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[Trojan X]

UIPDATE 15th November

Problem solved! The issue was software based on the PC side. I had some filters "e.g. Soundblaster" that was hiding in the background in windows that was adjusting the sound (for the better if played in stereo) with its own filters. Also, Power DVD 14 and my older version of MPC did NOT output true bit-streaming as it was compressing the audio or doing something to it even though my amplifier was saying it was receiving a DOLBY TRUE HD and DTS MA signal. Problem solved by turning off all additional background app that may filter the sound and downloading the latest MPC player (1.7.10) that contain Bit-Streaming and Exclusivity option (fantastic player). Due to this, my PC is now kicking my amplifier the same way as my PS3 does which sounds incredibly awesome. Note that my PS3 still sounds slightly better though as the mid-range sound less noisey, more distinctive, and slightly warmer. Incredibly weird findings for both devices, PS3 and PC, are bit-streaming to my amplifier but I will investigate further over time to figure out why this is so.

Thank you to everyone who helped solve this problem. This thread is now open to anyone who is experiencing sound issues or what to improve their Audio setup for true cinematic home theatre sound experience, so ask away.


Original Post
Right now, I have my Playstation 3 and PC both connected via HDMI to my good ol' PIONEER SC LX71 Amplifier and I use both my PC and Playstation 3 for watching movies. However, the sound quality output from my PS3 for both Dolby and DTS ranges of standard and HD audio sound much better (crisper and make solid use of my subwoofer) than anything outputted via my PC regardless of settings:

My PC contain a Rampage IV Formula motherboard and a GTX 680 graphics card. The software I use for all movies on my PC is the Power DVD 14 and Media Player Classic plugged LAV Audio Decoder. My Power DVD 14 is set to "Non-decoded high definition audio to external device" and "Full dynamic range Dolby Digital Sound for quiet environments". My Media Player Classic is set to bit-streaming, which is the same setting as my PS3, and all compressions are switched to off.

My question is, do you think it would be worth it for me to buy a dedicated Sound Card (Must play Atmos, DTS-X etc as I might get a new amp next year) for the PC and if I do would it make a huge difference? Please also note that I also do lots of video editing such as trailer for the big screen.

 

[Drazgul]

My PC contain a Rampage IV Formula motherboard and a GTX 680 sound card.

That would be your graphics card; that mobo comes with the SupremeFX III onboard audio - not the greatest, but not the worst by any means either. I think in your case a dedicated sound card could be justified, it's not like they cost a ton unless you go for some ridiculous high-end model that you don't even need. Just make absolutely sure it has all the connectors you'll be needing, it's a bitch when you buy new gear that you then find out won't even work with your current setup.

 

[Timedog]

Is the connection from PC to receiver digital or analog?

 

[Khaz]

Get a cheap sound card with digital out, and let your amp do its magic.

 

[Trojan X]

Is the connection from PC to receiver digital or analog?

Digital. Both devices (PC and PS3) setup via HDMI, essential for Dolby TrueHD and DTS MA, I believe.

Ahh. Didn't think too tough that my graphics card could be the bottleneck. I am planning to buy a 1080Ti from day one. Considering this, it is still better to pursue a dedicated sound card?

 

[tokkun]

If you are doing bitstreaming of the original audio via HDMI, then different hardware should make zero difference. There is almost nothing for the hardware to do to influence sound quality in that configuration.

The two most likely explanations for what you are hearing are:
A. The PC is not actually bitstreaming due to some incorrect software setting or because you are using a source with an unsupported audio format.
B. You are imagining things.

 

[TronLight]

I connected my PC to my receiver throught the videocard (GTX 970). For movies if you use MPC-HC, you can just set it so that it bitstreams everything and then your receiver will transcode whatever it gets.
Games use their internal audio codecs/engines and usually you can't change it. Quality depends on whatever the developer does, which usually means they use lower quality codecs than what you find PS3 I think. Or it used to, maybe things changed with the new generation.

 

[Trojan X]

I connected my PC to my receiver throught the videocard (GTX 970). For movies if you use MPC-HC, you can just set it so that it bitstreams everything and then your receiver will transcode whatever it gets.
Games use their internal audio codecs/engines and usually you can't change it. Quality depends on whatever the developer does, which usually means they use lower quality codecs than what you find PS3 I think. Or it used to, maybe things changed with the new generation.

MPC set to bitstream. All filters, mixing, etc are set to none or off. Unfortunately, the audio quality is still different. It's not different in the sense that it is not doing what it suppose to, but in comparison to the PS3, the sound quality itself is no as crisp, distinctive and sharp, and my LFE sound really low.

I was playing Star Wars Episode VI and Empire Strikes Back via Blu Ray and the sound difference from playing via my PS3 and PC is night and day! Via my PS3, I can showcase my sound system to anyone who wanted to know what true HD sound sounds like, but I definitely cannot do that via my PC for the sound is nothing to write home about.

The two most likely explanations for what you are hearing are:
A. The PC is not actually bitstreaming due to some incorrect software setting or because you are using a source with an unsupported audio format.
B. You are imagining things.

Definitely not imagine things. I'd like to think that I am very sensitive to sound quality and I really do my best to receive the best home sound experience. I'm thinking it could be the settings but since everything is set to bitstream, I don't understand I am still not getting the same sound quality as when played via my PS3. My only conclusion is in agreement with Drazgul, the issue could be the GTX680 sound chip, the SupremeFX III. That's the only thing that makes sense to me so far unless people got other theories such as using a different player. However, a player that is bettter than Power DVD and MPC in the sound department? It's hard to believe.

Does anyone have any recommendation on what Sound Card to purchase? Definitely want one that can deliver awesome HD sound or truely let my Amp do all the work without compromise.

 

[RipperGrim]

Try getting an external amp/dac, On board cards can get a little distorted or buzzing noise because of all the other components in the pc. They do literally the same job and it's easier to handle when it's external in my opinion.

 

[lastflowers]

Try getting an external amp/dac, On board cards can get a little distorted or buzzing noise because of all the other components in the pc. They do literally the same job and it's easier to handle when it's external in my opinion.

.

My roommate had some weird shit from his PC that started happening one day. External DAC solved the issue.

 

[chrislowe]

I used a amplifier couple years ago thru optical but could not stand the latency i got.
Nowdays I use my yamaha moxf6 synths DAC thru usb connected to studio monitors (krk rokit 5)

Sounds great.

 

[tokkun]

My only conclusion is in agreement with Drazgul, the issue could be the GTX680 sound chip, the SupremeFX III. That's the only thing that makes sense to me so far unless people got other theories such as using a different player.

That conclusion is irrational, because it has no technical justification. You are getting a lot of responses from people ignoring that you are trying to do bitstreaming over a digital connection. People are talking about the PC's DAC, which never comes into the picture, because the only conversion occurs in the receiver. If you are using bitstreaming, the PC should literally be doing nothing but transmitting an unaltered digital signal to your receiver. Although it is still possible for signal integrity to matter in these situations, it would be more likely to manifest as audio not working at all. It would not result in what you are describing.

The first suggestion I would give you is to try to verify that you getting a bitstreamed connection. If bitstreaming is working, the receiver should display the audio codec, e.g. DTS or Dolby. You should also be unable to control volume of the output via the PC.

 

[Skelter]

I have a 1080 GTX, Denon SB510bT receiver, and my PC is connected to my AVR through HDMI yet I can't get surround sound.

Would I need a soundcard? I don't need Atmos since well my AVR doesn't support it but when playing games all I can get is stereo!

 

[Arkanius]

I enjoy having a dedicated sound card just to use CMSS-3D which is a HRTF for headphones which transforms 7.1 sources or OpenAL games into stereo positional audio.

Other than that, you may want dedicated soundcards for a good DAC and a good headphone amplifier. But for that, usually external soundcards are better since you are skipping the internal PC hardware noise.

 

[NeOak]

Sounds like MPC isn't exactly bitstreaming if it sounds different.

Like tokkun, if it is bistreamed, all the sound device has to do is support bistreaming

 

[shockdude]

Right now, I have my Playstation 3 and PC both connected via HDMI to my good ol' PIONEER SC LX71 Amplifier and I use both my PC and Playstation 3 for watching movies.

Your amplifier is already a DAC. You do not need to by another DAC or sound card. Since your computer is connected to your amplifier via HDMI, you are sending a purely digital audio signal to your amplifier and thus your amplifier should be doing its job as a DAC for your PC, just like it does for your PS3.
Right click the volume icon --> Playback Devices, double click on the audio device representing your GPU's HDMI. Go through all the tabs and post screenshots of your settings. Make sure all digital formats supported by your amp are enabled.

 

[Trojan X]

I have a 1080 GTX, Denon SB510bT receiver, and my PC is connected to my AVR through HDMI yet I can't get surround sound.

Would I need a soundcard? I don't need Atmos since well my AVR doesn't support it but when playing games all I can get is stereo!

I do not believe you need a soundcard, especially with a 1080. In this case, my games come out in surround sound as long it provides it, and I have a 680. For example, in my case, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4 and Need for Speed The Run come out in full surround sound while certain other games I play comes out in Stereo because they don't have any surround option.

Ultimately, it depends on the game but:

1) Please check that your PC is seeing your Amplifier (the name of the amp should definitely display the model number of your amplifier in the in your Sound Devices) and you got it selected as default, and you are playing a game that use Surround Sound.
2) It if doesn't work then please change your sound settings on your amp to access "Direct Sound" or whatever its equivalent.
3) If that still doesn't work then change the game to something else such as Battlefield to see if it does output the surround sound by ensuring it is set to Surround Cinematic mode in the sound setting menu.
4) If that doesn't work then please double check you do not have any other sound program activated in your taskbar that could be acting as a filter such as SoundBlaster.
5) If that still doesn't work then change your HDMI cable. Swap it with the one you use on your DVD player, Xbox, Playstation, etc.
6) If that doesn't work, try updating your Sound Drivers or double check your Nvidia sound setting is set to HDMI.


If none of those work then, seriously, I am completely at lost to solve your problem because your setup sounds the same as mine and I am having no problem in that regard. I do hope the above suggestions work for you.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

If you have anything with HDMI out and that's your connection to your receiver, whether it's your video card or your motherboard, you have no use for a dedicated sound card.

 

[BIGWORM]

If you have anything with HDMI out and that's your connection to your receiver, whether it's your video card or your motherboard, you have no use for a dedicated sound card.

Are you talking literally, or figuratively, as far as sound quality? I'm currently using my Soundblaster X-FI which has SPDIF out, and I'm using a Turtle Beach PS4 DAC and outputting to some studio headphones and it's nice and clean.

 

[Boaty McBoatface]

That conclusion is irrational, because it has no technical justification. You are getting a lot of responses from people ignoring that you are trying to do bitstreaming over a digital connection. People are talking about the PC's DAC, which never comes into the picture, because the only conversion occurs in the receiver. If you are using bitstreaming, the PC should literally be doing nothing but transmitting an unaltered digital signal to your receiver. Although it is still possible for signal integrity to matter in these situations, it would be more likely to manifest as audio not working at all. It would not result in what you are describing.

The first suggestion I would give you is to try to verify that you getting a bitstreamed connection. If bitstreaming is working, the receiver should display the audio codec, e.g. DTS or Dolby. You should also be unable to control volume of the output via the PC.

This is all good advice, however the bold isn't true; unfortunately in windows you can still control the audio level even when outputting digital.

 

[Trojan X]

Ok. Here are settings in the image below. I think i did everything right:

You can see in the image that the sound is default to the HDMI that recognises the name of my Amp. My MPC is set to bitstream with no other filter activation; I didn't show but the mixing tab is set to no activated. My Power DVD is set to non-decode so it send the signal direct to my amp. After all that, I put on Man of Steel BluRay dishes in both my PS3 and PC and the sound still sound much better via my PS3. Also, the PS3 really use my subwoofer and all. Every sound crisper, sharper, more distinctive, more immersive and all.

I think i'm going to try swapping HDMI cables. If they no changes then I have no idea.

 

[shockdude]

Ok. Here are settings in the image below. I think i did everything right:

Looks like your GPU can deliver all the right digital formats to your receiver, so that's good.

I'm assuming your PS3 is set to bitstream; if it's not, set it to bitstream and try again.
When playing movies from your PS3 vs. your PC, do you see your receiver display the name of the audio codec being used? (e.g. Dolby, DTS)

Which version of Windows are you using?
Is your MPC-HC up to date? My copy of MPC-HC has an "Audio Renderer" option under "Internal Filters" which lets me enable bitstreaming. Also I use the x64 version of MPC-HC, not sure if that makes any difference.

I've never used PowerDVD, so you might need to google around for that. Or hopefully someone else can chime in.

 

[Skelter]

I do not believe you need a soundcard, especially with a 1080. In this case, my games come out in surround sound as long it provides it, and I have a 680. For example, in my case, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4 and Need for Speed The Run come out in full surround sound while certain other games I play comes out in Stereo because they don't have any surround option.

Ultimately, it depends on the game but:

1) Please check that your PC is seeing your Amplifier (the name of the amp should definitely display the model number of your amplifier in the in your Sound Devices) and you got it selected as default, and you are playing a game that use Surround Sound.
2) It if doesn't work then please change your sound settings on your amp to access "Direct Sound" or whatever its equivalent.
3) If that still doesn't work then change the game to something else such as Battlefield to see if it does output the surround sound by ensuring it is set to Surround Cinematic mode in the sound setting menu.
4) If that doesn't work then please double check you do not have any other sound program activated in your taskbar that could be acting as a filter such as SoundBlaster.
5) If that still doesn't work then change your HDMI cable. Swap it with the one you use on your DVD player, Xbox, Playstation, etc.
6) If that doesn't work, try updating your Sound Drivers or double check your Nvidia sound setting is set to HDMI.


If none of those work then, seriously, I am completely at lost to solve your problem because your setup sounds the same as mine and I am having no problem in that regard. I do hope the above suggestions work for you.

I'm so dumb. I remember the problem. I CAN'T get my receiver to display 4K video let alone 4K video at 60hz. Netflix, Xbox One S and other things are fine at 4K but not my PC.

My previous post I had my setup PC > TV > Receiver which is why it defaulted to stereo. Now I'm PC > AVR > TV.

I have a Vizio M60-C3 and my AVR is Denon S510bt. I had given up solving this problem and that is why I had settled for stereo but if there's anything you can do to shed some light, it'd be appreciated.

 

[Trojan X]

I'm so dumb. I remember the problem. I CAN'T get my receiver to display 4K video let alone 4K video at 60hz. Netflix, Xbox One S and other things are fine at 4K but not my PC.

My previous post I had my setup PC > TV > Receiver which is why it defaulted to stereo. Now I'm PC > AVR > TV.

I have a Vizio M60-C3 and my AVR is Denon S510bt. I had given up solving this problem and that is why I had settled for stereo but if there's anything you can do to shed some light, it'd be appreciated.

Sound silly but have you tried swapping the HDMI? Swap the Xbox One HDMI with your PC one and see if it makes a difference. Also, you need to make sure that your PC recognise your amplifier. Does it do that? Go through the list I made for you and let us know the results.


Ok. On my side, I seem to have some progress after making sure that ALL programs including Soundblaster are turned off. I put in this demo disc in my PC and PS3 and checked out the results:

From my findings, via the PS3 the sound quality is more slightly distinctive, warmer, and makes better use of the subwoofer. Via the PC, the sound was slightly louder, slightly noisier, and feature weaker use of the subwoofer. However, they are close but happily I can still use my PC for sound performances, none the less I'd still prefer going through my PS3.

Now I'm going to test strictly using movie files. Going to copy sound DTS and Dolby TRUEHD files to my PS3 HDD along with some movies and see how the quality stakes up.

 

[GrizzNKev]

Sound quality is my favorite pseudoscience

 

[KHarvey16]

Sound silly but have you tried swapping the HDMI? Swap the Xbox One HDMI with your PC one and see if it makes a difference. Also, you need to make sure that your PC recognise your amplifier. Does it do that? Go through the list I made for you and let us know the results.


Ok. On my side, I seem to have some progress after making sure that ALL programs including Soundblaster are turned off. I put in this demo disc in my PC and PS3 and checked out the results:

From my findings, via the PS3 the sound quality is more slightly distinctive, warmer, and makes better use of the subwoofer. Via the PC, the sound was slightly louder, slightly noisier, and feature weaker use of the subwoofer. However, they are close but happily I can still use my PC for sound performances, none the less I'd still prefer going through my PS3.

Now I'm going to test strictly using movie files. Going to copy sound DTS and Dolby TRUEHD files to my PS3 HDD along with some movies and see how the quality stakes up.

I know others have said this, but unless something is not properly configured an audible difference doesn't make sense. It is the same exact stream of 1's and 0's going to the exact same DAC.

 

[Trojan X]

I know others have said this, but unless something is not properly configured an audible difference doesn't make sense. It is the same exact stream of 1's and 0's going to the exact same DAC.

I know. This is what completely baffles me the most. It makes no sense but I can definitely tell the difference.

I checked the PS3 setting and the sound output is set to Bitstream and the volume assigned as +1. I don't get it.

 

[shockdude]

I know. This is what completely baffles me the most. It makes no sense but I can definitely tell the difference.

I checked the PS3 setting and the sound output is set to Bitstream and the volume assigned as +1. I don't get it.

Isn't the volume supposed to be set to +0? You're gonna clip loud noises otherwise.
Also dynamic range control should be disabled, but iirc that doesn't affect bitstreaming.

Yeah the discrepancy between your PC and your PS3 is really weird. The fact that your PC is louder than your PS3 tells me that something is definitely up.

Is there a way to force WASAPI/Exclusive mode? This will bypass Windows & DirectSound and guarantee bitstreaming.

And yeah disable all sound enhancements, Soundblaster or otherwise.

 

[Trojan X]

Isn't the volume supposed to be set to +0? You're gonna clip loud noises otherwise.
Also dynamic range control should be disabled, but iirc that doesn't affect bitstreaming.

Yeah the discrepancy between your PC and your PS3 is really weird. The fact that your PC is louder than your PS3 tells me that something is definitely up.

Is there a way to force WASAPI/Exclusive mode? This will bypass Windows & DirectSound and guarantee bitstreaming.

And yeah disable all sound enhancements, Soundblaster or otherwise.

The PS3 discrepancy is wild. The reason why it's +1 on the Volume Control is because I found the sound to be too low. Luckily, no clipping occurs.

My OS is Windows 7.

Ok. I updated my MPC to 1.7.10, previously it was 1.7.7. Thanks to this, everything sound MUCH better due to Audio Rendering option which I activated Exclusive Mode and Allow Bitstreaming! Finally, my subwoofer is being kicked around in a similar way to how my PS3 kicks it. I still think the mid-range sound is more distinctive when played via my PS3 but my PC is now capable of showcasing HD sound! Finally... frigging hell!

I'm going to conduct some more testing this week to check the quality further but so far, the sound is very crisp, distinctive and the subwoofer hits. Just the mid-range (which my speakers should be a winner in showcasing) that I am concerned about so I'll do some more testing and feedback here my finding.

Thank you, everyone. So far, it looks like I won't need another external sound card after all but I will check everything by conducting more tests.

 

[Trojan X]

... My previous post I had my setup PC > TV > Receiver which is why it defaulted to stereo. Now I'm PC > AVR > TV. ...

Question - when you connect the HDMI from your PC to your Amplifier, does your PC recognise the model number of your Amplifier via your Screen Resolution and Nvidia options? This is vital because if your PC does not pick up your amplifier in the first place then it probably won't provide you with the necessary 4K resolutions thus most likely defaulting to 1080p.

 

[tokkun]

This is all good advice, however the bold isn't true; unfortunately in windows you can still control the audio level even when outputting digital.

Outputting digital is not synonymous with bitstreaming. Bitstreaming means the audio never gets decoded in the PC, so it cannot apply effects (including volume control).

It is possible for a PC to output digital without doing bitstreaming. What happens is
1. PC decodes / decompresses the audio.
2. PC applies whatever effects to the decded stream. e.g. volume changes, equalizer, channel mixing.
3. (Optional) PC recompresses the audio. Alternatively it may just leave the audio in uncompressed PCM.
4. PC outputs the audio data over a digital connection.

With bitstreaming you would skip steps 1-3.

 

[Trojan X]

This is all good advice, however the bold isn't true; unfortunately in windows you can still control the audio level even when outputting digital.

Outputting digital is not synonymous with bitstreaming. Bitstreaming means the audio never gets decoded in the PC, so it cannot apply effects (including volume control).

It is possible for a PC to output digital without doing bitstreaming. What happens is
1. PC decodes / decompresses the audio.
2. PC applies whatever effects to the decded stream. e.g. volume changes, equalizer, channel mixing.
3. (Optional) PC recompresses the audio. Alternatively it may just leave the audio in uncompressed PCM.
4. PC outputs the audio data over a digital connection.

With bitstreaming you would skip steps 1-3.

This is 100% true. If you are sending a true bit-streaming signal then it cannot be adjusted/manipulated by the PC. I just finished watching Dawn of the Planet of the Apes just a few moments ago (love that movie) and with a clean bit-streaming signal, the only way I was able to adjust the volume is via my Amplifier. Optical signal is actually compressed sound because an optical cable doesn't provide enough bandwidth to deliver uncompressed sound signal, which is why you cannot hear DTS MA nor Dolby TRUEHD/ATMOS via that delivery method.

If anyone is still able to adjust the volume via their PC then that means their PC is not sending out a true bit-streaming signal. In fact, do not be surprised to find the signal is decoded, compressed by the PC and then send out via the Optical/HDMI as a compressed audio signal. If that happen, then I strongly believe that the sound quality will not be prestige as a true bit-stream signal (I believe this is what happened to me). Yes, perhaps your amplifier might still say DTS MA or Dolby TrueHD when playing, but in reality, you are not really receiving/sending a true DTS MA or Dolby TrueHD quality signal. The best way to really test to hear the difference is to do what I did, connect your BluRay Player/PS3 directly to the Amplifer and listen to the difference yourself. It should be clear-cut.

 

[Skelter]

Sound silly but have you tried swapping the HDMI? Swap the Xbox One HDMI with your PC one and see if it makes a difference. Also, you need to make sure that your PC recognize your amplifier. Does it do that? Go through the list I made for you and let us know the results.

Question - when you connect the HDMI from your PC to your Amplifier, does your PC recognize the model number of your Amplifier via your Screen Resolution and Nvidia options? This is vital because if your PC does not pick up your amplifier in the first place then it probably won't provide you with the necessary 4K resolutions thus most likely defaulting to 1080p.

I have tried switching HDMI cables, nothing. I have tried different ports but only ports 3-5 on my receiver allow for 4K/60...which is what I am trying to solve. I went through your list and well, nothing.

Here is Nvidia Control Panel detecting my receiver too.

 

[Trojan X]

I have tried switching HDMI cables, nothing. I have tried different ports but only ports 3-5 on my receiver allow for 4K/60...which is what I am trying to solve. I went through your list and well, nothing.




Here is Nvidia Control Panel detecting my receiver too.

From that image, it looks like your PC recgonises that your amp is capable of pumping out HD quality sound, which is great. Now the question remain is whether it actually pumps out surround sound and display a 4K display.

Let's sort out the sound first. What programs do you use to play all your movies? Forget games for now for once you know that it can play the movies then you know for sure that games will work in surround sound providing the sound is set correctly to the default.

Like what I did, show us your sound settings in your sound devices, the tabs of each program, show us the settings of the players you use. While you at it, also show us what shows up when you are in the Screen Resolution menu, and let us know what resolutions you adjust to when you pull down the resolution menu. Lastly, when you click on Advanced Settings within the screen resolution menu, click on the monitor tab and let us know what it shows together with the Screen Refresh Rate, Colors, etc.

Lastly, I just want to re-confirm from you that the HDMI is the ONLY cable that connects from your PC to your Amplifier and another HDMI connects from your Amplifier to your 4K TV.

 

[Skelter]

From that image, it looks like your PC recognizes that your amp is capable of pumping out HD quality sound, which is great. Now the question remain is whether it actually pumps out surround sound and display a 4K display.

Let's sort out the sound first. What programs do you use to play all your movies? Forget games for now for once you know that it can play the movies then you know for sure that games will work in surround sound providing the sound is set correctly to the default.

I don't play movies on my PC. I just use my Xbox One S for UHD bluray playback. Only thing I can use for testing out the sound are games.

Like what I did, show us your sound settings in your sound devices, the tabs of each program, show us the settings of the players you use. While you at it, also show us what shows up when you are in the Screen Resolution menu, and let us know what resolutions you adjust to when you pull down the resolution menu. Lastly, when you click on Advanced Settings within the screen resolution menu, click on the monitor tab and let us know what it shows together with the Screen Refresh Rate, Colors, etc.

Here's my TV in Nvidia Control Panel. You can see the resolution I'm trying to use. It's even native but yet, nothing. I have no idea what gives. Again, I have tried different HDMI cables. I have been able to game just fine at 4K/60 when my PC is connected directly from PC to TV via HDMI but NOT PC to AVR via HDMI.

Here you can see though that World of Warcraft does detect it. It sounds incredible too.

Lastly, I just want to re-confirm from you that the HDMI is the ONLY cable that connects from your PC to your Amplifier and another HDMI connects from your Amplifier to your 4K TV.

Yes, one cable from my GPU to the AVR and then one from the AVR to the tv.

 

[Trojan X]

I don't play movies on my PC. I just use my Xbox One S for UHD bluray playback. Only thing I can use for testing out the sound are games.

I know you don't but just do it to make sure your PC can output DTS-HD and Dolby TrueHD from your PC to Amplifier. Your game cannot confirm that fully. Once you know it works then the games should automatically work. If you cannot nail that down then you have a problem which we must resolve. My advice is for you to test both Blu-Ray disc and a movie/clip file that plays either Dolby TrueHD or DTS HD Master Audio. In fact, in case you don't know, get the Dolby and DTS demo files here: http://www.demo-world.eu/2d-demo-trailers-hd/

Here's my TV in Nvidia Control Panel. You can see the resolution I'm trying to use. It's even native but yet, nothing. I have no idea what gives. Again, I have tried different HDMI cables. I have been able to game just fine at 4K/60 when my PC is connected directly from PC to TV via HDMI but NOT PC to AVR via HDMI.

Yes, that is completely weird. I have been thinking about what could be the problem but nothing comes to my mind except for one thing.... the amplifier itself.

Have you updated the Amplifier's firmware to it's latest release? I believe that will solve the problem. From my quick research, updating the amplifier's firmware will take awhile (probably 30mins) but most people that done it was able to display everything at 4k 60hz on their PC and play at 4K on their Xbox One when played directly into the Amplifier.

If your Amp firmware is not the latest one, please go and update the firmware first then when that is done, please go and test out the 4K video via your PC. When the video signal is working, go and do the movie surround test that I told you about above. When all that is working then you're good to go!

 

[Skelter]

I know you don't but just do it to make sure your PC can output DTS-HD and Dolby TrueHD from your PC to Amplifier. Your game cannot confirm that fully. Once you know it works then the games should automatically work. If you cannot nail that down then you have a problem which we must resolve. My advice is for you to test both Blu-Ray disc and a movie/clip file that plays either Dolby TrueHD or DTS HD Master Audio. In fact, in case you don't know, get the Dolby and DTS demo files here: http://www.demo-world.eu/2d-demo-trailers-hd/

Okay, I do not have a way to play a bluray disc on my PC. I did download two demo files one in DTS-HD MA 5.1 and another in Dolby TrueHD 5.1.

These are the two files I downloaded. Dolby True HD 5.1 and DTS-HD MA 5.1. I don't know if it makes any difference in terms of helping to find the solution. I used VLC media player to play the files.

Yes, that is completely weird. I have been thinking about what could be the problem but nothing comes to my mind except for one thing.... the amplifier itself.

Have you updated the Amplifier's firmware to it's latest release? I believe that will solve the problem. From my quick research, updating the amplifier's firmware will take awhile (probably 30mins) but most people that done it was able to display everything at 4k 60hz on their PC and play at 4K on their Xbox One when played directly into the Amplifier.

If your Amp firmware is not the latest one, please go and update the firmware first then when that is done, please go and test out the 4K video via your PC. When the video signal is working, go and do the movie surround test that I told you about above. When all that is working then you're good to go!

My AVR's just had an update released back in September. I updated then. Lack of 4K/60 playback has been before and after updating my firmware.

 

[Trojan X]

Okay, I do not have a way to play a bluray disc on my PC. I did download two demo files one in DTS-HD MA 5.1 and another in Dolby TrueHD 5.1.

These are the two files I downloaded. Dolby True HD 5.1 and DTS-HD MA 5.1. I don't know if it makes any difference in terms of helping to find the solution. I used VLC media player to play the files.



My AVR's just had an update released back in September. I updated then. Lack of 4K/60 playback has been before and after updating my firmware.

What happened when you played the files? Did you get full surround sound? Use the latest MPC player instead of VLC as VLC is known to not always being true. When you get the latest MPC player, please set the mode to bitstream and exclusive. Remember the point is to see if the surround fully works or not as that was one of your issues. Once that works then we know for sure that anything else that doesn't work in respect to your games is down strictly to your PC and nothing else, most likely restricting the cause to an interfering program such as a filter activation, etc. Btw - Nothing came up via those urls.

What firmware number are you using now? If you are using the latest firmware then honestly, I am at a lost in respect to getting your PC to pump out 4K with your amp. I am also perplexed for, as you said, your Xbox pumps out 4K when going through your Amp, meaning it utilise the same HDMI cable that goes from your Amp to your TV. I assume you also are using the latest Nvidia drivers?

 

[Skelter]

What happened when you played the files? Did you get full surround sound? Use the latest MPC player instead of VLC as VLC is known to not always being true. When you get the latest MPC player, please set the mode to bitstream and exclusive. Remember the point is to see if the surround fully works or not as that was one of your issues. Once that works then we know for sure that anything else that doesn't work in respect to your games is down strictly to your PC and nothing else, most likely restricting the cause to an interfering program such as a filter activation, etc. Btw - Nothing came up via those urls.

I did get full surround but to be sure I set MPC to bitstream and exclusive. I'm out of my element here so if I did something wrong let me know. Still, after turning on those options the demos still worked fine and I could hear sound coming through each channel.

As for the links it was just a Dolby TrueHD sports demo and a DTS-HD terminator 2 demo.

What firmware number are you using now? If you are using the latest firmware then honestly, I am at a lost in respect to getting your PC to pump out 4K with your amp. I am also perplexed for, as you said, your Xbox pumps out 4K when going through your Amp, meaning it utilise the same HDMI cable that goes from your Amp to your TV. I assume you also are using the latest Nvidia drivers?

My receiver displays the exact firmware shown here.

Nvidia driver is 375.63


EDIT: Man, I'm sorry about hijacking your thread.

 

[Trojan X]

I did get full surround but to be sure I set MPC to bitstream and exclusive. I'm out of my element here so if I did something wrong let me know. Still, after turning on those options the demos still worked fine and I could hear sound coming through each channel.

Great! That means your Surround Sound issue with your PC is solved. Now, in regards to Surround Sound with games, it all depends on what game. Important note to remember:

Not all games allow you to play digital Surround Sound video your HDMI. Many of them utilise analogue surround sound or plain Stereo only.

This means, in order to hear surround sound, the back of your PC needs to have something like this which are, excluding the Optical cable output, Analogue sound outputs:

The answer to your whole Surround Sound issue for gaming then is that you need to check your games and take advantage of your sound analogue outputs if you have them available. Note that if you do select Analogue sound output then you'll have to hook up your HDMI directly to your TV for I'd imagine your Amplifier will not allow you to select a different sound source for a video feed. E.g. You cannot select HDMI for video then select Analogue Audio 2 for Sound input.

Battlefield 3 and onwards support full surround sound via HDMI, to which I can 100% confirm as I have Battlefield 3 and 4. Need for Speed The Run also contains Surround Sound via HDMI. You need to check your games.

As for the links it was just a Dolby TrueHD sports demo and a DTS-HD terminator 2 demo.

Good. I personal wouldn't use those ones but it doesn't matter for preference, in this case, is irrelevant. The point was to check if your PC can output surround sound fully and it does that.

My receiver displays the exact firmware shown here.

Nvidia driver is 375.63


EDIT: Man, I'm sorry about hijacking your thread.

Don't worry about the hijacking as this thread is open for everyone who is experiencing issues, want to improve their sound setup, or anything audio related be it games or movies via whatever involving their Amplifier/home theatre.

Since you are using the latest drivers then the next course of actions are the following:

1) Check to see if you have any other programs running in the background that might be highjacking your signal to change it to something else (probably unlikely).

2) Make sure that your visual setting is correct to the setting acceptable to both your amplifier and TV. For example:

I see your dynamic range is set to Limited and your Output Color Depth is 8pc. Isn't your receiver and TV capable of more? Adjust these to fit the same acceptable specs of your Amp and TV and see what happens.


3) Go to your Amplifiers main menu and double check for any Video options, there might be something you've missed (probably unlikely). I'm sure you are using the correct port.

4) Switch onto 4K Native then turn off and on your TV. Make sure it is on the same channel that is accepting the signal of your amp.


What is the maximum resolution your amp to tv accepts from your PC? 1080p?

 

[Filth]

Guys i have a question. I know absoluutly nothing about sound and whats good whats not and so on. Im going to start easy and dabble in my pc before i go to my tv. My pc i use astro a50 headset. Its connected through usb and thats it. They sound good to me but if i want a beter sound expirience do i invest in a better headset or go sound card ?

 

[shockdude]

Great! That means your Surround Sound issue with your PC is solved. Now, in regards to Surround Sound with games, it all depends on what game. Important note to remember:

Not all games allow you to play digital Surround Sound video your HDMI. Many of them utilise analogue surround sound or plain Stereo only.

This means, in order to hear surround sound, the back of your PC needs to have something like this which are, excluding the Optical cable output, Analogue sound outputs:

The answer to your whole Surround Sound issue for gaming then is that you need to check your games and take advantage of your sound analogue outputs if you have them available. Note that if you do select Analogue sound output then you'll have to hook up your HDMI directly to your TV for I'd imagine your Amplifier will not allow you to select a different sound source for a video feed. E.g. You cannot select HDMI for video then select Analogue Audio 2 for Sound input.

Battlefield 3 and onwards support full surround sound via HDMI, to which I can 100% confirm as I have Battlefield 3 and 4. Need for Speed The Run also contains Surround Sound via HDMI. You need to check your games.

Are you sure about that? Pretty sure all video games that support surround sound can and do output multi-channel over HDMI, so long as the receiver supports multi-channel PCM over HDMI. Analog audio out shouldn't be necessary.

2) Make sure that your visual setting is correct to the setting acceptable to both your amplifier and TV. For example:

I see your dynamic range is set to Limited and your Output Color Depth is 8pc. Isn't your receiver and TV capable of more? Adjust these to fit the same acceptable specs of your Amp and TV and see what happens.

Limited dynamic range and 8-bit color is fine. Full dynamic range requires some fiddling on the TV end and the benefit isn't much.

That being said, if you can get your PC to output HDR and you have some games that support HDR, you should try to get that working because HDR is really cool.

3) Go to your Amplifiers main menu and double check for any Video options, there might be something you've missed (probably unlikely). I'm sure you are using the correct port.

4) Switch onto 4K Native then turn off and on your TV. Make sure it is on the same channel that is accepting the signal of your amp.

What is the maximum resolution your amp to tv accepts from your PC? 1080p?

This is good advice. There honestly shouldn't be any good reason why your amp can't pass a 4K60 signal from your PC to your TV.
That being said, maybe your AVR doesn't support 4K60 with RGB? Change the Output color format to something else like 4:2:2 or 4:2:0 and see what happens.

Guys i have a question. I know absoluutly nothing about sound and whats good whats not and so on. Im going to start easy and dabble in my pc before i go to my tv. My pc i use astro a50 headset. Its connected through usb and thats it. They sound good to me but if i want a beter sound expirience do i invest in a better headset or go sound card ?

You're gonna need both. I'm not too familiar with the hardware side of things (just the software), but any combination of high-quality headphones, clip-on microphone, and external headphone DAC should be good.
There are a couple other threads on GAF dedicated to headphones and audio hardware, do a search and you should be able to find it.

 

[Finaika]

Are you sure about that? Pretty sure all video games that support surround sound can and do output multi-channel over HDMI, so long as the receiver supports multi-channel PCM over HDMI. Analog audio out shouldn't be necessary.

Yup.

 

[Trojan X]

Guys i have a question. I know absoluutly nothing about sound and whats good whats not and so on. Im going to start easy and dabble in my pc before i go to my tv. My pc i use astro a50 headset. Its connected through usb and thats it. They sound good to me but if i want a beter sound expirience do i invest in a better headset or go sound card ?

Welcome! Ok. I'm not 100% sure what you are asking so I'll tackle from two thoughts, just improving your headset experience or trying to get the best sound experience from your PC.

Want better headset experience - Whether you buy a sound card or use a USB device, everything depends on the quality of the headphones and the unit/device use to decode the sound. I never sampled Astro A50 headset but the quality of the sound whether via USB or Sound Card all entirely depend on the quality of the device hardware. I.e. A sound card does not get a free pass for providing a superior experience. So the best thing for you to do is to check out other headsets out there by going to your Hi-Fi or equivalent store then decide whether it's best for you to stick or go for an upgrade.


Want better sound experience The best way to answer that question is for you to sample what real HD sound sounds like first and ask yourself how far you want to go in quality and extending the experience to TV/movies. I strongly believe you know how far you want to go when you have sample true HD quality surround sound.

Do you have access to an awesome Home Theater HD Surround testing room? They are usually accessible at Hi-Fi Home Theaters stores. Of course, look for the ones that gloat about THX, Dolby TrueHD and DTS Master Audio sound. Avoid all those that uses those "all-in-one" Bose setup for those are all boom-boom muddy subwoofer noise and tiny speakers with no mid-range sound quality. Remember, amazing sound does NOT cause headaches, which is notorious with Bose sound systems (From experience, Bose are often noisy):

This is a typical Bose setup, the ones you want to avoid despite how costly they are. If a staff say this is the best, just say to yourself "yeah right" and walk away.


My premium 7.1 speakers, JAMO, together with my old Pioneer LX71 currently looks like this setup (I LOVE JAMO!! The mid-range, warmth and distinctive sharp and stable low frequency sound is incredible):

Good luck hunting. Try to find a sound testing/experience room that looks more like this along with a good screen (they normally use a projector screen):

When you've done that, you'll have a better idea on whether you want a full surround sound system or better headphones. If you decide that you want a good surround sound system then that depending on your CPU setup, you may not need to buy a sound card but you do need to buy an Amplifier and all the other usual juice (speakers, cables, decide arrangement, decide on your budget, etc).

Whether you decide to go for a home theatre setup or some kickass headphones, whatever you decide, you'll know for sure what you want to do once you've heard from the best first. Whatever you decide, come back here so we can all figure out your best next steps.

 

[Trojan X]

Are you sure about that? Pretty sure all video games that support surround sound can and do output multi-channel over HDMI, so long as the receiver supports multi-channel PCM over HDMI. Analog audio out shouldn't be necessary.

I'm 100% sure. Not all games are fully surround sound via HDMI. I wish that is not the game but not all games are. From experience, AAA games seem to use surround via HDMI very well but not every single game. Hopefully, games from last year and onwards are making use of it together with analogue as an option but, please, don't quote me on that.

 

[Filth]

Welcome! Ok. I'm not 100% sure what you are asking so I'll tackle from two thoughts, just improving your headset experience or trying to get the best sound experience from your PC.

yeah id say with my pc i strictly use a headset and if a sound card would improve on that experience what would you recommend?. i am financially not ready to dabble with receivers and surround sound systems just yet.

 

[Trojan X]

yeah id say with my pc i strictly use a headset and if a sound card would improve on that experience what would you recommend?. i am financially not ready to dabble with receivers and surround sound systems just yet.

Understood. There is not a true clear-cut answer to your question because it depends on some factors. Ultimately, there will be no difference or improvement between USB and a SoundCard sound device. What will determine the difference is the quality level (manufacturer) of both devices but on a basic level, getting a soundcard does not mean an automatic free pass to provide greater quality over a USB headphone device and vice versa. It's not like the difference between an Optical Cable and HDMI 1.4 (one can only provide compressed sound while the other can provide uncompressed and to more channels).

Your headphone provide 7.1 surround sound. For headphones, if I wanted the surround sound experience then I'll stick to USB because they are easier to attain. In fact, if you purchased a sound card, I don't think you can get a really good headphone to make use of it in the same manner. However, if you wanted the best Stereo experience then that's a different story as, usually, the best stereo headphones are mostly available in analogue. This means you need to think about what would give you the cleanest sound possible so you can make use of the best quality headphones. This could be all overkill though as it ultimately depends on what you are using the headphones for and how much you are willing to spend.

So, if you want to go deeper then I have some questions:

1) What do you want the use the headphones for?
2) Will you ever consider going speakers route?
3) Is Surround Sound headphone a must for you or not?


When you have figured out the above, the best thing to do from there is to go to your local stores and listen to the best headphone they provide. Use that as your benchmark for you need to know what the best sound like/. Your experience from listening to the best should help you to decide on whether to purchase another device or stick to what you have.

 

[Filth]

1) What do you want the use the headphones for?
2) Will you ever consider going speakers route?
3) Is Surround Sound headphone a must for you or not?

id say gaming / movies / im not sure. from using these headphones to using headphones in the past it doesn't seem that much different to me.

 

[Trojan X]

id say gaming / movies / im not sure. from using these headphones to using headphones in the past it doesn't seem that much different to me.

Please elaborate.

 

[Filth]

Please elaborate.

ive always just plugged headphones into my usb. never listened to anything for example dolby, dts. so i havent been blown away from sound clarity ever.