Yeah it could actually read as satire.
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AusPoliGAF |OT| Boats? What Boats?
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Yeah it could actually read as satire.
Judging from the last few years of politics, not long.
I thought it was satire until I saw the source. Given their history I think it is just the most oblivious propaganda I have seen in a while.
In other happy news: http://www.theage.com.au/federal-po...ers-writes-pynes-reviewer-20140202-31v2r.html
How can they be so transparent and still not face massive consequences?
In other happy news: http://www.theage.com.au/federal-po...ers-writes-pynes-reviewer-20140202-31v2r.html
How can they be so transparent and still not face massive consequences?
bobnowhere
Member
Never hold a review/commission/investigation where the outcome is not already known!
I'm still surprised the allegations of the three people dying after being forced back to Indonesia hasn't hit big. I can imagine the ABC being a little gunshy at the moment but imagine if it was Labor who sent them back. Morrison and Abbott would be jumping up and down like hyperactive 3 year olds screaming boats, labor's fault and dead refugees at the top of their lungs.
Right now the political message is completely controlled by the LNP, everyone else is ignored. I didn't have high hopes for Shorten, they are even lower now. He pops up every few days, mumbles some nonsense then crawls back down his hole. Imagine if Albo would've won, he's be punching on with every Tory he could find.
Yeah, not sure Albo would have been better, but Shorten has been Mr Invisible.
Why say anything and potentially dirty yourself when your opponents are more than happy to repeatedly punch themselves in the face?
Because the vast masses haven't seen that, and think things are peachy. The job of an opposition party is to hold the government of the day accountable.
I'm sure the only thing the "average punter" would get angry about is the boat. They really couldn't give a shit about the three people that died, if anything they'd probably be pissed off they didn't just shoot them all dead instead. :/
I've seen a lot of comments online that literally say "I don't give a crap how you do it, just do it". That's the sort of lunacy we're dealing with.
As someone who is going be a primary school teacher.. you have no fucking idea how much this shit pisses me off.
Time to make a rage status on FB about it meh.
shanshan310
Member
The LNP did have Murdoch on board though...
bobnowhere
Member
The attack Sharman Stone is targeting the LNP with is getting pretty amazing!
Evil Leftie Socialist News Source
I'm sure Labor is loving it, they don't have to say it's a thinly veiled attack on unions, the LNP is doing it for them!
Evil Leftie Socialist News Source
I'm sure Labor is loving it, they don't have to say it's a thinly veiled attack on unions, the LNP is doing it for them!
option a) regrouping and figuring out policy
option b) bludging
option c) they're now the LNP also
From a stategic standpoint, since it's so damn hard to dislodge a first term government and especially given the huge swing required, Labor should be aiming to stop Abbott at the end of his second term.
From the standpoint of the ALP, the economy is about to go into the shitter, we've got a weakening dollar which would normally be fantastic for the economy but all our major manufacturing has gone or is going and the weakening dollar won't do anything to help now. In fact it's going to make us a lot worse off because we have nothing to sell except for raw materials such as ore which is slowing down. Not to mention the weakening dollar will make everything significantly more expensive.
So it follows that people will be hurting in a few years regardless of what Abbott does which means the ALP can focus that pain towards the government and dislodge them from office.
Edit: Dollar jumped back up to 89c suddenly. The fuck happened? Ugh. Forex markets make my economically ignorant head hurt.
A
A More Normal Bird
Unconfirmed Member
Well, a decent number of them had to find new jobs. Maybe the others saw what life was like for them outside of Parliament and decided to take a break.
I wouldn't be surprised if many in the ALP feel they can win the next election. It's early days but things couldn't have gone much better for them so far. If the Liberals start cutting deep in the next few budgets and the economy worsens the narrative is clear as day.
Regarding the dollar, it's pretty much all about perceptions and expectations. I don't think people were expecting an interest rate cut, but in past statements Stevens made mention of the high dollar and signalled intent to do something about it. This time around it was apparently low enough to go without mentioning, so everyone gets the idea that they're not going to try and push it lower in the near future, so it goes back up.
Also, apologies for not responding to your last post on the ABC/media thing. My connection is pretty shoddy atm so the reply I was writing took a one way trip into the unknown.
Turnbull and Bishop have both come out swinging against the ABC today. The ABC has delivered a rather wimpish explanation of the burnt hands story. This semi back down is infuriating as it's taking the debate away from the real story, did the Navy mistreat asylum seekers? We don't know because of the militarisation of our Northern sea and the unnecessary escalation of secrecy. Then there's the loss of even more political capital with Indonesia. Whether the abuses happened or not, the fact is this was reported to Indonesians. Who, thanks to an overtly secret and arrogant Aus goverment attitude, think our side of the story is full of shit.
To get around this inflammatory story and it's unfortunate ramifications Abbott's moved to his opposition style attack mode and gone for Auntie's jugular. Considering the amount of trust Australian's have for the ABC and the very low popularity polling Abbott has, this is a huge risk and very likely to back fire twice. Once for attacking what is considered sacred by the vast majority of Australian's, the ABC and twice if these asylum seeker abuse allegations turn out to be true.
To get around this inflammatory story and it's unfortunate ramifications Abbott's moved to his opposition style attack mode and gone for Auntie's jugular. Considering the amount of trust Australian's have for the ABC and the very low popularity polling Abbott has, this is a huge risk and very likely to back fire twice. Once for attacking what is considered sacred by the vast majority of Australian's, the ABC and twice if these asylum seeker abuse allegations turn out to be true.
Interesting reading: http://www.abc.net.au/news/interactives/tables/aec-political-donations-table/
But unions donating is skewing politics, sure. Not sure about Ingham and the Hotels Assoc Federal Office, clever to make sure your arse is covered no matter who wins, I guess.
Those of 150k and up:
But unions donating is skewing politics, sure. Not sure about Ingham and the Hotels Assoc Federal Office, clever to make sure your arse is covered no matter who wins, I guess.
Love how Westfields gave a smiiiidge more to ALP than LIB, that's so petty
Missed that one, yeah. Seems odd.
You're not wrong, they are alienating some of the swing vote. From where I see it, if the ALP were in a good position in terms of their team, their presentation with a capable and charismatic leader with the ability to inspire people, they WOULD be able to win the next election. Hell I'd say that if the reverse is true, we've lacked a truly charismatic PM since Keating.
The problem is of course, the ALP is a complete and utter mess. I know a few people in the party who are making an incredibly strong push for democratising and modernising the party. If they succeed, I think they'll force the Liberals to do the same if they ever want to win an election ever again. Let's not forget that the major reason for the change in government were the swing voters siding with the Liberals because the ALP was in such a state.
That's why I thought the ALP basically need to replace their current crop of MPs except all the junior ones, pick up a few good new candidates at the next election, and make a push towards government in 2019 at the end of their second term.
Elaugaufein
Member
The ALP is in an uncomfortable position, and has been since the Greens essentially carved of the left edge of their vote. Part of the party wants nothing to do with the Greens, part of it would jump ship if things got pushed to hard, and part of it is pragmatic enough to realize that since the Greens have 5-10% of their vote they aren't likely to be able to govern with anything short of landslide victories without their association. With the membership vote making it clear that the membership certainly leans more left than the party politic, but with the catch of the Tasmanian election, I suspect the ALPs problem is figuring out what their message is.
They've been pretty much silent even on things that they'd usually only need to say out of formality (like that while corruption in the union movement is terrible and needs to be rooted out unions do a great deal of good for their members (and the workforce in general , even non-union wages are higher when strong unions exist)).
Charisma can be deeply polarizing: Keating was absolutely loathed by a great many conservatives despite that from what I can tell he didn't do anything more classically Left than his predecessors. It can also be dangerous in forming a cult of personality that can't see the inevitable coming.
Clive Palmer donated $50,000 to the LNP
EDIT: Oh that was before he wandered off to form a party
roosters93
Member
bobnowhere
Member
I'd so watch Late Pyne.
Newman having a good crack at the legal system.
http://m.couriermail.com.au/news/qu...nal-gang-machine/story-fnihsrf2-1226819588317
http://m.couriermail.com.au/news/qu...nal-gang-machine/story-fnihsrf2-1226819588317
Australia is apparently the most environmentally unfriendly country in the world.
The fact that this government is so anti-intellectual (read: anti-elitist, anti-technocratic, etc) is, in my opinion, its best aspect.
The fact that this government is so anti-intellectual (read: anti-elitist, anti-technocratic, etc) is, in my opinion, its best aspect.
Heh.
boom. lol.
Elaugaufein
Member
You're going to have a hard time convincing me that the Coalition which consists largely of White Anglo-Saxon males who have had (expensive) private school educations, who are upper middle class at worst and who regularly get more support from (and give more support to) the corporate sector than their opposition are anti-elitist in any meaningful sense of the world. They'll take an expert who agrees with them over someone without qualifications who doesn't, their anti-elitism only manifests in rejecting expert opinion when it disagrees with their economic, social or religious desires.
There is an element of truth to what you say, and there's no use trying to deny it but it goes both ways.
The left seem so damn eager to outsource their decision making to experts you end up getting this culture of: 'We know what's best for you on any given issue and because we're 'the experts' we are going to completely ignore your desires and dreams because you don't know shit.'
Even if the Science says that if we don't paint our houses yellow the world is going to explode, we, as sovereigns of the land get to make the choice as to whether we do it or not. Science is apolitical, science is science. The politics should be focused on what the appropriate response or adjustment should be and THAT decision should always be made by the people who it affects....the public at large.
That's what I was talking about and it's refreshing to see a government abolish all these quangos we've established in the name of democracy. I understand that to some it might be seen as an impartial committee looking after the best interests the country but to me it's just undemocratic.
For what it's worth, I think Barnett's policy of killing the sharks is pure lunacy but that's not the point. That's a choice for the people of WA to make, not me.
Elaugaufein
Member
I'm not sure how a duly elected government setting up expert panels to oversee an area is any less democratic than a duly elected government deciding to do anything else. The justification for either of these things is that it is the will of the people via their representatives. The people aren't making either the decisions made by the panel or their representatives.
And I don't think upholding majority ignorance over minority knowledge is worthy of the adulation it is sometimes given. I'd rather have 1 Architect than 2 Lawyers designing my house.
Public decision making on things like painting our houses yellow starting tomorrow or the world explodes in 80 years is only a sensible decision if the public can be fully made aware of the facts and there are frequently entrenched interests (like 50 year old sellers of green housing paint) who will do their level best to make sure that not only does this not happen but that people are convinced that its a conspiracy by people wanting to sell yellow paint which by the way is known to cause severe moral decay in children.
Elaugaufein
Member
I think he's said before he supports a method for Recall, which would be sufficient in this context.
My problem with delegation to a technocrat is that unlike the elected representative, he doesn't even need a passing glance towards his constituency while the elected representative knows his job is always on the line should he piss people off. Meaning that he can just exercise power with impunity, which can be problematic.
And yeah, I've always argued for more local grassroots power as opposed to big hulking political machines. If I could do one or two things to politics in Australia I'd want recall elections and open primaries.
And yeah, I've always argued for more local grassroots power as opposed to big hulking political machines. If I could do one or two things to politics in Australia I'd want recall elections and open primaries.
Elaugaufein
Member
I think a certain distance is a positive thing in many cases. I wouldn't want Judges or Prosecutors to be elected for example (there's a disturbing correlation between Election Years and what can charitably be described as enthusiastic oversights in the pursuit of justice in the US).
Likewise I wouldn't want recall elections to be instant (as it would discourages politicians from making long term beneficial choices instead of short term ones and be subject to kneejerk reactions), though I'm generally in support of the concept. Maybe some sort of 2 step process, where there needs to be a majority petition , a cooling off period and then a full recall election (which is either compulsory or has some other mechanism to prevent hijacking by special interest groups).
And the elected representative's job being on the line encourages short-term thinking.
I also find that our current culture of "What do those experts know?" is ignoring one of our primary civic duties to be properly informed participants in government. The system you're advocating just doesn't hold up when applied to human brains.
I don't agree with the Athenian definition of democracy that you propose. The idea that in order to be a proper citizen and to be afforded democratic rights, you have certain duties to be informed and active in civic life.
To me the test is simple, if the exercise of power has the capacity to affect you, you should get a say, no matter how banal or uninformed or just plain wrong you might view the legislation, you can still decide if you want to reject something or accept it.
The status quo?
I can't help it if your definition of a 'not fucked over society' is everyone else's definition of 'completely fucked over soceity'.
There's nothing wrong with it, at all, as long as they're held to account for their decisions.
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