Support NeoGAF

[crackhead_bob]

So Star Wars Rebels will be wrapping up after season 4. I've never read the Thrawn novels, but I do know that it was relegated to Legends status after the Disney buyout.

My question to anyone who's read the books, would it be possible to adapt the books into a Netflix miniseries event, assuming that Dave Filoni keeps Thrawn alive after Rebels concludes. Obviously, changes would be necessary, but in terms of the core outlines of the novels, I'm sure they could be streamlined to work with the current canon from the films, as well as Clone Wars and Rebels. And, with the more expansive nature of television, the writers wouldn't be constrained by the element of a movie's run time.

Second to Knights of the Old Republic, I think right now, fans would clamor for a Star Wars series set immediately after Return of the Jedi featuring the OT cast. And as Clone Wars proved, you can capture the spirit and emotions of the Prequel cast without having to rely on the real life cast members. Also, Rebels featured cameos of Princess Leia and Obi Wan Kenobi voiced by different actors, so there is precedent in that respect.

If shepherded in the right hands, I don't think recasting the original cast for talented voice actors would be an issue. So what would be the potential barriers to making this happen? Has too much paving been done in regards to the Thrawn trilogy being in the Legends canon?

 

[Google]

Mate, read the books.

Dark Force Rising is a classic.

Dreadnaughts. Mmmm

(No, the books would not make a good mini series. They're very much in the vain of the original movies. Good thing happens. Bad thing happens. Good thing happens. Everyone wins)

 

[DrForester]

I'm reading through the Thrawn trilogy for the first time. About 1/3 through Last Command.

I think it could work. So far, the story is split into lots of little adventures that could work as episodes that build on each other.

 

[grandjedi6]

Disney could easily cherry pick any "legacy" story they wanted into the new canon akin to how they take stories from decades of comics for Marvel shows/movies. And Thrawn is a good example of how Disney is starting to do exactly that. I would be surprised if they didn't eventual retell more of the Thrawn trilogy considering it's popularity.

Well maybe not the Luuke nonsense.

 

[Akuun]

Possibly yes, but it would require some very skilled reworking. If I remember right, the books have a lot of scenes that work because the book lays out what the POV characters are feeling or thinking right at that moment, with no actual internal monologing. It's just part of the writing style.

That would be hard to translate to TV.

 

[Temp_User]

As much as i love the Thrawn trilogy, aren't they currently under the Legends label which means they are non-canon?

 

[crackhead_bob]

I'm reading through the Thrawn trilogy for the first time. About 1/3 through Last Command.

I think it could work. So far, the story is split into lots of little adventures that could work as episodes that build on each other.

I'm thinking 3 or 4 main story arcs for each season, with each season representing a book. Plus, you could gently integrate characters and elements from Clone Wars and Rebels for good measure.

And given that Rebels takes place less than a decade prior to Return of the Jedi, you wouldn't have to drastically alter Thrawn that much. Maybe hand him a humiliating defeat at the end of Rebels, and that he decides to target the New Republic as a means of building up his cache within the faltering Empire.

 

[sphagnum]

Doesn't fit with the canon.

 

[crackhead_bob]

Disney could easily cherry pick any "legacy" story they wanted into the new canon akin to how they take stories from decades of comics for Marvel shows/movies. And Thrawn is a good example of how Disney is starting to do exactly that. I would be surprised if they didn't eventual retell more of the Thrawn trilogy considering it's popularity.

Well maybe not the Luuke nonsense.

Again, they could cherry pick what works and what doesn't work.

 

[Google]

I'm thinking 3 or 4 main story arcs for each season

Which 3 or 4 story arcs? Youve not read the books. Why are you discussing which stories should be made into a tv show?

(They've already explored Thrawn's backstory in Thrawns mid 00s novels)

 

[Temp_User]

Haven't read yet the canon Thrawn novel. For those that do, how difficult it would be to retrofit story elements from the non-canon Thrawn trilogy into it?

 

[sphagnum]

Frankly I'd rather see Luke and Lor San Tekka hopping around the galaxy going on adventures digging up Jedi lore and artifacts while the New Republic deals with all the new factions created due to the fall of the Empire (Sovereign Latitudes, Confederacy of Corporate Systems, New Separatist Union, Acolytes of the Beyond, etc.) than a rehash of Joruus C'baoth and Force blocking salamanders.

 

[crackhead_bob]

Which 3 or 4 story arcs? Youve not read the books. Why are you discussing which stories should be made into a tv show?

(They've already explored Thrawn's backstory in Thrawns mid 00s novels)

I'm being anecdotal, alluding to how television shows map out season long arcs. The best shows on television tend to go with 3 or 4 interconnected story arcs that converge by the end of the season. Clone Wars did this in their later seasons.

 

[Google]

Frankly I'd rather see Luke and Lor San Tekka hopping around the galaxy going on adventures digging up Jedi lore and artifacts while the New Republic deals with all the new factions created due to the fall of the Empire (Sovereign Latitudes, Confederacy of Corporate Systems, New Separatist Union, Acolytes of the Beyond, etc.) than a rehash of Joruus C'baoth and Force blocking salamanders.

Mate, I'd like a bit of love for Karrde though.

 

[molnizzle]

Wouldn't work. The current canon clashes with that trilogy big time. After all the reworking that would be required there wouldn't be much of the original stories left.

Frankly I'd rather see Luke and Lor San Tekka hopping around the galaxy going on adventures digging up Jedi lore and artifacts while the New Republic deals with all the new factions created due to the fall of the Empire (Sovereign Latitudes, Confederacy of Corporate Systems, New Separatist Union, Acolytes of the Beyond, etc.) than a rehash of Joruus C'baoth and Force blocking salamanders.

+1

 

[Unknown Soldier]

As much as i love the Thrawn trilogy, aren't they currently under the Legends label which means they are non-canon?

This is correct, the entire old Expanded Universe was declared non-canon after Disney's takeover and the decision was made to make the new sequel films.

Thrawn himself has been re-adopted into canon, and Timothy Zahn himself even wrote the new Thrawn book. I don't know if that's the first case of an author of a non-canon work being brought back to write a new canon work using the same character.

 

[Google]

I'm being anecdotal, alluding to how television shows map out season long arcs. The best shows on television tend to go with 3 or 4 interconnected story arcs that converge by the end of the season.

I mean, I keep harping on about this but read the books. The Thrawn trilogy is loved because it explored a bunch of shit we all wanted. Imperials as an actual military force with personality and character. Smugglers smuggling. Other Jedi's. Etc.

Looking back at those stories now almost 25 years on and they're incredibly simple and played out.

 

[sphagnum]

Haven't read yet the canon Thrawn novel. For those that do, how difficult it would be to retrofit story elements from the non-canon Thrawn trilogy into it?

Theres not really anything in the new Thrawn novel that in itself is contradictory to old Thrawn's stories, other than some timeline shuffling and maybe the fact that his sidekick is Eli Vanto instead of Gilad Pellaeon now. Well, that and Thrawn's major motivation is revealed to be

Spoiler

that he is not loyal to the Empire at all but infiltrating it to see if he can turn it into an ally to fight the great threat in the Unknown Regions or, if not, if he can use it as a road block in the threat's path to buy the Chiss time

. You could always say that was the intent with the Vong in the old canon though, which was sort of the case.

The first chapter is basically a canonization of a short story from the 90s so Zahn is obviously still very much in favor of keeping Thrawn who he was.

 

[grandjedi6]

Again, they could cherry pick what works and what doesn't work.

The issue would be that what doesn't work is possibly everything involving the Big Three. We still don't know exactly what happened with Luke, Leia and Han in the new canon but chances are their inclusion would range from problematic to impossible. Assuming Disney would even let anyone touch the Big 3.

A retelling of the Thrawn trilogy without the big 3 is plausible and could even be adjusted to explain why the Rebel Alliance never really beat the Empire remnants (Thrawn's too strong without Leia & Luke's involvement). But is it really the same story anymore without Luke, Leia, Han, Mara Jade and the kids?

 

[Google]

But is it really the same story anymore without Luke, Leia, Han, Mara Jade and the kids?

No. The story is literally about stealing Luke, Leia and the babies.

 

[sphagnum]

A whole show based on The Crystal Star please.

 

[grandjedi6]

A whole show based on The Crystal Star please.

Twilight was already adapted into a movie in 2008.

 

[molnizzle]

Acolytes of the Beyond show would be dope though.

 

[Moff]

I don't think its compatible with the new canon.

 

[Hazmat]

Once upon a time, maybe. Or used as for a sequel film(s). It's not canon now and can't mesh with E7+, so it's not going to happen.

 

[CazTGG]

Disney could easily cherry pick any "legacy" story they wanted into the new canon akin to how they take stories from decades of comics for Marvel shows/movies. And Thrawn is a good example of how Disney is starting to do exactly that. I would be surprised if they didn't eventual retell more of the Thrawn trilogy considering it's popularity.

Well maybe not the Luuke nonsense.

What's the "Luke nonsense", exactly?

 

[sphagnum]

What's the "Luke nonsense", exactly?

Luke had an evil clone named Luuke, created from his hand that got chopped off on Bespin, and wielding Anakin's lightsaber.

 

[RyanW]

This makes me hope Filoni is working on something post RotJ.

 

[Shoeless]

I'd never actually read this trilogy but had heard good things about it. Thanks for the reminder, I'm adding it to my Kindle list.

 

[Shaanyboi]

I have to imagine that once Rebels is wrapped, the next show will be Post-ROTJ where they have 30 years of near-freedom to play with and set up. Including in-their-prime versions of Luke, Leia and Han, if only as guest appearances. Hell, maybe they might get into the formation of Luke's Jedi academy.

I don't know how much legacy material they will bother readapting to this new continuity, but whether the Thrawn trilogy makes it is totally up to whether Thrawn survives this final season of Rebels.

I just want my girl Mara Jade back into the fold...

 

[crackhead_bob]

I have to imagine that once Rebels is wrapped, the next show will be Post-ROTJ where they have 30 years of near-freedom to play with and set up. Including in-their-prime versions of Luke, Leia and Han, if only as guest appearances. Hell, maybe they might get into the formation of Luke's Jedi academy.

I don't know how much legacy material they will bother readapting to this new continuity, but whether the Thrawn trilogy makes it is totally up to whether Thrawn survives this final season of Rebels.

I just want my girl Mara Jade back into the fold...

Why not have Luke, Han, and Leia in their prime as the main characters? Just cast voice actors. Fans of Clone Wars don't seem to have a problem with Anakin, Padme, and Obi Wan having voice actors replacing their live action versions. For my money, the eras that fans are hoping from Dave Filoni seem to be Knights of the Old Republic, the Prequel Era, the OT, and the current era. Disney will never sign off on the current era until it has finished, so that probably leaves the latter 3.

That's not to say that there are other ideas worth plumming, but in terms of the lowest hanging fruits, these are probably the easiest to mine from.

 

[BossDarkseid]

At this point, no.

They'd be better as movies too.

However Zahn is writing more Thrawn books so we'll get new Thrawn content.

 

[Markitron]

I can't see how you could integrate that story into the new timeline. The changes required would take it so far away from the source that it would be a new timeline.

I have to imagine that once Rebels is wrapped, the next show will be Post-ROTJ where they have 30 years of near-freedom to play with and set up.

I reckon the new one will be set during the OT, likely the 4 years between ANH and ESB.

 

[Shaanyboi]

Why not have Luke, Han, and Leia in their prime as the main characters? Just cast voice actors. Fans of Clone Wars don't seem to have a problem with Anakin, Padme, and Obi Wan having voice actors replacing their live action versions. For my money, the eras that fans are hoping from Dave Filoni seem to be Knights of the Old Republic, the Prequel Era, the OT, and the current era. Disney will never sign off on the current era until it has finished, so that probably leaves the latter 3.

That's not to say that there are other ideas worth plumming, but in terms of the lowest hanging fruits, these are probably the easiest to mine from.

Because Filoni and his crew will constantly be running into restrictions with what they can and cannot do with Star Wars' most famous characters. Not to mention fans will be insanely protective about that shit. If they restrict them to side characters, they have the freedom to go in almost whatever direction they want. The hand of Disney is way more restrictive.

 

[Markitron]

Because Filoni and his crew will constantly be running into restrictions with what they can and cannot do with Star Wars' most famous characters. Not to mention fans will be insanely protective about that shit. If they restrict them to side characters, they have the freedom to go in almost whatever direction they want. The hand of Disney is way more restrictive.

Agree with this. This is why I want them to back to the Old Republic and tell a new story free of restrictions, just like Bioware did.

 

[crackhead_bob]

.

 

[crackhead_bob]

Because Filoni and his crew will constantly be running into restrictions with what they can and cannot do with Star Wars' most famous characters. Not to mention fans will be insanely protective about that shit. If they restrict them to side characters, they have the freedom to go in almost whatever direction they want. The hand of Disney is way more restrictive.

And Filoni probably encountered numerous restrictions when it came to the Anakin, Obi Wan, and Padme. I don't see how recasting would be sacrilege given the accretion of time since ROTJ was made. The OT actors have moved on, as did the main cast from the prequel trilogies when they made Clone Wars. With these animated shows, you have a more flexible palate to experiment with. So if this production happens to falter, it wouldn't damage the brand in the same way if this fails on the big screen.

What's more, however, the team from Clone Wars/Rebels has had close to 15 years, so it's not like placing this task in their hands would be akin to entrusting this material to rank amateurs.

 

[Shaanyboi]

And Filoni probably encountered numerous restrictions when it came to the Anakin, Obi Wan, and Padme. I don't see how recasting would be sacrilege given the accretion of time since ROTJ was made. The OT actors have moved on, as did the main cast from the prequel trilogies when they made Clone Wars. With these animated shows, you have a more flexible palate to experiment with. So if this production happens to falter, it wouldn't damage the brand in the same way if this fails on the big screen.

What's more, however, the team from Clone Wars/Rebels has had close to 15 years, so it's not like placing this task in their hands would be akin to entrusting this material to rank amateurs.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Clone Wars could have only helped the characterization of Anakin and Padme. No one is going to go to bat for the films' portrayal of Anakin as something that should be beholden to, or waste time arguing for Padme as a "great character". Even Mcgregor's Obi-Wan, which is considered atleast one of the highlights of that era, comes off as little more than a set of mannerisms as opposed to a rounded character.

But fucking with Luke, Leia, and Han? That's completely different.


And besides, Clone Wars was before Disney, whose influence is very strongly felt during Rebels with the change in tone. The most central Star Wars characters are going to make them be insanely protective.

 

[MattKeil]

Doesn't fit the canon, was never good to begin with. Saving Thrawn from that mediocre trilogy to have him do bigger and better things in Rebels and other future stories is the right move. There's nothing else in the Thrawn trilogy worth salvaging, with the exception of Mara Jade. But I don't think we'll be seeing her re-canonized any time soon.

 

[Moff]

Doesn't fit the canon, was never good to begin with. Saving Thrawn from that mediocre trilogy to have him do bigger and better things in Rebels and other future stories is the right move. There's nothing else in the Thrawn trilogy worth salvaging, with the exception of Mara Jade. But I don't think we'll be seeing her re-canonized any time soon.

Rebels is trash compared to the thrawn trilogy.

 

[crackhead_bob]

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Clone Wars could have only helped the characterization of Anakin and Padme. No one is going to go to bat for the films' portrayal of Anakin as something that should be beholden to, or waste time arguing for Padme as a "great character". Even Mcgregor's Obi-Wan, which is considered atleast one of the highlights of that era, comes off as little more than a set of mannerisms as opposed to a rounded character.

But fucking with Luke, Leia, and Han? That's completely different.


And besides, Clone Wars was before Disney, whose influence is very strongly felt during Rebels with the change in tone. The most central Star Wars characters are going to make them be insanely protective.

Why isn't Disney as protective of their legacy characters when it comes to their Lego spinoffs? I enjoy the Freemakers Adventures, but you can tell the writers are having fun at everyone's expense.

But honestly, their entire animation output could be seen as being distant from the films themselves, given the visually tonal difference between live action and animation. Not everyone associates Clone Wars with the Star Wars films, and that, I feel, allows some benefits, availing Disney a venue to succeed or fail without damaging the main brand, which are the films.

Rebels featured Princess Leia, Lando Calrissian, Alec Guiness Obi Wan, and Darth Vader, among many of their classic stand-bys, so it's not out of the realm of possibility to go this route. I imagine a set of films or tv set after the events of Return of the Jedi would be interesting terrain to explore, but unlike Rebels, I don't think Disney could get away with having that story going forward without having the legacy characters involved. And as Clone Wars proved, you don't need to hire the original actors to perform these characters. None of the fans who enjoyed Clone Wars seemed to take umbrage over the fact that you had different actors supplying these performances. James Arnold Taylor never sounded perfectly like Ewan McGreggor, nor did Matt Lanter sound like Hayden Christensen for that matter. I don't think most people would begrudge the idea of Han Solo in animated form being done by a capable voice actor as opposed to Harrison Ford, either. I'm confident most people could keep their expectations in check.

 

[Shaanyboi]

Why isn't Disney as protective of their legacy characters when it comes to their Lego spinoffs? I enjoy the Freemakers Adventures, but you can tell the writers are having fun at everyone's expense.

But honestly, their entire animation output could be seen as being distant from the films themselves, given the visually tonal difference between live action and animation. Not everyone associates Clone Wars with the Star Wars films, and that, I feel, allows some benefits, availing Disney a venue to succeed or fail without damaging the main brand, which are the films.

Rebels featured Princess Leia, Lando Calrissian, Alec Guiness Obi Wan, and Darth Vader, among many of their classic stand-bys, so it's not out of the realm of possibility to go this route. I imagine a set of films or tv set after the events of Return of the Jedi would be interesting terrain to explore, but unlike Rebels, I don't think Disney could get away with having that story going forward without having the legacy characters involved. And as Clone Wars proved, you don't need to hire the original actors to perform these characters. None of the fans who enjoyed Clone Wars seemed to take umbrage over the fact that you had different actors supplying these performances. James Arnold Taylor never sounded perfectly like Ewan McGreggor, nor did Matt Lanter sound like Hayden Christensen for that matter. I don't think most people would begrudge the idea of Han Solo in animated form being done by a capable voice actor as opposed to Harrison Ford, either. I'm confident most people could keep their expectations in check.

What are you talking about...

Nobody is taking Lego spin-offs as some kind of relevant canon. It's some jokey shit they make to poke fun at their universe for kids. They're free to do whatever the hell they want. It's not what Rebels and Clone Wars are, which, however tangential, are part of the grander story.

Why do you keep bringing it back to the voice actors? That's not relevant to the issue with whether or not Disney goes ahead with a new animated show featuring those characters. Of course they aren't likely going to get even a fraction of the original cast. I don't think there's any expectation that they would. The issue would be how those characters are written, and what directions the creators would be allowed to take if those characters were made to be the central cast of a new TV show. There's only so far in any direction they can take Luke, or Han, or Leia. And people are going to be insanely defensive about which ways those characters can go. And when your three lead characters can't really stray far from what's established, there aren't a lot of really interesting stories you can tell with them. Nobody was as concerned when dealing with Anakin who was such an unlikable shitbag in the movies that nobody cared about anyway.

 

[SpaceWolf]

I'm sort of convinced Dave Filoni's new animated series is going to turn out to be a show set after The Return of the Jedi, chronicling Luke, Han and Leia's adventures in the run up to Force Awakens.

 

[Markitron]

I'm sort of convinced Dave Filoni's new animated series is going to turn out to be a show set after the Return of the Jedi, chronicling Luke, Han and Leia's adventures in the run up to Force Awakens.

I actually don't want this, even though it sounds great. I'd prefer them to explore a different part of the universe that's unconnected to the main struggle against the Empire.

 

[Phamit]

They are better off to just keep Thrawn around and ignore the rest with maybe some characters as exception

 

[deleted]

Wait, Rebels is done? Why is it axed?

Will the same crew be able to work on another Star Wars cartoon?

 

[Lifejumper]

Wait, Rebels is done? Why is it axed?

Will the same crew be able to work on another Star Wars cartoon?

Final season is airing in the next month or two. They are already busy creating another animated series. Its not announced yet tho.

 

[BossDarkseid]

Wait, Rebels is done? Why is it axed?

Will the same crew be able to work on another Star Wars cartoon?

They plan X amount of seasons.

I would kill for Filoni doing an Old Republic era show that maybe tells the Disney Canon events around KotoR etc. Never going to happen though

 

[Bobby Roberts]

Nope

 

[shira]

Nah, kk wants 100% control.

Maybe when she retires