more, the interest rates are low single digits. 20 years ago, my mortgage in Canada was about 5%. Baby Boomers in 1982 had 15% mortgages. I'm going to renew mine at about 1.35%. Everyone I know has a mortgage around 2% or less.

The big difference is spending. The farther you go back, the more cash hoarding and simple people were with their money, so you can still go after a cheap $150,000 house, but at 15% interest because they werent eating out every day, going on two trips to Mexico every year, and trying to buy a BMW before reaching 30 years old. So for young people I work with who make incredibly good money in their late 20s, somehow these idiots are broke. Well, ya, that Audi A4 you're driving is probably $1000/mth while a shitty Civic like I had at their age is probably about 1/3rd the cost.

No joke, some of these people have better cars than the veteran directors and VPs.

That's why many young people cant afford a decent mortgage. They got the income, but their monthly bills on record (credit check) are sky high. All that money spent in their 20s going on world trips can easily pile up as a down payment on a home too.

But some reason millenneals are a short term "spend today, hope for the best tomorrow" attitude, when historically it's the other way around where people "save first, and buy the spiffy toys later" in life. Crazy spending on trips, high end cars and eating out like crazy are the things traditionally people in the 40s or older who've made good money at a high level job can afford because they got the money and set in life.

 

[FunkMiller]

it can be

Millennial life: How young adulthood today compares with prior generations

Now that the youngest Millennials are adults, how do they compare with those who were their age in the generations that came before them?

www.pewresearch.org

even having a “roughly equal” income to those 20 years ago isn't great…

I guess I’m talking across the board in terms of lifestyle, health, wealth, opportunity, communication, relationships, etc. Progress always makes the world and people’s lives better as a whole, even if differing generations have differing issues with specific parts of their lives.

 

[TaylorSwiftFan]

But I've never seen or heard any of them in the cafeteria complain about wages or people treating them like shit or anything like that.

Maybe they don’t want to talk pay at the workplace?

I am a millenial of more conservative values but it is definitely harder today to achieve success than before. My grandmother bought a massive piece of land while working as a labourer. There is no way any labourer could afford 1/5th of that land now no matter how hard they work.

I do agree millenials have it easy in a lot of ways. But they also have it harder in others. The poor upbringing didn’t help as well as there is a lot of them who are entitled and think they should have everything on a silver platter. They want to wear expensive sneakers while also buying a house in their twenties.

 

[Torrent of Pork]

Sounds close enough to me.

One big boost millenneals have is rock bottom interest and loan rates. So while things cost more, the interest rates are low single digits. 20 years ago, my mortgage in Canada was about 5%. Baby Boomers in 1982 had 15% mortgages. I'm going to renew mine at about 1.35%. Everyone I know has a mortgage around 2% or less.

The big difference is spending. The farther you go back, the more cash hoarding and simple people were with their money, so you can still go after a cheap $150,000 house, but at 15% interest because they werent eating out every day, going on two trips to Mexico every year, and trying to buy a BMW before reaching 30 years old. So for young people I work with who make incredibly good money in their late 20s, somehow these idiots are broke. Well, ya, that Audi A4 you're driving is probably $1000/mth while a shitty Civic like I had at their age is probably about 1/3rd the cost.

No joke, some of these people have better cars than the veteran directors and VPs.

That's why many young people cant afford a decent mortgage. They got the income, but their monthly bills on record (credit check) are sky high. All that money spent in their 20s going on world trips can easily pile up as a down payment on a home too.

But some reason millenneals are a short term "spend today, hope for the best tomorrow" attitude, when historically it's the other way around where people "save first, and buy the spiffy toys later" in life. Crazy spending on trips, high end cars and eating out like crazy are the things traditionally people in the 40s or older who've made good money at a high level job can afford because they got the money and set in life.

When I got my CDL and finally started to make adult money I continued on like I was living dirt poor, dumping all that income into my various debts.

Now I'm debt free, and continuing to live dirt poor so I can pay off my grandparent's mortgage in about 5-10 years. (I'm getting the house in inheritance, so it's not completely selfless)

 

[jason10mm]

When I got my CDL and finally started to make adult money I continued on like I was living dirt poor, dumping all that income into my various debts.

Now I'm debt free, and continuing to live dirt poor so I can pay off my grandparent's mortgage in about 5-10 years. (I'm getting the house in inheritance, so it's not completely selfless)

That's admirable but probably a WAY better use for your money is in high yield stocks now since home interest rates are damn near Rock bottom.

Earn 7-10% on even a relatively conservative mutual fund package while paying down that 2.5% mortgage as slowly as possible!

May not apply to all countries though.

 

[Ionian]

That's admirable but probably a WAY better use for your money is in high yield stocks now since home interest rates are damn near Rock bottom.

Earn 7-10% on even a relatively conservative mutual fund package while paying down that 2.5% mortgage as slowly as possible!

May not apply to all countries though.

He's paying off a debt he'll inherit in advance whilst supporting his family? More power to him. Fair play to you Torrent of Pork

 

[Ragnarok]

i've followed antiwork for a while, and a lot of it is a bunch of lazy retards crying about never wanting to work in their life or that embarrassing mod completely disconnected with reality. but there are some legitimate concerns being raised as well. the gulf between income and cost of living has never been larger than it is right now for low paying jobs. and at a certain point, if you cannot cover your basic needs as a human being by working a full time job - why even go to work?

no one working in fast food or retail should be driving around in a lambo. but, you should to be able to afford the following:
rent
food
medical expenses
savings/rainy day/entertainment

or why even go to work? if you're going to be in poverty anyways, why not be in poverty with more free time on your hands?

"if you want all of those things go get a better job!". if everyone does that, who will do the shitty jobs that no one else wants to do? cooking burgers, making coffee, etc.. are not glamorous jobs but they are essential, someone needs to do that shit and it ain't gonna be me. we should at least ensure that they are fairly compensated for their efforts

i think we are starting to see a turn around, a lot of places are starting to up their pay to 15/hour minimum which is a start

My point is that finding a full time job that pays minimum wage or close to it is pretty rare these days. Fast food in my town starts at $13/hr and you basically just have to show up to get hired.

Warehouse and unskilled work is around $20/hr. You go to a trade school and you’re making bank after a year or two (and starting off at $18 or so)

The way the market is right now there is absolutely no excuse for making close to minimum wage unless you’re a high schooler working at game stop part time

 

[MomsNewBoyfriend]

Don't forget, it's not hard getting a decent paying job too! lol.

Out of university way back my first job was $40,000 and all I knew was what I learned in textbooks and doing shitty presentations in front of the class. See? Not hard.


Even if you work the crappiest job out there, you'll probably still make more than sitting around collecting welfare. Also, if you don't work how is anyone going to work their way up to betters jobs or promotions if they are sitting on the couch all day? And then nobody will hire you when you want to work because now you got a 2 year gap in your resume history from sitting at home you got to explain.

Not too many people out there start out with a great paying or middle manager kind of job when they are 25. Maybe if they are lucky enough their uncle works at head office and scores them a fast tracked job right away, but most people start from a low level job.

The McJobs out there arent meant to support someone who is 40 and has a family. Those are ultra low skilled transient jobs meant for kids or people looking for PT money while their spouse works a normal job. I did these shitty jobs in high school and university making anywhere from min wage (which was about $6/hr at the time, to "hitting the jackpot" so I thought making $10/hr). It's pocket money to goof around with and add to your bank account during university.

Nobody ever claimed in history a fry cook should make $50,000 ($25/hr) which is the average wage of the country (which is around $52,000 per person). Right now the fry cook gets anywhere from $8-15/hr in the US (depending on state min wage), and in Canada all jobs pay a minimum of I think $13/hr. And let's not pretend every one of these jobs pays the bare minimum.

So while making these bad wages won't get anyone anywhere in life, that's their problem. Most jobs arent even min wage kinds of jobs, so it cant be that hard to get a low level office or blue collar job that pays a tier up the ladder at $20/hr. But if somehow nobody wants to hire them, that's on them to figure out. Everyone else has.

The vast majority of low level jobs are food service, shopping mall sales, and things like that. IMO, there's too much of that anyway, so you could get rid of many business and the world will still turn. Everyone got by fine during covid and some cities were on shut down. All people did was cook more at home and order more stuff from Amazon. Problem solved and life goes on.

Low pay jobs is something every country faces. And it's kind of the same in every place. Make bad money at a bad job and you'll barely stay afloat. No different than 50 years ago.

So that tells me a few things about boosting people up:

1. Government and companies barely do anything about it (if any).

2. Since #1 holds true, If you want better paying jobs, got to go get it yourself

3. Or dont do anything and wish one day every company and government boosts min wage to $25/hr

Your choice what to do in life. Or just accept things as they are.

I was making fun of you chief. I've noticed gen x boomers by far equating life success to shiny trinkets and mcmansions, when your generation has the highest alcohol and drug abuse/suicide rate/failed marriage rate in history. I have the same cookie cutter analyst job as you do, and it does nothing for me personally. Financial security beats homelessness but that's as far as I'll give it credit for. We've paid a steep price in losing what really matters and none of us can get it back

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I was making fun of you chief. I've noticed gen x boomers by far equating life success to shiny trinkets and mcmansions, when your generation has the highest alcohol and drug abuse/suicide rate/failed marriage rate in history. I have the same cookie cutter analyst job as you do, and it does nothing for me personally. Financial security beats homelessness but that's as far as I'll give it credit for. We've paid a steep price in losing what really matters and none of us can get it back

I was making fun of you too chief.

You must have a shitty career where you hate your job. I dont. Every company I've worked for is great and lots of my best friends since my first job out of school are coworkers. I've been to I think 5 coworker weddings, including one of my bosses where a bunch of us went to Vegas. And some of them were even from shitty summer jobs before graduating. Not hard to make friends and have a good career. And some of my best friends I've known since kindergarten. Again, not hard. Hell, when you go to school with some of these people from kindergarten to high school, how can you not make longlasting friends? All we did was be in the classes and eat lunch together for over 10 years.

Problem with people like you is you cant appreciate anything and think everything should be put on a silver platter.

"Anything for an easy buck"

And you dont take career paths serious. Just because someone does well doesn't mean they only take that career for the money. You got to like what you do too. If you started out as an analyst and hate the job you took the wrong career. That's your problem. Bad choice. And besides, my finance job now is way higher than grad school finance job 20 years ago. Pays great, I like what I do and I can boss some people around (not all as there's some people above me) and aside from small amounts of OT it's a 9-5 job. Actually more like 9-4:30 during covid. lol

You think just because some people have money and a good job, it means they are miserable in everything else. Not true. Got great family, friends and coworkers.

As for your stats about gen X/boomers having issues, I'm not going to research and debate it because I'll assume it's true for sake of argument. So what? The past 40-50 years have been mom and dad working to put food on the table and for women to enjoy having careers instead of the 1950s where women stayed home baking an cleaning. That causes friction in families. And when you got some people's parents going through car loans and mortgages at 10-15% in the 80s, of course it'll strain a family. It'd piss me off too if I had to pay loans at double digit %.

At least they are doing what's right and trying to work and provide for the fam.

You on the other hand want to coast through life and live at home till youre 40, or get a big handout from mom and dad.

 

[MomsNewBoyfriend]

I was making fun of you too chief.

You must have a shitty career where you hate your job. I dont. Every company I've worked for is great and lots of my best friends since my first job out of school are coworkers. I've been to I think 5 coworker weddings, including one of my bosses where a bunch of us went to Vegas. And some of them were even from shitty summer jobs before graduating. Not hard to make friends and have a good career. And some of my best friends I've known since kindergarten. Again, not hard. Hell, when you go to school with some of these people from kindergarten to high school, how can you not make longlasting friends? All we did was be in the classes and eat lunch together for over 10 years.

Problem with people like you is you cant appreciate anything and think everything should be put on a silver platter.

"Anything for an easy buck"

And you dont take career paths serious. Just because someone does well doesn't mean they only take that career for the money. You got to like what you do too. If you started out as an analyst and hate the job you took the wrong career. That's your problem. Bad choice. And besides, my finance job now is way higher than grad school finance job 20 years ago. Pays great, I like what I do and I can boss some people around (not all as there's some people above me) and aside from small amounts of OT it's a 9-5 job. Actually more like 9-4:30 during covid. lol

You think just because some people have money and a good job, it means they are miserable in everything else. Not true. Got great family, friends and coworkers.

As for your stats about gen X/boomers having issues, I'm not going to research and debate it because I'll assume it's true for sake of argument. So what? The past 40-50 years have been mom and dad working to put food on the table and for women to enjoy having careers instead of the 1950s where women stayed home baking an cleaning. That causes friction in families. And when you got some people's parents going through car loans and mortgages at 10-15% in the 80s, of course it'll strain a family. It'd piss me off too if I had to pay loans at double digit %.

At least they are doing what's right and trying to work and provide for the fam.

You on the other hand want to coast through life and live at home till youre 40, or get a big handout from mom and dad.

Again, you're coping. You're trying to convince yourself something you don't actually believe, and making assumptions about things I haven't claimed. You wouldn't be here if you were satisfied in your life's direction, full stop

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Again, you're coping. You're trying to convince yourself something you don't actually believe, and making assumptions about things I haven't claimed. You wouldn't be here if you were satisfied in your life's direction, full stop

LOL. Actually it's the opposite. I like putting entitled people in their place.

But if there's only one thing out of everything I said you should remember is this advice to you:

"It's not that hard".

 

[Mamofish]

This is a little off topic but, I found this lecture to be intriguing. Johnathan brings up some good points about how software these days is so slapped together with so many other services it's too complex, not satisfying to work in. It's also an industry where when the experienced leave, taking years of insight about the system with them, It's hard to pass that insight to the new employees.

Our world is getting increasingly digital and I couldn't find a position that gave me meaning because I couldn't get over the idea that software doesn't feel real to me. I need to work with my hands and see something physical for a sense of satisfaction. There are other ways to find purpose or an identity outside of work of course and I just started reading Viktor Frankl to get a better sense of it myself. I think he would say it's about visioning a better future for yourself to live for, I guess people are struggling with that.

 

[Omega Supreme Holopsicon]

Nobody ever claimed in history a fry cook should make $50,000 ($25/hr) which is the average wage of the country (which is around $52,000 per person). Right now the fry cook gets anywhere from $8-15/hr in the US (depending on state min wage), and in Canada all jobs pay a minimum of I think $13/hr. And let's not pretend every one of these jobs pays the bare minimum.

So while making these bad wages won't get anyone anywhere in life, that's their problem. Most jobs arent even min wage kinds of jobs, so it cant be that hard to get a low level office or blue collar job that pays a tier up the ladder at $20/hr. But if somehow nobody wants to hire them, that's on them to figure out. Everyone else has.

The problem is there are tens of millions of US adults with IQ so low those are the only jobs they can do. What you're saying is they don't deserve to live out of poverty, and we should just accept this eugenic argument.

3 min video

 

[StreetsofBeige]

The problem is there are tens of millions of US adults with IQ so low those are the only jobs they can do. What you're saying is they don't deserve to live out of poverty, and we should just accept this eugenic argument.

3 min video

If that's why they get offered and its legal meeting min wage laws, then hey that's all they get.

I've still never seen anyone counter how much minimum money anyone should automatically get. Right now every country, state, province has min wage laws, and many of these jobs pay more than the bare minimum too.

So for let's say a FT paperboy (probably the lowest you can go), how much should this person get as a minimum annual salary? Right now they are probably making I'd guess about $10/hr (or more if the city/state has a higher min wage than $10/hr, so they can already be making $15/hr).

Some places are already close to $15/hr. Canadian provinces I think start at $13 already.

So for any paperboy or fry cook, it's obvious these amounts arent good enough for naysayers, so what's the call? $20? $25?

You can pick between two extremes in case cost of living is discussed. IDaho and San Fran.

 

[Taxexemption]

The problem is there are tens of millions of US adults with IQ so low those are the only jobs they can do. What you're saying is they don't deserve to live out of poverty, and we should just accept this eugenic argument.

3 min video

Although I agree with this you are unlikely to convince people. Most people are unaware of the extent to which IQ is hereditary, and they don't want to hear it cause it makes them feel bad.

To admit that you don't choose your IQ is to admit life is unfair in an important way. That makes a lot of people feel bad.