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Barack Obama Speaks at The University of Chicago (Livestream)
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TheLostBigBoss
Banned
He's talking to you
shnurgleton
Member
I like Barack Obama
El_Tiguere
Member
GAF is going to hate on Obama. He's arguing that we shouldn't apply blanket labels of racist to every voter worried about immigration. It comes down to economics, and understanding where that person is coming from.
It's great to hear Obama speaking about important issues again. We need his voice. This is a nice event.
Does he have any immediate plans for public appearances after this?
It's pretty amazing (and ironic) how much you missed the point here.
Does he have any immediate plans for public appearances after this?
It's pretty amazing (and ironic) how much you missed the point here.
Lord Frieza
Member
The irony is, though, is that she was actually warning them about the kind of people that was supporting Trump if you listen to the whole thing. Much like her Lincoln speech about having a public and private face as a politician made perfect sense if you actually looked at the context of what she said. But alas, alas.
He, at one point, said he wanted to help battle gerrymandering after his Presidency, but I don't know what, if anything, has been said about that.
He said people with rational concerns about immigration. "Build the wall" and blanket bans are not rational
I feel like the joke post is going over a lot of heads, unless it wasn't a joke post, which it should be because it's funny as hell.
Lord Frieza
Member
Thread so far as been positive.
Regardless of what Obama says, though, yeah a lot of those people are pretty racist. But even if they're not, and it is true there is a lot who aren't, are mostly misinformed about the immigration process, or how immigration in America is really handled.
Icebergslim
Banned
Obama is a beacon of light in the fog of ignorance that is the Trump era.
DontBeThatGuy
Member
They're willfully misinformed.
Ziltoidia 9
Member
Such a slap to the face of the country to go from Obama to freaking Trump.
Schattenjäger
Gabriel Knight
Great speech Bams - agree fully
Smiles and Cries
Member
Obama said nothing about Trump at all. Trump would have been all about him.
Netherscourge
Banned
I agree with Obama. A lot of people are using the "guilt by association" thing with Trump voters and racism.
But I know people who voted for Trump because they don't like Obamacare and no other issue whatsoever. I'm not even joking.
A couple people I know voted for him strictly because he promised to appoint Pro-Life judges.
One single issue or promise can win a vote from millions of Americans, despite any other problems or issues or stigma the President may represent. Trump made sure he focused on those individual things, rather than any blanketed policy. Being selective can win you votes among the people who don't even like you.
Economics is not why people in Kentucky and West Virginia want a border wall. Immigrants are (as always) a scapegoat: blame them for all of our ills. Drugs, jobs, crime: it's all the immigrants' fault (it's not).
And they work as a scapegoat due to racism.
Schattenjäger
Gabriel Knight
Way too blanket an entire region of people
I guess what Obama is saying isn't reasonating with you
this gif annoys me cause the woman behind her has a much better reaction, but is not in the crop.
Edit: ok, they're both great reactions, but the other woman doesn't get enough love for hers.
DontBeThatGuy
Member
They're guilty by association, and elected a verifiable con man who's failing spectacularly. We also know immigration(aka mexican rapists and evil muslims) and racial resentment played a huge part in the election, this shit isn't up for debate.
Hold these people accountable.
Ploid 3.0
Member
It seems so inconvenient to have the secret service there. Feels like they have him on a leash.
And yeah, it's hard not to associate people who still voted Trump knowing what they know about him, and what he stood for. It's like the wolf billboard cartoon. They saw he had fangs, they knew he promised to do horrible things, they know he walked back on pass promises/contracts and conned people out of money, but they voted for him because he promised that he would do a particular thing they were interested in by the likes they have never seen, he promise, likes they have never seen, hugely, spectacularly, he promise.
Also some religious people just couldn't bring themselves to vote for a woman leading, forgetting that women lead in almost every field, but because it would be the highest office some people couldn't have that, because reasons.
And yeah, it's hard not to associate people who still voted Trump knowing what they know about him, and what he stood for. It's like the wolf billboard cartoon. They saw he had fangs, they knew he promised to do horrible things, they know he walked back on pass promises/contracts and conned people out of money, but they voted for him because he promised that he would do a particular thing they were interested in by the likes they have never seen, he promise, likes they have never seen, hugely, spectacularly, he promise.
Also some religious people just couldn't bring themselves to vote for a woman leading, forgetting that women lead in almost every field, but because it would be the highest office some people couldn't have that, because reasons.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
You understand the general idea is that they blame immigrants for taking jobs, which is economics, right?
As someone from the south, it's absolutely also racism for a whole lot of people, but the racism doesn't come out publicly until those scapegoats are doing something the racist doesn't like, which is "taking our jobs."
ClosingADoor
Member
True for a lot of people. But imagine seeing those issues you name around you (drugs, crime, no jobs) and one set of politicians either don't come up with solutions, or can't explain them to you, and another group is giving you an easy enemy to blame. Who are you going to choose for?
A lot of issues we see at the moment are not just racism, but also politics that has failed regular people, through corruption, through income inequality, through a changing economy leaving regions without a future. The problem is: how do we convince those to not vote against their own interest? Not by saying they are all racist and should just fuck off.
It sucks, but in the end, these people vote. They have a voice. So you can't just put them aside.
Ok, so they're not racist, they're just ok with racism because they'd rather take healthcare away from people or appoint judges that would take rights away from women than vote against a racist.
Asking allot of people to try and convince others of something when facts don't work.
Ziltoidia 9
Member
Would have been nice for Obama to talk about money in politics a little more last year.
DontBeThatGuy
Member
They have to find out the hard way, since being reasonable means you lose. Clearly.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
What does it matter, though?
Every time I see a politics argument here just go back to "Trump voters are racist," I'm wondering what's the point of even saying so. We've known America is racist since its founding and that it's never let up. So what do we do now with that information? What's the point of repeatedly saying so without a solution? It just seems like an easy way to dismiss having to engage in national politics, which are never going to be comfortable or even logical.
ClosingADoor
Member
That's the major problem. When you have politicians and media channels actively lying to these people non-stop and pushing their own agenda. How you fix that... well, I hope there are smarter people then me in the world for that I'm afraid.
Lord Frieza
Member
Dude, don't.
I don't pretend to have the magic bullet, nor do I think a bunch of us talking on a forum is really going to come up with the Democratic Party's next big strategy on how to take on racist America. But we all do have to live with the people that voted this way, and I think we also have an obligation to not give racism a cover. If my friend or parents are trying to get away with racism by saying "Look, I'm not racist, I just believed in... " X or Y fucking stupid shit thing then they need to be told that they are apparently ok with racism because they voted that way anyway. That's the consequences of their actions. I don't give a shit that white people think being called racist is apparently the worst thing ever. They need to fucking hear it. They're ok with racism.
Now, with that information we can't do a lot except I guess know that people are ok with racism. That can be a pretty big tool, actually. Hillary ran a campaign that absolutely hinged on people not being ok with racism and sexism. Well... they're ok with that. So now democrats need to plan their campaign strategies around that knowledge. "Oh my god he's so racist" isn't going to work as well as it probably should. Talk about the things the racists pretend to care about. Rip apart their cover one by one. You'll still have racists pretending their vote was for someone else, but you'll flip some. You'll flip enough.
I don't think that's the issue. That line of people do not give a shit and will not change. Regardless. She should have went in harder on that group and really ostracized them for their racist, fear mongering views, and made that line clear. There is no reason to play with that ball at all. 60million will turn out every time to vote for the Republican candidate. Why waste the time appealing to them? It would be better to just call them out on it and hope it rallies your base more.
I feel like the issue is more with the central and left side, basically enthusiasm and identity.
So right now, the DNC biggest issue is finding an identity to go forward with. The Republicans haven't just doubled down on their identity, they tripled that shit. Dems on the other hand, still are trying to appeal to the moderates to extreme liberals, to young people, blacks, Hispanics, women, etc. Their is a lot of overlap, touchy subjects, etc. And every group is miserable. Their isn't a clear message or focus to rally behind. Better to say, their isn't a person. The biggest rally point is the anti-Trump. So they are stuck the typical more moderate Dems, Sanders burning shit down, and the fallout of the Clinton all fighting for that spot on where to push the party forward. Till they have that singular voice, it's going to be hard to get it across. It is going to need people to step out of their boxes and accept a lot of shit that isn't right and not in their favor, largely because the opposing party made it their agenda.
Just disappointed that Obama would disregard scientific research.
Its disheartening
entremet
Member
He's trying to reengage liberals, not win arguments.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
Can you cite them for us and Obama? I definitely saw them, but I'm interested in your angle that it's a scientific or polled consensus that Obama disregarded.
Wanda/Wander
Member
1. Obama says Trump won because of racists
2. Every media outlet runs some variation of the headline: "Obama blames racists whites for Trump victory"
3. Trump says Obama hates white people
4. Republicans repeat the "Obama hates white people" talking point over and over
5. Republicans, Trump and moderate white voters who feel slighted by Obama's words unify against a single enemy
6. Republicans win in 2018
7. Trump wins in 2020
Back to coddling racists, I see.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
Yep.
Remember, many Republicans banded together over stupid shit like made-up rumors that Michelle called people "whitey." Calling them straight-up racists would be political suicide for Democrats.
friskykillface
Banned
Obama the 🐐
TheStruggler
Report me for trolling ND/TLoU2 threads
is he going to cash in his money in the bank on trump yet?
Wanda/Wander
Member
In America there is more political consequence to calling someone a racist then actually being a racist.
As much as I hate this fact, it doesn't make it any less true.
We had at least 2 or 3 different studies that were discussed on GAF. I'm not gonna do a search for you.
If you make such an important decision over a single issue than you are still a dumb piece of shit and fuck you for doing so. And fuck those who try to absolve any and all shitheels with a 'guilt by association ' rebuttal, because you are guilty. You are guilty because you were willing to take a bet on whether or not Trump was being literal or figuratively speaking when he went after minorities / women rights / social safety nets on the campaign trail. America is a much worse spot because of them. Nobody gets to make a shit decision with one of the greatest freedoms you have, and walk away from the aftermath.
El_Tiguere
Member
shintoki said:
The simple message that resonated with Bernie voters (Democrats under 45), the rural voters, voters across races, women, etc.. IS THAT THE STATUS QUO/ESTABLISHMENT HAS MESSED EVERYTHING UP. Hillary was the Status Quo and got rejected. Bernie was not the status quo (by promising progressive ideals of a fair economy, a fair criminal justice system, etc.) so young voters had passion behind him. In France, we just got the status quo/establishment rejected once more. Voters got duped into thinking Trump was not the status quo, so he won.
The status quo means a failed economy for most (including under Obama), a failed criminal justice system against minorities, the (propagandized) sense that terrorism is a crisis inside the US, a failed health care/college model for most, etc. etc.
Democrats that run on status quo/establishment sugar-coating of these (and many more) American truths, and Democrats who offer "pragmatic" slow (red: not happening) solutions to these problems (mostly to appease big money donors and oligarchs) will go nowhere fast in 2018 and 2020.
Blame America's shit ass education system, and our broad lack of civic engagement as a people (you and me included). Blame the individual as you encounter them, but fuck off with the defeatist attitude when it comes to election campaigning time. Not only have these voters walked away with their decision just fine, but they will likely vote again in 2018/2020. One outcome fucks you over, and that outcome is to outcast them as deplorable/irredeemable so that they get entrenched on their side and actively want to fight back against you labeling them.
Wanda/Wander
Member
Yeah, and it's also the reason why "moderate" republicans like Joe Scarborough and Lindsey Graham were tripping over themselves to repeat the Trump lie about Susan Rice.
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