CDPR says the Kingdom Come style of systems-heavy RPG is 'super great' and an inspiration for Witcher 4

Denton

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The Witcher 4 will release in a very different world from The Witcher 3, and there are several high-profile examples of studios that don't seem to have kept pace with the times. Bioware's Dragon Age: Veilguard, for example, was a perfectly decent RPG, but the visuals aside it was almost like a game you could've been playing in 2015. But then there are those games that do feel like they're pushing the RPG forward, like Kingdom Come Deliverance 2 and perhaps most prominently Baldur's Gate 3. So where is CDPR and The Witcher 4 going to find itself?

"Bioware has changed for sure, but the industry has changed too," says CDPR co-CEO Adam Badowski. "We have a different strategy for our company. We definitely would like to continue keeping and truly understanding our core rules, how we develop our games, and of course, on top of that, we need to find new things, especially in gameplay, because there's not such a great progress when it comes to good stories.

To get down to brass tacks, then, what does CDPR see when it's looking at the likes of KCD2 and BG3?

"I love Kingdom Come because of the realism and the feeling, the sense of humor," says Badowski. Would he even say it's a little Witcher-y?

"Thank you," laughs Badowski, before going on to explain how some of the more simulation-y and systems-heavy aspects of KCD2 are the things CDPR watches with interest, because this is partly The Witcher 4's direction of travel.

"The Kingdom Come kind of simulation, it's great," says Badowski. "There's so many options, you can change the world, it's super great. And we would like to keep that, we'd like to follow this trend as well. So these are our next steps for sure, and it's kind of a similar challenge to what we have in The Witcher 3 because of the open world and storytelling here, freedom of choices. But at the same time, we would like to build very fleshy, very well-motivated characters. So it's kind of in contradiction from time-to-time. That's a great design challenge."

With Larian the influence is less direct. "In Larian's case it's turn-based so it's a different kind of game, and the way you interact with characters is totally different," says Bakowski. "We like to fully build the characters, understand the past and the future of the character motivation. That's why it takes so much time. [In BG3] there are great characters as well but sometimes your choices, because there's freedom of choices in Larian's work, it pushes you to use different tricks than ours. But I think we observe each other, and there are not that many games like that, so that's natural, yeah, and we see how players react, how fans react to those tactics."

More at the link.

Great to hear. I hope NPCs in Witcher 4 will have KCD style full behavior tree based schedules that allow for emergent behavior and much more immersive world bulding.
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

KCD2 is tedium baked into every action, similar to BotW. Some people love that and I did love BotW but in KCD2 it just did not have the novelty to hold me when I had to experiencing the tedium of every action. The atmosphere was great, but again, the combat in KCD2 is actually WORSE than Witcher 3 if you can even imaging that. Like, let's here someone defend the combat in KCD2.
 
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Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.
Lmao. So because you suck ass at it and cant get into it its bad? Man you are really a clown poster.

The man was super hyped for Casual ass Mario Kart so go play that instead and let the big bois talk about real games
 
Witcher 3's RPG systems were barely there. The more they look at KCD2 for inspiration, the better.
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.
4.64/5 rating on PlayStation, 93% rating on Steam. Over 3 million copies sold in a month, with the first selling over 10 million. Seems most enjoyed it, and certainly has the numbers sold of a mainstream RPG.
 
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Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

KCD2 is tedium baked into every action, similar to BotW. Some people love that and I did love BotW but in KCD2 it just did not have the novelty to hold me when I had to experiencing the tedium of every action. The atmosphere was great, but again, the combat in KCD2 is actually WORSE than Witcher 3 if you can even imaging that. Like, let's here someone defend the combat in KCD2.
Highly doubt CDPR will copy realistic aspects of KCD2.

Likely they are talking about village simulation and such.
 
Highly doubt CDPR will copy realistic aspects of KCD2.

Likely they are talking about village simulation and such.
NPC behavior simulation, affect on villages through your actions and more could be done.

KCD2 is outstanding in those aspects as well as variety of approaches to solving quests. CDPR dropped the ball big time with Cyberpunk with all of these.
 
NPC behavior simulation, affect on villages through your actions and more could be done.

KCD2 is outstanding in those aspects as well as variety of approaches to solving quests. CDPR dropped the ball big time with Cyberpunk with all of these.
They likely have a good team after Phantom Liberty and can deliver a game like this.

Surprising that Warhorse did so well just in there first attempt with KCD 1.
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

KCD2 is tedium baked into every action, similar to BotW. Some people love that and I did love BotW but in KCD2 it just did not have the novelty to hold me when I had to experiencing the tedium of every action. The atmosphere was great, but again, the combat in KCD2 is actually WORSE than Witcher 3 if you can even imaging that. Like, let's here someone defend the combat in KCD2.
Excuse Me Reaction GIF
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.
You would be wrong though, on steam at least it held very well. It's still seeing 20 - 30k peaks.
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

KCD2 is tedium baked into every action, similar to BotW. Some people love that and I did love BotW but in KCD2 it just did not have the novelty to hold me when I had to experiencing the tedium of every action. The atmosphere was great, but again, the combat in KCD2 is actually WORSE than Witcher 3 if you can even imaging that. Like, let's here someone defend the combat in KCD2.
jurassic park deal with it GIF
 
Just dont do Cyberpunk again and all will be fine.

If CDPR delivers something like KCD2, it will be great.
True, but I don't think they actually can.

They are praising an RPG while their game have become literally just action games with RPG-esk elements.

If I want a deep RPG, I'm playing the likes of Elder Scrolls, BG series and yes, KCD. Witcher ? Nahhh I loved part 1, meh on part 2, part 3 is basically an action game and as much as an RPG as AC Origin, Shadows, Valhalla etc I have no hopes for Part 4 to be this deep RPG and this company seems to love acting as if they are in the same ball park as other developers that actually make REAL RPGs.

CP is an action game and so is Witcher

This is glaze, this is trying to assoicate themselves with another developer on the come up that is making solid RPGs and acting as if those that like KCD2, should be on the look out for Witcher 4. It might be in the setting, theme and world of something that seems like an RPG, its features don't suggest it actually really supports those ideas within gameplay like KCD2.

Great to hear. I hope NPCs in Witcher 4 will have KCD style full behavior tree based schedules that allow for emergent behavior and much more immersive world bulding.
lol they are struggling to meet GTA 3 and AC 1 levels of NPC behaviors, they talk more then deliver. If they could do those things, we would have seen that in their last 2 games, their last 2 games do not have anything near Elder Scrolls or Fallout level NPC behaviors and CP fails to meet even GTA3 levels of Ai

Why hope this shit for a 3rd game? This is a damn team aspiring to always meet some standard they fail to deliver time and time again.

Witcher 5's dev comments will be like "KCD3 is super great an inspiration for Witcher 5"
CP2077-2 comments will be "GTA6 is a super great inspiration for CP2077-2 Sons Of Sinners"

This is a team aspiring to, hoping for, maybe will do, wishing to be etc Everyone else does those things, CDPR continues to live in this "we hope to do" type of fucking incompetence. They are wising to make a GTA3, AC1, Watchdogs game and maybe they'll get it right with the 5, 6 or 7th try

At some point, do you not think maybe this team simply isn't that good? If they were this good, why is it we are this many fucking games in and they are struggling to meet even older RPGs? So what does it matter they like KCD2, they need to worry about fucking matching KCD1 or AC 1 from 2007 at this point lol I was fine with this type of talk when they were new, not this many games in... they simply want to act as if their next game will be that deep to poach KCD2's install base
 
True, but I don't think they actually can.

They are praising an RPG while their game have become literally just action games with RPG-esk elements.

If I want a deep RPG, I'm playing the likes of Elder Scrolls, BG series and yes, KCD. Witcher ? Nahhh I loved part 1, meh on part 2, part 3 is basically an action game and as much as an RPG as AC Origin, Shadows, Valhalla etc I have no hopes for Part 4 to be this deep RPG and this company seems to love acting as if they are in the same ball park as other developers that actually make REAL RPGs.

CP is an action game and so is Witcher

This is glaze, this is trying to assoicate themselves with another developer on the come up that is making solid RPGs and acting as if those that like KCD2, should be on the look out for Witcher 4. It might be in the setting, theme and world of something that seems like an RPG, its features don't suggest it actually really supports those ideas within gameplay like KCD2.


lol they are struggling to meet GTA 3 and AC 1 levels of NPC behaviors, they talk more then deliver. If they could do those things, we would have seen that in their last 2 games, their last 2 games do not have anything near Elder Scrolls or Fallout level NPC behaviors and CP fails to meet even GTA3 levels of Ai

Why hope this shit for a 3rd game? This is a damn team aspiring to always meet some standard they fail to deliver time and time again.

Witcher 5's dev comments will be like "KCD3 is super great an inspiration for Witcher 5"
CP2077-2 comments will be "GTA6 is a super great inspiration for CP2077-2 Sons Of Sinners"

This is a team aspiring to, hoping for, maybe will do, wishing to be etc Everyone else does those things, CDPR continues to live in this "we hope to do" type of fucking incompetence. They are wising to make a GTA3, AC1, Watchdogs game and maybe they'll get it right with the 5, 6 or 7th try

At some point, do you not think maybe this team simply isn't that good? If they were this good, why is it we are this many fucking games in and they are struggling to meet even older RPGs? So what does it matter they like KCD2, they need to worry about fucking matching KCD1 or AC 1 from 2007 at this point lol I was fine with this type of talk when they were new, not this many games in... they simply want to act as if their next game will be that deep to poach KCD2's install base
While I do agree with you, their previous games are becoming action oriented.

I fully expect Witcher 4 to be story focused kinda action RPGs. I think they can incorporate some elements from games like KCD 2, Skyrim. Especially village simulation etc. That gives the game more depth. Story, writing, etc they can keep there own.

I feel they do have team that can make it work, after Phantom Liberty.
 
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Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

KCD2 is tedium baked into every action, similar to BotW. Some people love that and I did love BotW but in KCD2 it just did not have the novelty to hold me when I had to experiencing the tedium of every action. The atmosphere was great, but again, the combat in KCD2 is actually WORSE than Witcher 3 if you can even imaging that. Like, let's hear someone defend the combat in KCD2.
Lucky for you switch 2 is out today with plenty of exciting children's games at launch! Have fun!
 
CDPR probably also states the systems in KCD2 work "surprisingly well".


Thinking Think GIF
The NPC systems definitely work well and are as close to Rockstar levels than any other developer out there, really. I have a feeling Rockstar is going to bring the heat 10 fold over RDR2/GTAV with VI.
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

KCD2 is tedium baked into every action, similar to BotW. Some people love that and I did love BotW but in KCD2 it just did not have the novelty to hold me when I had to experiencing the tedium of every action. The atmosphere was great, but again, the combat in KCD2 is actually WORSE than Witcher 3 if you can even imaging that. Like, let's here someone defend the combat in KCD2.
TF you on about, KDC2 is up there for GOTY this year, have you actually played it? The more CDPR takes from it the better imo
 
Not sure if i want a super realistic simulation out of a witcher game tbh.

Maybe make the city more alive and fix your shitty npcs but leave potions making or stealing a bit more arcadey.
 
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TW3 sold like 60 million, so there's no way they go KCD2 levels of realism and punishment, although I would love it. At most it'll be like RDR2, where alot the animations and systems are there, but simplified and dumbed down to the point where you can pretty much just ignore them if you want.

Ideally there would be a casual mode that plays like normal TW3 style and a new "immersion" mode, but I doubt it.
 
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Yep, but how many finished it?
Same could be said for practically every game. Especially reviewers caught not finishing them.

That's not a measure of how great a game is. There are many games that are fantastic that I have still yet to finish. Especially one's you don't want to end with a rich interactive world to explore.
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

KCD2 is tedium baked into every action, similar to BotW. Some people love that and I did love BotW but in KCD2 it just did not have the novelty to hold me when I had to experiencing the tedium of every action. The atmosphere was great, but again, the combat in KCD2 is actually WORSE than Witcher 3 if you can even imaging that. Like, let's here someone defend the combat in KCD2.
I haven't played to completion a 100+ hour game since I was a teenager or my early 20s. I can't recall what the last game before KCD2 was. I spent roughly 130 on KCD2 and for the record:
-Played a hour of part 1 and hopped off
-Don't like first person melee combat games
-Have to this day not completed Witcher 3 or baldurs gate 3

I couldn't put it into words of why. On paper it should be a "fuck this game it isn't for me", and yet despite all that KCD2 I did all side quests and completed it. It has plenty of issues but it's such a unique experience that demands the player play it on its terms and I loved it.

9/10 from me a certified hater. If Witcher 4 can take the best things KCD2 does I'm all for it.

I said in the KCD2 thread if their studio made a fantasy rpg like elder scrolls but with all the great things KCD2 does it would be the ultimate video game ever made for my tastes.
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

That sounds ... great? God forbid the player should be able to feel more immersed in the lifestyle and activities of a witcher.
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

KCD2 is tedium baked into every action, similar to BotW. Some people love that and I did love BotW but in KCD2 it just did not have the novelty to hold me when I had to experiencing the tedium of every action. The atmosphere was great, but again, the combat in KCD2 is actually WORSE than Witcher 3 if you can even imaging that. Like, let's here someone defend the combat in KCD2.
I didn't like it either. I only played 2 hours of it when it arrived on PS+ and that was enough.

I know it was still a tutorial at that time but it was enough to bore me. More games need to skip tutorials and just let me play.

Jumping back into BG3 now, that is more my style.
 
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KCD2 has the immersive and interactive game world ever created, imo. Even more so than RDR2. It is really too bad the combat wasn't improved upon much tho. If KCD2's combat was just serviceable, like The Witcher 3's combat, the game would have mass appeal. The survival aspects of the game are really well done and nowhere near as tedious as mentioned ITT. It would be great if TW4 incorporated the more hardcore elements found in KCD2
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

KCD2 is tedium baked into every action, similar to BotW. Some people love that and I did love BotW but in KCD2 it just did not have the novelty to hold me when I had to experiencing the tedium of every action. The atmosphere was great, but again, the combat in KCD2 is actually WORSE than Witcher 3 if you can even imaging that. Like, let's here someone defend the combat in KCD2.

This post is offensively bad.
 
I said in the KCD2 thread if their studio made a fantasy rpg like elder scrolls but with all the great things KCD2 does it would be the ultimate video game ever made for my tastes.
Arthurian legends low-fantasy kino by Warhorse. I have set up an altar with some candles and pray for that to happen every single day.
 
The average numbers: 20-30%. Last time I checked KCD 1, it was 9%. So, it's practically not.
KCD 2 is more mainstream tho, I think it could reach 20%.


But you can't name those things, how do CDPR know what to do?:pie_thinking:
Cuz cdpr is coming to neogaf to read Arsics input on their next title.

Give me a fucking break man.

Edit: In case you want a list:
-Fantastic console visuals at 60 fps 99% of the time. Lots of details, wonderful lighting, etc.
-Amazing emergent quests or how you stumble on a quest.
-Quests that have characters that aren't one offs and end up being part of other quests or main story beats later. That change what happens in that later quest because you engaged with this other person earlier.
-Much better combat than Witcher 3. Both aren't "the best" but I vastly prefer KCD2.
-Both games have fantastic writing, characters, and story. Not worried there.
-A variety of ways to level, what I can level, and impactful choices to what I pick for skills. Not Witcher 3 +100 HP for a red orb socketed here if you have 3 red skills it boosts the HP total. A lot of skills are just garbage filler in Witcher 3.
-Both games struggle in equipment upgrades for the player in their own way. KCD2 you can get best gear just by stealing it, selling, buying. Witcher you just are constantly on a linear path of gear progression from vendors or crafting recipes from quests. Neither is better to me. Both games stop being exciting quickly for gear obtained.
-Music is wonderful in both games.


Just some stuff about both games I drew up for thoughts.
 
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Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews. I suspect most who tried the game also fell off pretty quick. No way this is a mainstream enjoyed game. Very niche.

Witcher 4 will absolutely have to dumb down every bit of it. No way potion making is the same for example. Everything will need qol fixes if they copy this. Imagine having to brew all your witcher potions like in kcd2. How long would that take per potion?

KCD2 is tedium baked into every action, similar to BotW. Some people love that and I did love BotW but in KCD2 it just did not have the novelty to hold me when I had to experiencing the tedium of every action. The atmosphere was great, but again, the combat in KCD2 is actually WORSE than Witcher 3 if you can even imaging that. Like, let's here someone defend the combat in KCD2.
I was on business trip and couldn't react sooner, but holy fuck what a dumb ass post.
 
Unfortunate. Don't glaze this till you actually tried KCD2. I could not stand that tedious shite. Do not assume the game is good just because of reviews.

Given your take, it seems you might just prefer games that offer instant gratification. Perhaps the issue isn't with the game's quality, but rather with an appreciation for depth that doesn't cater to immediate rewards. Tbh, that's a perspective I'd be worried about, especially when judging nuanced experiences.
 
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Why is this great to hear? It makes absolutely no sense in the context of the main character.

We're not customising our characters, we're playing as the most overpowered person in the whole universe. She literally has the nickname 'The Lady of Space and Time' because she can teleport and hop between dimensions at will.

I have serious reservations about Ciri as the main character because of this, not to mention she can't actually be a witcher. If this is also a serious consideration than the narrative will be even more muddled.
 
KCD 2 is more of a hardcore pc game, a game like that would never break out like witcher 3 did.

For me, CDPR has always seemed like a company that admires Rockstar, trying to meet maximum acclaim with maximum sales and a more casual mainstream approach.
 
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We're not customising our characters, we're playing as the most overpowered person in the whole universe. She literally has the nickname 'The Lady of Space and Time' because she can teleport and hop between dimensions at will
We have no idea what happened between TW3 and 4, I am sure CDP will have some narrative explanation for why Ciri won't be extremely OP.

As for why this is great, more simulation and reactivity in the game world is always a good thing. And that is what KCD2 excels at (among many other things such as writing, quest design, mechanics design, atmosphere..).
 
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