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[Drew1440]

Why is everything an 'experience' now?

It's a store, you stupid bitch. There's nothing exciting or innovative about it. And it will fail, because you and your cronies are cretins who have had a decade of straight losses in everything you touch.

Yeah something like that popped up when I was viewing a PDF file in Microsoft Edge, like what kind of experiance is viewing a PDF file?

A mobile store that will be used on mobile devices needs a vehicle to get it into the hands of mobile device-users.

Apple has iOS and the iPhone. Google has Android and the Samsung Galaxy series..... what does MS have?

MS is still in denial about the importance of hardware. Still thinking MAUs will just crawl out from the ether. They're still just as delusional as ever.

Microsoft did actually release an Android phone, the Surface duo. It's more of an enterprise device and not intended for consumer use though.
I'm not sure what other Android Oem Microsoft could partner with, Samsung has its own Galaxy store, Google Pixels are probably out of the question, LG got rid of their smartphone division and Sony/Asus/HTC don't have the marketshare.

 

[UltimaKilo]

so now they are competing with apple and google and leave sony alone?

Whats next? Microsoft launching their own PC platform to compete with Steam?

Hate to break it to you, but that has always been Microsoft's competition. Sony is not really in the equation with FAANG.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

LOL, I don't work for Microsoft. I literally responded to your question with a general framework. It's not a memorandum or business plan. You're going to have dozens of teams working on this.

I never said you were..im saying that in your head you have a clear plan....

10-15 years?

Technology doesn't take as long as you seem to think it does.

is not about technology per se, it's about the market

Snake released on Nokia phones in 1997. The first blackberry phone released in 1999. The first iPhone came out in 2007.

and Nokia and blackberry are basically dead.

Nokia reached maximum success in the early 2000s it's popularity started to dwindle with the introduction of the smartphone (2007) in 2011 had a partnership with MS and then it got acquired in 2014.

a cycle of 10-15 years.

with blackberry is a similar timeline.

Netflix started streaming in 2007 and House of Cards aired on streaming in 2013.

Netflix had a diffent business model for about 10 years

then from 2007 to 2019 slowing raised to become the dominant streaming service thanks to original programing. global Hits like Steranger things (2016) and squid game (2021)

another timeline about 10-15 years.

Internet Explorer came out in 1995. Google Chrome came out in 2008.

13 years

It was the worlds largest browser by the end of 2009...

and its relevance has decreased by the use of social media (YouTube, TikTok)

all these examples show how disconnected you are from reality

Now look at any business/service/"Technology" and how it changes and it's adopted/decline over time. you will see a pattern of 10-15 years.


MS is trying to enter into an already saturated, established and mature market. the 30% cut is not the issue; it's going to be its visibility.


Samsung has its own app store introduced in 2009.
Xiaomi has its own app store as well, introduced in 2015.
so on and so forth.


1-2 years is laughable ignorant.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Hate to break it to you, but that has always been Microsoft's competition. Sony is not really in the equation with FAANG.

why make a console in the first place then.?

contradiction detected

 

[lh032]

Hate to break it to you, but that has always been Microsoft's competition. Sony is not really in the equation with FAANG.

yes, AFTER Xbox is losing ground.
The narrative has changed now it seems.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I never said you were..im saying that in your head you have a clear plan....

Dude you're absolutely not paying attention to anything I actually wrote.

is not about technology per se, it's about the market

The market is guided by the technology.

and Nokia and blackberry are basically dead.

Nokia reached maximum success in the early 2000s it's popularity started to dwindle with the introduction of the smartphone (2007) in 2011 had a partnership with MS and then it got acquired in 2014.

How long until Blackberry surpassed Nokia? How long until Apple surpassed Blackberry?

a cycle of 10-15 years.

with blackberry is a similar timeline.

It was not 10-15 years.

Netflix had a diffent business model for about 10 years

then from 2007 to 2019 slowing raised to become the dominant streaming service thanks to original programing. global Hits like Steranger things (2016) and squid game (2021)

Within 6 years Netflix was a streaming juggernaut completely changing their business model. Stranger Things is 9 years from when they started streaming. And they weren't even streaming in earnest yet in 2007.

another timeline about 10-15 years.

Again no.

13 years

Now you're fabricating timelines.

Again Chrome came out in 2008 and was market leader by the end of 2009.

and its relevance has decreased by the use of social media (YouTube, TikTok)

all these examples show how disconnected you are from reality

Now look at any business/service/"Technology" and how it changes and it's adopted/decline over time. you will see a pattern of 10-15 years.

MySpace launched in 2003. Facebook surpassed MySpace in 2009. It launched in 2004.

MS is trying to enter into an already saturated, established and mature market. the 30% cut is not the issue; it's going to be its visibility.


Samsung has its own app store introduced in 2009.
Xiaomi has its own app store as well, introduced in 2015.
so on and so forth.


1-2 years is laughable ignorant.

No one is saying that Microsoft needs to be the market leader in 1-2 years, but the framework for them to compete can absolutely be in place in a year or two.

Samsung's app store is a joke. Can you tell me what the top apps are on the Samsung app store?

 

[Dr.Morris79]

Wouldn't it be good if MS just made great games again

Crazy, I know.

 

[Hudo]

On one hand: Cool, more competition for the motherfuckers at Apple and Google.
On the other hand: Microsofts are evil motherfuckers themselves.

So either way, the consumer won't gain anything from this.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

No one is saying that Microsoft needs to be the market leader in 1-2 years, but the framework for them to compete can absolutely be in place in a year or two.

Absolutely not.

I present you this:

The Dunning-Kruger effect is a cognitive bias where people with low ability at a task tend to overestimate their ability, while those with high ability may underestimate theirs. It's essentially the idea that incompetent individuals often fail to recognize their own incompetence because they lack the skill or knowledge to accurately assess their own performance.
The Dunning-Kruger effect can be applied to various domains, including assessing timelines of processes and projects. In this context, it would refer to individuals who may overestimate their understanding of the timeline or project requirements due to their limited expertise or experience, leading to inaccuracies in their estimations.

Samsung's app store is a joke. Can you tell me what the top apps are on the Samsung app store?

exaclty. who gives a shit about a Samsung app store?

who gives a shit about the Microsfr store.?

 

[hemo memo]

On one hand: Cool, more competition for the motherfuckers at Apple and Google.
On the other hand: Microsofts are evil motherfuckers themselves.

So either way, the consumer won't gain anything from this.

The more competition the better. Let them fight.

 

[Griffon]

MS is not wrong in trying this. Good third party stores for mobile are way overdue. Not sure if MS can succeed at it, but at least the base initiative is sound.

Btw Gaben where the fuck is my Steam mobile store?! Pls.

 

[3liteDragon]

 

[UltimaKilo]

why make a console in the first place then.?

contradiction detected

To make money and to build an ecosystem. It's more valuable, Apple has proved, to build your ecosystem, not just one product. This is about protecting your bottom line and growing revenue in the space that is most appealing to consumers, not childish console warring by teenagers online.

yes, AFTER Xbox is losing ground.
The narrative has changed now it seems.

Losing what ground? Xbox has never had much of any market share, sans a brief stint with the Xbox360. This is now, beating back the encroachment of Apple and Google. The data shows that mobile is where the money is to be made, especially among the younger generation that don't care for consoles or PC like us.

 

[RoboFu]

No shit I told you guys as soon as apple announced their deal. Console gaming is going to mobile devices whether you like it or not.

 

[AndrewRyan]

If it's like when they launched their first store, many devs will receive tremendous incentives to list on their store in the first year.

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

Not so long ago, a company named Mihoyo approached MS to offer their promising new F2P game on XBOX. The response was to laugh in their faces. How things turned out...

A few years later, in the same timeline, MS wants to convince those and others like them to publish in their brand new store just because.

Sorry, but I can only laugh at this bullshit.

In simple words, I would like to know what benefit players and devs would get out of this. The only way something like this might work is with a Steam-like platform but we all know that MS won't do that. They couldn't for consoles, much less for mobile.

 

[Little Chicken]

Sounds amazing!

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

For iPhones, they'll be able to work with ATT, Verizon, and T-Mobile to get the App store on their devices from the jump.

Good luck getting carrier software preinstalled on the iPhone.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Hate to break it to you, but that has always been Microsoft's competition. Sony is not really in the equation with FAANG.

Ironically neither is Microsoft since they aren't part of the FAANG acronym.

 

[Dorfdad]

So what are these apps pwa's? As far as I know you can buy anything on a website but getting it installed into your system is the problem. You will have to side load and apple still only allows this in European countries afaik.

 

[balls of snow]

The sooner they go mobile the sooner they can fuck off into the sunset in the console space.

 

[Ronin_7]

Google & Apple shutting down as we speak.

 

[Ronin_7]

If it works across any Windows device it could be a huge potential existing market of consumers which could drive developers into looking at it. If it doesn't and it's only an app store you have to side load on your phone like Amazon, it's dead in the water.

Current Microsoft drama aside, they could do well from this >>>>IF<<<< they don't fuck it up.

Windows Mobile and tablets are no longer viable options.

Users are heavily invested in the app ecosystems of Google Play and the Apple Store, with significant financial commitments.

Switching to a different app store is a tough sell. It's like asking a dedicated PlayStation user to abandon their entire library and switch to Xbox, incurring a major loss.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I present you this:

The Dunning-Kruger effect is a cognitive bias where people with low ability at a task tend to overestimate their ability, while those with high ability may underestimate theirs. It's essentially the idea that incompetent individuals often fail to recognize their own incompetence because they lack the skill or knowledge to accurately assess their own performance.
The Dunning-Kruger effect can be applied to various domains, including assessing timelines of processes and projects. In this context, it would refer to individuals who may overestimate their understanding of the timeline or project requirements due to their limited expertise or experience, leading to inaccuracies in their estimations.

Hilarious because this is actually you right now...

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Good luck getting carrier software preinstalled on the iPhone.

Regulatory changes are coming. That people don't understand this... is astonishing.

 

[mayham2199]

Hate to break it to you, but that has always been Microsoft's competition. Sony is not really in the equation with FAANG.

Then why was MS ceo asking Phil about console sales in 2021 and worried about not getting to far behind Sony?

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Bond says the store is launching on the web, versus an app, so it's "accessible across all devices, all countries, no matter what, independent of the policies of closed ecosystem stores."

Not a single mention how the EU legislation made it happen. Corpos will fight to the death to protect their interests, the turn heel.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Regulatory changes are coming. That people don't understand this... is astonishing.

Not in EU.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Regulatory changes are coming. That people don't understand this... is astonishing.

You're changing the discussion - carrier bloatware and regulatory mandated installed software are different things.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

[h3][/h3]

Well reasoned debate in the form of meme... love it.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

You're changing the discussion - carrier bloatware and regulatory mandated installed software are different things.

....No one said regulatory mandated installed software.

Regulators will force Apple to allow preloaded applications/appstores from different vendors.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

....No one said regulatory mandated installed software.

Regulators will force Apple to allow preloaded applications/appstores from different vendors.

And that has nothing to do with carrier forced installs/bloatware. Which was my post.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

And that has nothing to do with carrier forced installs/bloatware. Which was my post.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Just in case you don't remember your own post:

For iPhones, they'll be able to work with ATT, Verizon, and T-Mobile to get the App store on their devices from the jump.

So yeah, Microsoft ain't getting their crummy shop on an iPhone as carrier bloatware. That ain't happening.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Just in case you don't remember your own post:



So yeah, Microsoft ain't getting their crummy shop on an iPhone as carrier bloatware. That ain't happening.

Again... I don't see how you're struggling to understand this.

Apple will be force by regulation to allow carrier bloatware. If they elect to not sell their phones through carriers, their sales and marketshare will decline.

Microsoft can work with carriers to get the appstore preloaded just as any other app owner on Android phones.

So what makes you think this isn't/can't happen?

 

[Lunarorbit]

This is gonna fail so hard. Oh wow Sarah bond can I play candy crush on your shitty app now?

Blind cash grab because why not have another launcher cluttering up your device. This does nothing for the consumer.

Just more greed. And that's why xbox fails

 

[Bojanglez]

why the fuck someone spend money on unoffical 3rd party store when you have google play or apple store ? it's stupid

Imagine Gabe had this mentality

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Apple will be force by regulation to allow carrier bloatware.

No it won't happen. Regulators might decide that having a way to access existing third party shops must shipped as default. Something similar to the browser picker that is shipped on some regions with windows.

But regulators will never make it mandatory to install whatever crap the carrier wants built in.

 

[rm082e]

Short sighted.

They're starting as a website because it's easier to manage across devices and regions until they can create an app store. Same reason why they're only starting with games, it's a simple thing to focus on.

You start off with a website that you can access the files from any region and it will detect whether you're on android or iPhone and download the appropriate version for your device.

Once they've built out the website essentially as a demo, they'll attract others who may depending on the size and traffic of the website put their games there exclusively.

Then once they've built it out, it'll act as the backend to their mobile app.

In time, they'll put non-games there too. And they'll work with different companies to get the app pre-loaded on devices.

For some reason people have limited vision and think you must immediately go from 0-100 rather than have a roadmap.

Internet Explorer had full market share dominance on windows... until it didn't...

As for why consumers might want to go to that site, maybe the games are available there early access, exclusively, discounted, or for free if you have gamepass e.t.c. e.t.c. there are lots of way to attract people to the site. Plus most advertisements for games take you to the app store, no reason why advertisements can't take you to the Microsoft site.

I work as a Product Manager for a small software company. I can totally see how this line of logic and this plan comes together in a white board meeting with a few people, gets turned into a slick presentation with a slide deck, and pitched up the chain to the decision makers. I can see the argument being laid out by people who are really good at story telling.

The problem here is if you just step back and think about the end state: Are people who use Apple phones really going to choose to go to a website and press a button to download an app that acts as a new storefront after they've spent their entire experience on Apple using the App Store? I get that they could, but does anyone really think a lot of people will do that? I think that idea is laughable.

Apple more than any other company has trained (some might say brainwashed...) their users into doing things the Apple way, because the Apple way is best. People who use Apple products are more resistant to stepping outside the box than any other group of users I've ever encountered. This is about culture and feelings, not logic. That seems to be a concept that Microsoft are incapable of grasping.

As for the Android customers, sure they are more open-minded. But they typically fall into two camps: People who just use the default apps and don't do anything outside the box, or people who want to tear the box apart for the fun of tearing it apart (enabling developer options, rooting, side-loading apps, etc.). For that second group, I've never seen them actually care about any of the apps they side load. They just do it because they like to tinker. Microsoft trying to appeal to a subset of a subset of users who they don't understand also seems destined to fail.

Or, maybe Phil and the C-Suite know this, but they need to look like they're trying something so they can ride out another couple of years seeing how this plan goes. Even if they know it's sure to fail, if they can get a couple more years of employment trying to make it work, that's a lot more money in their pockets.

 

[FIREKNIGHT2029]

Imagine Gabe had this mentality

When was Steam competing with other massive stores and ecosystems on PC?

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

This is gonna fail so hard. Oh wow Sarah bond can I play candy crush on your shitty app now?

Blind cash grab because why not have another launcher cluttering up your device. This does nothing for the consumer.

Just more greed. And that's why xbox fails

COD mobile is huge tho. Just saying.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

Microsoft did actually release an Android phone, the Surface duo. It's more of an enterprise device and not intended for consumer use though.
I'm not sure what other Android Oem Microsoft could partner with, Samsung has its own Galaxy store, Google Pixels are probably out of the question, LG got rid of their smartphone division and Sony/Asus/HTC don't have the marketshare.

Well then they're not going to be able to compete with Apple or Google at all.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I work as a Product Manager for a small software company. I can totally see how this line of logic and this plan comes together in a white board meeting with a few people, gets turned into a slick presentation with a slide deck, and pitched up the chain to the decision makers. I can see the argument being laid out by people who are really good at story telling.

The problem here is if you just step back and think about the end state: Are people who use Apple phones really going to choose to go to a website and press a button to download an app that acts as a new storefront after they've spent their entire experience on Apple using the App Store? I get that they could, but does anyone really think a lot of people will do that? I think that idea is laughable.

Apple more than any other company has trained (some might say brainwashed...) their users into doing things the Apple way, because the Apple way is best. People who use Apple products are more resistant to stepping outside the box than any other group of users I've ever encountered. This is about culture and feelings, not logic. That seems to be a concept that Microsoft are incapable of grasping.

As for the Android customers, sure they are more open-minded. But they typically fall into two camps: People who just use the default apps and don't do anything outside the box, or people who want to tear the box apart for the fun of tearing it apart (enabling developer options, rooting, side-loading apps, etc.). For that second group, I've never seen them actually care about any of the apps they side load. They just do it because they like to tinker. Microsoft trying to appeal to a subset of a subset of users who they don't understand also seems destined to fail.

Or, maybe Phil and the C-Suite know this, but they need to look like they're trying something so they can ride out another couple of years seeing how this plan goes. Even if they know it's sure to fail, if they can get a couple more years of employment trying to make it work, that's a lot more money in their pockets.

Do you think if someone sees an advertisement for a game on facebook, that they care if it takes them to a the storefront that they've spent their entire experience on Apple using or a website? No one has any irrational attachment to the apple appstore. It's just a storefront.

When the game installs it will also probably install the Microsoft app store. as well.

Microsoft can easily get their store added to Android from day 1 in most cases. Maybe not on the Pixel phones, but certainly on Samsung phones.

I feel like you guys haven't thought this through and you're being purely reactionary.

 

[Bojanglez]

When was Steam competing with other massive stores and ecosystems on PC?

I never said they were. But it is weird how people seem happy to just allow Apple and Google to have such tight control over their operating systems and associated stores, but don't welcome or understand the benefits of competition. The reason we have the Steam Deck and improved Linux support on PC is because Valve were anxious about Microsoft locking down Windows and pushing their own app store.

 

[rm082e]

Do you think if someone sees an advertisement for a game on facebook, that they care if it takes them to a the storefront that they've spent their entire experience on Apple using or a website? No one has any irrational attachment to the apple appstore. It's just a storefront.

Yes, I think they absolutely will care, and many will just close out the web page when they see it's not the App store. For the most part, I don't think mobile gamers care enough about any one game to deviate from their traditional App Store experience to try a game.

I get that they shouldn't care, but I think they do care. Hell, these are the people who don't want to message with people on Android because they want to see blue bubbles instead of green...

My daughter and wife are in this die-hard Apple camp. I prefer Android and I get endless shit from them for not having an iPhone. And it's not just them - this is a common theme I see with iPhone users.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

No it won't happen. Regulators might decide that having a way to access existing third party shops must shipped as default. Something similar to the browser picker that is shipped on some regions with windows.

But regulators will never make it mandatory to install whatever crap the carrier wants built in.

Again... there is some sort of block here with you. Maybe it's because you're looking for a strawman.

Regulators will not make it mandatory to install anything. But they will likely mandate that carriers have the ability to add whatever they want... Can you not see the difference?

They probably won't mandate that the appstore be removed from the device, similar to how internet explorer wasn't removed, but they will restrict apple from preventing the installation of other software on the device before sale. And then Microsoft simply needs to pay to have the app pre-installed.

Once the appstore is on enough devices, Microsoft can pull their apps and games from the apple appstore.

You can make an argument that it won't be successful, but none of you are arguing the merits of the steps that can and probably will happen.

 

[FIREKNIGHT2029]

I never said they were. But it is weird how people seem happy to just allow Apple and Google to have such tight control over their operating systems and associated stores, but don't welcome or understand the benefits of competition. The reason we have the Steam Deck and improved Linux support on PC is because Valve were anxious about Microsoft locking down Windows and pushing their own app store.

No one is happy to see Apple and Google dominate, we are just skeptical of MS' plan. Their plan doesn't seem built in reality and it's most likely doomed to fail like their other side projects.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Yes, I think they absolutely will care, and many will just close out the web page when they see it's not the App store. For the most part, I don't think mobile gamers care enough about any one game to deviate from their traditional App Store experience to try a game.

I get that they shouldn't care, but I think they do care. Hell, these are the people who don't want to message with people on Android because they want to see blue bubbles instead of green...

That's another poor example.

The green bubble has significance largely because of what it actually means. i.e. horrible video quality, broken up text messages, and broken reactions, no read receipts e.t.c.

The apple appstore gives no unique functionality what so ever. It's a storefront.

 

[//DEVIL//]

If I play call of duty mobile mobile of candy whatever it's called.

Why would I open the phone , open the browser. Go to MS site to download or play from the web when I can just …. Open the phone and click the app ?

What kind of stupid monkeys running there at HQ ??


Now you have what it takes to make your own phones and tablets l. You have all Nokia patents too.

Just make your own phone again and don't fuck it up this time . Make games exclusive to your phone or exclusive skins and contents and cheaper than other stores due to no loyalty fees from apple and google

Don't fuck it up . Why it's so hard ?

But after closing tango … yeah you guys are useless

 

[SlimySnake]

I find it hilarious that THE OS developer on PC cant figure out a way to make an OS for phones. They shouldve set aside a massive team with $80-100 billion in developing an OS for mobile and they wouldnt have had to beg Apple and Google for scraps.

No one. I repeat no one is going to download apps from their store using a phone browser. no one.